#indiewebcamp 2014-09-10

2014-09-10 UTC
#
Phyks hi, I've been hanging around for a while, to remember to have a look at microformats and h-feeds and finally got some time to handle it.
#
Phyks I'm wondering about the implementation of h-feeds, as if I understood correctly, that only requires to add some classes on key elements in HTML (h-entry, and so on)
ShaneHud_ joined the channel
#
Phyks but then would that mean that a feed agregator wanting to parse my feed would have to handle the full HTML of my blog and parse it to extract the relevant data ?
#
aaronpk Phyks: there is a well-defined parsing algorithm that takes the additional classes you add and returns a nice data structure
#
Phyks yes, I found [this implementation PHP](https://github.com/indieweb/php-mf2)
#
aaronpk as an example, take a page like this on my site and run it through a microformats parser http://aaron.pk/n4Y22 results in http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=http%3A%2F%2Faaronparecki.com%2Fnotes%2F2014%2F09%2F09%2F2%2Fapple-watch
#
Phyks but I'm wondering how does it compares to parsing Atom feed directly
#
Phyks AFAIK, parsing HTML requires much more computation power and network bandwidth than a simple feed, no ?
#
aaronpk the difference in parsing HTML vs XML is so slight that in practice it really doesn't matter
#
aaronpk and HTML feeds tend to be smaller than Atom or RSS
#
Phyks (actually, I was wondering whether I should add this on the homepage, or create also a separate light page with only the necessary elements, ATOM-like)
#
gRegor` mf2 is a lot less finicky than XML, too
#
gRegor` I'd recommend the homepage. It maintains DRY and I've not heard of anyone having problems re: computation power/bandwidth
#
Phyks gRegor`: I'm not necessarily talking about real life problems, but unnecessary extra computation / slower loading on slow networks and so
#
gRegor` Hm
#
Phyks actually, maybe it's a vision formatted by my habits with Atom/RSS, but it seems to me that using my homepage is definitely not optimized as up to half of the actual content can be really useful for the feed for instance
#
Phyks and I was wondering whether it was still the way to go, or I missed something
#
eliemichel In my opinion, h-feeds can't completely be machine-friendly as soon as they are human-readable
#
eliemichel humans do not want to read at the same time 50 articles
#
aaronpk I don't see why that is relevant
#
eliemichel but machines prefere that
lukebrooker joined the channel
#
aaronpk not really. if you're polling for updates, you really don't want to get the last 50 articles every time
#
gRegor` Eh. "machines" can easily be made to make multiple requests to get up to X posts, if that's what they want
#
eliemichel well, if you want to automatically gather the whole articles of a blog, you should browse many pages if they are organised in a human-confortable way
#
Phyks aaronpk: as I see them, "feeds" and "syndication" is a machine to machine process, whereas HTML usually serves machine to human content. That may be why it seems strange to me.
#
eliemichel Maybe you don't want, but that seems to be what Phyks want
#
gRegor` Phyks: I think the pros outweigh the cons. Even if only half of the HTML on your homepage is mf2, the benefit of having one version of your data and not having to maintain an XML feed, is worth it.
#
eliemichel And that's what I was looking for some days ago
#
Phyks gRegor`: +1 for the non duplication of data
#
Phyks but still, it seems to me it is more human oriented that machine oriented
#
aaronpk yep, a common problem is that sites will update the human-readable version and forget to update the machine-readable version, leading to broken rss feeds
#
aaronpk so focusing on making the human-readable version also be machine-readable solves that
#
Phyks (ie machines do not care about readability, etc., the only matter is efficiency and low bandwith requirements)
#
aaronpk machines don't "care" about anything
#
eliemichel People that command machines care about what machines do
#
Phyks care in the sense of "requires no more than"
#
Phyks aaronpk: I feel like mf2 is taking the counterpart and prefers human readability on machine readability
#
gRegor` Phyks: What is the filesize of your homepage HTML vs its XML feed?
