#microformats 2017-03-28

2017-03-28 UTC
nitot, tantek, davidmead and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
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tantek hey kevinmarks, over in #whatwg they were mentioning a github issue about how there is no formal rel-canonical spec https://github.com/whatwg/html/issues/2351 and I pointed out that there is a stub spec http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-canonical that anyone can edit / add to
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tantek since IIRC you're familiar with a lot of details (and have thought a lot about) rel=canonical, want to take a crack at writing something up?
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tantek hmm maybe I will volunteer you in the GH issue :D
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[kevinmarks] I could base it on http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-nofollow
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Loqi rel="nofollow"
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[kevinmarks] hm, except that has all the profile cruft
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tantek no you can do a lot better than nofollow
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tantek just by starting from scratch and documenting the things I mentioned in the GH issue
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tantek the formalisms of the rel-nofollow spec are long out of date, back when I didn't know (as much) about not following W3C spec boilerplate as much
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tantek if you want a spec-like structure / outline of header, and specific headings, I'd say use microformats2 or h-card
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[kevinmarks] Irony: this MSFT page about rel-canonical https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/webmaster/archive/2009/02/12/partnering-to-help-solve-duplicate-content-issues.aspx
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[kevinmarks] I miss the edit notifications
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Loqi misses the edit notifications too
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@davidmosnacz Hey guys, another website has been deployed https://www.eko-agrofarma.cz/ including admin sms notifications, microformats etc. Check it out :) (twitter.com/_/status/846671430209163264)
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[kevinmarks] talking of over-formal: https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6596
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@hex_pm microformats2 (0.0.8): A microformats2 parser (http://microformats.org/wiki/microformats-2) for Elixir https://hex.pm/packages/microformats2 (twitter.com/_/status/846703298463752193)
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aaronpk hm yeah I'm not sure what happened to the edit notifications
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[kevinmarks] Was loqi apologising?
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aaronpk i think someone with admin access to the server just needs to change the IP address in the config file
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[kevinmarks] In theory I have admin access, but I have not used it in years. Tantek may be a better bet.
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aaronpk server admin access? just need to change a line in LocalSettings.php
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@kevinmarks @davecheney a longer answer to "what's wrong with mailing lists" is http://microformats.org/wiki/wiki-better-than-email (twitter.com/_/status/846735873030967296)
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[kevinmarks] Tantek, how's the new rel-canonical page?
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tantek checks logs
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[kevinmarks] Logs don't show edits any more
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[kevinmarks] Aaron needs a config change for his webhook
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tantek ah - did we document how to maintain this somewhere?
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tantek kevinmarks that email list tweet thread ? https://twitter.com/maria_fibonacci/status/846616043871092736
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Loqi [@maria_fibonacci] @davecheney agree. I guess younger people feel more comfortable using shiny UIs.
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tantek and https://twitter.com/davecheney/status/846613023829602305
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Loqi [@davecheney] @LewisCowles1 the point is there is any way to participate in the discussion unless you play @slack's game of always online addiction.
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aaronpk tantek: it's a setting in LocalSettings.php on the server
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tantek aaronpk: ok I will see if I can discover a) the path to that, b) the specific setting
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aaronpk reviews http://microformats.org/wiki/admin-to-do
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Loqi admin to-do
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tantek The problem with this reasoning as justification for mailing lists is that when you try to read (many?) mailing lists after a discussion has "happened" (AKA async), you have to waste time trudging through inflated prose essays, which makes email LESS inclusive to those with time constraints: https://twitter.com/davecheney/status/846614430020354048
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Loqi [@davecheney] @maria_fibonacci not everyone has the liberty to be present in chat 24/7. IMO asynchronous communication is more inclusive.
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aaronpk LocalSettings.php is in the "/wiki/" folder on the server. search for $wgRC2UDPAddress and set it to 'freenode.loqi.me' (it's probably an old IP address right now)
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tantek reviews http://microformats.org/wiki/admin-how-to
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Loqi admin how-to
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tantek found the php file
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tantek aaronpk, same port # ?
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aaronpk yeah
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tantek Do I have to restart MediaWiki to get it to reload LocalSettings.php or does it execute everytime?
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aaronpk it executes every time
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tantek checks to see if wiki is still up
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aaronpk eagerly awaits a wiki notification
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tantek edits the admin-how-to page with notes
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tantek edited /admin-how-to (+731) "irc" (view diff)
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aaronpk yay
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tantek edited /irc (+352) "/* Bots on IRC */ only one known bot currently, link to what to do if bot missing or features missing, note other bots as previous" (view diff)
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tantek tries to make this more discoverable / less head-stateful for the future
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tantek KevinMarks that's a great start on rel-canonical!
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tantek thanks for the research and gathering the citations!
