#social 2014-08-21

2014-08-21 UTC
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cmhobbs good evening, socialwg!
nicolagreco, caseorganic, Arnaud, bblfish, azalea, pfefferle, pfefferle_, bblfish_, shepazu, KevinMarks, ShaneHudson, Shane, ajal, englishm, cmhobbs, evanpro, tantek and jasnell joined the channel
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jasnell [AS2] - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-socialweb/2014Aug/0042.html
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tantek jasnell - pretty much all other objects are using a "url" property, e.g. all the microformats from 2005 to present.
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jasnell many use href, many use id, others use link relations
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tantek also IANA Link Relations are largely deprecated/ignored at W3C. E.g. HTML (both W3C HTML5, and WHATWG HTML normatively reference the microformats rel-registry which is both far more comprehensive, and far more up to date.
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tantek jasnell - only use of "href" I know of are <a> and <link> tags in HTML
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tantek id means something completely differently, and microformats that have an "id" property use "uid" to indicate a "universal" (AKA globally intended) ID
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jasnell http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7033#section-4.4.4
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tantek where as "id" attribute in HTML and XML:ID both indicate only a *local* identifier (local in scope to the document / page only)
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tantek "self" was largely a deadend from Atom
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tantek by rfc7033 do you mean webfinger? because webfinger itself is not really a good example to draw any precedents from.
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tantek it's one of the worst examples of reinvention
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tantek nevermind the whole well-known path nonsense
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tantek *not really a good example of a standard or spec for that matter
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jasnell I pointed to webfinger as an example where href was used, not as a model to follow
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tantek also - "alignment with things like JSON-LD" has always appeared purely political, rather than technical for any actual real-world use-case.
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tantek jasnell - sure, my point with webfinger is that it's so broken in so many ways that it's a horrible citation for anything.
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tantek webfinger is largely ignorable.
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jasnell perhaps it is. my goal right now is to simplify the AS2 spec. Having a separate "url" field is unnecessary
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jasnell the JSON-LD stuff has nothing to do with politics. I, for example, use JSON-LD processing to decompose Activities into a graph database for query and analysis. The JSON-LD model gives a very simple and easy way of breaking it down. Sure, there are other ways I could do it, but most of the work has already been done for me.
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tantek jasnell - "url" is perhaps one of *the* most useful properties (fields) we have found - as that's where you can find the thing itself.
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tantek jasnell - interesting to know you have found JSON-LD useful. At the osfw3c workshop a year ago, it was very clear that the pressure for AS2 to use JSON-LD was nearly all political
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tantek as a result a bunch of "we don't need JSON-LD" type posts were written critiquing it
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jasnell there's a ton of the RDF stuff that I find to be absolutely useless... however, breaking down activity data into a graph gives some very interesting advantages. the JSON-LD model gives us a very simple way of doing that. Any other approach would end up simply duplicating the work that's already been done there. I have my own nits with JSON-LD but it actually does prove to be useful when used in moderation
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tantek jasnell - I look forward to understanding your specific constrained useful use of JSON-LD further, pehaps at the f2f.
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tantek as it sounds like something that has to be interactive/in-person to be effective
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jasnell I have a working demo ready to go that I just need to get legal clearance to show off. working on that now
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tantek of the AS2/JSON validator?
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jasnell-github [w3c-socialwg-activitystreams] jasnell pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/CcFOPA
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jasnell-github w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/master 816f024 James M Snell: A pass on simplification of the main spec... pull out most of the...
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jasnell tantek: of an activity stream server endpoint that does json-ld processing.
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jasnell and the validator :-)
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jasnell-github [w3c-socialwg-activitystreams] jasnell pushed 1 new commit to gh-pages: http://git.io/Hn4_KQ
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jasnell-github w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/gh-pages 94a05e8 James M Snell: A pass on simplification of the main spec... pull out most of the...
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jasnell-github [w3c-socialwg-activitystreams] jasnell pushed 1 new commit to gh-pages: http://git.io/XrsbSg
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jasnell-github w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/gh-pages fed9c79 James M Snell: condense the comparison of id's discussion to simplify further
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jasnell-github [w3c-socialwg-activitystreams] jasnell pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/o6PUEg
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jasnell-github w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/master 012e136 James M Snell: condense the comparison of id's discussion to simplify further
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jasnell-github [w3c-socialwg-activitystreams] jasnell pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/Dd-Sig
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jasnell-github w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/master 3c2689e James M Snell: additional minor tweaks
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jasnell-github [w3c-socialwg-activitystreams] jasnell pushed 1 new commit to gh-pages: http://git.io/_A-SeA
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jasnell-github w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/gh-pages cabcd77 James M Snell: additional minor tweaks
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