#social 2014-10-21
2014-10-21 UTC
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# tantek btw - freshly posted by adactio on IndieWeb building blocks they got numerous folks up & running with social personal sites last weekend in Nürnberg: https://adactio.com/journal/7698
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# Arnaud I added a link to today's agenda: https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/2014-10-27
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# RRSAgent logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/10/21-social-irc
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# jtauber Zakim, what's the code?
# elf-pavlik stuck on gas station, can do only IRC and not sure for how long on this hot spot :(
# jtauber Zakim, [IPcaller] is me
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# elf-pavlik if we mute/unmute this way it will not get into minutes!
# MarkCrawford Zakim, +1.703.670.0920 is me
# MarkCrawford zakim, +1.703.670.aabb is me
# AdamB evan: first item approving last weeks minutes
# AdamB ...pretty important resolutions in the minutes ....
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# AdamB ... any objections to approving?
# AdamB .... minutes have been approved
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# AdamB RESOLVED: Approval of Minutes of 14 October 2014
# AdamB evan: like to talk about upcoming face to face ... unfortunately have 2 diff schedules
# AdamB ... will use Arnaud version
# AdamB .... first covering overall direction as a group, where we are going
# AdamB ... discussing AS 2.0 and moving that forward
# AdamB .... new efforts coming up around Social API and Federation protocol ... F2F best time to discuss those
# AdamB Arnaud: first would like to ask people ...schedule of tpac provides 11am to 5pm for adhoc group breakouts ... put together on F2F page for two possible options to choose from
# AdamB ... ... as a working group we should decide our approach ... on that list is straw man to start discussion
# AdamB ... think we should choose between these 2 options
# elf-pavlik q+ re: any news from OpenSocial?
# AdamB ... could mix for example, could do option 1 on monday and option 2 on tuesday
# AdamB evan: one way to max. productivity by taking first day to address 3 major goals of this group
# AdamB ... if conversation goes well on monday will likely have tuesday then to do more break out sessions
# AdamB evan: suggesting option 1 on monday and 2 on tuesday
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# AdamB proposal of: option 1 on monday and tuesday do more break out sessions during the mid day break
# elf-pavlik q-
# jtauber +0
# elf-pavlik +0
# MarkCrawford +1
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# MarkCrawford WG dinner on Monday or Tuesday?
# MarkCrawford Tuesday is AC dinner
# Shane Zakim, ??P18 is me
# Shane Zakim, mute me
# Shane Hi all, sorry I'm late
# AdamB evan: given this structure can we break up the day on monday in to 3 blocks
# MarkCrawford MTWThF
# AdamB MTWTh
# AdamB evan: are ok with leaving agenda for day 2 relatively open and putting that together at the end of day 1
# MarkCrawford Can we have some time for use case presentation from the SocialIG?
# AdamB arnaud: seems to make sense
# AdamB evan: some have been discussing proposals ... this is the optimal time to start making suggestions for presentations etc
# AdamB ... asking that folks that are willing to do that to post to the email list and will fit in to those slots on afternoon of monday
# AdamB ... 5-10 minute presentations
# elf-pavlik harry, anyone from OpenSocial in https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35125/TPAC2014/registrants#SW ?
# MarkCrawford q+
# AdamB arnaud: referencing marks question about giving some time to social IG use cases
# AdamB MarkCrawford: have narrowed down the use cases ... continuing to work them ... would like to share them to the WG
