#indiewebcamp 2013-04-11

2013-04-11 UTC
josephboyle, bnvk, duckbillp, spinnerin, b0bg0d, smus and jedahan joined the channel
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tantek.com edited /posts-elsewhere (+48) "/* Automatic */ tommorris.org also supports rel=syndication on links to syndicated copies of his posts" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /posts-elsewhere (+15) "/* See Also */ comments" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /comment (+55) "/* POSSE a comment */ improve grammar, more details" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /comment-presentation (+886) "/* Existing specifications for display */ example of how Pingback displays are nearly always useless and the problems it demonstrates" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /posts-elsewhere (+95) "rel-syndication is now defined on microformats.org" (view diff)
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tommorris afternoon barnabywalters
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barnabywalters afternoon tommorris
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barnabywalters just munging some SVG at Vísar
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barnabywalters flexi-charts FTW :)
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barnabywalters nice one on the auto-addition of syndication links
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tommorris semi-auto-add at the moment
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tommorris app.net is done by parsing the RSS feed and updating the database
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barnabywalters wow, that’s full on
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tommorris which is currently done by me triggering the parse command in a Ruby shell. eventually, it'll be a cron job
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tommorris the RSS feed is pretty handy actually
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tommorris https://alpha-api.app.net/feed/rss/users/49269/posts
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tommorris each item has a link back to the source <atom:link href="whatever" type="text/html" rel="source" />
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barnabywalters oh, cool — so they delivered on one open standard, at least
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tommorris so it's just a matter of getting each item, matching them up using that, and then retrieving the URL of the app.net post
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tommorris so, <item>... <link>https://alpha.app.net/tommorris/post/4656089</link><atom:link href="http://tommorris.org/posts/8198" type="text/html" rel="source"/></item>
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barnabywalters wow, that’s nifty
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barnabywalters so, “source” — you can tell ADN that a post is a POSSEd copy?
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tommorris well, on IFTTT, you can include a link
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tommorris so https://alpha.app.net/tommorris/post/4656089 - it has a line that says "from tommorris.org" - that's a link back
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barnabywalters ah, of course — so you’re (ab?)using the posted from field to link back. That’s a great approach
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barnabywalters much more interesting than linking to the app used, which I think (?) was the purpose?
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tommorris no, it's meant for that
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barnabywalters really? cool
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tommorris I mean, from other silos
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tommorris is how I think they wanted it
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barnabywalters ah, okay
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tommorris like, you posted a photo on Instagram
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tommorris it'd say "from Instagram"
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barnabywalters well, either way, it works
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tommorris with a link back to the original pic on Instagram
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tommorris I'd know more about how it worked if I became an App.net developer, but $99 buys a lot of cocktails.
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barnabywalters tommorris: that you’ve got POSSEing with backlinks set up without forking out for the dev price is impressive
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tommorris I'll document it when I'm not working. ;)
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barnabywalters awesome :)
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tommorris also without paying for a user account
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tommorris free account
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tommorris the free account doesn't let you follow more than 30 people IIRC
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tommorris but I don't really care about following people. I have an RSS reader. ;)
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barnabywalters oh, is that a limitation? interesting
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barnabywalters what’s sold as a feature in path is a limitation elsewhere :)
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tommorris the idea is that you'll hit 30 people and become so addicted you'll pay the $30 or whatever to upgrade
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@BarnabyWalters @laurakalbag feel free to point cross-poster builders towards POSSE To Twitter, we (@indiewebcamp) have documented… http://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/1274/
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barnabywalters hmph, looks like t.co is broken
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tantek barnabywalters, what was the problem with t.co?
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barnabywalters tantek: it stopped working for a little while
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tantek.com edited /Twitter (+658) "fix heading hierarchy a bit, not everything is about porting to twitter, POSSE Replies fixes, distinguish POSSE Replies to Tweets and POSSE Replies to Twitter" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /App.net (+713) "How to / POSSE to ADN" (view diff)
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tantek tommorris - I tried outlining what you described about POSSEing to ADN here a bit, but could use your help with details: http://indiewebcamp.com/App.net#POSSE_to_ADN
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tommorris tantek: will pop the code I use up.
