#indiewebcamp 2013-08-19

2013-08-19 UTC
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@feralismyheart RT @WIRED: Meet the hackers who want to jailbreak the internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?mbid=social10894254 #IndieWebCamp (twitter.com/_/status/369265770485665792)
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@arahal_online RT @WIRED: Meet the hackers who want to jailbreak the internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?mbid=social10894254 #IndieWebCamp (twitter.com/_/status/369286482194100224)
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@TheAkashKumar Meet the Hackers Who Want to Jailbreak the Internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/ #IndieWebCamp #tech #innovation (twitter.com/_/status/369327654165413889)
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@wan_li RT @w3c: W3C this week: #HTML5 Web Apps in Amazon #Appstore, kill #CAPTCHAs, #osfw3c --W3C Social Standards Workshop, etc. http://t.co/2tUC… (twitter.com/_/status/369332095845285888)
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@14thFloorView RT @w3c: W3C this week: #HTML5 Web Apps in Amazon #Appstore, kill #CAPTCHAs, #osfw3c --W3C Social Standards Workshop, etc. http://t.co/2tUC… (twitter.com/_/status/369332253031022592)
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@UnseenRevolutio W3C this week: #HTML5 Web Apps in Amazon #Appstore, kill #CAPTCHAs, #osfw3c --W3C Social Standards Workshop, etc. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-w3c-digest/2013JulSep/0005.html (twitter.com/_/status/369332276187779072)
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@wan_li HTML5 Web Apps in Amazon Appstore, kill CAPTCHAs, #osfw3c Social Standards Workshop, etc. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-w3c-digest/2013JulSep/0005.html (twitter.com/_/status/369332312757915648)
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@splendidwebtech RT @UnseenRevolutio: W3C this week: #HTML5 Web Apps in Amazon #Appstore, kill #CAPTCHAs, #osfw3c --W3C Social Standards Workshop, etc. http… (twitter.com/_/status/369335542804402176)
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tantek and the retweets continue apparently. any new folks here from the WIRED article?
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hadleybeeman I've been meaning to post it. The non-technical world could do with a read of it.
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@nigelbabu Really wish I could be at Indie Web Camp http://indiewebcamp.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/369338392296714242)
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@annettebothe RT @WIRED: Meet the hackers who want to jailbreak the internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?mbid=social10894254 #IndieWebCamp (twitter.com/_/status/369340039882608640)
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hadleybeeman Hey Tantek (and Bay Area #indiewebcamp-ers): I'm in SF next week. Let me know if there is anything useful going on?
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@olivierjeulin RT @WIRED: Meet the hackers who want to jailbreak the internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?mbid=social10894254 #IndieWebCamp (twitter.com/_/status/369341849489506304)
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Jihaisse hello
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@HTMLdaily W3C this week: #HTML5 Web Apps in Amazon #Appstore, kill #CAPTCHAs, #osfw3c --W3C Social Standards Workshop, etc. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-w3c-digest/2013JulSep/0005.html (twitter.com/_/status/369385161206419457)
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@aenimaestudio Hackers belonging to the #IndieWebCamp want to jailbreak the #Internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/ (twitter.com/_/status/369385960728850432)
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@domenicoperri IndieWebCamp | @scoopit http://www.scoop.it/t/invispide/p/4006270267/indiewebcamp (twitter.com/_/status/369389722176454656)
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Loqi [mention] http://www.scoop.it/t/invispide/p/4006270267/indiewebcamp linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/ (pingback)
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Loqi [mention] http://backfill.note-to-self.baker.com/2013/08/19/trawl-dredging-of-contemporaneous-links-on-identity-management/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/projects (pingback)
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bnvk Just spent some time doing damage control on the mostly hideous comments of that Wired post!
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bnvk is IndieAuth borked for anyone else? I keep getting a Ruby error "RelParser::InsecureRedirectError at /auth/start" which ever 3rd party service I try to connect with
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@brennannovak Wonderful post about the exciting stuff going on in the #IndieWeb movement. Can't wait to meetup with... http://bnvk.me/hCR (twitter.com/_/status/369430138359803904)
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neuro` In case you're still looking for a Reader replacement and don't want to use tt-rss, GoRead is impressive https://github.com/mjibson/goread
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barnabywalters bnvk: RE damage control — *thank you*
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barnabywalters I’ve been avoiding that thread like the plague :)
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barnabywalters checking indieauth now…
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bnvk It's really fascinating how haters come out of the woodwork and start complaining that apples are oranges!
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cweiske kind of funny that someone builds a google reader replacement that only works with google sign in and on google app engine
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neuro` bnvk: haters and morons are the reason why I don't read comments anymore.
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neuro` I think I'll close them as soon as I implement Web mention: if you want to comment, do it from your place.
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barnabywalters bnvk: which IA auth providers were you trying? github just worked fine for me
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barnabywalters bnvk: yeah, and getting thoroughly confused (“they got $200,000 and they still haven’t built anything”)
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bnvk Yah... Web Mentions are the most exciting thing to combat spam & trolls I'm aware of
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bnvk barnabywalters: I tried Twitter and Github
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barnabywalters bnvk: hm, weird. from the exception it sounds like there’s a https -> http redirect going on somewhere
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barnabywalters so maybe check the protocols on your profile links?
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neuro` bnvk: unfortunately, I already built a spam machine using Web mention :(
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barnabywalters neuro`: wait, you built a spam machine?
