#meta 2025-05-20

2025-05-20 UTC
barnaby, gRegor, ben_, doesnm and [jeremycherfas] joined the channel
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loqi.me created /sign-in_wall (+23) "prompted by [tantek] and redirect added by [tantek]" (view diff)
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loqi.me created /signin_wall (+23) "prompted by [tantek] and redirect added by [tantek]" (view diff)
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tantek.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:2025-140-bsky-sign-in-required.png]]" https://indieweb.org/File:2025-140-bsky-sign-in-required.png"
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-popups (+10) "update from https://events.indieweb.org/tag/popup" (view diff)
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-popups (-10) "update from https://events.indieweb.org/tag/popup" (view diff)
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artlung.com uploaded /File:2025-05-20-FrESH-Group-Photo.jpg "Group Photo https://indieweb.org/File:2025-05-20-FrESH-Group-Photo.jpg"
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[artlung] !archive https://events.indieweb.org/2025/05/front-end-study-hall-028-FnCziY2O2Fd9 events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall
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cali-iwc Created https://indieweb.org/events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall. Please review the page to ensure the document is correctly formatted and remove any unnecessary text.
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cali.moe created /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (+3700) "Created event page using IndieWeb events / Etherpad archiver" (view diff)
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artlung.com edited /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (-1) (view diff)
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artlung.com edited /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (+2) "/* Participants */" (view diff)
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artlung.com edited /Front_End_Study_Hall (+139) "Adding #028" (view diff)
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-popups (+165) "update from https://events.indieweb.org/tag/popup" (view diff)
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[artlung] what is rss?
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Loqi RSS is an acronym for a set of XML feed file format variants used for syndicating time-stamped content from web sites like blogs and podcasts, and sometimes a shorthand for feed file formats as a whole including Atom, or even more broadly for the concept of feeds or syndication in general https://indieweb.org/RSS
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[artlung] what is autodiscovery?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "autodiscovery" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "autodiscovery is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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[artlung] what is atom?
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Loqi Atom is an XML format and protocol for publishing feeds that was developed as a more formally specified alternative to RSS https://indieweb.org/Atom
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artlung.com edited /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (+615) "microformats" (view diff)
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artlung.com edited /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (+230) "/* Burning Questions 1 */" (view diff)
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artlung.com edited /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (+520) "/* Performance on iOS */" (view diff)
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artlung.com edited /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (+741) "Finally" (view diff)
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artlung.com edited /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (+39) "Link to #027" (view diff)
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artlung.com edited /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (+69) "/* Front End Study Hall #028 */" (view diff)
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[tantek] artlung what's the difference between autodiscovery and discovery? is autodiscovery purely programmatic / algorithmic discovery?
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[artlung] I don't know if it's just me but "autodiscovery" I think of as the exposure of RSS/Atom links programmatically or via UI which externalizes (makes visible) a feed.
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[artlung] Whether there's a better word for it, that's my vernacular usage of autodiscovery. So "The browsers removed the RSS autodiscovery icon" or "The _Awesome RSS_ extension adds an icon for websites which provide an autodiscoverable Atom or RSS feed"
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[artlung] discovery sounds less specific to rss. I didn't add a definition because not certain my usage is common
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[artlung] https://www.rssboard.org/rss-autodiscovery (and a warning that page includes horrendous ****ing Google ads.
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[artlung] > _Supported by Mozilla Firefox 2.0, Microsoft Internet Explorer 7.0 and other browsers, autodiscovery has become the best way to inform users that a web site offers a syndication feed. When a browser loads a page and discovers that a feed is available, Firefox and Internet Explorer display the common feed icon in the address bar._
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[artlung] THE EMPIRE OF RSS, LOST
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[tantek] good digging
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[tantek] I gotchu [artlung]
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artlung.com edited /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (+1072) "/* Finally */" (view diff)
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[tantek] what is discovery-algorithms
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Loqi Discovery algorithms are a set of algorithms to start with a URL like a home page or post permalink, and determine information about that URL, such as authorship, page-name, and date published, often making use of follow your nose techniques https://indieweb.org/discovery-algorithms
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tantek.com created /autodiscovery (+34) "prompted by [artlung], r" (view diff)
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artlung.com edited /events/2025-05-20-front-end-study-hall (+3) "/* Joe's Zoom Background */" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /discovery-algorithms (+74) "feed file usecase in dfn, and note autodiscovery" (view diff)
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[artlung] Good stuff. Glad to be able to link up my use of the term today to that page.
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tantek.com edited /discovery-algorithms (+134) "/* Legacy Discovery */ update to Alternates Discovery and Feed File Discovery" (view diff)
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[tantek] [artlung] stubbed this section for you to hopefully summarize a how to from your use of "autodiscovery": https://indieweb.org/discovery-algorithms#Feed_File_Discovery
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[artlung] I added that as a todo for myself tomorrow. next up Rx pickup and beach. 🙂
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[tantek] I wonder if autodiscovery is a better term than follow your nose
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gRegor autodiscovery sounds a bit tech-y, wonder if follow your nose is more approachable
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capjamesg What is follow your nose?
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Loqi 👃 follow your nose is an intentional principle for designing discovery algorithms that start with the specific URL you want to discover things about, retrieving headers or contents, and parsing for particular link rel values to URLs to the desired information, in contrast to the “well-known” approach of looking outside the specific URL, like using only its domain and a hardcoded path https://indieweb.org/follow_your_nose
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[tantek] gRegor, yes that was my hope too, more approachable terminology
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[tantek] less jargony
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tantek.com edited /Category:jargon (+20) "+autodiscovery" (view diff)
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