#dev 2024-09-28

2024-09-28 UTC
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[tantek] trwnh, following up from your use-case in #indieweb-random: your summary of how/where to post "loose collection of context-free threads copied out of social media or chatrooms or whatever" sounds like a good use-case for /quotation posts (yes, which are quite different from typical /article or /note posts). Then you can separately decide if you want them in any particular (composite) stream/feed like a home page or feed file
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trwnh [tantek] are you suggesting making a "quotation" post for each "loose thread of thought"? this could work i guess, but looking at indieweb.org/quotation i'm not sure. the "why" section calls out things like "portion not whole" and "secondary brief commentary" which lead me away from the concept. unfortunately i'm not entirely sure what the true purpose is here; maybe i should figure that out first lol. but looking at "instead use", i can say
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trwnh it's not a reply or bookmark or repost, either.
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[tantek] right, I think "quotation" posts are still under some amount of experimentation so they felt like the closest to your use-case
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trwnh like if i had to put a "kind" on it, i think it's mostly a "page"?
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[tantek] maybe for a "collection of context-free" set of them yeah
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[tantek] I figured easier to start with a simpler building block
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[tantek] something to capture and save/post a "thread copied out of social media or chatrooms or whatever"
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[tantek] that would make sense as a /quotation post IMO
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[tantek] then sure you could make a /page out of them manually
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[tantek] or you could add hashtags to your /quotation posts, and then make one or more tag aggregation pages which automatically created that "loose collection" for you
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[tantek] that seems like it would be less work as an author. collect "threads copied out of social media or chatrooms or whatever" as individual /quotation posts on your site, hashtag them accordingly by whatever comes to mind, then use your own tag aggregation pages for an automatic "loose collection of" feature
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[tantek] what is a tag aggregation
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Loqi tag aggregation is a feature of some search, indexing, and bookmarking sites that collect tagged posts from many different sites, including IndieWeb sites, and present them for exploration by topic, and sometimes related or highly correlated topics https://indieweb.org/tag_aggregation
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trwnh you could maybe argue that it is a sort of h-feed or that the individual "threads" are a sort of h-entry but that feels like giving it too much formalism, and also opens the question of what kind the h-entry is. especially for stuff copied out of something like mastodon which is ostensibly a microblog, i guess it is could be seen as a series of quotations since there would be multiple posts? but for stuff copied out of matrix or xmpp or telegram
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trwnh or whatever it's a bit weird. there's also a slight transformative element to it because it's not a direct quotation it's more of a "i'm copying this over in case this thread ends up being useful later"
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[tantek] sorry I meant "tag page" not "tag aggregation"
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[tantek] what is a tag page?
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Loqi A tag page is a page that provides a way to browse and navigate posts on that site with a specific tag https://indieweb.org/tag_page
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[tantek] before jumping to h-feed/h-entry details, I think it's interesting to explore your intended meaning/uses of these collections, because that will help determine the design
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[tantek] this: > not a direct quotation it's more of a "i'm copying this over in case this thread ends up being useful later"
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trwnh in concrete terms i just want to upload this one static html file and idk what uri to give it. i do agree that it probably comes down to figuring out more of the intended meaning first
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trwnh otherwise i'd just put it at /threads and call it a day
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[tantek] sounds like a /bookmark post! especially the aspect of "copying this over in case this thread ends up being useful later" is very much a /bookmark use-case, or also a "pin" like Pinterest posts
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[tantek] the other term I have heard for those descriptions is a "clipping" for the individual things you've collected, and a "scrapbook" for a collection of them
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trwnh i might actually end up just putting it on /threads if i can't actually figure out a better intended meaning
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[tantek] maybe exploring what people have done with clippings / scrapbooks could help find approaches that reflect your use-cases
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[tantek] these are really good use-cases too. it's basically what drives Pinterest
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[tantek] Pinterest has individual "pins" of things you find and "copy over in case it ends up being useful later", and they have "boards" that are loose collections exactly as you describe
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trwnh hmm, "pin" sounds wrong but feels like it could be closer
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trwnh maybe an example can help. one of my loose "threads" (i am currently compiling these by e.g. scraping my own posts and finding all instances where i replied to myself) is about necromancy. i think i made an idle post about how people usually use the word to mean some kinda pseudo-resurrection thing instead of literally "learning from the dead". someone replied asking if divination is any better. i replied to that with some thoughts about
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trwnh stigmatization of death and the mechanics of souls. so this one example is probably most similar to a "reply-context" of sorts, just.... with the context removed.
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[tantek] makes sense. I think there's a potential for using different building blocks for different aspects of the use-cases you provide, something like:
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trwnh another example is like, i reply to myself 30 times in a row and this is very clearly a social-media-style "thread" that should have actually been a blogpost, and if i were publishing it formally i would call it an "article", but before i do that, i just dump it in this dumping ground i've built.
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[tantek] hashtagged quotation and/or bookmark posts -> automatic tag pages on your own site -> curated/edited named "page" (like a wiki page) on your site on the topic that references / embeds those posts
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trwnh another example is having a thought that was sent in two posts because it took me a while in between the two halves to come up with what i was trying to say. if i published that, i'd publish it as a "note" because it's short and doesn't have a title
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[tantek] right, the nice thing is that if your reply posts are hashtagged, they'll automatically show up in the tag pages on your own site along with any other kind of post that you tagged with the same subject(s)
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[tantek] what is unroll
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Loqi tweetstorm is a series of tweets, each replying to the previous, often each numbered so the sequence is clear, as a method of expressing a longer series of related thoughts as a single thread on Twitter https://indieweb.org/unroll
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trwnh so essentially what i have is some things that could be articles, and some things that could be notes, and maybe some things that could be quotations or bookmarks or something else.
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[tantek] ^ some related examples there too
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trwnh ah, "unroll" could be very relevant here, since that's in effect how i'm even compiling this stuff lol
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[tantek] yeah, lots of things that "could be" other things, tied together by a common topic. that sounds like a tag page which then you could source from to make a curated named page
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trwnh > a single repost, with individual blockquote elements
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trwnh this seems like markup that generally makes sense except i'm generally using p elements instead of blockquote elements
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[tantek] what is a pin
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Loqi 📌 pin or pinning is a feature that allows the author to choose a post to put at the top of their profile (or homepage) which is then called a pinned or sticky post https://indieweb.org/Pin
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trwnh i'm kind of drifting to just calling them "threads" for now, and if i come up with a more clearly defined use case i can think about reclassifying them. or i could just call them /self-replies i suppose?
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trwnh since they basically are mostly that (but not just that? i'm definitely filtering out some self-replies)
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[tantek] maybe another step would be to implement your own thread unrolling and capture the results as notes
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[0x3b0b] two more (kind of jocular, but who knows what might spark a good idea) things my brain has floated past while reading this are "compendium," which I think may connote more careful curation than it sounds like you're doing _yet_, and (in the context of this sounding sort of PESOS-related) "change-sorter"
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