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bnvk barnabywalters: all my links are HTTPS
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neuro` barnabywalters: I wanted to POC a theory I had about Webmention.
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neuro` It's only running locally
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neuro` And it won't leave my laptop
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neuro` running against 127.0.0.1:80 (netcay
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neuro` netcat)
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barnabywalters neuro`: did you learn anything worth documenting at http://indiewebcamp.com/spam?
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cweiske you can't have captchas in webmention
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neuro` barnabywalters: checking.
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cweiske but you could actually send the author of the mention a mail, asking for verification
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cweiske that'd actually be cool
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barnabywalters bnvk: not sure what’s up with the redirect thing, I think it’s coming from here: https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth/blob/master/lib/relparser.rb#L64
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bnvk barnabywalters: it was a different error when I used Twitter
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barnabywalters weirdness. probably easiest to wait for aaronpk to drop by and ask him
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@btincq Meet the Hackers Who Want to Jailbreak the Internet - great story about the #IndieWeb movement in @WIRED http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?utm_source=buffer&utm_campaign=Buffer&utm_content=bufferac8fc&utm_medium=twitter (twitter.com/_/status/369438737123393537)
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@stwn RT @WIRED: Meet the hackers who want to jailbreak the internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?mbid=social10894254 #IndieWebCamp (twitter.com/_/status/369442558977396736)
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brennannovak.com edited /2013/UK (+461) "/* RSVP */" (view diff)
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brennannovak.com edited /2013/UK (+64) "/* RSVP */" (view diff)
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Jihaisse neuro`: it's seems unatural to me to not be able to comment directly from the website
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neuro` Jihaisse: I understand, but to be honnest, I'm more than sick with all the legit looking spam comments I get everyday
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neuro` Just because some SEO companies have noticed that I didn't want to break the Web going nofollow.
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Jihaisse :)
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Jihaisse I got some too
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barnabywalters Jihaisse: check out web actions for doing things like commenting on other sites using your own site without any need to authenticate between the two: http://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/4RRNLz/
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Jihaisse but it's a mess for now to write a webmention (with wordpress)
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Jihaisse barnabywalters: seems cool
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Jihaisse bookmarked it
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barnabywalters Jihaisse: cool, let me know if you want to try setting it up. adding action markup to your own site is super-easy, setting up your browser to actually use the markup is slightly more tricky
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@ARTeTIC RT @btincq: Meet the Hackers Who Want to Jailbreak the Internet - great story about the #IndieWeb movement in @WIRED http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?utm_source=buffer&utm_campaign=Buffer&utm_content=bufferac8fc&utm_medium=twitter (twitter.com/_/status/369458482602598400)
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Jihaisse barnabywalters: ok, I will give it a try later
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pfefferle Jihaisse let me know if you have some ideas to improve the webmention wordpress plugin
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hidgw I noticed that <link rel="me"/> support is mentioned in a pretty recent commit to IndieAuth. How long until such a thing is likely to be supported on the IWC site?
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hidgw Procrastinating on modifying my homepage, I am
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barnabywalters hidgw: if it’s in the indieauth repo it should be actively supported on indieauth.com too
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hidgw barnabywalters: I have suddenly lost any reason to procrastinate on this… :)
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tommorris has fun and games with SiloAuth, brought to you by Facebook®.
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tantek good morning indiewebcamp!
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barnabywalters morning tantek
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hidgw I just realized I might have signed into the IWC site back when it supported OpenID. If I make IndieAuth work, will I get back into my old account after signing in with the same domain?
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tantek hidgw - so few people signed in with openid back in the day that aaronpk just does manual merges (I think)
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tantek or maybe we just redirected our old user pages to the new ones
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tantek the openid login for mediawiki was a very odd flow - didn't make much sense
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hidgw tantek: Thanks. I'll see what happens when I get the proper links set up.
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hidgw There are a lot of things about mediawiki that don't make much sense, I've found
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hidgw The Vector skin appears not to even show MediaWiki:Loginprompt any more
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@0DC6E394 RT @btincq: Meet the Hackers Who Want to Jailbreak the Internet - great story about the #IndieWeb movement in @WIRED http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?utm_source=buffer&utm_campaign=Buffer&utm_content=bufferac8fc&utm_medium=twitter (twitter.com/_/status/369478543261962240)
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Jihaisse pfefferle: I don't. that's a problem too :)
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pfefferle :)
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@RochelleLynee RT via @muvmint: RT @shanley: Wired article on indieweb movement http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/ #technology (twitter.com/_/status/369484305212256256)
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aaronpk bnvk: there's still a caching bug with indieauth.com, but if you click the second github link on your login page it should work
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bnvk aaronpk: hrm, i'm pretty sure I tried both
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cweiske aaronpk, is the <link> patch live?
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bnvk but i'll check now just to be sure
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aaronpk bnvk: it looks like you logged in successfully a couple hours ago?
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bnvk yah, I manually changed the redirect URL in query string and pasted it in the browser :)
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aaronpk ah strange...
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bnvk yah, that github link is what the error was screenshotted from
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aaronpk bnvk: it's complaining that http://brennannovak.com is redirecting to https://brennannovak.com/. are you linking to the http version from your github?
