#meta 2022-06-17

2022-06-17 UTC
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@person72443 the difference between #indieweb side project and work life is hilarious work: "Let's use whatever libraries will make the code cleanest" indieweb: "okay we're talking html and javascript only let's MAKE this interactive table" (twitter.com/_/status/1537610923690512384)
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[hollie] A question about the events page on IndieWeb.org: On the Pacific group's web page, it has an "Add to Calendar" link. However if you click that, it goes an iCal feed, and says, "Copy the URL above and subscribe to it in your favorite calendar app!" But the "feed" is for just that one event, it isn't a feed of all the events. I kept re-subscribing trying to figure out why the feed wasn't refreshing. I finally realized it's a "feed"
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[hollie] for a single event. Normally when I click on an "add to iCal" link from other organizations or meet-ups, it adds a single event to the iCal of my choosing. It's confusing to a new person to have to constantly subscribe to a feed that only shows a single event. Can this be changed to a true "add to iCal" link?
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aaronpk Usually "add to calendar" links on an event page are just for the one event
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aaronpk the tag page for any tag has an ical link for all events with that tag
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aaronpk eg https://events.indieweb.org/tag/americas
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aaronpk or https://events.indieweb.org/tag/pacific
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[hollie] If you go here: https://events.indieweb.org/2022/06/homebrew-website-club-pacific-bMwiUsVKSuq2
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[hollie] And you click "add to calendar", it asks you to subscribe to a feed. That feed is for a single event. Normally "add to calendar" adds an _event_ to your calendar. Or, alternately, if you're going to subscribe to a feed, then the implication would be that you're subscribing to a feed of all the events for the Pacific group. Neither of these are true with this link. It's confusing. Why ask people to subscribe to an entire calendar
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[hollie] that will only ever have one event on it?
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aaronpk I'm not sure what you mean by "adds an event to your calendar"?
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aaronpk i guess I've seen sites that give you an ics file download for the one event
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aaronpk is that what you mean?
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[hollie] An ics file downloads a single event to your calendar. You download it, it says, "Which calendar would you like this event to appear in," you chose, and there it is. You haven't subscribed to a new calendar. You just downloaded an event.
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[hollie] The "add to calendar" on the page I liked to above (the newest Pacific event page) has a single event on it, it doesn't refresh. There is never a new event. This is very confusing. Is isn't a single event downloaded to your calendar, it's a feed that you're asked to subscribe to.
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[hollie] That isn't an event, that's a feed.
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[hollie] This is confusing because you think, "Oh if I subscribe, I'll see all the Pacific events." But you won't, you'll only see the one event. That "add to calendar" link should be an ics file that creates the event in your calendar. It makes no sense to have a feed for a single event.
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aaronpk I'm still unclear on your expectation of what happens between clicking the link and it appearing on your calendar. Are you referring to the UX of a particular calendar application?
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aaronpk In other words, what is the thing that says "which calendar would you like this even to appear in"? The web page? Your computer/phone?
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aaronpk Just to be clear, I am open to fixing this, just not clear on what the right behavior actually is
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[hollie] I'm unclear on what part of this is confusing. If you see a link that says, "Add to Calendar," and you click that link, what do you expect will happen next?
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[hollie] Or more specifically: do you see a difference between adding an event to your calendar, versus asking someone to subscribe to a feed?
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aaronpk I mean it depends, am I on a phone? Cause then I expect some weird thing that doesn't work. On desktop I guess I'd expect a file to download, and if I use Apple Calendar then clicking it works mostly well, but if I'm using google calendar then I have to figure out where the "upload ics" link is
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[hollie] Do you see a difference between subscribing to a feed vs. adding an event to a calendar?
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aaronpk I guess calling the single event one a "feed" is the source of this problem?
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aaronpk Cause I've also seen "add to calendar" links that download an ics file with a whole bunch of events in it
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[hollie] The problem isn't _calling_ it a feed, it's that is _is_ a feed. Do you see the screenshot above? That's a link _to a feed_. If I subscribe to that feed, I now have a whole new feed on my calendar for IndieWeb, that has one single event on it, that will never update. This is super confusing to a new person. I have missed several meetings because I didn't understand why that feed I was asked to subscribe to was never updated with new
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[hollie] meetings.