# AdamB ... important for us in the IG to report back on where we stand at this point
# AdamB evan: sounds great, make time on tuesday morning on that?
# AdamB MarkCrawford: that should work, schedule around use case task force leader availability
# AdamB evan: lets plan on tuesday barring any objections
# MarkCrawford q-
# KevinMarks I may be remote too
# AdamB Arnaud: remote participation .. elf and shane remote is all right now? are there others planning to call in?
# Shane I've not checked the times yet for whether I can remote, I think there will be issues with timezones, but we shall we
# Shane *see
# elf-pavlik q+ re: who will participate on Wed in Schema.org and Social WG? https://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2014/SessionIdeas#Schema.org_and_Social_WG
# AdamB Harry: all the rooms have polyphones ... can put a bridge booking request in now
# AdamB evan: sounding like a general framework and with the chairs can resovle the schedule
# AdamB tantek: think its fine to just add directly to wiki
# AdamB ... for remote participation I can setup a audio/video broadcast using Talkie RTC session
# KevinMarks talky++
# AdamB evan: will be able to show screen?
# Shane Yeah talky has show screen
# AdamB tantek: it can pick from multiple inputs
# elf-pavlik talky sounds great!
# AdamB ..including screen share
# AdamB waht about the network issues ?
# AdamB slow network?
# AdamB tantek: also setup an etherpad (sp?) especially if we start doing breakouts
# AdamB ... can be hard to follow IRC
# Shane During indiewebcamps etherpads have been extremely useful
# AdamB evan: sounds great, lets do both
# Zakim elf-pavlik, you wanted to discuss who will participate on Wed in Schema.org and Social WG? https://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2014/SessionIdeas#Schema.org_and_Social_WG
# elf-pavlik ^
# AdamB tantek: this is all in addition to IRC
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# KevinMarks kmarks2 is apparently my username, but when I try to reset I get stuck
# AdamB harry: in response to elf-pavlik question .... breakout session on wednesday to talk about Schema.org and Social WG
# KevinMarks I'm happy to start a new account but it didn't like me trying that with an email it had seen (kevinmarks@gmail.com)
# AdamB evan: I will be there
# AdamB ... def some coordination needed there
# elf-pavlik evan: could you add yourself to that section in a wiki?
# AdamB harry: its an open space 1hr session. good to be there from beginning but can drop in at any time
# AdamB arnaud: tpac registry is officially closed but can register on site
# AdamB harry: our social group space is completely booked
# AdamB harry: space is booked because of observers ... members have priority over them
# AdamB tantek: regarding about participation ...since we are full for monday and tuesday if you are attending as observer please join as member
# KevinMarks is trying to join but w3c password process designed by Kafka
# AdamB ... for folks that do plan on wednesday session about schema and social wg .. for those attending from social wg strongly encourage them to join
# AdamB evan: this wraps up tpac conversation
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# AdamB ... next want to talk about AS 2.0 working draft
# AdamB jasnell: first cut working draft are in and been working with harry fixing up details on html validation. hopefully those are resolved
# AdamB ... one question about the Actions draft
# Arnaud if you're not registered but plan to attend, please add your name to https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/2014-10-27#Participation
# elf-pavlik q+ re Reference issues inline in the spec. https://github.com/jasnell/w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/issues/29
# AdamB ... way the docs are right now the first public working draft points to the editor draft
# AdamB I missed the question
# AdamB due to noise
# AdamB harry: still trying to aim for thursday pub date ... because all 3 drafts are linking to each other the linking validation fails
# AdamB ... wouldn't be good to publish all 3 together would have re-write links
# KevinMarks I am logged in now, but boy that was hard
# elf-pavlik tantek, core has section on PotentialAction which uses terms from Actions Vocab
# AdamB ... in terms of just pure publication have them heavily linked and not on w3c space makes publishing little bit trickier