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bnvk nope
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bnvk http://github.com/brennannovak
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aaronpk bnvk: wow weird
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bnvk yah, I was a bit stumped, glad i'm not the only one :)
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bnvk if it's at all helpful- the one odd thing is the step 1 (select provider) shows my Icelandic #
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bnvk but my site doesn't have that number listed in the sources
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aaronpk that's the caching thing
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bnvk hrm, ok
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aaronpk if you hit re-scan it will go fetch your home page again
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barnabywalters I just tried rescanning brennannovak.com and it seems to have hung
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aaronpk give me a sec
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barnabywalters with error: Finding rel="me" links on http://brennannovak.com
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barnabywalters well, not error
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aaronpk oh yea you have to enter explicitly https:// if your site redirects
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barnabywalters yep, if I try with https:// it’s looking more promising
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barnabywalters apart from github, twitter, app.net not verifyinh
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aaronpk weird, it's like it's not finding the links on the remote site
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aaronpk s
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@dellasm RT @InfoliteTech: How To Write Your Own Great American Novel – Inspiration - http://infolitetech.com/blog/2013/07/inspiration-great-american-novel/ #amwriting #author #indiepub #indieauth… (twitter.com/_/status/369488620119654400)
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cweiske aaronpk, is the <link> patch live?
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aaronpk cweiske: just pushed up the changes from a couple days ago, so yes i believe so
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aaronpk bnvk: can you try again? just pushed up a change
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@jonnydouglas 100 of the best programmers in the world have been hacking...they want to jailbreak the internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?mbid=social10894254 #IndieWebCamp (twitter.com/_/status/369490385166299136)
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cweiske whoa. it found my github link
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aaronpk nice
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cweiske but it verifies since a minute now
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barnabywalters ^ woo you guys are the best programmers in the world
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bnvk trying
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cweiske how long should the verification take?
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aaronpk not that long, must be stuck
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bnvk aaronpk: nope, still same errors
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aaronpk bnvk: argh how did you get it to work?
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barnabywalters bnvk: you are explicitly typing the https:// right?
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bnvk yes in the query string then pressing enter
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aaronpk bnvk: you have to also enter https in the login box for it to work, did you do that too?
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bnvk well, I've tried that
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bnvk does the same as when I enter brennannovak.com
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@comzeradd Meet the Hackers Who Want to Jailbreak the Internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/369491527019401216)
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aaronpk ok the only thing you should be trying is entering https://brennannovak.com in the login box. can you do that, press re-scan, then try the github link?
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aaronpk cweiske: try again
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cweiske whoa
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cweiske first indieauth login
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aaronpk yay!
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Loqi giggles
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cweiske erm
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cweiske why does indieauth want to read my public repos?
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cweiske and my gists?
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cweiske my profile should be enough, shouldn't it?
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aaronpk because there isn't any smaller scope on github
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barnabywalters also, they’re public, so there’s effectively no difference
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aaronpk goes and looks
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aaronpk apparently there is a smaller scope now, so I will change it
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aaronpk but yes what barnabywalters said. it's already public
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barnabywalters this is a documented UX problem though
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barnabywalters I have spoken to people who are put off by apps listing the permissions they demand
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barnabywalters even if they’re all public
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aaronpk they'd rather not know? lol
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aaronpk http://developer.github.com/v3/oauth/#scopes (no scope) public read-only access (includes public user profile info, public repo info, and gists)
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aaronpk this is why ^
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aaronpk because i'm not providing a scope parameter right now
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barnabywalters aaronpk: it’s more of a “wall of things” problem — twitter’s asking for all this stuff, I can’t be bothered to read through it and decide whether or not I’m actually in danger
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cweiske.de edited /IRC_People (+48) "add cweiske" (view diff)
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aaronpk yeah that makes sense
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aaronpk i've seen various different approaches to that problem
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cweiske.de created /User:Cweiske.de (+35) "Created page with "* Blog: http://cweiske.de/tagebuch/"" (view diff)
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aaronpk bnvk: i have to get back to work. but I think if you type https://brennannovak.com into the login box, then press re-scan (or choose the second github link) it will work
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bnvk okie, cool
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bnvk I'll try agian
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@nitot Feat @t : RT @comzeradd: Meet the Hackers Who Want to Jailbreak the Internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/369493846851207170)
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@libr Lire un article Wired. Regarder les photos. Se dire "Huh!". Bref, l'IndieWebCamp 2013 a eu lieu chez @elementaltech http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/ (twitter.com/_/status/369496259494563840)
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@pablo_ruth RT @nitot: Feat @t : RT @comzeradd: Meet the Hackers Who Want to Jailbreak the Internet http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/369497404032438272)
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aaronpk really want to post my trip itinerary for iwcUK as a private message on my site for people to see
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aaronpk rather than restrict access to individual URLs, I want to say "only people listed on http://indiewebcamp.com/2013/UK can see it"
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barnabywalters aaronpk: ooh great idea
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aaronpk right now everyone on that page is listed as an attendee
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aaronpk which is great for an event, but I can imagine pretty quickly wanting to use it for access control that is not just event based, primary a "group"
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barnabywalters I hate the term “group” when applied to this sort of access control use case
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aaronpk e.g. I want to share with people in my office: https://geoloqi.com/about
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barnabywalters I love the specific use case you gave
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aaronpk i know, terminology is tricky, but this is a good use case
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aaronpk i also don't like managing groups in my facebook or g+ account
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aaronpk interestingly, in both of these examples, I'm basically delegating the management of the group to a third party
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barnabywalters aaronpk: I don’t see how letting a URL be used for non-event based auth is a problem
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barnabywalters or limits it to only events
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aaronpk not a problem, just need a way to list people under something other than "attendees"
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aaronpk like "members"
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barnabywalters just say “any h-cards with urls and/or urls with XFN” found at this URL are in the group
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aaronpk hm, you think the "attendee" semantic is unnecessary?
