#indiewebcamp 2014-01-18

2014-01-18 UTC
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tantek of where JSON is human-unfriendly
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aaronpk JSON doesn'thave a date/time type
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tantek hence the problem
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tantek that lack of type forces programmers to canonocalize on ISO8601 long form in Z which is both human unfriendly and loses information (timezone etc.)
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tantek or worse - # of seconds since epoch
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tantek or some such other human unfriendliness
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bear just like mf2 - you can use json in a way that doesn't lose data
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tantek.com edited /storage (+52) "markdown in practice requires custom extensions to store data" (view diff)
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tantek bear - no one does
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tantek or rather - can you point to any examples of anyone using JSON in a way that doesn't lose data in a human-unfriendly fashion?
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tantek especially examples of dates and times?
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bear all of the examples are from internal data conversation tools that go from SQL -> JSON or XML -> JSON
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bear because of the lack of data types, everything is stored as JSON strings
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tantek.com edited /storage (+144) "/* Databases */ databases = custom schemas = more pain to import/export = adds friction to portability" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /storage (+90) "db antipattern para" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /storage (+30) "category" (view diff)
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tantek bear - then you likely are losing the SQL type information in your JSON
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bear it wasn't but that's only because each field value had a corresponding meta data value of where it came from and how it was stored there
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bear I found with data conversion code, to always store the schema along with the data when transporting
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bear but again, probably out of band to IndieWeb discussions
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tantek bear - which then doubles the complexity
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bear yep
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tantek whereas with uf2 - we've minimized that to infrequent occurences
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tantek with a handful of dt- u- e- prefixed properties
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bear sorry - I must be in a really off mood as I'm seeing everything thru a curmudgeon filter
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tantek hehe
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tantek that's not always bad ;)
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tantek (darn kids)
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bear :)
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bear I actually mutter that about what most of you all say
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bear (being probably the older person in the room)
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tantek refrains from contesting that.
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bear is 50 and has been in computers since 1979
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tantek is not 50 but has also been coding on computers since 1979 (even if it was BASIC on a timeshare).
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bear ah - nice!
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tantek notes that length of time coding on computers does not really correlate to much, except for having spent that time.
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bear but age doesn't matter - i've learned to try and listen to everyone and then ask questions
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tantek agreed
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bear my older habits get in the way some times
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bear.im edited /storage (+162) "/* Flat files */" (view diff)
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tantek nice
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bear the authorship update earlier has me chewing over some ideas and now i'm going to go add them to the python code I am using
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KevinMarks is 47 and coding on computers since 1979 though it was a PET
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bear all of my earlier computers where other people's that bought them but couldn't figure them out - they hired me to fix, setup and program them
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tantek Cue Smashing Pumpkins 1979
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KevinMarks I really need to write up my post about mapreduce mindset too
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tantek aaronpk - can we get Loqi to play music in the channel?
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bear it's amazing how pervasive of a mindset earlier tool use is
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bear.im edited /storage (+35) "add time shard info" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /authorship (+25) "/* Issues */ theoretical" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /note (+24) "/* FAQ */ see also storage" (view diff)
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iangreenleaf Hi all! Do you know of / maintain a list of data liberation options anywhere?
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iangreenleaf I.e. "How to get your __[type of data]__ out of __[cloud service]__"?
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tantek hello and welcome iangreenleaf!
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tantek we tend to call them "silos" rather than "cloud services" (If I get your meaning)
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iangreenleaf right yes, that's what I meant
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tantek and such information (how to export your data from) is available on the wiki page for each
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tantek e.g. for the Twitter silo
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tantek you can simply go to http://indiewebcamp.com/Twitter
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iangreenleaf yeah, I noticed the Twitter and Tumblr pages - is there much beyond that?
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tantek yes - plenty!
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tantek http://indiewebcamp.com/silos has a decent list of them
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iangreenleaf nifty, thanks. so if I wanted to contribute, the way to do it would be to edit/create separate pages for each silo?
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tantek exactly!