#
eliemichel gRegor`: What is interesting is the ratio of the size of the page and the amount of raw information
#
eliemichel (interesting for the machine I mean)
#
gRegor` php-mf2 uses xpath and has always seemed quite fast to me.
#
aaronpk I feel like most of these quesitons/arguments are already answered on the microformats wiki, anyone remember the page?
#
Phyks gRegor`: wow, indeed, you have a point
#
Phyks it very counter-intuitive
#
Phyks half of the info on my blogpage is useless for the feed
#
Phyks but still, the feed is a bit larger than the html file
#
snarfed also, if you're worrying about your web site's speed, html file size is pretty damn low on the list of things to optimize. *many* other things matter more.
#
gRegor` The pin13.net parser aaronpk referenced runs php-mf2, so feel free to test it out there
#
Phyks snarfed: not really worrying for my speed, but for the other speed. An increase of 10% of the size, would mean 10% more time to refresh the feeds, and that's a real problem for an agregator
#
snarfed Phyks: no, that's not the math. lots of stuff matter for network time and cpu time for processing. file size is only one (often small) factor for either
#
aaronpk I think even a 10% increase in time to process would not be a thing worth optimizing
#
snarfed aaronpk++
#
Loqi aaronpk has 559 karma
#
snarfed design/write the simplest code possible until something is actually too slow. only then optimize
#
Phyks aaronpk: I'm working on a feed agregator right now, that's how I came across mf2, and reducing the refresh delay is a real pain. No need to increase it :)
#
Phyks (especially when I have to download more than 100 feeds each time :)
#
aaronpk aha! cool. well you're going to get a much bigger speed boost by being smarter about polling vs the (hypothetical) 10% increase in parsing time
#
Phyks yes, I know about polling, that is planned as well
#
aaronpk such as using PuSH to be proactively notified of new content
#
snarfed Phyks: i assume you've seen http://superfeedr.com/ ?
#
Phyks snarfed: I read a lot about PubSubHubbub, but did not come accross superfeeedr. But one of the main problems remains the implementation on server side…
#
Phyks (RSS / Atom already has some mechanisms to reduce polling, but they are barely used as far as I could see)
#
Phyks another question on the implementation :
#
eliemichel My problem with h-feeds is that I have just no page where full articles are listed. On the home page I put only summaries. So to be able to get the full feed I would need to query each article-related page…
#
Phyks I display the date in a specific format, for instance dd/mm on my blog, so this means I should add an element with the full date and hide it in CSS ?
#
eliemichel no, you can use the <time> tag
#
eliemichel <time datetime="yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm:ss" class="dt-published">dd/mm</time>
#
Phyks eliemichel: ah true, I missed it in the example code, my bad
#
gRegor` http://microformats.org/wiki/h-entry#dt-published_property_and_HTML5_time_element
#
snarfed Phyks: sure. rss/atom still need polling. the point is that superfeedr does it for you, so you don't have to. (they amortize the polling across all of their clients.)
#
Phyks snarfed: yes, but that mean one more centralized service
#
Phyks I'm not in favor of feeburner… nor am I for superfeedr…
#
Phyks *feedburner
#
snarfed Phyks: ok. i'm not too interested in getting religious about decentralization, so i'll back away slowly now. P:
#
Phyks snarfed: haha
#
Phyks whereas ATOM/RSS polling reduction can be done on the client side
#
Phyks (for instance "check hourly" or "check everyday except weekend" or so)
tantek joined the channel
#
tantek good evening #indiewebcamp! back in PDT :)
#
tantek catches up on logs
#
gRegor` Welcome back, tantek
#
tantek thanks gRegor`!
iboxifoo, KevinMarks__, halorgium and paulcp joined the channel
#
tantek welcome Phyks!
#
tantek what's your personal site?
#
eliemichel https://phyks.me
#
tantek cool! Phyks, go ahead and add yourself to http://indiewebcamp.com/irc-people
#
eliemichel Phyks: ^
#
eliemichel (actually he's gone, it's about to be 3am here in France
#
eliemichel )
#
tantek KevinMarks: can you POSSE your http://known.kevinmarks.com/2014/indieweb-xoxo-breakfast event to FB too so we can invite folks who are on the edge of the IndieWeb?
