#dev 2021-04-28

2021-04-28 UTC
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@tomlarkworthy
↩️ It's a feature in my notebooks, I am adding a load of IndieAuth stuff (including a server) in https://observablehq.com/collection/@endpointservices/indieauth/2
(twitter.com/_/status/1387302386503401474)
loicm, Seirdy, [Rose], Paul[m]2, smacko[m], reed, Caleb[m]1, jamietanna[m], edsu, Salt[m], astrojl_matrix, forest[m], JackyAlcin[m], fredcy_, batkin[m], Ethan[m] and [Murray] joined the channel
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[Murray]
@petermolnar it's a bit cursed, but I've seen fallbacks that use `background-image` to place the png, which is then covered up by the SVG for browsers that support it. There may be a way to combo that with CSS `@supports` so that it is removed for more modern browsers, or you could always use JS to remove that style.
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[KevinMarks]
can you use the src vs srcset technique?
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[KevinMarks]
put the svg in srcset, and the old browser will use src?
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petermolnar
the <image> trick looks interesting
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[schmarty]
snarfed++ for the excellent glitch.com custom domain sleuthing
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Loqi
snarfed has 29 karma in this channel over the last year (60 in all channels)
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[schmarty]
i got a big hint visiting the http:// version of the site which showed not `found: kapowski.schmarty.net`
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[schmarty]
so i went to my project and removed the custom domain, then added it back, and 🎉 it works again. 🤷‍♂️
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[snarfed]
schmarty++ glad you figured it out!
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Loqi
schmarty has 8 karma in this channel over the last year (56 in all channels)
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[tantek]
[schmarty]++ nice. removing/re-adding sounds like a version of turn it off and on again 😂
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Loqi
[schmarty] has 9 karma in this channel over the last year (57 in all channels)
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[schmarty]
tantek: that was the spirit in which I tried it 😂
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Poorchop
I could use some tips regarding an implementation for sending webmentions - I was thinking of aggregating all of my posts in an xml file that gets autoupdated with every new post, then writing a script to parse that file depending on the depth/number of items that I specify which I call after pushing changes to my site
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Poorchop
I'm not really sure how to implement sending webmentions for updated posts though
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Poorchop
do I need to create a database of all sent webmentions with associated URLs and then regularly check if the URL has changed in order to decide whether to re-send webmentions?
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Poorchop
a lot of this sounds prohibitively confusing for the average layman
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barnabywalters
greetings Poorchop!
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aaronpk
generally yes, the idea is if you update a post, you'd send webmentions again from that post
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aaronpk
but the idea is you'd know if your own posts are updated
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Poorchop
oh I thought that was referring to updates on the receiving end
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Poorchop
as in a post that I mentioned in the past was updated or moved to a new location
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aaronpk
you should also be prepared to receive webmentions *from* posts that have been updated, but you don't need to do anything proactively for those
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Poorchop
I don't know if I'm going to implement receiving webmentions, it's incredibly tough for someone like me to write an implementation
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Loqi
definitely
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barnabywalters
Poorchop: I suppose you know about https://webmention.io/?
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Poorchop
I figured that it would just be easier to send them once I work out the logic for updating my posts
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Poorchop
yes
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Poorchop
I just don't want to rely on a third party service, that's a major reason why I host my own site in the first plac
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[tantek]
developers are definitely not the average layman 😂
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Poorchop
yeah but I was approaching this from the perspective as being something that the average person on geocities could've implemented back in the day
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Poorchop
that's definitely not the case
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aaronpk
from scratch? no, but integrating with third party tools definitely
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barnabywalters
well, if you don’t want to implement your own incoming webmention handling, then relying on webmention.io is a reasonable compromise for still being able to show reactions to your posts
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aaronpk
there was lots of stuff on geocities that was embedded from third party services too
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Poorchop
true
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[tantek]
I like that summary though: "something that the average person on geocities could've implemented back in the day"
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Poorchop
I'm not too concerned with receiving webmentions anyway, I don't want to know who is reading my site - I just want to let other people know that I'm reading their stuff so that they don't disappear
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[KevinMarks]
What is your site coded in? There may be an existing webmention receiving library you can use
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Poorchop
it's just html and css with some python scripts handling some automation
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Poorchop
I saw mf2util and I think that I'll need to use it for sending mentions
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Poorchop
in order to parse for the endpoint or whatever
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Poorchop
it's a weird process because I make changes locally and then upload via ftp, so I gotta remember to run the webmention script on the server when everything is in finally in the right place
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Poorchop
is there a test endpoint that automatically deletes received mentions after some time? I don't want my test to be on https://aaronparecki.com/2018/06/30/11/your-first-webmention forever
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Loqi
[Aaron Parecki] Sending your First Webmention from Scratch
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aaronpk
it'll disappear after a few days
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barnabywalters
you can delete webmentions by sending a webmention again, but having the source URL return a 410 Gone response
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barnabywalters
…in theory. not sure how many implementations actually support that
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barnabywalters
mine definitely doesn, yet
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petermolnar
(so, this is not for -chat) for HWC Europe: https://github.com/eentzel/htmltruncate.py - this is what I used to truncate HTML instead of a full fledged parsing unit
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Loqi
[eentzel] htmltruncate.py: Python module for truncating text that contains markup
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jacky
that page is _so_ long lol
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[KevinMarks]
did Quill's email support go away?
