#indiewebcamp 2013-05-07

2013-05-07 UTC
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pdurbin I'm not a big fan of URL shorteners but whatever
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tantek pdurbin - yeah, in general I tend to agree. It's a way to deal with POSSEing to silos with post length limits
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tantek also, I'm a big believer in algorithmic shorteners, rather than database-backed shorteners (which die when the database disappears, ineveitably)
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tantek pdurbin, in addition, permashortcitations in POSSEd copies enable original-post-discovery
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tantek so those reasons make personal short domains worth it IMO
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pdurbin tantek: I guess I just don't use any silos with post length limits. from the wiki it sounds like foursquare has such a limit
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tantek.com created /rel-in-reply-to (+271) "stub" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /in-reply-to (-20) "l" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /in-reply-to (+22) "see also" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /Foursquare (+464) "stub" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /short-domains (+1517) "add more explicit reasons why (now that we've come up with and implemented more!)" (view diff)
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tantek pdurbin - there you go, now documented more thoroughly: http://indiewebcamp.com/short-domains#why_personal_short_URLs
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pdurbin cool. makes sense for anyone doing POSSE, I guess
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pdurbin tantek: any chance http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/today could be made to redirect to the current day's IRC log?
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tantek aaronpk ^^^
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pdurbin aaronpk: oh, links for "previous day" and "next day" would be appreciated as well :)
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tantek pdurbin - POSSE is kind of key to this iteration of the indieweb - beyond just blogging
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tantek we want to own our content yet still stay in touch with our friends on the silos
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tantek POSSE is the best we've come up with so far to do so
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pdurbin tantek: so what if you publish to Twitter but someone replies to you via Twitter and you want to reply back? do you just reply on Twitter?
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tantek no you reply on your own site and syndicate your reply to twitter
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pdurbin so you're kind of building you own http://hootsuite.com ?
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tantek well hootsuite was just another twitter app
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tantek here's details on how to reply to folks on Twitter: http://indiewebcamp.com/comment#POSSE_a_comment
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tantek aaronpk and barnabywalters are now regularly doing this
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tantek it's pretty awesome
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tantek I'm working on adding support for POSSE replies to Falcon as well (what runs the posts on tantek.com)
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pdurbin so for aaronpk it's a feature of http://indiewebcamp.com/p3k
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tantek right
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gRegorLove Hello. More fun with indieauth / relmeauth. :) This seems pretty straightforward, but is causing me trouble. The links are set up properly on gregorlove.com and twitter.com/gregorlove, but indieauth is telling me "There was an error verifying this provider. Confirm you have a rel="me" link on this site pointing to your website."
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gRegorLove Tried the twitter link with https and without
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gRegorLove Same response. Doesn't seem to be finding my URL on twitter
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@wirresnet [link] http://indiewebcamp.com/Main_Page http://indiewebcamp.com/Main_Page
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@6efc That previous post (and this) will be the only tweets I ever submit directly to Twitter. Everything else will be http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE
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christopheducamp.com edited /Why_web_sign-in-fr (+458) "[fr: sync'd translation]" (view diff)
laurian, duckbillp, bnvk, adactio, mxuribe, bnvk_, scor, bnvk__, eschnou, josephboyle, singpolyma, b0bg0d, tantek, fmarier, spinnerin, benwerd, caseorganic, seyz, xtof, b0bg0d1, barnabywalters and tilgovi joined the channel
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tantek !tell gRegorLove why are you display:none'ing your Twitter link on gregorlove.com? I don't think that affects IndieAuth but it might? aaronpk - gregorlove.com appears to be setup with rel-me to @gRegorLove but isn't working. Take a look?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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aaronpk arg, another t.co problem
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aaronpk twitter only t.co's some peoples' URLs, not sure how it decides
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tantek aaronpk - it might be based on age of account, presence of normalish activity
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barnabywalters looks like gregorlove has a github account, I’ve found GH to be a better auth provider than twitter recently
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barnabywalters twitter’s been repeatedly asking me to reauthenticate
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aaronpk GH is definitely the most solid
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aaronpk also app.net works great now
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barnabywalters oh cool!
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tantek aaronpk - good to know - perhaps we should re-order them in the status template accordingly
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tantek and at least log this as part of IndieAuth trouble-shooting
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tantek btw
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tantek aaronpk, barnabywalters any thoughts on the iterations to http://indiewebcamp.com/Getting_Started#Connect and the section after?
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tantek before I go updating all the remaining Getting Started steps
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aaronpk ah great!