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iangreenleaf I started thinking (as I wrested my 360 movie ratings out of Netflix) that we should have a good list of all this stuff
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iangreenleaf especially since it's hard to figure out what is currently working, what has broken since first being released, etc
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tantek.com edited /FAQ (+628) "How do I export my data" (view diff)
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tantek Thanks iangreenleaf - a very good general question to add to the FAQ: http://indiewebcamp.com/FAQ#How_do_I_export_my_data
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tantek yes it would be good to create a Netflix page - please go for it
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tantek oh and feel free to add yourself to: http://indiewebcamp.com/irc-people
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iangreenleaf awesome, I'll work on contributing to a couple tonight - off the top of my head I can offer some info for Netflix, Facebook, Fitocracy, Garmin...
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tantek we do have a FB page http://indiewebcamp.com/Facebook
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tantek and right at the top http://indiewebcamp.com/Facebook#Exporting_your_data
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tantek.com edited /FAQ (+69) "/* How do I export my data */ FB Exporting your data" (view diff)
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tantek you might ping aaronpk about Fitocracy and Garmin - I know aaronpk has done a lot of work with personal metrics services - and I'm sure he'd be interested in whatever you document for those.
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iangreenleaf BTW, what's the word on "unofficial" export solutions? legit to add to the wiki or not?
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iangreenleaf for example, I worked up a bookmarklet to export photos from others I was tagged in on Facebook a while back
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iangreenleaf ...something Facebook does not include in the official export
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www.iangreenleaf.com edited /IRC_People (+69) (view diff)
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tantek iangreenleaf - 3rd party tools for exporting data would be great to add to the wiki
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tantek we fight for the users
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Jeena ok, very rudimentary but it works https://jeena.net/notes/1
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Jeena no webmention on it yet and no automatic POSSE
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tantek Jeena, beautiful!
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tantek that's perfectly fine
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Jeena it is a start :)
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tantek start with manual POSSEing! I (and most others) did.
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tantek it also helps you figure out how you want your code to automatically POSSE for you
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Jeena yeah
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tantek and heck, I'm not even sending automatic webmentions yet myself - I manually curl them
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Jeena hehe
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tantek it's in my queue of things to code: http://indiewebcamp.com/Falcon#send_webmentions_for_posted_links :)
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tantek I'm preferring to document my thinking / figuring out of such features publicly in the hopes that such thinking helps others.
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Jeena I have all the code for doing it automatically implemented because I use it for posts already, so it should be quite easy to add tomorrow
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tantek excellent!
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snarfed iangreenleaf: i'll take a note to go update export pages on the wiki too
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snarfed that's probably my next project: to finish http://freedom.io/
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bret In terms of UX vs Security, threema.ch sets the bar for encrypted messaging. Been using it the past week and its been great
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bret its unfortunately phone app only though :(
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iangreenleaf snarfed: that looks super cool! are you working through the official APIs?
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iangreenleaf !t snarfed that looks super cool! are you working through the official APIs?
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Jeena and not even for Firefox OS!
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iangreenleaf !tell snarfed freedom.io looks super cool! I'm curious if you're going through the official APIs, and if so, how you're handling the restrictive terms
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi [mention] http://upon2020.com/blog/2014/01/the-family-intranet-or-not/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-01-15-homebrew-website-club (pingback)
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Loqi snarfed: iangreenleaf left you a message 1 hour, 5 minutes ago: freedom.io looks super cool! I'm curious if you're going through the official APIs, and if so, how you're handling the restrictive terms
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@igorette RT @nxD4n POSSE is an acronym/abbreviation for Publish (on your) Own Site, Syndicate Elsewhere. http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE #reclaim (twitter.com/_/status/424404554533568512)
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snarfed iangreenleaf: thanks for the kind words!
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snarfed it does use the official apis
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snarfed I've been shut down before, so I have a feeling for what usage thresholds and tips trigger it, etc. http://snarfed.org/2013-07-09_twitter-atom-is-back
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snarfed in practice, Twitter is the most aggressive by a wide margin
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iangreenleaf do you think, if it got wildly popular, that you could stay on their good sides?
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snarfed no, I doubt it
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snarfed my workaround for the last one was to have users generate their own api keys :/
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iangreenleaf yeah :)
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iangreenleaf thanks for indulging my curiosity
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snarfed I just finished my last big project and got it stable - https://www.brid.gy - so I'll be back to hacking on freedom.io in a week or two
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snarfed feel free to Kiko into the github repo if you're interested!
