#microformats 2025-03-17

2025-03-17 UTC
sebbu2 and [snarfed] joined the channel
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aaronpk this draft is being presented at the IETF meeting right now, looks like a more complicated version of rel=me https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-org-trust-relationship-protocol-01.html
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aaronpk https://journallist.net/
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[tantek] Yeah I know this from the credweb cg at W3C. Scott presented it there a while ago
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[tantek] More .well-known garbage
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[tantek] well-known--
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Loqi well-known has -1 karma in this channel over the last year (-5 in all channels)
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[tantek] Scott is a nice person and no mal-intent but the "trust.txt" proposal has always been kinda crap technically. I encouraged him to try both rel=me and prototyping whatever ideas he had figuring the act of implementating would help make the flaws more self-evident
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[tantek] [aaronpk] which group / meeting / where?
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[tantek] Which session?
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[tantek] @ me
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aaronpk IETF Bangkok secdispatch
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aaronpk weirdly the draft barely mentions reciprocal links
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aaronpk anyway it sounded like the outcome was to recommend taking it to the W3C instead of IETF
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[tantek] lol
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[tantek] It came from W3C. Smells like venue shopping. I've alerted folks
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[tantek] Thanks for the heads up
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[tantek] I really need to write up something more thoroughly unrecommending well-known except for a very narrow set of use cases (the login/logout thing for example)
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[tantek] I have an outstanding action item to work on this with the TAG since TPAC 2024
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aaronpk mnot made a good comment about that in the session, he pointed out that things in .well-known are explicitly about the origin, not about the organization that owns the domain
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aaronpk and this draft is clearly meant to express relationships about the organization, and has almost nothing to do with the web origin
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[tantek] nice
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[tantek] were mnot's comments scribed somewhere like in minutes that I can cite?
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aaronpk yes, live notes here https://notes.ietf.org/notes-ietf-122-secdispatch
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aaronpk oh and they are already even archived here https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/minutes-122-secdispatch-202503170230/
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[tantek] LOL: "(there was much heckling in the chat)" I can't even
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aaronpk hahaha
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Loqi hahahaha
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aaronpk that chat should be visible too, but it’s not on the web, it’s in zulip
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[tantek] which is js;dr presumably?
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aaronpk it’s a chat app, not a website, so yeah
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aaronpk i think you even need an account to join, but you can then see the archives, like slack/discord
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[tantek] pour one out for XMPP then?
btrem, [KevinMarks], [Trevor_Morris], [jeremycherfas], Guest6, IWSlackGateway, [artlung], [tantek], gRegor, gRegorLove_, [schmarty], Guest6_ and [artlung]1 joined the channel
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mandaris I’m rethinking some of the meta data that I include for individual posts on my website. I have micro formats for the blog and the post. Should I remove the author information because my blog is written only by me?
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mandaris https://mandarismoore.com/2025/02/16/tell-us-something-good.html
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IWDiscord <m​andaris>
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mandaris [edit] I’m rethinking some of the meta data that I include for individual posts on my website. I have micro formats for the blog and the post. Should I remove the author information because my blog is written only by me?
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IWDiscord <m​andaris>
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mandaris https://mandarismoore.com/2025/02/16/tell-us-something-good.html
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gRegor I don't think so. It can be used by link previews or reply contexts, when someone replies to your post
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[tantek] you should markup whatever (meta)data you are visibly displaying on your posts
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[tantek] and then check it with http://indiewebify.me
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Loqi yea!
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gRegor Hm, that permalink has an h-feed, which doesn't seem correct for a single post. Think you just want the h-entry
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[tantek] yep. and indiweb-specific markup questions like that are also totally fine in #indieweb-dev!
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gRegor This is more indieweb-dev, but there are ways you can avoid repeating the author information on each page, if you prefer to link to your homepage that has an h-card. https://indieweb.org/authorship
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gRegor jinx :)
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[tantek] 🙂
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mandaris Could I use meta tags instead? I’m trying to reduce the amount of things that I’m hiding via css
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gRegor See https://indieweb.org/authorship#Dedicated_author_page for how you can not visually show author information on permalinks and only have the h-card on the homepage
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gRegor Then you don't have to visually hide any elements on posts
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gRegor Can discuss more in #indieweb-dev
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[tantek] metatags--
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Loqi metatags has -1 karma over the last year
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mandaris Did not expect to see metatags being disliked
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[tantek] there's lots more on the harms of meta tags and other invisible meta data in https://microformats.org/wiki/invisible-data-considered-harmful