# elf-pavlik just remove PotentialAction section?
# AdamB jasnell: actions piece is still an open question ... def. interesting in working on but was missing clear use cases so objection was raised due to that
# AdamB arnaud: minutes from last week show that clearly
# elf-pavlik s/remove/move to dedicated spec/
# AdamB ... there is interest in group but non documented yet
# AdamB jasnell: base on that we don't have documented ones for AS either
# MarkCrawford implementations are not necessary until we get further along
# elf-pavlik +1 tantek
# AdamB jasnell: does look to be a public link issues from publishing perspective
# KevinMarks +1 on links having to resolve
# AdamB ... could just publish with actions but that still doesn't commit the wg to do anything with it
# AdamB harry: we hit a hitch in w3c because of the links not resolving .. in general want them to resolve properly
# AdamB ... it might slow things down past thursday
# AdamB evan: is it reasonable to kick out actions for the first version
# AdamB jasnell: could do that .. basic actions has been in AS since the begining
# Shane That makes sense to me
# AdamB ... could do that if that is what this group wants
# elf-pavlik +1 move actions to dedicated spec
# MarkCrawford as an editors draft, why can't we publish w/o the links to gain a broader audience for the work and get more feedback?
# AdamB evan: from my view ... since some discussion and not competely essential to core would suggest trim them out now and address later on
# Zakim elf-pavlik, you wanted to discuss Reference issues inline in the spec. https://github.com/jasnell/w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/issues/29
# elf-pavlik ^
# elf-pavlik i got impression last week that James agreed
# elf-pavlik <wilkie> elf-pavlik: jasnell said that they would be included in the spec as yellow highlighted sections that link to the github issue I believe
# AdamB harry: its not a modularity issue but a links not resolving ..other issue was AS namespace referenced within
# MarkCrawford Harry - does the resolving links requirement apply to all versions, or just final?
# AdamB ... lot of links get 404 errors which is not acceptable
# AdamB ... could monkey patch the links out
# AdamB jasnell: the AS namespace is personally owned by ??? is maintained by AS on github
# AdamB ... i have access to that domain. larger question is do we want to keep that domain / namespace or not?
# Shane Would it be better to move them to the w3 domain, perhaps wiki?
# AdamB thanks harry!
# Shane Zakim, ??P4 is me
# Shane Zakim, mute me
# oshepherd elf-pavlik: No, http://w3.org/<blah>
# AdamB evan: two big issues: 1. adding or removing actions 2. removing AS in the namespaces
# elf-pavlik evanpro, can we come back to my question after you ack me?
# elf-pavlik q+ re Reference issues inline in the spec. https://github.com/jasnell/w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/issues/29
# AdamB tantek: given existing impl have not had to know anything about actions that the spec rec doesn't need to refer to it either. that is what i mean by modularity failure
# AdamB ... its like a layering failure
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# Shane I think the activitystrea.ms should redirect to a page on w3.org, it is unlikely it will dissapear then