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snarfed s/Kiko/jump/
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Loqi snarfed meant to say: feel free to jump into the github repo if you're interested!
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iangreenleaf yeah, I might poke around, POSSE is of great interest to me so always cool to see people building things
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www.iangreenleaf.com edited /silo (+172) "Adding some additional silos" (view diff)
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www.iangreenleaf.com created /Netflix (+215) "Created page with "== Data Export == === Ratings === * You can use [https://userscripts.org/scripts/show/288110 this Greasemonkey script] to scrape all your ratings into a CSV document. === Revi..."" (view diff)
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www.iangreenleaf.com created /Fitocracy (+67) "Created page with "== Data Export == * https://github.com/luketurner/fitocracy-export"" (view diff)
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www.iangreenleaf.com created /Garmin_Connect (+207) "Created page with "== Data Export == * You can use [https://tapiriik.com/ tapiriik] (for free) to sync GPS files between a number of destinations, including a Dropbox folder. ** This will not sync..."" (view diff)
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www.iangreenleaf.com created /Strava (+294) "Created page with "== Data Export == * You can use [https://tapiriik.com/ tapiriik] (for free) to sync GPS files between a number of destinations, including a Dropbox folder. ** This will not sync..."" (view diff)
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www.iangreenleaf.com edited /Garmin_Connect (+206) (view diff)
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bret.io edited /storage (+288) "/* Markdown plus extensions */" (view diff)
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www.iangreenleaf.com edited /Facebook (+145) (view diff)
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@ant0ine RT @kevinmarks: According to Google Play, Indie/Alternative is the biggest category http://research.google.com/bigpicture/music/ #indieweb #SoIndieItsMainstream (twitter.com/_/status/424422547325591553)
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@voxpelli Everything seems to be working well with my WebMention endpoint, so I'm making 5 more accounts available: https://webmention.herokuapp.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/424463318913658880)
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@linusbohman RT @voxpelli: Everything seems to be working well with my WebMention endpoint, so I'm making 5 more accounts available: https://t.co/jpviUX… (twitter.com/_/status/424465175987884032)
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Jeena good morning! Is it possible to POSSE my notes automatically to Facebook? Is there a API for that?
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@jeena Note webmention test (twitter.com/_/status/424515945181511680)
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@jeena webmention test 3 (twitter.com/_/status/424519976373190656)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/repost/googleplus/116873380212462409886/z12gjrkgbxvththgd04cedboqsj5ztth4fk/101810602218469667807 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/Google%2B-fr (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/googleplus/116873380212462409886/z12gjrkgbxvththgd04cedboqsj5ztth4fk/108704761256162733831 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/Google%2B-fr (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/googleplus/116873380212462409886/z13zgbhw3kimepnmt22mdx5q3tjyifd2w/109136078678251061361 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/ (webmention)
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Jeena Wohoo now my mentions can POSSE to Twitter and send+receive webmentions!
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Jeena not my mentions, my notes!
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@jeena I’ve been working on my own #indieweb twitter replacement. Right now it is POSSING notes to twitter, can send and receive #webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/424551524929662976)
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@jeena I’ve been working on my own #indieweb twitter replacemen... http://lala.home.jeena.net:3000/notes/11 (twitter.com/_/status/424551885128077312)
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@jeena I’ve been working on my own #indieweb twitter replacement. Right now it is POSSING notes to twitter, can send a... https://jeena.net/notes/5 (twitter.com/_/status/424554756917702656)
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Jeena Finally it is freaking working ^^
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Jeena Next step would be Facebook
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snarfed nice work!
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@jeena @zatnosk hehe yeah, sorry ^^ I was testing my new #indieweb notes, so they would push to Twitter too and had a nasty bug :-p (twitter.com/_/status/424555182186561536)
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Jeena thanks :)
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bnvk nice
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bnvk Jeena: what is it written in?
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Jeena it is a rails app
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bnvk ah, cool
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Jeena my blog has from the start been a rails app so I just upgraded first from rails 2 to 3 and now to 4 and added the indieweb stuff on top of everything. Back then I only had Pingback which later on stopped working
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Jeena For now I added a atom feed for my notes too because there are no h-entry feed readers that I know of
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@jeena @goetzb yeah I probably should write a blog post, but until then check out http://indiewebify.me/ and then http://indiewebcamp.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/424558055410253824)
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Jeena Hm now I also need to implement the special in_reply_to for Twitter so they can connect them in the right way
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Jeena wow, that was easy, and it is done, not I finally can answer people on twitter via my own notes :D
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neuro` Jeena: congrats!