#
tantek !tell Phyks welcome! go ahead and add yourself to http://indiewebcamp.com/irc-people :)
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
#
tantek thanks eliemichel
#
kylewm what's going on here: http://aaronparecki.com/events/2014/09/13/1/indieweb-xoxo-breakfast
#
kylewm it looks like aaronpk is POSSEing to known.kevinmarks.com
fmarier joined the channel
#
tantek kylewm: no that's an RSVP post
#
tantek or so I thought?
#
tantek hmm
#
tantek ok this is confusing: http://aaronparecki.com/replies/2014/09/08/1/ (that's the actual RSVP post)
#
tantek it's a multi-reply RSVP!
#
tantek (which I don't think we've seen before)
#
tantek kylewm - it looks like a duplicate event post - not sure what is going on there. aaronpk - what's the reasoning for two indie events for the same event? did you repost KevinMarks's indie event?
lukebrooker and cmhobbs joined the channel
#
eliemichel https://addons.mozilla.org/fr/firefox/addon/webmention/
#
eliemichel And the code is hosted here: https://github.com/eliemichel/firefox-webmention-addon
#
tantek awesome!
#
tantek eliemichel++ !
#
Loqi eliemichel has 3 karma
#
eliemichel it's a nice way to discover FF addon system
#
eliemichel but it's 3:30a.m. now…
#
eliemichel so, good nite!
#
tantek.com edited /webmention (+204) "/* Implementations */ Add Tools section with Firefox Addon from eliemichel!" (view diff)
#
kylewm wow, that's pretty awesome
#
kylewm eliemichel++
#
Loqi eliemichel has 4 karma
#
tantek eliemichel: good night! And feel free to expand http://indiewebcamp.com/webmention#Firefox_Addon - I just put the URLs you gave
#
Loqi buenas noches
#
kylewm gotta be careful not to use it on h-feeds :)
#
tantek kylewm: hmm - perhaps that's a protocol vulnerability we should explore?
#
tantek we shouldn't need to "be careful" about sending webmentions - since obviously anybody *could* be doing so (maliciously)
#
Loqi it is probable
#
kylewm tantek: maybe, I think the right solution is for receivers to only process the first h-entry on a page
#
kylewm it was a bug in Known a couple months ago, probably fixed now
#
@lightcoin BTW the Free Software Foundation is on Twitter, #indieweb style! @fsf https://www.fsf.org/twitter (twitter.com/_/status/509516599288541185)
#
@johnverdon RT @lightcoin: BTW the Free Software Foundation is on Twitter, #indieweb style! @fsf https://www.fsf.org/twitter (twitter.com/_/status/509516792629592064)
#
tantek kylewm: could you add this as an issue here? http://indiewebcamp.com/webmention#Issues (along with your propose solution)
#
tantek s/propose/proposed
#
Loqi tantek meant to say: kylewm: could you add this as an issue here? http://indiewebcamp.com/webmention#Issues (along with your proposed solution)
brianloveswords joined the channel
#
kylewm tantek: sure! i have to vacate the office right now, but i will add tonight
#
tantek thanks!
#
@BraveNewCloud RT @lightcoin: BTW the Free Software Foundation is on Twitter, #indieweb style! @fsf https://www.fsf.org/twitter (twitter.com/_/status/509518285155880960)
#
@cryptocoinage RT @lightcoin: BTW the Free Software Foundation is on Twitter, #indieweb style! @fsf https://www.fsf.org/twitter (twitter.com/_/status/509523671476875264)
#
KevinMarks Tantek that's a manual POSSE I think, not sure there is direct RSVP mapping yet
#
tantek KevinMarks: what is a manual POSSE?
#
KevinMarks I mean known doesn't POSSE events itself yet
lukebrooker, KevinMarks__ and RichardLitt joined the channel
#
tantek KevinMarks: right, if you manually POSSE a FB event for your indie event, Bridgy will send RSVP webmentions from the FB event back to your original indie event
mdik, tantek and scor joined the channel
#
KevinMarks Hm, so I need to connect bridgy to my known site?
