#indiewebcamp 2013-09-19

2013-09-19 UTC
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ShaneHudson Just a quick note... looks like .net magazine have 'moved' their digital presence and appears to have broken all links to their posts!
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cweiske aaronpk, the webmention 0.1 link header - am I obliged to use < and > as separator for the link, and " " as separator for the relation, or am I free to use any of the RFC2616 defined separators (as defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2616#page-16 )
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cweiske ?
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cweiske tantek, do you know?
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@Ladygoldiee #BuyTheWayOnItunes Full Eclipse" The Album https://itunes.apple.com/us/album/full-eclipse/id317227879 … … it's BLACK SUN #Follow @BlackSunDMV #HipHop #indiewebcamp (twitter.com/_/status/380591247053701121)
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@haverholm .@infonauten AppNet is still hosted. I'm on twitter until a self-hosted, federated social thingie appears. #indieweb has some good ideas. (twitter.com/_/status/380591382173589505)
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neuro` Hello
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@Ladygoldiee #BuyTheWayOnItunes Full Eclipse" The Album https://itunes.apple.com/us/album/full-eclipse/id317227879 … it's BLACK SUN #Follow @BlackSunDMV #HipHop #indiewebcamp (twitter.com/_/status/380611561682776065)
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tantek cweiske - good q
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tantek I was going to say add it to the page as an FAQ
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tantek but then I just got:
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tantek "
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tantek HTTP ERROR: 504
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tantek Gateway Timeout
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tantek RequestURI=http://indiewebcamp.com/webmention
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tantek "
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tantek cc: aaronpk
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cweiske same for the html link tag. the pingback spec explicitely states that the attributes may not be swapped
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cweiske http://archive.cweiske.de/pingback/pingback-1.0.html#TOC2.2
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cweiske so that you can regex on it
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cweiske instead of having to use an xml parser
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cweiske the webmention spec doesn't say anything about that
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ShaneHudson I'm trying to get .net to put all of their data on github or somewhere. So many articles lost :(
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cweiske who is .net?
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ShaneHudson it is a magazine. They have just 'merged' with a blog, so that the .net magazine is physical only. Moved over some content but most links broken and thousands of articles lost
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ShaneHudson They had so many guest posts and interviews etc. They should not be lost
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tommorris ShaneHudson: sigh. am I going to have to go on an archive.org replacement hunt on Wikipedia? I've done that before. so dull.
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tommorris someone just pointed me to http://ourincrediblejourney.tumblr.com/
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tommorris.org edited /site-deaths (+232) "/* related */ Our Incredible Journey." (view diff)
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@tommorris @harry_wood So tacky. Added to http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths#related (twitter.com/_/status/380675935948660737)
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@dellasm RT @KatherinePym: RT @MutinousBoomer Find out what happens when real life and real miracles collide! http://www.amazon.com/dp/B007H0RS60 #sep #IndieAuth… (twitter.com/_/status/380679742711930880)
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@dellasm RT @mtnmoxiegirl: RT @MutinousBoomer Find out what happens when real life and real miracles collide! http://www.amazon.com/dp/B007H0RS60 #sep #IndieAuth… (twitter.com/_/status/380682430879105024)
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ShaneHudson http://www.shanehudson.net/2013/09/19/stop-deleting-content/
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tommorris ShaneHudson: Sigh. Looks like a chunk of my weekend will be fixing links to netmag
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cweiske do you know about simple to setup single-site mirror scripts?
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tommorris ShaneHudson: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ALinkSearch&target=*.netmag.co.uk
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pdurbin cweiske: wget --recursive
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ShaneHudson tommorris: that's a handy search page. Luckily wikipedia only links to 41. There will be thousands of links on the web broken because of it :(
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tommorris ShaneHudson: it's worth using when you want to make the case against people stupidly deleting content. I spent weeks fixing links when PinkPaper, a UK LGBT newspaper, went offline.
