2013-05-08 UTC
# 00:07 pdurbin heh. I think I only ever used it to edit local files
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# 00:15 tantek I think we here (#indiewebcamp) have the best chance of re-attaining a read-write web.
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# 00:22 pdurbin tantek: well, the web was more read/write back when the only people on the web were pioneers and technologists, right? people who were motivated to register their own domains, maybe even host stuff themselves
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# 04:42 tantek we have *got* to solve the indie events posting + RSVP problem
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# 09:46 pdurbin I still use evite. old school, I guess :) ... works well enough for me
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# 14:52 aaronpk really tempted to add full h-event support to IndieNews this weekend
# 14:53 aaronpk right now it recognizes h-events and uses the event title + venue as the headline for the entry
# 14:54 tantek aaronpk - how about the datetime at the start?
# 14:55 aaronpk I also would love to see a calendar view of entries
# 14:56 aaronpk well I'll add an "/events" URL that shows just the h-events it found
# 14:56 tantek at most, a calendar widget to click-on to scroll around is a nice-to-have
# 14:56 barnabywalters if people want calendar view, they should feed the h-entry -> VCALENDAR into their calendar app of choice
# 14:57 aaronpk true! I can add "events.ics" so you can subscribe directly
# 14:58 barnabywalters aaronpk: that would be cool. protip: the vobject library extracted from sabredav is a great way of generating that nasty VCARD/CALENDAR syntax
# 15:00 barnabywalters with taproot my approach so far has been to ignore them and hope for the best
# 15:00 tantek with Falcon I've just put everything in Pacific time, even when I'm posting from overseas / other timezones.
# 15:00 aaronpk i've been trying to be better about supporting timezones in things I make
# 15:01 tantek so I can re-interpret the data later if I need to
# 15:01 tantek though right now I'm not distinguishing PST/PDT
# 15:01 tantek so some additional smarts may be necessary (beyond simply -0800)
# 15:03 barnabywalters I have some styling stuff planned involving the amount of daylight in my current timezone
# 15:04 aaronpk i want to figure out some sort of visual indication of my local time that isn't obnoxious
# 15:04 aaronpk suppose I could just use a slightly darker grey grid background in the evenings
# 15:08 barnabywalters the idea is to store everything in flat files, have SQL-based indexes, with a table per index
# 15:09 barnabywalters and all DB stuff is completely automated, so I can freely add/remove/change indexes and everything just gets updated
# 15:10 aaronpk i've gone with a different approach with p3k, not as flexible
# 15:11 barnabywalters where schema of info in flat files is optimal for reading, schema of info in DB is optimised for querying
# 15:11 barnabywalters and I can throw away DB without worrying, because all the indexes will get rebuilt automatically
# 15:11 barnabywalters I have flat file saving working, just getting started on the DB/indexes stuff
# 15:12 aaronpk my "/notes" URL does a directory scan to find all the files in my "notes" directory. my tags are indexes saved as flat files (yaml format)
# 15:12 tantek aaronpk - sounds like a good detail to add to indiewebcamp.com/p3k ;)
# 15:13 tantek my storage directory structure is already documented on indiewebcamp.com/Falcon
# 15:14 tantek so that's a good starting point for both figuring out the pieces of an RSVP post
# 15:14 tantek (one that others will recognize for sure, since people see them in FB)
# 15:14 tantek and once we have that, we can start posting RSVPs on our own sites
# 15:15 tantek where said "event" posts can be on another indieweb site (of course)
# 15:15 tantek OR (and in addition to) on events.indiewebcamp.com
# 15:15 tantek the same logic that displays comments received via webmention on a post
# 15:15 tantek can be used to display RSVPs received via webmention on an event post
# 15:16 tantek of course that "logic that displays comments received via webmention" is only implemented currently in Storytlr right?
# 15:17 aaronpk so it will be a relatively small change to recognize "rsvp comments" and display those accordingly
# 15:21 tantek barnabywalters - extracting the implied schema from the FB RSVP example as we speak
# 15:22 tantek aside, I was searching for the answer to "news feed or newsfeed" and found this:
# 15:24 aaronpk you sure? I clicked the "join the waitlist" button and it said 14 of my friends have "made the switch"
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# 16:09 tantek np - I'm off to a telcon - might do while walking/running ;)
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# 17:14 pdurbin you guys are giving me too much to catch up on ;)
# 17:15 aaronpk I would totally expect to write something like this in a note: I'm <span class="p-rsvp value-title" title="yes">going</span> to <a href="http://indiewebcamp.com/2013">IndieWebCamp 2013</a>
# 17:16 pdurbin cool. and links to the next and previous day of logs?
# 17:16 aaronpk I'm <span class="p-rsvp value-title" title="yes">going</span> to <a href="http://indiewebcamp.com/2013" class="u-in-reply-to">IndieWebCamp 2013</a>
# 17:16 aaronpk pdurbin: yes, that was an oversight :) all my other IRC log views have next/prev day links
# 17:18 pdurbin otherwise the logs are perfect. permalinks per line. links are clickable
# 17:19 aaronpk I do want to add highlighting of the line that is permalinked like how Github does it
# 17:44 Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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# 18:21 aaronpk "At the end of these standards, in order to be federated, we are essentially talking about one system. Standardized storage, as well as back ends, basically with infinitely customizable GUIs."