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[hollie] If I click "add to calendar" for a single event, that link should _add an event to my calendar_, it should not create an entire feed that I have to copy and past and manually subscribe to, for only a single event.
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aaronpk Which calendar are you using? The UX of these tend to be pretty different
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aaronpk ok I think I see the source of the confusion. I can't add an event to your calendar. I can give you something you can use to add the event to your calendar.
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aaronpk So the question is what's the best thing to give you to add it to your calendar
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[fluffy] I think the issue is with the UX for adding things. An ics file is both an event and a calendar and it's up to the calendaring app to know to subscribe to the URL rather than importing the file.
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aaronpk One other thing I'm picking up on here is that currently the only link between multiple events is the tags, but there's no concept of "HWC Pacific" on the site to tie these together
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GWG aaronpk: So, are you thinking there needs to be a way to tie together recurring events of the same type?
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aaronpk More like "part of the same series" instead of type but generally yes
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aaronpk it might also work for making events for individual sessions of an IWC under the main IWC event
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GWG aaronpk: So, a good long term option.
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Loqi Just generated the first draft of this week's newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html I'll generate a draft again tomorrow, so please add to it before then! https://indieweb.org/this-week#How_to
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[hollie] He said, "You're confused about what an ICS file is, and so your explanation that seems very clear to you is actually confusing them." I didn't understand what exactly an ICS file was. More specifically, I thought that an ICS file created individual events, whereas a feed was an entirely separate thing. Greg explained that an ICS file is the whole thing, and whether your calendar reads it as an isolated event or whether you copy and
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[hollie] Okay, my apologies! I now understand what was going wrong! We're having a big family night with my in-laws, and we were all sitting around playing board games and I handed my iPad to my husband Greg and said, "Can you please read this and explain to me what isn't clear? I am so confused as to why they're confused."
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[hollie] paste it into your "subscribe" field determines whether your calendar sees it as a single event or a feed of events.
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[hollie] So it looked to me like the where a link should go to an ICS file - an event, it was instead going to a feed. So I'm saying, "Don't put a link to a feed there, make it a link to an event," and [aaronpk] is asking what I mean by event, and I'm just baffled by the question, and he's baffled at my bafflement. So sorry about that! Mea culpa!
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[hollie] So then we're finishing up this game and we're all laughing about this and I turned and say to Greg, "How do you know all this?" He goes, "Because I was a member of the calendaring consortium working on ICS interoperability," and the table went wild, lol! Which makes it even more embarrassing that I came here to ask a question and didn't know how ICS works, but my father-in-law said, "It's not like this is what you talk about all
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[hollie] the time," which is true.
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[hollie] He says the fix is that "there's some way to mark the link so that your calendar reads it as a single event and doesn't ask to subscribe to it like a feed," but he wasn't sure how to do that, so I'm afraid he didn't have the answer. But at least now I will be able to describe the issue with accuracy! I enjoy learning this stuff. Sorry for the confusion!
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aaronpk Well that is quite the small world story!
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aaronpk I didn't know about that option but I will look into it!
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aaronpk Also I still think there's some room to improve the flow there , I think making the single event version download the file would help
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[Scott_Jack] “I was part of the consortium” was quite the twist
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jamietanna Jacky still no dice, see the site down on / too
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@fundor333 How I implement Indieweb, Webmention and H Entry in My Blog #hentry #hugo #indiweb #twtxt https://fundor333.com/post/2022/indieweb-webmention-and-h-entry-in-my-blog/ (twitter.com/_/status/1537725754376605697)
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@StrawberrEclair ↩️ This is also my first step into #POSSE and really making my #indieweb presence know, so I'm very excited about that too. (twitter.com/_/status/1537784828006907904)
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@justgottagotta @web3isgreat@indieweb.social 嘻嘻 (twitter.com/_/status/1537802212768108545)
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@chegalabonga Everyone seems to have their own “discord” server nowadays. Imagine a place, where you have your very own home – and domain – on the web. One where you could communicate to and from those websites. It exists and its called the #Indieweb. And it is… https://davidpeach.me/?p=44360 (twitter.com/_/status/1537801361970151429)
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jacky.wtf edited /User:Jacky.wtf (+90) "/* Itches */" (view diff)
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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[tantek] looks into the events.indieweb UX and links to see what is up
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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GWG Reminder... bonus Galactic HWC tomorrow
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sknebel 👀
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sknebel 18:00 my time, ok, might be able to make that
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GWG sknebel: Welcome, Fellow Galactic Citizen
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Zegnat adds to calendar in case
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GWG Zegnat: Hope you are doing well
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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@type__error #indieweb friends: has anyone managed to get http://brid.gy working with twitter replies? it comes up with likes and retweets, but seemingly not replies to my tweets with eligible URLs in :/ (twitter.com/_/status/1537844036710674432)
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Zegnat GWG: I am now! :D
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GWG Zegnat: Sorry you weren't
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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gregorlove.com edited /xss (-196) "/* XSS from webmentions */ link checkmention page, update text to note it's open source code; appspot service hasn't been online for a while" (view diff)
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work.vera.pink created /User:Work.vera.pink (+17) "Created page with "VERONIKA WAS HERE"" (view diff)
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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gRegor what is this week?