# AdamB ... no reason core spec should have to mention it at all. so suggestion its completely commenting out from spec.
# AdamB .. lets pospone any first draft issues
# Lloyd_Fassett Zakim +Lloyd_Fassett
# AdamB harry: namespace is pretty close to a blocker
# AdamB harry: could remove them, comment them out but that is weird cause they are referenced
# AdamB .. could replace with w3c ones
# AdamB ... or could update domain so they don't 404
# AdamB jasnell: does have access so can do it
# AdamB ... just need to have the time
# AdamB evan: its more about the 404 than the namespace issue
# AdamB harry: its kind of weird ... its been done but not common
# evanpro Can we use http://www.w3.org/Social/WG ?
# AdamB ... should at least dedicate real thought sometimebefore last call
# AdamB .. have to fix broken links now
# Loqi evanpro meant to say: Can we use http://www.w3.org/Social/WG ?
# AdamB evan: james, can we setup way to fix broken links
# AdamB jasnell: can try to get it done before end of week but not positive i can get it done
# Shane That's probably the best way, for FPWD
# AdamB harry: i can comment them out for now and add them back in later? are people ok with this?
# MarkCrawford +1 on commenting out the links
# AdamB evan: maybe comment out and open issues to add them back in
# AdamB harry: will do that and mark as editors draft
# AdamB harry: will just comment out all broken links
# elf-pavlik +1 move actions out of core
# Zakim elf-pavlik, you wanted to discuss Reference issues inline in the spec. https://github.com/jasnell/w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/issues/29
# elf-pavlik [from last week minutes] <wilkie> elf-pavlik: jasnell said that they would be included in the spec as yellow highlighted sections that link to the github issue I believe
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# elf-pavlik [from last week minutes] <wilkie> elf-pavlik: jasnell said that they would be included in the spec as yellow highlighted sections that link to the github issue I believe
# AdamB evan: discussing elf question
# AdamB ... not sure understand what the issue is yet elf
# AdamB Arnaud: it has to highlighting within the text with the issue
# elf-pavlik jasnell, thx!
# KevinMarks is this a fragmention use case?
# AdamB tantek: believed would be called out inline within the document. we agreed to publish with that being the case
# AdamB evan: jasnell can we get this in?
# AdamB jasnell: yes
# elf-pavlik harry, how about -comments mailin list?
# AdamB Arnaud: we should use what ever is the most efficient way to the document out. but should put in a tracker for what namespace should be used going forward
# AdamB harry: need those inline issues within the next hour to make it by thursday
# elf-pavlik jasnell, please :)
# AdamB jasnell: i can try to get it in the next hour but very difficult. if there are higher priority ones send email and i can try to do them by most important
# AdamB harry: webmaster needs 1 day to review it
# AdamB ... thats how publications always worked
# elf-pavlik jasnell, just 4 main issues there
# AdamB how hard does that make it for adding issues in the future? does webmaster always have to review those too ?
# KevinMarks managed to log into the wiki too - something must have propogated
# Shane Is the issue about Hydra actually an issue of the spec? I don't think it is, just perhaps something to discuss later possibly
# elf-pavlik I think we at least need to mention missing JSON-LD @context in examples, but other 3 would also make sense from my POV
# AdamB harry: inclined to suggest to link this in later
# AdamB Arnaud: sounding like we go with out the links are we don't go .. not sure if elf would like to hold up the process for that or not
# elf-pavlik can we at lest mention missing @context ?
# AdamB tantek: if there is only a single objection its the chair prerogative to declare rough consensus
# Shane I think we need to get it to FPWD
# AdamB ... if we are risking not getting it out i don't think its worth postponing for this right now
# elf-pavlik i will not block but would appreciate at least mention of missing JSON-LD @context in examples, and maybe one about _:post
# AdamB jasnell: yeah thats as simple as a link ... but if we have no place to host that officially but there is a link to that context in document already
# AdamB evan: since it's called out maybe take an action to link directly but willing to go with what we have right now
# elf-pavlik with a link to context at that stage?
# Shane Sorry I have to rush away, thanks everyone.
# AdamB harry: most working groups only call out substantial issues directly in the spec
# elf-pavlik anyways, i trust in your decision folks so just go ahead without including that request from me
# elf-pavlik ok, end of this topic?
# AdamB evan: would like to wrap up agenda items we have open and defer to next week at F2F, any objections?
# AdamB ... ok would like to adjourn
# Arnaud here is what's currently available (because I asked ;-) http://www.w3.org/2014/11/TPAC/schedule.html
# AdamB trackbot, end meeting
# RRSAgent I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/21-social-minutes.html trackbot
# elf-pavlik goes back hichhiking :) ciao o/
# AdamB you bet
# AdamB i won't be arriving until about 12:00 on monday
# tantek linked right there on our home page: https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg#Members
# tantek AdamB - go ahead an add yourself to https://www.w3.org/wiki/Irc-people
# tantek For anyone interested in the Social API work in this WG, if you're in SF, make your way to see benwerd's talk today at 17:00 PDT at Moscone: http://werd.io/2014/the-web-is-your-api-feeds-and-actions-using-html5
# KevinMarks hm, so I have w3c profile, I can edit the wiki, but I can't log into the invited experts form
# KevinMarks oh wait, I can if I try 3 times
# KevinMarks o_O
# KevinMarks the popup for affiliation is quite the thing too
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