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Jeena thx :)
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neuro` Did you already add the HTML?
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neuro` Jeena: BTW, what's your blog engine? I read it was Rails based
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Jeena yeah it is just a plain rails app I wrote, nothing special
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Jeena I tried to use blog engines but never got them working like I wanted them to work so I gave up and wrote my own blog software.
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neuro` Oh OK. I've been maintaining a Rails publishing engine for 8 years now, that has notes and Twitter replies, that's why I was asking
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Jeena just small stuff like a subtitle can be really complicated to add to a blog engine
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Jeena ah nice, link?
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neuro` https://github.com/fdv/publify/ demo at http://demo.publify.co/
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Jeena and then this blog is a playground for me too, I try crazy stuff on a real audience sometimes just to check their reactions :-p
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Jeena thx
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neuro` used to power blog.rubyonrails.org in 2004/2005
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neuro` before they move to Mephisto
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Jeena back then in 2004 you used rails already?
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neuro` I started Ruby in 2002, and Rails when they released 0.4 iirc.
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Jeena jesus
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Jeena in 2002 I bought my first PC and got a modem for it :D
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neuro` Hahah. You're probably younger than me
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Loqi hehe
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Jeena before that I had an Amiga without internet between 1992 and 1995
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Jeena I'm 35
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neuro` Same age then
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Jeena yeah I was kind of late to the whole computer thingy
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Jeena but in 2004 I also wrote a blog engine, which still runs my german blog http://jeenaparadies.net/weblog/ but it was in PHP4 https://github.com/jeena/jlog
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Jeena but it was my first programming project so it is spagetti code all the way
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neuro` Hehe
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neuro` I have a story for you then.
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neuro` I
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neuro` One day, a French guy was bored during the summer holliday, so he started to learn PHP and coded a spagetti blog engine. IIRC, it was first called "cafelog", then "b2".
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neuro` B2 popularity grew quickly (was in 2001 or 2002), and after a while, that guy moved to something else.
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neuro` Then, another guy forked the project, and named his fork "Wordpress"
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neuro` (hello michel_v)
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neuro` So you see what can happen to PHP4 blog projects :)
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Loqi barnabywalters: bnvk left you a message on 1/17 at 2:39pm: your "Feedreader Mockups" page seems to be hidden behind an auth http://photos.waterpigs.co.uk/p/pu
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barnabywalters !tell bnvk RE feedreader mockups hidden: indeed, my openphoto instance broke and I haven’t figured out how to fix it yet :( More up-to-date feedreader mockups at http://waterpigs.co.yk/intertubes
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi bnvk: barnabywalters left you a message 1 minute ago: RE feedreader mockups hidden: indeed, my openphoto instance broke and I haven’t figured out how to fix it yet :( More up-to-date feedreader mockups at http://waterpigs.co.yk/intertubes
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barnabywalters afternoon bnvk
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bnvk barnabywalters: afternoon- what are you up to?
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Jeena barnabywalters is that http://waterpigs.co.uk/intertubes/feed/ a h-entry feed reader where you in some way subscribe to other websites?
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barnabywalters Jeena: yep
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Jeena cool! so how do you get new data from the websites, are you spidering those websites every couple of minutes or something?
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barnabywalters nothing as fancy as that yet — I’m just requesting them live at the moment, which is why it’s quite slow
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Jeena ah I see
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Jeena are you requesting the index pages or something else?
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barnabywalters I’m just trying to fix the authentication problem so you can see the config UI
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Jeena ok :)
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Jeena I'm also confused about where to point #tags in my notes
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barnabywalters Jeena: point them to pages on your own site which aggregate content tagged with that tag
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barnabywalters e.g. http://waterpigs.co.uk/tags/gurdy
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tantek that's good FAQ to add
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Jeena I see, ok I will do that in the future, right now there are just too few posts ^^
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barnabywalters Jeena: okay try http://waterpigs.co.uk/intertubes/feed/edit/ (maybe force refresh or clear cache)
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Jeena wow fancy
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waterpigs.co.uk edited /hashtags (-345) "/* Brainstorming */ removed brainstorming, superceded by actual implementations" (view diff)
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barnabywalters http://waterpigs.co.uk/intertubes/people-ive-talked-to-recently/edit/ is a little more complex
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Jeena but that is just read only for me right now I assume?