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Loqi This Week in the IndieWeb is a weekly digest of activities of the IndieWeb community https://indieweb.org/this-week
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gRegor Does the newsletter use alt text if the event permalink has it?
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gRegor Guess I can edit an event and wait until the next generation to see :)
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gRegor should alt list names/nicknames or generic like "grid of attendees on Zoom"?
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aaronpk hmm i don't think it does because i don't think i've updated the mf2 parser it uses since the alt text was incorporated into the parser
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aaronpk that's a good question... my inclination is to make it match what someone looking at the photo would see. so if there are names visible in the screenshot then the alt text would include names, but if there are no names visible then i wouldn't add that info in the alt text
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gRegor On this one which I think I did, I included names: https://events.indieweb.org/2022/05/homebrew-website-club-pacific-JGTF0RmSRvLF
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gRegor and yeah don't think it went in the newsletter: https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-05-20.html
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gRegor Filed https://github.com/indieweb/this-week/issues/23
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Loqi [gRegorLove] #23 Include img alt text
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gregorlove.com edited /Homebrew_Website_Club (-16) "/* Optional Domain Name */ +London" (view diff)
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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sknebel the emojis on /like are also slihghtly out of control
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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gregorlove.com edited /Homebrew_Website_Club (+3609) "start new section == How to Organize Virtual Events == with details from my recent experiences" (view diff)
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gRegor GWG, tracydurnell, angelo, anyone else: I split out a section for virtual HWC, feedback/updates welcome: https://indieweb.org/Homebrew_Website_Club#How_to_Organize_Virtual_Events
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gRegor We might be able to merge the "Running the event" section and https://indieweb.org/Pop-up_Organizing#Running_the_event into its own "Running virtual events" page. They're pretty similar, small differences for events we record. But this is a start.
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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Loqi Generated a new draft of the newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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Loqi Just generated this week's newsletter! You still have a few minutes to make changes, and I'll re-generate it 10 minutes before it gets sent out at 3pm Pacific time. https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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GWG gRegor: Can you run Wednesday?
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gRegor Maybe. I thought jacky said he was?
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jacky I can be available
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GWG jacky: Got credentials?
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jacky that I don't
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GWG I might have missed it
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jacky I know that there's in some 1password store I believe
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gRegor aaronpk can add you to 1password
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GWG Was just about to ask
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gRegor I should be around, so just ping me if running late or you're not able to, jacky
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work.vera.pink edited /chat-names (+56) (view diff)
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work.vera.pink edited /chat-names (+226) (view diff)
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Loqi Generated the final version of the newsletter! This will be sent out at 3pm Pacific time. https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html
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GWG I'll be away. Had to change my travel time
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@indiewebcamp This week in the #indieweb https://indieweb.org/this-week/2022-06-17.html (twitter.com/_/status/1537921792345374721)
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IWDiscordGateway <tracydurnell> gRegor++ for writing that up!
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IWDiscordGateway <tracydurnell> Looks good to me
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sknebel gRegor++ as proxy ;)
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Loqi gRegor has 16 karma in this channel over the last year (34 in all channels)
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IWDiscordGateway <tracydurnell> (ty 😁)
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gRegor gives loqi a discord
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Loqi investigates the discord
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jacky will do, gRegor, thank you!
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gregorlove.com created /Template:infobox (+302) "generic infobox template" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com created /Template:infobox/doc (+992) "infobox doc" (view diff)
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