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Loqi benwerd: tantek left you a message 2 days, 1 hour ago: congrats on idno / indieweb video support! http://werd.io/view/520ed6b7bed7de4914317083
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barnabywalters hm it’s useful for the even use case, but as you said it limits it
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Loqi benwerd: tantek left you a message 2 days, 1 hour ago: let's for sure do an indiewebcampsf dinner monday night. adactio (Jeremy Keith) will also be in town.
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Loqi benwerd: barnabywalters left you a message on 8/17 at 2:10pm: as requested: how to perform tasks after response content is sent in PHP http://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/4R_M2J/
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Loqi benwerd: barnabywalters left you a message on 8/17 at 2:20pm: shaners, tantek thinking about indieweb video + gap between photos which move and “full” video — where do these things fit in? http://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/?tagged=panorama
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aaronpk benwerd: welcome back lol
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benwerd whoa, and that's what happens when I don't log in all weekend
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Loqi benwerd: tantek left you a message 1 day ago: with this 2nd burst of wired coverage we should definitely do dinner tomorrow!
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benwerd hey, right on time. tantek, still up for dinner tonight?
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benwerd barnabywalters: thanks for writing that up! makes sense.
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tantek can do - maybe on the later side - what's the word from kevinmarks or shanley?
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benwerd tantek: I got no reply from shanley
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benwerd I'm up for anything, anyhoo - so if it works, cool. Might come in and work from SF a little later regardless
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tantek I'm thinking around 20:30 if we can find some place convenient to downtownish, maybe near Embarcadero or Montgomery stations.
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tantek benwerd - have any spots you've been wanting to try thereabouts?
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tantek could also do a cafe in north beach - like the old beat poets.
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benwerd tantek - Depends what we're after! north beach is also good (& I really like that neighborhood), although I only really know Vesuvio offhand.
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benwerd You know better than me
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benwerd I haven't explored down there enough, and tend to gravitate to Local Edition in the center ;)
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tantek I do like Local Edition
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tantek and a Monday night might not be too busy
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benwerd 8:30 is actually a really great time, too. I've got some stuff that I need to shovel away first.
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tantek shall we do IndieWebCampSF drinkup at Local Edition 20:30 then?
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tantek going to try to get Jeremy Keith to stop by as well
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benwerd very cool
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rknLA benwerd, tantek: may i invite myself along?
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benwerd rknLA: I think the idea is that it's a drinkup! No need to invite yourself
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benwerd you're invited!
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rknLA swell!
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rknLA I wasn't sure if Local Edition also served food, and it still sorta sounded like a dinner, so i figured asking couldn't hurt
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rknLA :)
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benwerd nah, it's a speakeasy cocktail bar
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@dshugrue The Indieweb: http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/ (twitter.com/_/status/369516255922774016)
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@CaliceST RT @btincq: Meet the Hackers Who Want to Jailbreak the Internet - great story about the #IndieWeb movement in @WIRED http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?utm_source=buffer&utm_campaign=Buffer&utm_content=bufferac8fc&utm_medium=twitter (twitter.com/_/status/369517231379845120)
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@simplonco RT @btincq: Meet the Hackers Who Want to Jailbreak the Internet - great story about the #IndieWeb movement in @WIRED http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/indie-web/?utm_source=buffer&utm_campaign=Buffer&utm_content=bufferac8fc&utm_medium=twitter (twitter.com/_/status/369517332801925122)
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tantek benwerd - great - shall we start a wiki page?
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benwerd sounds good. can do that in a few mins
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benwerd in a call right now
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tantek I stub one
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tantek.com edited /Posts_about_the_IndieWeb (+33) "add id wired-2013-226 for ref" (view diff)
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josephg You guys dinnering tonight?
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josephg ah - drinks.
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rknLA josephg: fwiw, i am also planning to eat dinner at some point this evening. ;)
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josephg :)
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josephg I'm keen - I actually have an idea that I need to run past a few people to make sure I'm not nuts
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tantek.com edited /Events (+488) "IndieWebCampSF drinkup tonight!" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /events/2013-08-19-sf-drinkup (+1100) "stub with at least benwerd and me as attending" (view diff)
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tantek rknLA - great - add yourself: http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2013-08-19-sf-drinkup#Participants
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tantek josephg - you too
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tantek and no Local Edition does not have food
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rkn.la edited /events/2013-08-19-sf-drinkup (+73) "/* Participants */" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /events/2013-08-19-sf-drinkup (+109) "add faq/food" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /events/2013-08-19-sf-drinkup (+190) "add topics" (view diff)
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rknLA i will probably be heading to the soma streatfood park thingy beforehand to grab a bite if anyone is interested in joining
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RedType jeu o, pme tje mew irc people
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RedType hey i'm one of the new irc people
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RedType my right hand was misaligned
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bret Hey RedType
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tantek welcome RedType!
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bret welcome :) How did you make your way here?
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RedType ive been following the iwc site and stuff for a while
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aaronpk it still surprises me that bars can not serve food
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aaronpk i do kind of like that law in oregon, everything has food
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bret Oregon loves food
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bret Sweet RedType what do you think so far?