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[KevinMarks]
poorchop: we have a couple of webmention receiving implementations in python
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Poorchop
thanks
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Loqi
[Ryuno-Ki] webmention-tools: Tools for webmention.org
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Poorchop
I'm getting "HTTP/1.1 405 Method Not Allowed" when sending a webmention via curl as described in the your-first-webmention post
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Poorchop
trying to send it to webmention.rocks/test/4
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aaronpk
double check you've typed it right, i'm guessing it's trying to send a GET request if you type the curl command wrong
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aaronpk
(also side note, wtf did i do to my website to make the scrolling so choppy?)
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Poorchop
it definitely looks like I typed everything correct - could the problem be using the in-reply-to class?
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Poorchop
u-in-reply-to*
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aaronpk
no, that error would be returned way before getting to any webmention processing stuff
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aaronpk
are you sending it to the webmention endpoint of that test or that test URL itself?
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Poorchop
sending it to the URL with the webmention endpoint as the target
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aaronpk
other way around
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Poorchop
oh
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aaronpk
send to the webmention endpoint with the post's URL as the target
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Poorchop
awesome, it mostly worked thanks
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Poorchop
"The post did not provide a URL, using source instead" not sure what I missed
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Poorchop
but it showed up at least
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Poorchop
I'm guessing because I didn't add a timestamp
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aaronpk
that means there's no u-url property in the microformats of the post. that's where the post links to itself, usually on the timestamp
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Poorchop
got it
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barnabywalters
I like how webmention.rocks is sneakily also a basic h-entry validator
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aaronpk
haha yes
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barnabywalters
come to test webmentions, leave with valid h-entry markup because your test report looked so much prettier that way
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Poorchop
can I provide a u-url without wrapping it around a time tag?
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Poorchop
or is that a webmention violation or something
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barnabywalters
you can provide u-url however you want
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Poorchop
thanks
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barnabywalters
just add class="u-url" to an <a> element on the page which contains the canonical URL of the post
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barnabywalters
(where “contains” means “is in the href attribute”, ovbiously)
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Poorchop
even though I do this in the RSS feed, it's kind of funny referencing the URL of a post that doesn't exist yet before pushing to the server
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Loqi
[Poorchop] Testing out sending my first Webmention. Sent using curl on the command line.
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aaronpk
if you want to be real sneaky, and if you're only doing this on permalinks not on feed pages, you can use `<a href="" class="u-url"></a>` since a blank string will resolve as a relative URL to the page itself
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aaronpk
but that doesn't work if you insert that same markup into a list of posts
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Poorchop
nice
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sknebel
please put a tabindex=-1 on hidden links
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aaronpk
oh i wasn't suggesting making it hidden even. could put "permalink" as the text in the link
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aaronpk
point was about the empty string href
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sknebel
ah, sorry, "sneaky" kinda suggested that to me :D
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aaronpk
yes that was ambiguous
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Poorchop
yeah I was just about to add it as "permalink" text
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barnabywalters
I suppose a <link> element would be more appropriate for truly hidden links
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barnabywalters
but having hidden data is a microformats anti-pattern anyway
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Poorchop
I've spent hours trying to get the layout right versus minutes on trying to actually send a mention
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Poorchop
CSS is once again the final boss
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petermolnar
ok, I burst into laugh
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Loqi
hehe