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tommorris mostly to point to archive.org and archive.is
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ShaneHudson oo didn't know about archive.is :)
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tommorris neither did I until I had to fix lots of links and found someone had backed lots up there
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@MutinousBoomer RT @mtnmoxiegirl: RT @MutinousBoomer Find out what happens when real life and real miracles collide! http://www.amazon.com/dp/B007H0RS60 #sep #IndieAuth… (twitter.com/_/status/380700557746253824)
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ShaneHudson Looks like a few of us are going to try putting the articles on github. So what about IP lol authors can remove if they want, not be forced to have it deleted
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@ShaneHudson Oh and for those of you that agree with me about the link rot. Definitely worth looking into http://indiewebcamp.com/ #indiewebcamp (twitter.com/_/status/380704611394277376)
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@jegtnes RT @ShaneHudson: Oh and for those of you that agree with me about the link rot. Definitely worth looking into http://indiewebcamp.com/ #indie… (twitter.com/_/status/380704791418404864)
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veldenz hi
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barnabywalters welcome to #indiewebcamp veldenz
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veldenz hehe
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veldenz so I just wanted to get some confirmation on my understanding of the concept as english is not my mother tongue
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veldenz of the concept of indie web i mean
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barnabywalters sure
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waterpigs.co.uk edited /IRC (-13) "/* Quick Start */ removed #microformats from webchat room list as people keep on not realizing they’re in #microformats when they’re expecting #indiewebcamp" (view diff)
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veldenz the idea is to encourage people to build website and host them through hosting companies rather than relying on corporations like FB or Tumblr ?
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barnabywalters veldenz: that’s pretty much it, yes — to encourage and empower people to own their identity and content on the web
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veldenz oh, great
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barnabywalters veldenz: do you have a personal site?
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veldenz i've built one for friends
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veldenz we debatted wether to host it on wordpress.com (as it's running with wordpress software) or get a host and choose the hosting solution because we wanted to tweak it too much for wordpress.com limitations
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veldenz but then we're not professionals, and i sometimes think : aren't we somehow tied to the hosting company ? because if they dispute the domain for example I wouldn' t know what to do
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barnabywalters it’s true that we have to rely on hosting companies and domain companies
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barnabywalters the nice thing is that there are so many, they have to compete on price and service
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barnabywalters so they’re generally pretty good about moving things around
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barnabywalters some people do host everything themselves — for example BjarniRunar hosts his personal site on a computer in his basement using Pagekite
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veldenz A friend of mine used to run his own server as well, Thor though
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veldenz got troubled by Interpol :/
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barnabywalters oh, he ran a Tor exit? nice
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veldenz yeah sorry
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veldenz hehe
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barnabywalters yeah, people I know have been hassled about Tor exits before too
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veldenz too much avengers for me
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veldenz what kind of mastery level would one need to contribute to the project ?
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veldenz like, I tried to find a french version of the concept when stumbling upon it and google has nothing
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veldenz i'm not a developper in any fashion, but are there other ways to get involved ?
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barnabywalters veldenz: really? actually there are quite a few wiki pages and articles which have been translated into french
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aaronpk veldenz: actually there's a pretty thorough french translation of the wiki! http://indiewebcamp.com/Main_Page-fr
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veldenz heee
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barnabywalters veldenz: sure you can contribute without being a developer
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veldenz weird :/ google kept getting me articles about french indie bands
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veldenz the translation is interesting, but could use a few tweaks
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aaronpk i think you've just found a way to contribute ;)
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veldenz hehe :)
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veldenz i need to find a way to sign in first, as the one domain I helped set up is not mine
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barnabywalters veldenz: setting up a domain to sign in is really easy. you just need to have a simple HTML page with some links to your accounts elsewhere, or email address
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veldenz i actually have a domain ! he :) it host my portfolio
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veldenz i forgot about it
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barnabywalters veldenz: so you’re already most of the way there! what’s the domain?