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barnabywalters tantek: looks good
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aaronpk yes, I like the "zeroth" step, as well as the shortened section for "Personal Domain"
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barnabywalters +1 on the de-emphasis of short domains as well — an extra step, extra money, and short domains are meh anyway
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tantek thanks guys
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tommorris never really bothered with the short URL thing
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aaronpk I think more steps that are smaller and easier to understand are better!
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tantek barnabywalters - re: short domains, do you mean you like how I changed it? or are you suggesting further de-emphasis?
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tantek tommorris - I think short domains are going to be very handy for original post discovery
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barnabywalters tantek: I like how it is now — a nice-to-have, but not as important as main domain
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tantek especially when you want to put permashortcitations in POSSE'd notes but not permashortlinks
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tantek barnabywalters - thanks for the clarification, and yes, that's the balance I was aiming for.
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tommorris the new OpenStreetMap editor is mindblowingly awesome.
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tommorris no Flash or Java required. all in-browser Ajax, and open source too. ;)
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barnabywalters tommorris: briansuda mentioned that at work!
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barnabywalters it sounds great
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tommorris I just did my first edit and it needed nothing more than a browser.
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tommorris should try it from an iPad. ;)
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barnabywalters oh, and OSM doesn’t fail on OpenID logins anymore
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barnabywalters wow, that’s shiny
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barnabywalters starts adding house numbers on my street
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tommorris performance is a bit shit on iPad 1
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barnabywalters tommorris: yeah, I’ll stick to using pushpin on iPad, but for desktop editing that’s fab
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tommorris barnabywalters: oh boy oh boy, they've nicked the JOSM keyboard commands too. Q orthogonalizes.
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tommorris is very happy.
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tantek.com edited /To-do (+1257) "Improve [[Getting Started]] - record state/intentions here publicly (instead of a private todo text file)" (view diff)
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@sandeepshetty Happy with solution for auto-tagging I came up with for #converspace http://sandeep.shetty.in/2013/05/thinking-about-metadata.html Looking forward to some feeback from #indieweb
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tantek sandeepshetty - if you're looking for indieweb feedback, you should /join #indiewebcamp on IRC
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tantek.com edited /Why_web_sign-in (+33) "/* Why not Open ID */ OpenID" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /OpenID (+52) "Why not OpenID" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Why_web_sign-in (+32) "/* Why not both OpenID and Web sign-in */ used to" (view diff)
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tantek welcome b0bg0d!
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tantek related to Getting Started
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tantek how do we further explain/propagate the importance of indieweb to the broader open web?
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b0bg0d thanks @tantek
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aaronpk and also how do we make it easier for people to "get on the bandwagon" so to speak?
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b0bg0d hey — i only have 5 mins before i need to do something else
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b0bg0d but let me drop an idea to the group
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b0bg0d just as the web is client-server
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b0bg0d so is there two sides to the web
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b0bg0d user and publisher
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b0bg0d nearly 99% of web platform development, from HTML to JS performance, primary to exclusively benefit the *publisher*
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b0bg0d the user web remains woefully underdeveloped
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b0bg0d user agents do very little more than back and bookmark
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b0bg0d the opportunity for the user web is enable users to present as much code + data to publishers as publisher present to users
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b0bg0d this is most realized in browser extensions, but the UX to date has been geeks-only — you have to know that to change your relationship with a publisher, you must modify your client with third-party software. that is to say, as a user you have to know how the web works before you can even begin to assert your agency.
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tantek b0bg0d - perhaps take a look at (the in progress) http://indiewebcamp.com/Getting_Started page and make suggested improvements!
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b0bg0d ask any car driver what are the first five things a car does when one turns the key. all of them wil get it wrong.
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b0bg0d tantek — will do. :)
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tantek b0bg0d depends on the year/make of car, different key-based (so to speak) security systems etc.
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b0bg0d heh, that too.
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tantek ;)
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b0bg0d anyway, that's my dangerously reductionistic mental model of user web vs publisher web. :)
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b0bg0d gotta run. i'll be around later tonight. cheers!
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tantek perhaps some aspects of rebellion in here that may provide motivation for/towards the indieweb: http://techcrunch.com/2013/05/05/iterations-facebook-youthful-rebellion/
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pdurbin tommorris: the openstreetmap thing *does* look good. linked it up at http://irclog.greptilian.com/sourcefu/2013-05-07#i_5950 ... thanks
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tantek.com edited /Facebook (+966) "see also, articles" (view diff)
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pdurbin b0bg0d: dunno if you've ever used http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amaya_%28web_editor%29
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pdurbin I did, years ago. it's a web browser that's also an editor from the W33
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pdurbin initial release: 1996 :) ... old school
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tantek pdurbin - way to drop the old school reference :)