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RedType bret: it's good things
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bret anything particularly interesting you?
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RedType ui/ux stuff, some of the authentication stuff
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RedType decentralized secure web auth with the capability for anonymity
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RedType actually owncloud is what got my attention
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bret Decentralized yes, I'm not sure if anyone has done much with anonymity
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bret aaronpk: has been working on decentralized privacy though
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RedType yeah it's not a necessary thing. it's just stuff that got me interested
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bret own cloud is way cool, I want to check that out eventually
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bret RedType: -
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bret woops
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RedType i kind of sketched out what would be needed for something like that, then someone did it
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bret The primary focus for most people recently seems to be replacing what Silos provide to them
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bret have you seen http://indiewebcamp.com/Getting_Started ?
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RedType yeah i have
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RedType i have my own short name
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bret right on, thats a huge step
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RedType i actually am thinking of using a url scheme for my personal stuff in the form of domain.tld/verb/noun/subnoun/#pagelocation
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RedType anyways i am going to grab lunch but i might go the drinkup if that's a thing
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bret yeah! beyond that whole list, the best way to get involved is to meet up with folkd
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bret folks*
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bret i recommend it :)
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bret (although I won't be there, I'm in portland)
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tantek.com edited /events/2013-08-19-sf-drinkup (+203) "Local Edition address" (view diff)
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tantek is a fan of the "bars have food" law in Portland.
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bret All of oregon!
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bret I think*
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tantek oh sweet
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adactio.com edited /events/2013-08-19-sf-drinkup (+75) "/* Participants */" (view diff)
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bret We need to implement IndieRSVPs on that events page
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bret RedType: feel free to add yourself to http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?diff=4555&oldid=4554&rcid=4629
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bret errr i mean http://indiewebcamp.com/Events/2013-08-19-Sf-Drinkup
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bret actually I mean http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2013-08-19-sf-drinkup whew
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tantek.com created /Events/2013-08-19-Sf-Drinkup (+42) "bc bret put it in IRC" (view diff)
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bret i need to start to remember doing that
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bret remember to do that*
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bret ok I'm going to stop now
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tantek hey look Twitter is implementing display of mentions on tweets: https://blog.twitter.com/2013/new-headlines-feature-offers-story-behind-the-tweet
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aaronpk " links to websites where the Tweet was embedded" whoa
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@lelli RT @brennannovak: Wonderful post about the exciting stuff going on in the #IndieWeb movement. Can't wait to meetup with... http://t.co/Ld6r… (twitter.com/_/status/369537814720835584)
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tantek aaronpk, that's basically like showing pingbacks/mentions right?
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aaronpk yeah basically
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bret Sounds potentially super unreliable
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aaronpk espn.com linked to this tweet, so the tweet shows the link from espn.com
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aaronpk except with their embeds, not just links
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tantek so I wonder if this is whitelisted or does everyone who embed a tweet get to show up on the tweet permalink
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aaronpk seems like it would be a ton of work to whitelist that
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aaronpk their examples are sites that also have twitter accounts, maybe it's limited to domains that map to a twitter account
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tantek aaronpk - or they just use their existing TwitterCards whitelist :/
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aaronpk ah could be the twittercard whitelist
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aaronpk which means I can experiment :)
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tantek note that they are currently showing "Related headlines" *above* replies: https://twitter.com/jasoncollins34/status/329000293373210625
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tantek that seems backwards
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@jasoncollins34 All the support I have received today is truly inspirational. I knew that I was choosing the road less traveled but I'm not walking it alone
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aaronpk tantek: normally i'd agree, but since they have infinite scrolling on the reply list it make ssense to have the headlines above
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bret aaronpk: also, you totally link to a silo instead of your primary identity on the web on your business profile :p
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aaronpk heh, yea we all have our twitter accounts there
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tantek so how is twitter notified of the embedding? does it require someone to view the article that embeds the tweet and thus execute the Twitter embed JS?
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aaronpk i would imagine so
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aaronpk especially cause the first thing you're going to do when embeddeing a tweet is go look at it yourself
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tantek so … what would happen if the IndieWebCamp IRC logs used the Twitter embed JS for blockquoted tweets?
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aaronpk LOL
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aaronpk the logs would be super ugle
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aaronpk ugly*
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tantek Do the articles themselves have to use TwitterCards?
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aaronpk i'm guessing yes. i just made this page and embedded one of your tweets: http://aaronparecki.com/2013-231-test-embedded-tweet
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aaronpk no twitter card yet, and it's not showing up
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aaronpk also not sure how long it will take before it's picked up. I know the twitter cards themselves have a short delay before the tweet permalink shows the card
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aaronpk my guess is twitter card is required which is where it gets the page title from
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tantek as opposed to say … the <title> element :P
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aaronpk yeah lol
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aaronpk ok just added a twitter card to that page
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aaronpk https://twitter.com/dangillmor/status/369510144813436928
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@dangillmor Hey, Twitter: WTF are you doing, adding "relevant" links to my posts? How about letting me decide what's relevant? https://blog.twitter.com/2013/new-headlines-feature-offers-story-behind-the-tweet
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aaronpk interestingly the techcrunch story does not appear on that tweet yet
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aaronpk LOL best headline: http://pandodaily.com/2013/08/19/twitter-adds-related-headlines-to-tweets-enrages-everyone-for-5-seconds/
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aaronpk well keep an eye on your tweet, tantek, we'll see if it shows up at some point: https://twitter.com/t/status/367798983131168768
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@t nice @klintron article http://t.co/pDWUEVmuQH!