# 18:31 benwerd That's not a million miles away from saying we should only have one kind of web server, or browser type.
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# 18:48 tantek aaronpk - btw re: your p-rsvp markup snippets - better to use <data> element as provided in the examples in the brainstorm proposal.
# 18:49 tantek also, enums aren't really supposed to go into visible title attributes
# 18:50 tantek as enums are machine-values - that they're human readable is a positive design accident at best, and likely only to English readers
# 18:50 tantek which is why if you *really* wanted to use the value class pattern you should use the nested-empty-span approach
# 18:50 tantek to avoid the problem of visible title enum values
# 18:50 tantek I'm <data class="p-rsvp" value="yes">going</data> to <a href="http://indiewebcamp.com/2013">IndieWebCamp 2013</a>
# 18:51 aaronpk I'm <data class="p-rsvp" value="yes">going</data> to <a href="http://indiewebcamp.com/2013" class="u-in-reply-to">IndieWebCamp 2013</a>
# 18:57 tantek aaronpk - just reading that FSW thread now. yikes.
# 18:58 aaronpk I kind of want to chime in with a link to your post showing our indieweb comments
# 18:58 tantek I kind of want to reply with either a Yoda-style or Morpheus-style reply debunking each and every false assertion / assumption that is made in that thread.
# 19:20 tantek wow - there were no messages in April so the link for FSW April archives is a 404
# 19:39 tantek aaronpk - on a more positive note - I'm working on getting sponsors for parts of IndieWebCamp 2013
# 19:39 tantek do we have a "how to sponsor IndieWebCamp" page somewhere?
# 19:40 tantek I noticed that in the left sidebar, the "You?" blue text doesn't link to anything - is it supposed to?
# 19:43 tantek do you have any text from emails you've sent other sponsors like Tropo that you could turn into a small "how-to-sponsor" wiki page?
# 19:43 aaronpk should take some hints from opensourcebridge.org, they have great sponsor materials
# 19:44 tantek nothing too big, something short and sweet would be sufficient
# 19:44 tantek and then we can add to adaptively it as sponsors ask questions
# 19:44 Loqi tantek meant to say: and then we can add to it adaptively as sponsors ask questions
# 19:49 aaronpk wow, somehow I've been able to get all the sponsors so far by talking to them in person. Can't find any sort of pitch email in my archives
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# 20:30 tantek shall we ditch the printed material until we actually have a reason to have some
# 20:31 elf-pavlik xtof: we were talking something about personal data in context of IndieWeb... :)
# 20:32 xtof elf-pavlik hi, I'd be happy to talk IRL if you're still in Paris ?
# 20:33 elf-pavlik cool! i may stay here till end of the week, when would you have time?
# 20:33 xtof available all the week whenever you want. would be happy to invite you for dinner ?
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# 22:58 aaronpk posts syndicated from instagram to twitter are discovered using the algorithm described
# 23:12 tantek hey Loqi - what in that tweet made you post it here?
# 23:18 tantek aaronpk - sounds like you might be taking a shortcut in the original post discovery algorithm
# 23:18 tantek step 3 (which works with URL at end of tweet) explicitly says "see if it links back to the POSSE'd copy with rel=syndication and then use that URL "
# 23:19 tantek since instagram is not linking to that tweet with rel=syndication, that step should fail
# 23:19 aaronpk ah yea, I left that out for now, because not enough sites have rel=syndication yet (like yours :))
# 23:19 tantek otherwise you're likely to get false positives
# 23:20 aaronpk yes, although in this case it's a true-false-positive
# 23:20 tantek no it is a false positive - since the original does lack the commentary
# 23:20 aaronpk the text in the tweet? it's the caption of the image
# 23:21 aaronpk instagram.com shows it overlaid on the image though so it's not obvious
# 23:22 aaronpk on mobile the text appears below the photo, it kind of looks like a comment
# 23:24 tantek well perhaps we should see if we can get IG to adopt h-entry p-author h-card on their IG photo permalinks
# 23:25 tantek so what should an indieweb reply to a photo post look like? as compared to a reply to a note?
# 23:25 tantek (in terms of showing the context of the original)
# 23:26 aaronpk IG posts often have text, so there's the text to display as a normal post text
# 23:26 aaronpk I would imagine a thumbnail of the photo about 100px, kind of like how facebook shows inline previews
# 23:28 tantek not sure I agree with the FB treatment of context like that
# 23:28 tantek it's like Twitter "cards" which show something below
# 23:31 aaronpk huh yea..this is interesting, can't quite figure out where to put the photo on my page
# 23:34 tantek I think you were on the right track. Do what you do now, just
# 23:35 tantek are you going to whitelist IG permalinks as photo posts?
# 23:35 aaronpk (quick mockup in chrome dev tools, not actually coded)
# 23:35 aaronpk I think I might add a mf2-parser shim for Instagram like I have for Twitter
# 23:36 tantek and let's put it on the comment page as a way to display a reply on your own page
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# 23:46 aaronpk so yea, I have a class that takes Twitter JSON and outputs the same structure as if it had parsed an h-entry
# 23:59 reidab are you allowing non-domain-root logins now?