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tantek Next up, I'd say it needs subsections for "Publisher Requirements" "Consuming Code Requirements" with all the should/must language, and then perhaps "This section is non-normative" for the FYI sections
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tantek that ought to do to be spec-like enough for now
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tantek kevinmarks++
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Loqi kevinmarks has 2 karma in this channel (268 overall)
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tantek also, "Discussion" could be "Background" (if you want to de-emphasize it, and put it at the end of the doc), or "Why" (and leave it where it is, as it provides good incentive for publishing / parsing)
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tantek could be *renamed* to
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tantek whereas "Discussion" usually implies and invitation to the discussion :)
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tantek an* invitation
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tantek (I'm starting to understand the value of pull requests that can be proposed instead of just summarily committed, and thus invite discussion on a pull request before committing - perhaps by another person)
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tantek (because the above would make sense as a pull request, with structure, easier to "accept" UI, rather than just lines of IRC)
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hectorMcSpector Hi Folks, I just got an IRC Client back after a long time and i see that this channel is still active (great). I thought it might be worth me posting here that we recently released Apache Any23 http://any23.apache.org.
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hectorMcSpector It supports microformats 1 and 2
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tantek welcome (back) hectorMcSpector!
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tantek and very cool! glad to hear it!
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hectorMcSpector ack
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hectorMcSpector I should have posted to your mailing list
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tantek no no you did the right thing here :)
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hectorMcSpector I'll make sure to do so when we release next time around.
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hectorMcSpector OK doke
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hectorMcSpector cool
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hectorMcSpector Thats good news
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Loqi agreed.
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hectorMcSpector One question...
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tantek same :)
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tantek go ahead
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hectorMcSpector Do you have some sort of test suite? So we can check for compliance?
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[kevinmarks] Adding it to the list of implementations is also a good idea
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tantek yes there is a microformats test suite
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tantek for microformats2 as well
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hectorMcSpector @tantek where is it?
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tantek http://microformats.org/wiki/test-suite is the page about it
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Loqi microformats test suites
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tantek but it lives on github
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[kevinmarks] https://github.com/microformats/tests
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hectorMcSpector @[kevinmarks] we used to be listed on the Website, maybe Any23 was removed?
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tantek http://microformats.org/wiki/any23
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tantek clearly needs an update now :)
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Loqi any23
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hectorMcSpector Yes, I'll go and update that page... thanks folks
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tantek hectorMcSpector: one quick q - previously Any23 did not support parsing hAtom, the classic microformat which has quite widespread adoption (especially in WordPress)
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hectorMcSpector OK @tantek thanks for the links... I'm going to make sure we have implementations for test compliance in Any23.
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tantek did hAtom (specifically root classnames "hentry" and "hfeed") get added in this revision of Any23?
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hectorMcSpector @tantek hentry has been added
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hectorMcSpector hfeed no
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hectorMcSpector :(
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tantek that's a good start!
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hectorMcSpector I'll implement the test suites and then provide an update on where we are with it.
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hectorMcSpector https://github.com/apache/any23/search?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=hentry&type=
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[kevinmarks] The tests map html to json, so depending on your implementation you may be able to map the json to your triples more easily than the html
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hectorMcSpector OK thanks @[kevinmarks]
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tantek hectorMcSpector: were you able to implement general microformats2 parsing and not just current mf2 vocabularies?
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hectorMcSpector FYI folks, out implementations can be seen at https://github.com/apache/any23/tree/master/core/src/main/java/org/apache/any23/extractor/html
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tantek is hopeful
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hectorMcSpector Yes, IIRC this is implemented through the entity based microformat extractor
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hectorMcSpector EntityBasedMicroformatExtractor
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hectorMcSpector http://any23.apache.org/apidocs/index.html?org/apache/any23/extractor/html/EntityBasedMicroformatExtractor.html
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hectorMcSpector I'll log an issue for test compliance
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tantek awesome!
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tantek hectorMcSpector++ !!!
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Loqi hectormcspector has 1 karma
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[kevinmarks] I need to write up the mf1 hfeed backcompat
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tantek edited /rel-nofollow (-50) "rm spam link" (view diff)
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tantek edited /Special:Log/block () "blocked [[User:Autoquangvu]] with an expiry time of infinite (account creation disabled): Spamming links to external sites" (view diff)
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tantek created /Loqi (+39) "stub" (view diff)
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martymcguire[m] the irony of spam links on a page about rel=nofollow
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tantek martymcguire[m]: heh. unintended humor likely
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lewismc edited /any23 (-433) (view diff)
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lewismc edited /parsers (-50) (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk++ for that little bit of info nudge about how to resolve the problem of wiki edits not being reported!
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Loqi aaronpk has 5 karma in this channel (1257 overall)
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lewismc edited /microformats2 (+216) (view diff)
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hectorMcSpector Hi Folks, all of the Any23 documentation and links have been updated. I've also added Any23 to the production parsers...
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hectorMcSpector http://microformats.org/wiki/microformats2#Parsers_in_production
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hectorMcSpector Over and out, I'll be back
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tantek nice work!
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Loqi microformats2
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@isithran @binitamshah Metadata, you forgot to add machine-readable metadata ;-) http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard (twitter.com/_/status/846797418675032065)
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tantek wow the tweet was deleted right away
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