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tommorris tantek: https://gist.github.com/tommorris/5364658
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tantek.com created /rel-syndication (+354) "stub" (view diff)
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tommorris.org edited /App.net (+114) "code" (view diff)
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tommorris so, app.net's Atom feed uses rel="source" to link from the ADN version to the original version. it'd be nice if their HTML did likewise. ;)
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tantek it really should use rel=canonical in the HTML version
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tantek although the example you gave only showed your blog post title on ADN
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tantek whereas you had a complete post on your own site
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tantek I thought from the ADN post that it was only a short note kvetching about mobile internet
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tantek it's not obvious that I should click through to an entire blog post
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tantek that's a case where it may make more sense to include the full URL to your blog post inline in the post
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tommorris yeah, for posts with titles, I just syndicate the title to ADN. for posts without titles, I sync the first ~400 chars (whatever the ADN limit is)
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tantek.com created /syndication (+409) "stub" (view diff)
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tommorris so here is a truncated one - https://alpha.app.net/tommorris/post/4661001 - http://tommorris.org/posts/8199
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tantek tommorris - here's the description of best practices so far for POSSEing an article (blog post) to a microblogging silo: http://indiewebcamp.com/Twitter#POSSE_Articles_to_Twitter
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tommorris I should have a public list on indiewebcamp.com of things I should fix to be more indieweb-compliant
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Loqi agreed.
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tantek.com created /IFTTT (+174) "stub" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Ferocity (+71) "add To Do section" (view diff)
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tommorris.org edited /User:Tommorris.org (+42) "/* personal site todo */ adding link to [[tommorris.org public todo]] - be bold and add things I ought to be doing. ;)" (view diff)
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tommorris oh, yes, [[Ferocity]] does the job
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tantek.com edited /Ferocity (+8) "TOC" (view diff)
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tantek there you go: http://indiewebcamp.com/Ferocity#To_Do :)
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tommorris.org edited /User:Tommorris.org (-24) "Undo revision 2346 by [[Special:Contributions/Tommorris.org|Tommorris.org]] ([[User talk:Tommorris.org|talk]])" (view diff)
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tommorris.org edited /Ferocity (+101) "/* To Do */ adding tantek's suggestion" (view diff)
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tommorris do feel free to expand. ;)
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tantek awesome
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tantek.com edited /App.net (+146) "/* POSSE to ADN */ add ellipsed note example" (view diff)
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tantek tommorris, what's the ruby code for? I thought your POSSEing to ADN just used IFTTT?
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tommorris the Ruby code is for pulling the data back out of ADN
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tantek have I misunderstood the flow? http://indiewebcamp.com/App.net#POSSE_to_ADN
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tommorris parses the Atom feed and updates the posts
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tantek parses which Atom feed and updates which posts?
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tommorris so, I post to tommorris.org
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tommorris ifttt periodically polls my Atom feed and syndicates it to ADN
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tommorris then my site periodically polls https://alpha-api.app.net/feed/rss/users/49269/posts to work out what the ADN URL is for each post
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tommorris then updates the post on my site to link to the ADN version
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tommorris which seems very Heath Robinson, but such is the problem of silos
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tantek a-ha because the IFTTT runs sometime later, and you have to explicitly do work later to go get the syndication permalink
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tommorris yep
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tommorris in an ideal world, I'd send a copy directly to ADN in a message queue from my site
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tommorris but that'd require an ADN API key, and I'd rather spend the $100 on tequila.
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tantek.com edited /App.net (+906) "/* POSSE to ADN */ better sumary and flow reinterpreted from TomMorris description in IRC, also pay alternative" (view diff)
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tantek ok I think I understood a bit better - is this right? http://indiewebcamp.com/App.net#POSSE_to_ADN
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tommorris yep, that's brill tantek
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tantek it's like, secondhand knowledge!