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veldenz www.tigerturtle.net
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veldenz was supposed to host my band website but the project didnt go through
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barnabywalters veldenz: so the indieauth set up guide is here: http://indiewebcamp.com/How_to_set_up_web_sign-in_on_your_own_domain
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barnabywalters that should explain how to set up your domain so you can log in to the wiki
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barnabywalters any issues, just ask :)
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veldenz ok ! I'll have to look into it later, the school i'm connected in holds a meeting in the computer room :)
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veldenz thanks ! see you soon :) gotta run
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barnabywalters bye veldenz
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waterpigs.co.uk edited /How_to_set_up_web_sign-in_on_your_own_domain (+9) "/* 1. Link to your various social profiles on your home page */ added rel to email example" (view diff)
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aaronpk ShaneHudson: nice you're on the front page of hackernews!
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ShaneHudson aaronpk: yeah.. it is just a shame I needed to write it at all
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ShaneHudson I've always got on great with Oliver and now he probably hates me! But it needed to be said.
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ShaneHudson (A lot more was said on twitter lol)
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aaronpk you might be interested in this: http://indiewebcamp.com/IndieArchive
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ShaneHudson Oh that's pretty cool
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aaronpk cause this problem isn't going away any time soon
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ShaneHudson The worst bit is they always blame IP
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ShaneHudson .net apparently cannot release an archive because of IP but the authors also cannot republish without asking permission!
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ShaneHudson And geocities said the same thing
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aaronpk wait, that's broken
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aaronpk either the authors own the copyright and so they can republish however they want, or .net owns the copyright so they can republish however they want
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ShaneHudson Precisely
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ShaneHudson I *think* it is to do with the merge... lots of legal complexities
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ShaneHudson Kind of becomes a different company? Because it was owned by Future.. but they are print only now.
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ShaneHudson Not sure... absolutely stupid though
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aaronpk ah yeah, licenses get tricky when a company is bought/merged/etc
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aaronpk either way, you'd think someone would want to figure it out
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ShaneHudson Yeah, they don't have the man power apparently. My reply was if they asked on twitter for help.. they would have got it easily
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ShaneHudson There are plenty of us with the skill to write scripts to automate it etc
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ShaneHudson It's wound me up. And I never even wrote anything there.. can only imagine how the authors feel!
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barnabywalters ShaneHudson: wilto spotted that http://m.netmagazine.com/ isn’t gone yet
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barnabywalters I’m running a wget grab of it now
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ShaneHudson I think it is down now
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ShaneHudson I was about to wget too :(
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barnabywalters not for me, yet
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ShaneHudson I don't get how famous people cope on twitter. In the last hour, I've had 94 mentions lol
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barnabywalters still resolving for me
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barnabywalters I’m just going to leave it running
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ShaneHudson Brilliant
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ShaneHudson Are you on a fast connection? I could pop back to work and download if we need it quick (140mb down)
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barnabywalters I need to be more careful about backing up people’s sites — I made the mistake of leaving one job running and ended up downloading almost 1GB of content from one personal domain!
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barnabywalters I’m on a pretty slow connection — Iceland -> rest of world isn’t very fast
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barnabywalters but that might also be the reason it’s still resolving — DNS propogation ftw
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peat Contemplative Internet.
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ShaneHudson haha I did that once! Think it was Eric Meyer's site, downloaded his entire server xD
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Loqi rofl
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barnabywalters this site in particular is one of the most valuable and complete collections of period books, music and other manuscripts on the web
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ShaneHudson Yeah it is resolving for me too, just not the page I was looking at
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ShaneHudson ah wow lol
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barnabywalters including tonnes of early dance and cooking tutorials — really cool stuff
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barnabywalters lol, I just looked in my terminal output and saw an article called “make your own SOAP API”
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barnabywalters apparently the download job is further on than I thought
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ShaneHudson :D
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ShaneHudson 900 visits so far to my article... seems to have struck a nerve with people. Good.