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Jeena and it is your own instance of this feedreader?
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barnabywalters Jeena: yep, this is my instance of a flow-based-programming environment built for processing microformats data
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barnabywalters anyone can try out the UI, but can’t save new pipes
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Jeena it kind of looks like Yahoo pipes, I always liked their intuitive UI
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barnabywalters it’s pretty experimental
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Jeena I see
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barnabywalters yep, a lot of it is based off yahoo pipes
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Jeena ah and everything is HTML, I wonder how you do the connections
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Jeena ah SVG, hehe interesting
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waterpigs.co.uk edited /hashtags (+359) "/* IndieWeb examples */ added FAQ" (view diff)
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barnabywalters yep, there’s this awesome JS library http://jsplumbtoolkit.com
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barnabywalters which handles all the connections. you just specify which HTML elements to connect, and it draws and updates the SVG
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Jeena neat, even though I kind of would have expected it to be rendered in a WebGL canvas
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barnabywalters well that would mean having to learn WebGL :)
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Jeena hm yeah perhaps
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Jeena but lerning new stuff is fun anyway :D
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barnabywalters of course! but in this case the important thing is the flow based programming UI, not the nitty gritty of how it’s implemented, so I used the tools which allow me to focus on that
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tantek Jeena - congrats on getting your notes to POSSE to Twitter!
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tantek you mentioned replying to people from your site - that's definitely a good thing to implement!
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tantek it requires a little more work of course, to set the in-reply-to-status-id for proper threading
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tantek gets a URL
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Jeena thanks, it wasn't that complicated, I found out that you can get a oauth_token and secret from the dev-page on twitter so you don't have to deal with the oauth process
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barnabywalters Jeena: how have you implemented posting without having to log in? https://jeena.net/notes/5
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tantek Jeena - you may find this helpful when implementing replies: http://indiewebcamp.com/Twitter#POSSE_Replies_to_Tweets
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Jeena I saved twitter_consumer_key, twitter_consumer_secret, oauth_token and oauth_token_secret in my code
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tantek barnabywalters - I'm guessing secret URL on his site ;)
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Jeena tantek I already did, with:
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Jeena in_reply_to_status_id = in_reply_to.split("/").last if in_reply_to.starts_with? "https://twitter.com/"
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Jeena and then instead just the status I send:
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Jeena {status: text, in_reply_to_status_id: in_reply_to_status_id }
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barnabywalters SECRETS
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tantek nice
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tantek what happens if you have more than one in-reply-to URL?
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Jeena I obviously make a ton of assumptions but that is ok, I'm the only one who uses it
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tantek I think we are all doing that (making a ton of assumptions about usage) :)
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tantek http://indiewebcamp.com/multiple-reply
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Jeena tantek I only can have one twitter in-reply-to but I can have multiple others
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Jeena I just go through the links in my html and do a webmention to every of them
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tantek great
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Jeena Does the Twitter API even allow more then one in_reply_to_status_id?
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tantek no
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Jeena ok
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tantek but if you have more than one in a post, you have to pick one somehow to POSSE
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Jeena my UI looks like this: http://jeena.net/s/latest.png the one at the bottom is for one which doesn't need to be in the text
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Jeena If I need more I have to put them into the text
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Jeena and those only work with webmentions, not with twitter, but ok for now I think
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tantek Jeena what's the name of your posting tool?
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Jeena uhm it doesn't have one :-(
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Jeena If I come up with one I will tell you :)
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tantek :)
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tantek.com edited /design (+254) "add a screenshots section with links to p3k, taproot, example from Jeena" (view diff)
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Jeena oh but let me change the URL, because next time I make a screenshot this url will show something else ;)
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tantek.com edited /design (+58) "/* Screenshots */ specific URLs" (view diff)
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tantek Jeena - or feel free to upload it (perhaps with an ISOdate in the name) to indiewebcamp.com
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Jeena ok
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jeena.net uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:Jeenas-notes-post-UI-2014-01-18.png]]""
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jeena.net edited /design (+15) "/* Screenshots */" (view diff)
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Jeena hmmmm, perhaps I should write some user-js so if I click on a reply button in twitter it opens my website and populates everything so I don't need to do it manually ...