#
KevinMarks Can bridgy understand that I have more than one indieweb site for a given Facebook account?
#
tantek does bridgy distinguish subdomains?
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/jkphl/508578124729417728/785475632 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/webactions (webmention)
techlifeweb joined the channel
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/BarnabyWalters/508172582169100289/785475632 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK (webmention)
#
kylewm KevinMarks: Bridgy will only search one domain for posse-post-discovery, but if your posse copy includes a link to the original it should still find it (i think)
#
KevinMarks So do I need to sign up with known.kevinmarks.com as well as kevinmarks.com?
#
kylewm nope, I don't even think you could if you wanted to
lukebrooker joined the channel
#
KevinMarks Ok, I'll try it out
indie-visitor joined the channel
#
Loqi Welcome, indie-visitor! Set your nickname by typing /nick yourname
#
kylewm KevinMarks: did you have benwerd set a CNAME for you for known.kevinmarks.com, or is there some way to do it without his intervention?
#
KevinMarks Other way round - I cname known.kevinmarks.com to domains.withknown.com and Ben does the hosting
KevinMarks_ and KevinMarks__ joined the channel
#
kylewm (for context, i'm watching my partner walk through the set up process)
#
KevinMarks__ do take notes and record comments - so valuable to known dev
#
kylewm totally!
#
KevinMarks__ OK, POSSE copy https://www.facebook.com/events/1475412386074562/ of http://known.kevinmarks.com/2014/indieweb-xoxo-breakfast
#
kylewm amusing quote ... her: "oh there is some explanatory text for dumb people", me: "hey not everyone knows what a bookmarklet is", her: "all women do!"
#
KevinMarks__ pinterest++
#
Loqi pinterest has 0 karma
#
kylewm bingo
#
KevinMarks Would POSSE to pinterest be good for Known?
wolftune joined the channel
#
@grigs @scottjenson Yes, @erinjo has been heavily involved with indieweb and I think she is amazing. Her involvement makes it worth checking out. (twitter.com/_/status/509572631759036416)
eschnou joined the channel
#
@scottjenson @grigs @erinjo appears heavily education based, but I love the #indieweb spirit and looking for more integration tools (pocket, ifttt, etc) (twitter.com/_/status/509575892801052672)
#
@javajini I just found out about POSSE. I'm going to have to look into it some more. http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE (twitter.com/_/status/509576518528684033)
#
@benwerd @scottjenson @grigs Education is our first market but our ambitions are wider. We love the #indieweb (& the web as a whole). @erinjo (twitter.com/_/status/509576597783867393)
KevinMarks_, alanpearce and michiel_laptop joined the channel
#
kylewm.com edited /webmention (+467) "/* Issues */ add issue about multiple comments when h-feed is sent as the source page" (view diff)
#
Loqi [mention] http://chrisaldrich.withknown.com/2014/today-i-started-experimenting-with-a-blog-on-the-known linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE (webmention)
lukebrooker, KevinMarks, alanpearce, michiel_laptop and michiel_ joined the channel
#
@ChrisAldrich I'm excited for what @withknown portends for the social web. @erinjo @benwerd #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509592606628540416)
#
@benwerd RT @ChrisAldrich: I'm excited for what @withknown portends for the social web. @erinjo @benwerd #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509592784538324992)
KevinMarks, fmarier, chrissaad, ShaneHudson, Guest97536, alanpearce and KevinMarks__ joined the channel
#
@jordan_web Trying a new way of posting to social media http://withknown.com/ Start of my IndieWeb participation Post on my own site and syndicate out (twitter.com/_/status/509605714965561344)
petermolnar, kensanata, friedcell and KevinMarks joined the channel
#
KevinMarks_ So, who was I supposed to invite on Facebook?