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@vduglued @marramgrass Sure I can’t remember saying anything useful. I’m reading this and feeling guilty and/or afraid http://indiewebcamp.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/380738454688387073)
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@adactio @mtheoryx @bdielman @bradcolbow The Indieweb principles are a good place to start: http://indiewebcamp.com/principles See also: http://adactio.com/links/tags/indieweb/ (twitter.com/_/status/380744274217684992)
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barnabywalters huh, apparently this is a static copy of the netmag site: http://d.pr/f/xboO
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barnabywalters not downloaded it myself, YMMV
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bret any crashable xoxo events in portland coming up?
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ShaneHudson how'd the wget go?
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ShaneHudson btw. 1k visits. I hope they are checking out indiewebcamp.com
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barnabywalters still going, 1164 items now
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barnabywalters 42MB
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barnabywalters it’s skipping the images and articles which already redirect to the new location
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ShaneHudson Ah, that is fair enough
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barnabywalters SO MANY CDN DOMAINS
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ShaneHudson lol
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ShaneHudson did it save the css?
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ShaneHudson (is it still on cdn?)
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barnabywalters sadly it doesn’t look like it
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ShaneHudson ok, fair enough
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barnabywalters pretty sure everything apart from the HTML is on CDNs
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ShaneHudson That's fine. Images are important but text moreso
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barnabywalters too much effort to figure out every CDN domain they’re using and add it to the whitelist
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ShaneHudson yeah
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ShaneHudson I think the best idea would probably be github pages? That way we can offer a way to take articles down if the IP owner wishes.
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ShaneHudson Hey caseorganic, how are you?
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caseorganic ShaneHudson: well, how are you?
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ShaneHudson Pretty good thanks :)
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barnabywalters oh yeah, I hadn’t really thought about actually republishing all this :) GH pages probably a good plan
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barnabywalters afternoon caseorganic
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ShaneHudson Think I might head to the gym to calm down a bit lol.. still semi-raging.
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bret what happened?
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ShaneHudson barnabywalters: feel free to compress as small as possible and send to me if you don't have time/bandwidth to upload
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ShaneHudson bret: http://www.shanehudson.net/2013/09/19/stop-deleting-content/
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bret thanks ShaneHudson
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barnabywalters oh yeah we should add this to /site-deaths
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waterpigs.co.uk edited /site-deaths (+266) "/* 2013 */ stubbed .net merger" (view diff)
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barnabywalters feel free to add more details w/ citations if you have them
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barnabywalters finished in 1hr 10mins, 70MB of HTML
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barnabywalters unfortunately 50MB of that is redirect URLs which all resolved to the creative bloq page
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barnabywalters so there are at least 600 articles which weren’t successfully fetched
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ShaneHudson if they are redirected then that's fine. We can backup those whenever
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ShaneHudson It's the ones that they haven't bothered the backup that are the worry
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caseorganic barnabywalters: afternoon!
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barnabywalters ShaneHudson: nope, all of the 600 redirects go to the “we’ve moved” landing page :/
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ShaneHudson barnabywalters: Oh. Shit :/
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ShaneHudson How many didn't?
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barnabywalters still, 1200 pages in total
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cweiske aaronpk, the webmention 0.1 link header - am I obliged to use < and > as separator for the link, and " " as separator for the relation, or am I free to use any of the RFC2616 defined separators (as defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2616#page-16 )
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ShaneHudson Good work
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barnabywalters most of which are valid and actually have content in, I think
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@benedfit The stars have aligned for this weeks' @thewebahead in which @adactio and @jensimmons talk the #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/380755234056060929)
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barnabywalters ah, scratch that, looks like the actual content behind most of those splash page redirects was saved
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barnabywalters the redirects were to the desktop version of the site from the mobile articles
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aaronpk cweiske: i'm kind of inclined to require the syntax described in the webmention spec as opposed to any rfc format
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aaronpk cause it makes parsing it out easier
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cweiske I understand that
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aaronpk same reason pingback defined a strict format
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cweiske but please state that in the spec
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ShaneHudson I'm heading out, thanks for doing that barnabywalters!
