#social 2015-10-07
2015-10-07 UTC
nicolagreco, tilgovi_, jasnell, bblfish, KevinMarks, tantek, wilkie_, tilgovi, the_frey, jasnell_ and elf-pavlik joined the channel
# 
elf-pavlik rhiaro, re: http://rhiaro.co.uk/2015/05/generating
# elf-pavlik {
# elf-pavlik "@type": "Consume",
# elf-pavlik "published": "2015-05-15T13:06:00+02:00",
# elf-pavlik "actor": "http://rhiaro.co.uk/about#me",
# elf-pavlik "object": {
# elf-pavlik "title": "An apple"
# elf-pavlik } }
# elf-pavlik I see blank node totally fine here, if you really want you could ofcourse alwasy do http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf11-concepts/#section-skolemization
# elf-pavlik "@id": "http://rhiaro.co.uk/skolems/8281ef48-32ac-47c3-b6a5-f72854568e8a" - a one liner in source code
# elf-pavlik but "@type"/rdf:type IMO comes more interesting here or for more 'relaxed' usage mf:category
# elf-pavlik or for @type trying http://www.productontology.org/
# elf-pavlik so the "@id" doesn't matter in cases like that, it can if you redeem a meel voucher in places like http://cafeerde.com/
# elf-pavlik we should work with such use cases soon in http://valueflo.ws/ and https://www.w3.org/community/economy/
# elf-pavlik ATM I stay in coutryside near paris with couple of people working on http://openfoodnetwork.org/
# elf-pavlik also meeting more peple workin on various projects linked to in README of https://github.com/ouisharelabs/food-dashboard
# elf-pavlik another example of useful blank node (which one can always easily skolemize!) https://schema.org/TypeAndQuantityNode
# 
ben_thatmustbeme hey elf-pavlik, was just reading rhiaro's post and had a few questions for someone who does their site entirely activity based
# ben_thatmustbeme if you are around
# ben_thatmustbeme or anything else i suppose
# ben_thatmustbeme s/anything/anyone/
# ben_thatmustbeme still waking up
# ben_thatmustbeme in any case, let me just put some questions here. those that have actual implementations, how do you store your posts/activities?
# ben_thatmustbeme are they only stored as activities, and so to generate a front end your site (latest posts / wall / whatever you want to call it)
# ben_thatmustbeme I am more thinking along the lines that activities and posts are not the same, yes they overlap on "create" and "like" but they are really not the same. and maybe we should be defining ways to define both
# ben_thatmustbeme look at facebook, You have your "notifications" drop down, (actually they have several based on how you group people) but it shows things like "Bill added a new photo" and a thumbnail, "john updated his status" without the status text, "Stephanie commented on your post" without text.
# ben_thatmustbeme these are clearly activities, it has likes, comments, etc
# ben_thatmustbeme but rarely content, or only part of the content
# ben_thatmustbeme someone's wall or i guess they call it "timeline" now, is completely different it shows only posts, reposts, events, etc It shows full or sometimes nearly full content (have to click to expand) along with comments. and now to see comments on comments you have to view the post at its original URL
# ben_thatmustbeme These are very very different from activities, activities really don't contain comments, unless you are sending across extra data.
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# ben_thatmustbeme also, most activity feeds on sites (facebook, G+, LinkedIn) all have a limited time length before they are discarded
# ben_thatmustbeme if you stop using those sites for a while you'll notice they drop to empty lists
# ben_thatmustbeme which makes sense really, do we care about activities that happened 2 years ago ( outside of the person themselves possibly wanting to store it)
# ben_thatmustbeme AS2 specs out how to write those activity feeds, but thats all
# ben_thatmustbeme the indiewebcamp has really done everything via posts but we were not doing notifications at all yet. When aaron and I started doing notifications it became pretty clear (to me at least) that these need to be stored differently, they are different content entirely most times
# ben_thatmustbeme aaronpk i'm sure could explain all the text he had to go through to get notifications on his phone working because he had to figure out copy for every one of those notifications
# ben_thatmustbeme I'm more of the opinion that we actually need both
# elf-pavlik ben_thatmustbeme, I started modeling my data in context of w3c-social here https://github.com/hackers4peace/plp-test-data/blob/master/w3c-social.jsonld
# elf-pavlik I don't follow current AS2.0 draft but stay very close to how it works
# elf-pavlik major difference explained in https://github.com/w3c-social/social-vocab/wiki/Verbs---owl:Class-vs.-rdf:Property
# elf-pavlik this gives me 'follow' nose to specific collections and counters to show before 'following the nose'
# elf-pavlik I also can start from event and find - list of attendees, speakers, organizers etc. https://github.com/hackers4peace/plp-test-data/blob/master/w3c-social.jsonld#L214-L230
# elf-pavlik this will come useful for defining ACL eg. only organizers can update event itself, but attendees and speakers can post to event's wall
# elf-pavlik no matter if it uses direct POST or webmention indirection ACL seems orthogonal IMO
# elf-pavlik actually webmention adds extra complexity of giving endpoint access to secret post to include it on event's wall, but i know IWC explores this topic
# elf-pavlik for now i work very close to https://www.w3.org/wiki/WebAccessControl
# elf-pavlik which SoLiD uses
# elf-pavlik ben_thatmustbeme, IMO both can complement each other, we just need to align on usage of vocabularies and clarify different semantics of used terms
# elf-pavlik i tend to draw diagram to show the underlying EAV model and avoid arguments about particular syntax
# elf-pavlik with graphs people can draw edges very freely and if one can traverse it in multiple ways ofter good reasons exist to have those different ways
# ben_thatmustbeme elf-pavlik: the most interesting thing to me is that when I started to work on notifications/activities I found no need for explicit typing for them. Since its just a stream of activities that link to something for more info
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# 
jasnell you might want to start here: https://github.com/digitalbazaar/pyld
# jasnell once initialized, I can ask it questions like reasoner.node('http://example.org/foo').is('http://example.org/bar') to determine if a 'foo' can be considered a type of 'bar'
# 
aaronpk here's an example of what I was talking about yesterday... facebook does it. <html lang="en" prefix="op: http://media.facebook.com/op#">
# aaronpk but http://media.facebook.com/op --> ERR_NAME_NOT_RESOLVED
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# elf-pavlik aaronpk++
# elf-pavlik cwebber2, I guess you keep in mind that pretty much all properties can have multiple values?
# elf-pavlik in general checks for .includes? work better than ==
# elf-pavlik cwebber2, illustration of rdfs:subClassOf inference which AS2.0 vocab defines in non normative way http://www.slideshare.net/EUCLIDproject/querying-linked-data/61
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# elf-pavlik cwebber2, do you think I clarified this issue in my last comment?
# elf-pavlik would your implementation handle it as expected? expanding CURIE used as *values* to IRI?
# elf-pavlik thanks!
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# 
Loqi Tantekelik made 1 edit to [[Socialwg]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=85901&oldid=85865
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