Guest97536 and krendil_ joined the channel
#
Loqi [mention] http://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/4Y38Ts/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/Falcon#Storage_format (webmention)
Sebastien-L joined the channel
#
@AntheaMilnes Testing out the @withknown beta site, set up by my buddy Ben Werdmuller, an indieweb publishing platform for education. (twitter.com/_/status/509625367015874560)
#
@digitalblissltd Just wanted to thank everyone at @IndieWebCampUK for a great weekend once more. See you next year! https://twitter.com/digitalblissltd/status/509628396369108992/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/509628396369108992)
fourtonfish and glennjones joined the channel
#
Phyks tantek___: thanks ! I'll add myself. My personal website is http://phyks.me as linked by eliemichel (content mostly in French and occasionally in English)
#
Loqi Phyks: tantek left you a message 8 hours, 55 minutes ago: welcome! go ahead and add yourself to http://indiewebcamp.com/irc-people :)
#
Phyks and yes, I went to sleep, it was 3am in France =)
Jihaisse1 joined the channel
#
@dajbelshaw Yep, thinking that my @withknown could be an #indieweb way to reclaim all the things. <3 it. http://dajbelshaw.withknown.com/ https://twitter.com/dajbelshaw/status/509642820790280192/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/509642820790280192)
Jihaisse and adactio joined the channel
#
Loqi [mention] http://kimberly.withknown.com/2014/trying-out-known-and-liking-it-known linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/Known (webmention)
PierreO, scor, Sebastien-L, tantek and cmhobbs joined the channel
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/508567952527212545/785475632 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/webactions (webmention)
scor and ShaneHudson joined the channel
#
david.shanske.com edited /WordPress (+289) "/* More building blocks */" (view diff)
#
david.shanske.com edited /WordPress (-1) "/* More building blocks */" (view diff)
Guest97536 and verdi joined the channel
#
david.shanske.com edited /WordPress (+625) "/* IndieWeb Examples */" (view diff)
#
david.shanske.com edited /User:David.shanske.com (-11) "/* Current Progress */" (view diff)
friedcell1 joined the channel
#
david.shanske.com edited /User:David.shanske.com (+393) "/* In Development */" (view diff)
#
GWG There we are
#
GWG !tell acegiak I see your Whisperfollow plugin uses the JSON API. I have an idea for using it to add a reply/like/etc endpoints to Indieweb Taxonomy
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
#
jonnybarnes what is whisperfollow
#
Loqi http://indiewebcamp.com/Whisperfollow
#
jonnybarnes hmm, that needs some dfn tags, but I've never added them myself before
#
jonnybarnes.uk edited /Whisperfollow (+17) "/* WhisperFollow */ add dfn tags" (view diff)
#
jonnybarnes what is whisperfollow
#
Loqi WhisperFollow is a WordPress based social reader create by acegiak that currently supports H-Entry, RSS, Atom and PubSubHubbub http://indiewebcamp.com/Whisperfollow
#
jonnybarnes wooo, it worked :D
Sebastien-L joined the channel
#
ben_thatmustbeme good morning all
#
jonnybarnes morning
Pea joined the channel
#
ShaneHudson What is the best way to test sending webmentions from site? I am not sure mine is working, it does work internally though
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "the best way to test sending webmentions from site? I am not sure mine is working, it does work internally though" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=the+best+way+to+test+sending+webmentions+from+site%3F+I+am+not+sure+mine+is+working%2C+it+does+work+internally+though
persand, Guest97536 and ShaneHudson joined the channel
#
@kyle_wm @mattl if you're around tonight, you should totally come to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (twitter.com/_/status/509712412329512961)
gRegor` and eschnou joined the channel
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/comment/twitter/kyle_wm/509712412329512961/509715642682208256 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
wolftune and brianloveswords joined the channel
#
@benwerd Just made webmention, indieauth and micropub available to thousands of people. So much more to come. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509720263970127875)
#
jonnybarnes ShaneHudson: voxpelli wrote a script to mock webmentions
#
jonnybarnes https://github.com/voxpelli/node-webmention-testpinger
#
ben_thatmustbeme weird thing of bridgy i noticed this morning, it thought my linkedin account was my indie web page.