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barnabywalters no problem, let me know if you want a zipped copy :)
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barnabywalters I’m heading out too
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ShaneHudson Yeah I wouldn't mind it if you could :) .tar.gz probably do better though
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barnabywalters okay
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aaronpk cweiske: ok, good idea
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caseorganic is there going to be an indieweb meetup at xoxo this week?
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bret caseorganic, i hope so :)
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bret everyone is here
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aaronpk let's put something together!
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aaronpk i know friday morning is already taken
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aaronpk but sat/sun morning are free
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indiewebcamp-vis hosting a round mix party...playin current trends in indie right now....click here to join http://plug.dj/indie-best-2013/
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aaronpk lol
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indiewebcamp-vis hosting a round mix party...playin current trends in indie right now....click here to join http://plug.dj/indie-best-2013/
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indiewebcamp-vis hosting a round mix party...playin current trends in indie right now....click here to join http://plug.dj/indie-best-2013/
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indiewebcamp-vis hosting a round mix party...playin current trends in indie right now....click here to join http://plug.dj/indie-best-2013/
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@dellasm RT @Stephonavich: RT @MutinousBoomer Find out what happens when real life and real miracles collide! http://www.amazon.com/dp/B007H0RS60 #sep #IndieAuth… (twitter.com/_/status/380769955731759104)
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indiewebcamp-vis hosting a round mix party...playin current trends in indie right now....click here to join http://plug.dj/indie-best-2013/
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vrypan_ I'm trying to parse reply-context. I'm a bit lost, it seems there are so many ways to describe it. p-in-reply-to and u-url? u-in-reply-to? (Same with author info)
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bret what is the easiest way to bind a keyboard button to a form button on a page?
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bret addeventlistener
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tantek greetings #indiewebcamp!
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tantek on a plane :)
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tantek bnvk - you in PDX?
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bnvk tantek: nope, London! Are you got to XOXO?
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tantek going to XOXO yes
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ShaneHudson I was hoping to go to the Ghost launch party, but sadly it is tonight and not a weekend!
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tantek tommorris - LOL - site-deaths already had *TWO* links to "our incredible journey" so you added a third? ;)
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tantek ShaneHudson - WTF? A launch party? Who's actually running it?
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ShaneHudson tantek: John O'Nolan
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tantek URL?
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tantek as in, are the creators of Ghost self-dogfooding yet?
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ShaneHudson Trafalgar Square roof gardens... should be amazing. I went to the original meetup, that was incredible
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ShaneHudson Yeah they are
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tantek ShaneHudson - there's been no evidence to date of that
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tantek quite the contrary
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tantek seems like another hyped monoculture effort :/
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tantek http://indiewebcamp.com/Ghost
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ShaneHudson http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/johnonolan/ghost-just-a-blogging-platform/posts/593474?ref=activity they wrote the post on kickstarter
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ShaneHudson but they've definitely been using it. I've got a copy running locally, it is very good
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tantek yet another ks means nothing
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tantek if they're not selfdogfooding on their own primary personal URL - who cares?
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tantek if they are - then add it to http://indiewebcamp.com/Ghost
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ShaneHudson http://ghost.onolan.org/
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tantek add it to the wiki page
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ShaneHudson he is running on a separate sub domain for now.
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tantek that's close enough ;)
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ShaneHudson I expect that will change now it is launching.. probably means it is stable enough to use
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aaronpk at least it's on his own TLD, not onolan.ghost.org or whatever
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ShaneHudson yeah
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ShaneHudson They will be offering hosted, but mostly since it runs on node
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ShaneHudson and not many people can set up node easily
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tantek yeah - it's why I haven't bothered with node yet and went the cassis.js route instead
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ShaneHudson well, it's not hard. But I can't even on mine as I use a shared server
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ShaneHudson (for now)
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tantek cassis.js doesn't require that you install anything on your web server
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ShaneHudson I need to learn more about cassis.js
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tantek it's basically a subset of JS that runs in both browsers (obv) and natively on PHP.