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tantek aaronpk - indeed - especially since that tweet of mine was a "reply" on Twitter
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aaronpk oh interesting point, i should have tested with an original
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aaronpk ok I did it with another one: http://aaronparecki.com/2013-231-test-embedded-tweet-1 and https://twitter.com/t/status/368053711794634752
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@t Thank you #xkcd: https://xkcd.com/1179/ nephews use ISO 8601 dates, you can too.
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josephg <3
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neuro` Good evening.
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aaronpk shaners: are you part of this? http://farmhouse.la/conf/5
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aaronpk oh hey look at the nice xfn links on iamshane.com
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aaronpk in other words, I answered my own question with the INTERNET
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shaners aaronpk: yes. it's my conference.
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shaners FHC5:Collapse is the final show.
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josephg that looks really fun
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aaronpk shaners: that's awesome. you should put your name somewhere on farmhouse.la tho!
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shaners aaronpk: heh. that's not a bad idea, huh?
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aaronpk a bunch of cool speakers listed at http://farmhouse.la/conf/5 but none of the organizers!
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shaners i think everyone should come to it, and then the day after we can do actual indiewebCAMP in my backyard.
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shaners aaronpk: part of the reason for that was to make it not about me.
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rknLA everyone should go to farmhouse. it's one of the best things i've ever been to.
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shaners thanks, rknLA!
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RedType bret: i will
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RedType i'm going to reconfigure irssi to use a better nick
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RedType brb
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rknLA shaners: you're welcome, and thank _you_ for putting it all together
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shaners would people be into doing an IndieWebCamp::Hollywood on 2013-11-03?
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@GreatBookDeal RT @gaelynnwoods: Is bigger always better? With regards to #books, of course... Chime in on THE BIG HEAT: http://gaelynnwoods.blogspot.com/2013/08/does-size-matter-sorry-all-you-sex.html #indieauth… (twitter.com/_/status/369549921588097024)
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aaronpk shaners: awesome. i'm going to try to go to that too then!
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rknLA shaners: i'd be into that. might want to figure out borrowing a tent or something for while i'm down there.
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@Author_Carmen RT @gaelynnwoods: Is bigger always better? With regards to #books, of course... Chime in on THE BIG HEAT: http://gaelynnwoods.blogspot.com/2013/08/does-size-matter-sorry-all-you-sex.html #indieauth… (twitter.com/_/status/369550135287889920)
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tantek sexy indieauth?
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rknLA #indieauthor
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rknLA :\
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shaners camping is welcome. there'll likely be leftover food and drinks from Farmhouse Conf 5. I'll have 4 VIP portapots and 150 wooden folding chairs. no projector. but there is a 110 ten year old avocado tree. and a barn.
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shaners should we do just Sunday? or sunday and monday?
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tantek aaronpk, speaking of ISO dates - am I the only one that experiences cognitive dissonance on tweet permalinks when they say things like "15 Aug 13" and I think, August 13th?
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aaronpk urgh yeah i hate that format
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aaronpk talk about ambiguous
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tantek shaners - like any barcamp, I'd suggest getting a co-organizer or a few and collectively driving details like that.
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shaners i'm taking a straw poll right now of attendees. who would STAY for monday? are most people weekend only.
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shaners tantek ^
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aaronpk shaners: I would probably not stay for monday. If I go I'd likely be going to Redlands on Monday with Davy
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tantek shaners - maybe create a draft wiki page gauge attendee interest
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shaners tantek: sounds good
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tantek IndieWebCampUK started as a one day event
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tantek and then co-organizers adactio and aral drove it to become two days
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tantek once there was some critical mass/interest
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shaners tantek: ok
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Sparverius cool cool cool
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rknLA i'm not sure if i would stay for monday either. depends if i would have to take vacation time to do it :\
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aaronpk is setting things in motion to be able to go to LA that weekend
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tantek welcome Sparverius!
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Sparverius tantek: im redtype, just changed my nick
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Sparverius irssi default config and all that
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tantek a-ha. Sparverius - add yourself to http://indiewebcamp.com/IRC-people
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Sparverius i dont have indieauth setup
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tantek can we help with that?
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aaronpk luckily that is an easy problem to solve
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Sparverius i'm mid move
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Sparverius which is important because my desktop is packed up
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Sparverius with all of my keys on it lol
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Sparverius it should be super simple stupid easy to set up
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Sparverius i just can't rofl
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Sparverius i should probably buy a laptop
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Loqi I agree
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Sparverius so yeah i'll probably set it up sunday or something
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tantek so this is very strange, the @Twitter tweet announcing this new features used to show ~5-6 @-replies below it, but I just reloaded the permalink and they're all gone: https://twitter.com/twitter/status/369548560825450497
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@twitter New headlines feature shows stories related to tweets: https://blog.twitter.com/2013/new-headlines-feature-offers-story-behind-the-tweet
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aaronpk whoa, do you think they're able to block some of the replies now?
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neuro` shaners: you're welcome.