#
ben_thatmustbeme it goes through in order it looks like and skipped over twitter but not linked in
eschnou joined the channel
#
@dealingwith RT @benwerd: Just made webmention, indieauth and micropub available to thousands of people. So much more to come. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509725945196843009)
#
aaronpk good morning!
#
@Indie_Auth RT @benwerd: Just made webmention, indieauth and micropub available to thousands of people. So much more to come. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509726845550346240)
#
@vrypan RT @benwerd: Just made webmention, indieauth and micropub available to thousands of people. So much more to come. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509727736441868289)
#
ben_thatmustbeme good morning
#
aaronpk morning
#
@randyburge RT @ChrisAldrich: I'm excited for what @withknown portends for the social web. @erinjo @benwerd #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509728101169762307)
#
ben_thatmustbeme getting close to having my micropub endpoint add syndication links after the fact
#
aaronpk sweet
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/adactio/508573119213473793/785475632 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/webactions (webmention)
#
aaronpk the "edit" I described on the page?
#
ben_thatmustbeme just with the link or shortlink i can already pull up the post, its just the UI for the micropub page, and UI for syndication links being displayed
#
ben_thatmustbeme yep, u=<url>&syndication=<url>
#
aaronpk sweet
#
aaronpk what are your thoughts on whether that parameter should be "u" or "url"?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "your thoughts on whether that parameter should be "u" or "url"" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=your+thoughts+on+whether+that+parameter+should+be+%22u%22+or+%22url%22
#
ben_thatmustbeme i knew that was going to be your question. haha
#
Loqi nice
#
ben_thatmustbeme haven't completely organized my thoughts on it yet
Sebastien-L joined the channel
#
GWG I need clarification
#
ben_thatmustbeme i think url= might make more sense honestly
#
ben_thatmustbeme GWG on what?
#
GWG I am thinking about the demo from Sunday.
#
ben_thatmustbeme h-entry => h=entry, u-url => ? u=<some value> doesn't really fit the same scheme to me
#
ben_thatmustbeme demo from what GWG?
#
GWG Replying seamlessly from someone else's site.
#
GWG Indiewebcamp UK
#
ben_thatmustbeme yeah, i figured that, didn't know which demo, not that i saw them
#
jonnybarnes GWG you mean like with shrewdness?
#
ben_thatmustbeme you are talking about the webaction bits?
#
GWG Yes
#
aaronpk the only danger with using >1-letter parameter names is that those names can't be used for the actual data in the request
#
GWG webactions
#
ben_thatmustbeme aaronpk, i was trying to think of things that url= would be used for other than setting the URL for a new post. and that would actually line up perfectly
#
GWG It refers to a reply endpoint
#
GWG Us there a standard for that?
#
GWG Is
#
ben_thatmustbeme so url= would be the URL of the post, if it doesn't exist, the MP endpoint should create it with that URL (if it supports that), if it does exist, update it
#
aaronpk that seems reasonable
#
jonnybarnes GWG: I think that would mean a micropub endpoint
#
jonnybarnes I can post notes to my site by making an authenticated API request to /api/post
#
GWG I am trying to map out a plan.
#
jonnybarnes so I could authorise an app like shrewdness
#
jonnybarnes hows the map looking so far?
#
aaronpk jonnybarnes: there was a demo that did not require micropub access for commenting
#
voxpelli GWG: We replaced a {url} part in the url with the actual url in the UK-demo, https://github.com/voxpelli/indie-action-component
#
jonnybarnes aaronpk: but the comment still appeard on your own site?
#
aaronpk yes, it was clever
#
jonnybarnes it must have been very clever
#
aaronpk I really want someone who worked on it to make a diagram explaining it
#
GWG I am trying to figure out how to add this to WordPress
#
voxpelli aaronpk: I'm here :) Just have been traveling around since the camp :P
#
kylewm GWG: do you have those sort of reply intent urls in wordpress?