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tantek and I'm selfdogfooding it in Falcon and on tantek.com
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tantek shanehudson -> #cassis.js
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ShaneHudson It is JS that runs in PHP? Interesting
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tantek without any interepretation - i.e. not like coffeescript
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tantek.com edited /site-deaths (-232) "already 2 links to incredible journey, don't need a 3rd. Undo revision 5266 by [[Special:Contributions/Tommorris.org|Tommorris.org]] ([[User talk:Tommorris.org|talk]])" (view diff)
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shanehudson.net edited /Ghost (+982) "Added a small amount of information about Ghost" (view diff)
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ShaneHudson This is worth a read http://ghost.onolan.org/what-it-means-to-be-non-profit I think they will be running it well.
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tommorris tantek: good call on the revert. I got over-excited about that link. :)
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bret anyone want to help me test something really quick?
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ShaneHudson bret: what is it?
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Loqi it is JS that runs in PHP
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ShaneHudson Loqi, you're like 20 minutes late.
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tantek Loqi :D
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Loqi :)
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bret ShaneHudson, i need someone to help me confirm my program works on th eopen internet: i need someone with a webRTC enabled browser to click this: http://marxtwain.dyndns.org:3000/
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ShaneHudson sure thing
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ShaneHudson I see myself. buttons don't seem to do anything though
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bret you should see me
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ShaneHudson nope
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bret :/
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bret what browser are you using?
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Loqi yea
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ShaneHudson Chrome 29 on OSX 10.8.3
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bret pressing the buttons is working, as in, its making stuff blink over here
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bret ShaneHudson hold tight
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ShaneHudson WebRTC should work fine in this browser, it is what I've been working on.
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bret see me?
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bret i sew you
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bret see
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ShaneHudson I can hear you
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ShaneHudson what's that for?
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ShaneHudson pretty cool :D
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bret Thanks :)
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bret where are you located?
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bret im in portland
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ShaneHudson England
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bret Wow! the video looked great
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ShaneHudson Yeah it seemed fine :D
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@ShaneHudson I just controlled an arduino over WebRTC, cool :D #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/380785560065179649)
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bret ShaneHudson technically the arduino was just controlled via sockets.io + node
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bret adrenaline rush :) thanks ShaneHudson
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ShaneHudson bret: Ah... you should try it over WebRTC alone. Then it is peer to peer :D
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ShaneHudson though data channels don't work well between ff and chrome yet
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bret i want to put the signaling server on appfog or heroku or something
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bret and then do pure webRTC, but it would be slick if I didn't have to run a browser on the SEM control computer
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bret video over websockets is weird though. so meh. ship something now refine later
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donpdonp bret: i want to encode webrtc from a webcam on an rPi for streaming to a browser. have you done that?
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bret donpdonp exactly... no idea. I have only seen websockets + ffmpeg + javascript mpeg decoder
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donpdonp bret: i saw that blog post too! works sort of maybe okay
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bret donpdonp ShaneHudson if interested: https://github.com/bcomnes/SEMterface
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tantek greetings #indiewebcamp!
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ShaneHudson Good evening tantek :)
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tantek there's an open drinkup tonight 17:00-19:00 in PDX at Green Dragon Bistro: https://www.facebook.com/events/702726303089128 (event says "public" but might have to login to the silo :/ )
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tantek sorry, just "The Green Dragon"
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tantek they have wifi+power so if anyone wants to catchup on what happened in IndieWebCampUK 2013 etc.
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tantek at a minimum myself and shaners will be there
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tantek cc: aaronpk bret caseorganic
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aaronpk you not going to the official xoxo party?
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tantek aaronpk - this is a pre-party before the opening party
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aaronpk ah
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aaronpk i'm giving a talk at the quantified self meetup tonight
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aaronpk before the party
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ShaneHudson I'm stuck here working and your having pre-party parties! Lol
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aaronpk right now i'm having a pre-pre-party with my slide deck
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tantek now that sounds like a party
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bret :)
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bret I was thinking of going to the sidedoor for the node meetup
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bret hrrrm going to have to rethink this
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tantek bret - nevermind node, here's #cassis.js ;)
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tantek is on the Trimet redline
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bret does it have a serial interface?