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barnabywalters Jeena: take a look at https://github.com/barnabywalters/web-action-hero-toolbelt/ for that sort of thing
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Jeena I see you guys have already done everything I come up with :p
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Jeena it is impressive https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvcaqSwMVBE
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barnabywalters Jeena: thanks :) hope you find it useful — any feedback/pull requests very welcome, I haven’t really worked on it much for a while
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Jeena hehe watching https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OAfvuKCsEk it looks like it would let me do exactly what I was thinking about
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Jeena hm how do I get to the options? firefox opens a new tab with chrome://webnactions_kango/content/options.html which obviously doesn't work ;)
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Jeena ok got it
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Jeena oh man, this is almost perfect, the only thing I would need is the twitter username as a variable
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Jeena but I can get it from the URL instead as a forkaround for now
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barnabywalters Jeena: yeah I did make an earlier version with some silo-specific things like that but decided instead to make something which just works with URLs
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Jeena yeah I understand
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voxpelli Displaying WebMentions – sort on h-entry publish date or on webmention receive time?
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snarfed voxpelli: dt-published or dt-updated please!
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voxpelli snarfed: yeah, makes sense with Brid.gy in mind – dt-published it is then
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voxpelli Just a bit worried that it will be hard to track new entries when they can appear in the middle of a comment thread
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snarfed if you're ordering by time, then a reply's time is dt-published if it provides it
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snarfed for direct replies, that will usually be the same as the received time, but for indirect cases like bridgy, it's not
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snarfed bridgy often sends webmentions for replies (likes etc) that were created days or weeks or months earlier
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snarfed sorry, you already knew that :P
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snarfed you can do nested threading too if you want. an h-entry can have multiple u-in-reply-to links, e.g. one to the top level post and one to another reply
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snarfed doesn't happen often in practice yet though
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snarfed Jeena: late to the game, but you can definitely posse to facebook automatically w/their api
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snarfed there's plenty of code that does that automatically, e.g. wordpress plugins and more
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Jeena Ok, nice, but I need to do it half manually, but perhaps there is a rails plugin too
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iangreenleaf aaronpk: Have you done any POSSE stuff with fitness tracking data? I see you've written about it.
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aaronpk iangreenleaf: I haven't done POSSE with the data, but I am tracking a few things on my own site
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aaronpk http://aaronparecki.com/metrics
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aaronpk I just don't push that out to any Esilos
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aaronpk and technically the sleep and weight there is PESOS, but the pushups are original data
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iangreenleaf cool cool. you just making up your own data formats? I don't know of any particularly standard ones for most metrics
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aaronpk i'm basing it off of microformats
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aaronpk and based off of the format from the device I get the data
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KartikPrabhu bear: any reason ronkyuu stores that a url is a reply? https://github.com/bear/ronkyuu/blob/master/ronkyuu/webmention.py#L63
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bear looks
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bear KartikPrabhu - that is my planning ahead. I *think* that reply mentions will be handled/flagged for further processing (at least I did when I wrote that :)
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KartikPrabhu bear: cool!
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bear KartikPrabhu - and i'm also all for removing it if it's not used - keeping code around "just because" is, for me, a old bad habit - so please do call me on it so I can unlearn it
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KartikPrabhu bear: I think when sending mentions it does not matter if it is a reply or not. But it would be important while parsing a received mention.
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bear nods
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KartikPrabhu and if I am parsing a mention I received then I wouldn't be searching for all 'a's anyway. just the one that was mentioned
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KartikPrabhu that's why I was thinking that the reply check is not necessary in this one
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bear that's a good point about the code - please do submit a PR with that change (and even a note as to why) - I would love to have your ideas and usage notes in the code
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bear if not a PR then an issue with the above - so I can make the change later
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KartikPrabhu i was modifying quite some bits in my forked version. I'll update it on Github with notes of changes. I'll let you know
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bear \o/ thanks
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Jeena Pullrequest!