#
GWG I think I need a plan
#
aaronpk plans are good
#
GWG kylewm, I have to build them
#
GWG I have been working on the idea since Sunday.
#
GWG I am moving toward an idea of how to implement them.
#
kylewm perhaps you can build off of https://snarfed.org/indieweb-press-this-bookmarklets-for-wordpress
#
@dealingwith @openintro no it is a more complete distributed publishing platform. Own all content, push to networks. @withknown #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509732606498185217)
#
GWG kylewm, bad idea
#
GWG The next version of Wordpress will have a new JSON API
#
GWG It is available as a plugin now.
#
GWG I want to build it using that.
npdoty joined the channel
#
GWG That is why I am reading and planning.
squeakytoy joined the channel
#
voxpelli aaronpk: quick diagram: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/304233/indieconfig_webactions.svg
#
voxpelli of indie-config + webactions
#
aaronpk whaaa crazy
#
aaronpk so if I want to be able to do that on my site, what do I need to add to aaronparecki.com?
#
aaronpk I think I need to add a page that does navigator.registerProtocolHandler?
#
aaronpk and the JS that does the window.parent.postMessage?
paulcp joined the channel
#
voxpelli aaronpk: Exactly
#
voxpelli Barnaby decided to add the navigator.registerProtocolHandler() on a hidden URL and the postMessage() on the frontpage
#
voxpelli and checking on the frontpage if the page is framed or not and only postMessage() if it is framed
#
voxpelli aaronpk: upper part of https://gist.github.com/voxpelli/e64db6931a951b2d5181 shows my way of only doing postMessage() when in an iframe
alanpearce joined the channel
#
voxpelli is on a train with bad wifi so might lose connection momentarily now and then
#
aaronpk voxpelli: isn't '/?url=%s' on line 12 supposed to be a full URL?
#
aaronpk or is that relative to the page
#
voxpelli aaronpk: It's relative to the page, registering the index-page as the page the protocol resolves to
#
voxpelli the "?url=%s" part is just there as at least Firefox required it to be, it will contain the full protocol URL that was resolved
#
joel.franusic.com edited /IRC_People (+133) "+Joel Franusic" (view diff)
#
aaronpk now I really wanna try this
#
voxpelli aaronpk: all posts on my blog has a reply link you can use to test it out: http://voxpelli.com/2014/05/better-colors-with-sasscript/
#
aaronpk sweet
#
voxpelli and um, as the component broke in Chrome you can't test the configuration in anything but Firefox right now :P
#
voxpelli that's because of my failed web components skills rather than Chrome/Opera not being able to load the configuration though, that they can
#
aaronpk oh darn
#
aaronpk well that worked https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3914/15196942911_9801e25bba_b.jpg
jfranusic joined the channel
#
jfranusic hmm
#
jfranusic Well hello everyone
wolftune joined the channel
#
alanpearce Hello :)
#
aaronpk hi jfranusic!
tantek joined the channel
#
tantek aaronpk nice!
KevinMarks__ joined the channel
#
tantek interesting, based on that screenshot I wonder if a different scheme would read slightly better
#
tantek voxpelli: how would you feel about using the scheme "web+action" instead of "web+indie" ?
#
tantek Then the permission drop down would read:
#
tantek "Allow yoursite.example.com to open all web+action links? Learn more [ Deny ] [ Allow ]
#
tantek "
#
tantek to me that reads much more sensibly, and directly ties the permission to something which is googleable etc.
#
tantek and welcome jfranusic!!
#
voxpelli tantek: original idea was that the config wasn't necessarily tied to webactions but the indieweb in general, but true, the use case is just for web-actions right now I agree that it might be a better protocol
#
tantek cool. I also think that it has plenty of room for growth too.
#
tantek since "web actions" in general describe doing something from one site across to another site (e.g. your own site), and that's exactly what registering a protocol handler is for in general!
#
voxpelli yes, I like that everything don't have the "indie" name as well
#
tantek right, that's another good point.
#
aaronpk i agree
#
voxpelli tantek: most importsnt thing now: Getting a page up on the wiki for all of this indie-config stuff
#
tantek true!