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tantek that sounds like a WebAPI
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bret that would be slick
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bret is the official xoxo party open to the public?
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jernst Hey indie'ers: The Indie Box Project has successfully installed its first web application with a single command on a Linux plug computer. All open-source. http://indieboxproject.org/blog/2013/09/indie-box-has-successfully-installed-its-first-web-application/
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ShaneHudson Hah.. I found photos from clearleft. I *really* need to learn to smile properly xD http://www.flickr.com/photos/clearleft/9725007043/lightbox/
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ShaneHudson jernst: Pretty cool :)
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jernst ShaneHudson: thanks!
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jernst Imagine if all the stuff we're discussing here was installable by anybody with a single command.
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bret jernst: way cool!
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jernst bret: it's not very hard to enable an application to participate: https://github.com/indieboxproject/indie-helloworld/blob/master/indie-box-manifest.json
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jernst This is a trivial hello world app, but illustrates the principle.
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bret reminds me of a package.json from node :)
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bret (doing a bunch of node work the last few days)
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bret which is a good thing. NPM is amazing
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jernst Lots of similarities. dpkg, packman, etc etc
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jernst Big difference: this is about "N installs of the same app on the same machine" aka virtual hosts
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jernst So I can have one box for my family, and run a blog for everybody in the family, for example
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bret sweet :)
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bret I can't wait to see it develop
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jernst me neither :-) I keep waiting but for some reason it just isn't intelligent enough to develop itself :-)
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ShaneHudson Awesome!
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bret Evan P was talking about selling plug servers with pump.io pre-setup
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jernst I know. I've been trying to talk him into doing it a way that we don't end up with one box per app
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jernst somehow I don't want to have one Wordpress box for each family member, one Owncloud, one Trovebox nee OpenPhoto etc.
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bret i want to jump into that project and do some PR's to get mf2's onto the post permalink pages
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jernst what's a mf2
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bret microformat 2
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jernst that project being pump?
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jernst that'd be cool
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bret im hoping that once people startin using pump notes in their own reply context, that evan will start processing webmentions and consuming mf2
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bret will be motivated to...*
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jernst I'd love to have that. essentially my own version of twitter, plus the entire conversation of the universe around what i said, residing on a box under my desk that I can unplug and take with me
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jernst and everybody else I know can do it, too, without having to be a geek
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jernst that's the kind of web I thought we were building 20 years ago
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bret tantek: are peopel already at the sidedoor?
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tantek heading to Green Dragon now (not sidedoor)
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tantek jernst - a bunch of us our building our own versions of twitter on our websites
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tantek e.g. I post all my "tweets" from tantek.com
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tantek and they have favorite/reteweet/reply buttons right there on my own website
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tantek so you're in the right channel for this :)
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tantek bret - hope to see you at Green Dragon
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jernst tantek: do you think those private "twitters" will remain exclusive to their creators or become "products" of some kind that others can use?
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aaronpk jernst: have you seen the work benwerd has done with idno? several people are using it now
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aaronpk there are like half a dozen other projects that are turning into real products too
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jernst yes I have. I know he wants it to be a product that others can use
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bret jernst: it depends on the creator. I think ben werdimuler and idno wants to make something for lots of people to use
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jernst cool! I'd like them all to be installable and upgradeable via Indie Box!
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bret pump.io is another one that has a wide appeal but is kind of doing its own thing still
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bret having a meta project to make using tools easy to use is importaint too
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jernst we need an entire stack
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bret i guess not meta, but focused on ease of deployment
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bret as long as we are aware of the monoculture issue: http://indiewebcamp.com/antipatterns#monoculture
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jernst from OS (linux, easy) via middleware (need conventions, so different applications don't step on each other's feet) over management (e.g. IndieBox) to shared services (e.g. single-sign-on, shared data elements across apps)
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jernst agree with the "let many flowers bloom"