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KartikPrabhu Q: For webmention endpoint discovery is it correct to only look in the document head and not the entire document?
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Jeena don't forget the Header too
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bear I think it's head only
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KartikPrabhu Jeena: yes. I still have to figure that out :)
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bear jeena - you mean in the HTML server response header?
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aaronpk you should probably just parse the whole HTML document for the rel values
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Jeena yeah
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Loqi fo sho
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aaronpk for example if you run a page through php-mf2 you get back an array of rels regardless of where in the HTML they occur
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bear hmm, didn't think it would be returned in the header
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Jeena I think it is more complicated to stop at the end of head then just let a parser parse the whole thing
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tantek bear - there are examples of sites that do that
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bear guess I have some code to change/improve then
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tantek listed on the webmention page (that use HTTP LINK header for webmention discovery)
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tantek there's a bunch of open source to parse them too - in various languages
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Jeena I only add the link to the HTTP header
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aaronpk yes, both the HTTP header and HTML header
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KartikPrabhu Jeena: Beautiful Soup in python can parse any fragment. and it is apparently foster to do only the required parts
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KartikPrabhu faster not foster
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Jeena how much faster, 20 ms?
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KartikPrabhu yeah well! good point
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KartikPrabhu Jeena: point taken
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Jeena ;)
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aaronpk yeah the time saved by parsing only the HTML <head> instead of th ewhole doc is going to be exponentially less than the time spent making the HTTP connection to actually send the webmention
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KartikPrabhu \me needs to stop over-optimizing
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bear I did the <head> only from my reading of the /webmention page
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bear ah, and I guess I didn't make it down to the bottom of the page where Alternatives are listed
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Jeena curl -I https://jeena.net
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bear it just that it seemed (to me) that /webmention page was clear that it be only in <head>
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Jeena btw. parsing the header is really easy, I always thought it is complicated because you can have multiple links in one Link: header etc.
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Jeena links = response["link"].split(",").reject{|l| not l.split(";")[1] =~ /webmention/}>
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Jeena or something like that
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bear yea, not too worried about implementing it or changing what parts to look for it - just being cranky-grumpy about something that I just need to stop being cranky-grumpy and edit the wiki about :)
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jeena.net edited /webmention (+387) "added jeena" (view diff)
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Jeena so with me we're 9 people using webmentions? That is not many, but I still like it.
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aaronpk i think there's more. that list is probably not complete anymore
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Jeena yeah tantek isn't on it either
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@diplix auch dieser tweet kann getrost ignoriert werden. ausser von https://www.brid.gy/ #webmention (http://root.wirres.net/reclaim/webmention/) (twitter.com/_/status/424688781443096576)
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Jeena german webmentions tweet!
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@jeena @diplix german Tweet about #webmention wohoo! (twitter.com/_/status/424689024738275329)
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Jeena My workflow works really well after just one day of development https://jeena.net/notes/7
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aaronpk Jeena: that's awesome! congrats!
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Jeena :)
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KartikPrabhu bear: made some changes to webmention sending in ronkyuu. feel free to comment/critique. https://github.com/kartikprabhu/ronkyuu/commit/de415b0a6a6430bf6fbbf2cea9e0c9ca3d394410
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bear thanks!
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snarfed nice work Jeena! btw, happily, there are plenty more webmention userse. idno and pfefferle's wordpress plugin have lots of users, for example. also see http://indiewebcamp.com/bridgy#IndieWeb_Examples
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Jeena yeah I just saw, this german tweet was done with this plugin, need to have a look at it
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bear KartikPrabhu - great changes! I would love to see this as PR and I would love to add you to the project contributor's list
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Jeena I wonder about https://www.brid.gy/ I'm not quite sure I understand it correctly, what does it actually do? How does it know which of the links I post are posts to my website which have webmentions enabled?
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KartikPrabhu bear: I'm new to git, so will have to figure out how to do PRs :P. But will do so for these changes...
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Jeena ah there is a more link
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bear KartikPrabhu - I appreciate you taking the time to improve the code. if you have made the change to your fork on github, the web ui for the commit should have a pull request button that is now visible
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KartikPrabhu bear: I want to use ronkyuu instead of writing the same code again, so I am adding things that I would use. :) also did the pull request thing. Did it work?