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tantek aaronpk - I don't know - I wish I'd used a separate tab
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shaners thx neuro`
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neuro` shaners: using a CNAME when pointing to an external resource is the less crappy way to ensure consistency in your resources URLs
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neuro` (I backport the conversation here because it's indie web related)
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shaners right. my S3 urls were never meant to be permanent. it's on The List to be done. :/
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tantek.com created /wordpress (+23) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /Wordpress (+23) "r" (view diff)
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bret shaners: IWC at the farmhouse sounds way cool but I get super busy in november with school
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neuro` That's the reason why I advice people who want to use service like Feedburner to use a CNAME / redirect from their domain name like feed.mydomain.com -> feeds.feedburner.com/mysite (it's already on the wiki tantek, no need to mention :))
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shaners bret: maybe you could take a short whirlwind get away for a 3 day weekend?
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Sparverius hey, can someone msg me the drinkup info?
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Sparverius i dont keep irc logs :(
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tantek neuro` - if it's already on the wiki, why not link to it instead of repeating it? ;)
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neuro` OK, ok you win this time ;)
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tantek Sparverius - you can always check indiewebcamp.com/events :)
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tantek perhaps even subscribe to it in iCal
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Sparverius ah, i didnt realize it had been updated
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neuro` tantek: speaking about it, do you know when you're free during your Paris trip?
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Sparverius also i didnt check there :p
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bret shaners: maybe, I will have to see how my budget and TA schedule looks. I will def remote in and see what I can do to make it
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shaners grood
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bret are there any non proprietary ways to do realtime video on the web?
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iamshane.com created /2013/Hollywood (+5350) "Indie Web Camp : Hollywood 2013 draft page" (view diff)
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tantek bret - good q to add to a (new?) FAQ section on http://indiewebcamp.com/video
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shaners http://indiewebcamp.com/2013/Hollywood
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shaners aaronpk: i left you on the page (copy/pasted from 2013/IWCUK) to save you some typing, since you already said you'd likely be coming.
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aaronpk :)
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bret.io edited /video (+85) "Added QA/FAQ section and my question" (view diff)
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vrypan Hi guys. I'm not sure if this is the right place for this, but I dug up an old idea of replacing "traditional" search engines with a distributed query system. If anyone feels like working on it, I've posted some more details here http://blog.vrypan.net/2013/08/19/distributed-query-system/
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@benwerd There's an #indieweb drinkup happening at Local Edition tonight at 8:30pm: http://indiewebcamp.com/Events/2013-08-19-Sf-Drinkup (twitter.com/_/status/369561664930054144)
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@veganstraightedge Want to help build the #indieweb? Join us @indiewebcamp : Hollywood 2013 at The @Farmhouse on 2013-11-03. http://indiewebcamp.com/2013/Hollywood (twitter.com/_/status/369561689068294145)
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Loqi [mention] http://werd.io/view/521284bdbed7dea00964f209 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/Events/2013-08-19-Sf-Drinkup (pingback)
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tantek vrypan - how much of your distributed query system have you implemented on vrypan.net?
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vrypan tantek, unfortunately, zero. I had written some code (WP plugin) that could be a start, but it's been many years since, I don't even know where the code is.
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bret Sounds like a neat idea, maybe it could become the basis of some kind of distributed consumption tool
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vrypan bret - If it was used, I could search indiewebcamp.com for, say, "rss" and get answers from sites that are related to indieweb and have written something about RSS. Much more relevant for me than googling "rss".
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@jmsmcfrlnd RT @veganstraightedge: Want to help build the #indieweb? Join us @indiewebcamp : Hollywood 2013 at The @Farmhouse on 2013-11-03. http://t.… (twitter.com/_/status/369565884756803584)
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barnabywalters vrypan: you’ve come across blekko right?
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barnabywalters at some point I’m going to make script which creates new blekko slashtags from URLs with XFN or h-cards in
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barnabywalters so I can search for topics on the sites of people I trust about that topic
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barnabywalters which is one step toward what you’re talking about
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barnabywalters otherwise, a combination of opensearch and microformats could be used to search many sites at once and accumulate the results
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vrypan barnabywalters: that would be cool. But blekko is sitll centralised. And it has little knowledge of what my site thinks is important.
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vrypan Google is trying to do it too, by relating sites and +1s to your social network.
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epeus.blogspot.com edited /events/2013-08-19-sf-drinkup (+81) "/* Participants */" (view diff)
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epeus.blogspot.com edited /Posts_about_the_IndieWeb (+170) "/* 2013 */" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk - hmm - isn't blogspot a silo? should we be allowing *.blogspot.com sign-ins for indieauth for indiewebcamp.com?
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aaronpk yeah. i'm not sure the blacklist is working
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aaronpk although blogspot was never on it
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epeus.blogspot.com edited /events/2013-08-19-sf-drinkup (+89) "/* Topics */" (view diff)
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@rknLA RT @benwerd: There's an #indieweb drinkup happening at Local Edition tonight at 8:30pm: http://indiewebcamp.com/Events/2013-08-19-Sf-Drinkup (twitter.com/_/status/369576739736780800)
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vrypan permashortcitations are a bit cryptic for the uninitiated. Have you tried alternative forms?
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vrypan For example it looks like .example.me/123 is not auto linked by twitter (and it's easier for someone to get the hint and copy-paste to the browser)
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aaronpk vrypan: look at my tweets, I always include a full URL (aaron.pk/xxxxx)
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vrypan aaronpk: yes, but yours are auto-linked by twitter (t.co)
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aaronpk yea cause it's a link, is that bad?
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vrypan I guess that the spirit of http://indiewebcamp.com/short-domains#permashortcitations is to avoid having someone else control the links.