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tantek so is 400 characters the ADN post limit?
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tommorris no, 256. 400 was in my brain from something else
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tantek.com edited /App.net (+57) "citation for post limit" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk, barnabywalters, here's a good example of a full fledged article post which is clearly a direct reply to another article post. In this case, copying the first paragraph of the reply article as a comment on the original article (with a "view more" hyperlink to the permalink) would work quite well.
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tantek so perhaps that would be a good heuristic for abbreviating an article (without an explicit p-summary) when copying into a "Comments" section - use the first paragraph.
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tantek oh forgot the URL. here is the reply article: http://alistapart.com/column/hellish-other-people
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tantek ok new challenge
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tantek check out this TFA with GA article: http://www.twilio.com/blog/2013/04/add-two-factor-authentication-to-your-website-with-google-authenticator-and-twilio-sms.html
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tantek and figure out a way to use the methods described with RelMeAuth to implement TFA (Two Factor Auth) with your own domain
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tommorris tantek: I used to do two-factor-auth to log in to my own site. implemented it myself in JavaME, back when that was a thing.
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tommorris I just sha1'd secret string + Unix epoch / 100 (so it'd refresh every 100 seconds)
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tommorris then the iPhone happened and I couldn't be bothered to port it over to a smartphone platform.
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tommorris and... someone does a password reset on my OpenID provider. I remember why two factor auth seems like a good idea.
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tantek whoa - really? someone is attacking your OpenID provider?
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tommorris wordpress.com is my OpenID provider.
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tommorris myopenid seemed to fail too much so I switched over to the wp account I have
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tantek ah, yes, they're a big target in general
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tommorris wordpress.com now does two-factor auth
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tantek as is WordPress the software
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tantek is their two-factor auth open sourced somewhere?
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tantek would be great to figure out how to adapt that for any indieweb site
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tommorris it's Google Authenticator
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tantek sure, it uses GA on the backend, but I mean the UI/glue code
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tantek that connects to GA
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tommorris en.blog.wordpress.com/2013/04/05/two-step-authentication/
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tantek oh hey, 2 letter language code subdomains, where have we seen that anti-pattern before ;)
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tommorris is it an anti-pattern on, say, wikipedia?
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tantek :)
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tantek ooh this is what I was asking for (I think) http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/google-authenticator/
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tommorris put 2FA on my wordpress.com acc
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tommorris tantek: implementing 2FA isn't too hard. not sure about Google Auth, but having written my own implementation, it can't be too hard. ;)
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tantek.com edited /IndieAuth (+508) "/* To do */ add TFA support for providers that support it (e.g. Google!)" (view diff)
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tommorris the hardest thing about writing my own 2FA app was that SHA1 isn't part of the JavaME API, so had to write my own implementation of SHA1
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tantek aaronpk: http://indiewebcamp.com/IndieAuth#tfa-support - pretty please? :)
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tommorris which is just a matter of taking the algorithm and writing it in Java.
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tantek tommorris - is perhaps something (that algorithm implementation) that should go into the W3C Crypto API?
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tantek https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/webcrypto-api/raw-file/tip/spec/Overview.html
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tantek or perhaps it already does? perhaps you can decipher https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/webcrypto-api/raw-file/tip/spec/Overview.html#sha
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tommorris would rather if nothing he'd written crypto-wise would ever run on anybody's devices ever.
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tommorris standardising hashing and crypto in JavaScript seems sensible.
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tommorris I'd say it seems fairly straightforward, but I've read W3C specs like the old RDF C&AS doc and found it fairly clear while others found it completely imponderable
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tommorris so I'm perhaps not a good test of intuitive simplicity
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tommorris especially as I tend to use words like "adicity" without a second thought.
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tantek this is interesting: http://laughingsquid.com/inactive-account-manager-after-a-google-user-dies-a-will-for-their-google-data/
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tantek I wonder what an indieweb version of that would look like
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aaronpk waves from Portland
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aaronpk back on west coast time
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