#social 2018-01-16

2018-01-16 UTC
rowan, mib_mbeteo, xmpp-social, Loqi, KevinMarks, JanKusanagi, jankusanagi_, jankusanagi__, KjetilK, KevinMarks_ and cdchapman joined the channel
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cwebber2 beep beep
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cwebber2 aaronpk: next meeting is tomorrow, yeah?
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cwebber2 should edit the wiki page
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aaronpk o yea guess so!
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cwebber2 anyone have topics they want me to put on the agenda for tomorrow?
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csarven cwebber2, note taravancil (beaker/dat) here
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cwebber2 taravancil: oh!
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cwebber2 hello / welcome :)
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taravancil hi! pfrazee will be joining here soon
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pfrazee o/
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saranix when is meeting?
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cwebber2 context: https://twitter.com/dustyweb/status/953299602861588487
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Loqi [@dustyweb] Dat / Beaker looking at exploring ActivityStreams: https://github.com/beakerbrowser/beaker/issues/820 Really excited about this!
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cwebber2 saranix: tomorrow
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saranix thx
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cwebber2 https://www.w3.org/wiki/SocialCG/2018-01-16
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cwebber2 pfrazee: taravancil: not sure if you'd like to join the call, but you'd be very welcome to do so :)
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aaronpk whoops I put the wrong date in the url
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pfrazee cwebber2: :) appreciate it
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cwebber2 I'd be happy to put what you're workingo n in the agenda
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cwebber2 aaronpk: oops!
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aaronpk fixed https://www.w3.org/wiki/SocialCG/2018-01-17
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cwebber2 aaronpk: ty :)
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aaronpk oh you made the page
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aaronpk I thought I did that last week :)
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pfrazee cwebber2: too busy this week but appreciate the offer
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cwebber2 aaronpk: yeah, I made the mistake!
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cwebber2 go figure :)
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cwebber2 pfrazee: taravancil: we'll have another meeting in 2 weeks
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cwebber2 if you'd like to do it then
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cwebber2 (or if it's hard for you to schedule around the SocialCG time and you'd like to catch up one on one, just ping me)
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pfrazee cwebber2: we'll be in SF the last week of the month, so we may be traveling. But even better, if anybody here lives in SF, maybe we can meet for drinks or coffee
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cwebber2 pfrazee: ah, unfortunately I don't!
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pfrazee cwebber2: too bad! Well if you're ever in austin :)
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cwebber2 btw pfrazee
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cwebber2 next Rebooting Web Of Trust is March 5-9 in Santa Barbara
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cwebber2 last RWoT was a blast for me
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cwebber2 if you're interested in going
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cwebber2 folks working on related things
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pfrazee cwebber2: yeah tara and I are constrained on travel budgets but if we can make it, we'd be very happy to be there
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pfrazee cwebber2: Im looking at activitypub's spec and thinking about how a dat app could leverage it. One of the interesting differences is about how objects are created. My read of the spec so far is that clients affect changes by sending activities to servers, and those activities wrap objects. In the dat ecosystem, we have a shared FS of json objects, so you could think of it kind of like an object store that's exposed directly to the client app
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pfrazee cwebber2: my natural inclination would be, instead of using activities, we'd just write the object records and assemble the feeds from them
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pfrazee cwebber2: but I suppose the other option would be to write the object records, and then also write activities as .json files which reference the object .json files
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cwebber2 pfrazee: yeah... so ActivityPub is fairly "side-effect'y"
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pfrazee cwebber2: right, sensible for the federated server design
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cwebber2 we had some discussion, back in the day, about whether or not Create was really needed
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cwebber2 in some ways it's probably the case that it would be much easier to do a non-side'effect'y design without Create
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cwebber2 some of the other verbs may still be useful
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cwebber2 eg Like, even on an append-only datastructure, is still useful
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pfrazee right
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cwebber2 pfrazee: so is there anything else cruft'y aside from Create in a p2p append-only structure context?
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cwebber2 pfrazee: basically Delete and etc become more informative then
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cwebber2 so does Update
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pfrazee cwebber2: right there'd probably be no need for update or delete. I'll keep reading and mention thoughts as they come to me
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cwebber2 pfrazee: thanks :)
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pfrazee cwebber2: the inbox/outbox differs. In a way, every dat is an outbox, and the inbox is assembled by syncing the followed outboxes.
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pfrazee if I were to try to build a reliable mail system on top of Dat, one element I'd include is a federated server layer which helps the client discover mail from users that they don't follow. That server could discover the mail by crawling the dat network like a search-engine spider, or it could use a server-to-server signal like activitypub does. (I hope that's illustrative of how dat works.)
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cwebber2 pfrazee: interesting!
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