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vrypan Otherwise, why have your own short domain?
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aaronpk ah I see what you're getting at
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aaronpk but my short URLs are still visible in the tweet text, just not in the href attribute
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vrypan You have a point.
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aaronpk it's a subtle difference
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@natevw @stevenf We talked about that at #IndieWebCamp two years ago — basically MITM yourself to improve/sustain/customize centralized services. (twitter.com/_/status/369594260481249282)
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rknLA what do y'all use for link shortening?
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aaronpk tantek and I use an algorithm so that there is no database backing it
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rknLA that sounds sane.
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vrypan aaronpk: yes, I've read about it, I like the idea.
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@anildash Is there a single Indieweb (how ever you define that) app that you use/used which isn't merely an inferior clone of a closed app? (twitter.com/_/status/369598953496793088)
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shaners rknLA: i use the same enshortening algorithm using NewBase60
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rknLA do you run analytics on the endpoints that do the shortlink processing, or just let it run free?
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shaners rknLA: huh?
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edwardhotchkiss.com edited /2013/Hollywood (+425) "/* Sunday AND Monday RSVP */" (view diff)
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rknLA free as in, un-tracked.
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rknLA analytics as in, how many people have clicked through your shortlink
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shaners I don't get it
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rknLA hmm. in explaining, i think i am answering my own question,
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rknLA or rather, in attempting to explain
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shaners glad i can help?
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shaners :/
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rknLA basically i was wondering about link tracking,
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rknLA but you could just shortlink with a tracking parameter?
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shaners i don't do ANY analytics
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rknLA ah
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rknLA that also answers my question :)
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shaners rknLA: i wrote and use this: https://github.com/veganstraightedge/new_base_60
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edwardhotchkiss.com edited /2013/Hollywood (+17) "added github/edwardhotchkiss" (view diff)
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shaners aaronpk: are you using my https://github.com/veganstraightedge/new_base_60 gem anywhere? or did you just add those two commands for funsies way back when.
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aaronpk i use it in my bash
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shaners and it's been ok for you?
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aaronpk yeah
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shaners grood!
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shaners tantek: is your site's conent CC?
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shaners s/conent/content
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Loqi shaners meant to say: tantek: is your site's content CC?
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@veganstraightedge @anildash http://indiewebcamp.com/Homesteading It powers my site: http://iamshane.com (twitter.com/_/status/369606331776253952)
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tantek shaners - nicely done with your reply tweets.
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tantek no my site content is by default all rights reserved
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tantek though I put my slide decks into PD via CC)
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shaners tantek: i try to play at being an ambassador
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tantek s/CC)/CC0
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Loqi tantek meant to say: though I put my slide decks into PD via CC0
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tantek I think. Hmm. maybe they're CC-by and I just ask for people to link/attribute tantek.com
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shaners tantek: i certainly don't care if you CC your site content or not. I was just surprised.
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tantek shaners - enough of it is "personal" in nature that doesn't quite feel right to CC.
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tantek I try to explicitly CC (by or 0) the professional / how-to stuff.
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shaners sure. that's fair.
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tantek all the stuff others might actually find useful :)
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shaners i'm always surprised by what others find useful of mine
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tantek funny thing about anil's question, despite its negative framing, I think he has no idea that there is a whole legion of indieweb "apps" (as he put it) that are slowing growing stronger, richer, and will inevitably eclipse all of the closed "apps" (silos UIs).
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shaners tantek: while i agree with you, there's no proof that we'll eclipse all of those silos yet. ;)
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tantek also funny that he got not one by *two* reply tweets saying no idea what he's talking about.
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tantek shaners - we're going to eclipse them because they're actually quite slow to innovate.
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tantek and we can pick and choose the best UI ideas from them, and ignore their mistakes
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tantek I have no doubt that at least 2+ indieweb projects will eclipse Twitter UI functionality by IndieWebCamp 2014
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npdoty I've been responding to Anil as well, but I think the most interesting thing about the question is the framing of "apps"
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shaners i'm not surprised that people don't know what he's talking about. we have yet to do much outreach/marketing/branding
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npdoty what's most advantageous about indieweb projects is that they're generally interoperable rather than self-contained, like the Web
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tantek npdoty - yeah - did you ask him? what does he mean by "app"?
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tantek shaners - it's ok people don't know what he's talking about - his question was poorly worded in the first place.
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tantek however, get this
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npdoty while I had doubts about the question, I tried to respond positively, by suggesting email, IRC, personal blogs, etc.
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tantek he did end up using the term "indieweb", thus exposing more people to it, making them curious about it, and boom: https://www.google.com/search?q=indieweb
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npdoty also, in his follow up he specifically asked for non-commercial applications
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shaners no doubt. every mention of it helps grow it.
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tantek shaners - so as far as outreach/marketing/branding - the greatest hack of all is just getting people like Anil to user our language, to user our brand.
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npdoty ... and while that's generally an interesting question, I think indieweb doesn't mean non-profit
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tantek we don't need him or any other "pundit" to do or say anything else. the indieweb meme takes care of itself.
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tantek It's question
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aaronpk who said anything about non-profit? http://indiewebcamp.com/business-models :D
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tantek It's the question that drives us. It's the question that brought you here. You know the question, just as I did. What is the IndieWeb?
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Loqi the IndieWeb is great
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npdoty :)
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tantek (with apologies to http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0133093/quotes?item=qt0324238 )