#
tantek what is indie-config?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "indie-config" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=indie-config
#
alanpearce This all seems very exciting :)
#
tantek alanpearce: it is super exciting!
#
voxpelli I'm still traveling around so will still have a bit of a hard time getting such a page up
#
alanpearce Moreso that what I'm working on :) :(
#
tantek thanks to voxpelli's innovative use of protocol handlers and postmessage, we've got webactions working cross-site WITHOUT having to install anything!
#
tantek voxpelli: ok I'll start a stub
#
voxpelli tantek: super, thanks!
#
aaronpk wait a sec... this "setup" page that has the JS you linked in that gist, is that ok if I am the only one who can view that page?
#
voxpelli aaronpk: The one with the registerProtocolHandler()? Yes
#
tantek.com created /indie-config (+310) "stub" (view diff)
#
aaronpk and also the URL that handles the web+action:// protocol
#
aaronpk ?
#
voxpelli The one with the postMessage() could be locked down as well, but would be advisable to at least have an alert() or something telling you if you're not logged as you will have a hard time noticing
#
tantek aaronpk - or it can be on your *logged-in* home page - i.e. only send that registerProtocolHandler script to the client if your server knows that it's you that is logged in
#
tantek no separate page is needed
#
tantek what is indie-config?
#
Loqi indie-config is a method of using protocol handlers and postmessage to setup your indie website to both notify the browser that it can handle webactions and then do so http://indiewebcamp.com/indie-config
#
voxpelli aaronpk: a cool privacy hack is to use a confirm() in the iframe to ask if one wants to whitelist the current page, save a whitelist in localStorage and only send a postMessage() if the document.refeerer matches a page in the localstorage
#
voxpelli +1 on what tantek said
#
aaronpk this is really stretching my brain lol. one thing at a time.
#
tantek aaronpk - can you braindump what you did so far today into /indie-config ?
#
voxpelli tantek: perhaps could add https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/304233/indieconfig_webactions.svg or its content to the wiki somehow?
#
tantek.com edited /indie-config (+337) "why and how stub" (view diff)
#
tantek aaronpk - braindump what you did to get what you have working today to this: http://indiewebcamp.com/indie-config#how
#
aaronpk i'm doing this on a separate page right now so I don't confuse the crap out of myself later
#
tantek aaronpk - doesn't your home page have logged-in-logic to show a textarea for writing a new post at the top already?
#
tantek (e.g. adactio has that setup on adactio.com - it looks awesome, like original Twitter)
#
aaronpk i suppose
#
tantek same place that outputs the <textarea>, then just put in the little <script> snippet to do the registerprotocolhandler
#
adactio tantek: aarronpk: https://dribbble.com/shots/1577366-Speak-your-brains
#
aaronpk is there any harm in running that register protocol thing every time I load my home page?
#
tantek adactio is that a screenshot of your home page?
#
adactio yes
#
tantek I don't see any posts below it - it looks like a dedicate post writing page
#
tantek s/dedicate/dedicated
#
Loqi tantek meant to say: I don't see any posts below it - it looks like a dedicated post writing page
#
tantek aaronpk - should be fine - pretty sure it's a NOP if it's already registered
#
tantek adactio - where's the "embed" button on Dribble so I can copy/paste some markup to embed that image?
#
@IndieWebCampUK RT @kevinbeynon: The people I met at @indiewebcamp are the A-Team of the Internet. Give them some tape and an oxy-acetalyne torch and they'… (twitter.com/_/status/509749791899668480)
#
adactio tantek: here's the markup: <img src="... ;-)
#
tantek lololol
#
aaronpk :D
#
@IndieWebCampUK RT @digitalblissltd: Just wanted to thank everyone at @IndieWebCampUK for a great weekend once more. See you next year! http://t.co/QF0ClX… (twitter.com/_/status/509750153264115712)
#
tantek adactio - nm looks like we already have it on the wiki: http://indiewebcamp.com/create#Jeremy_Keith :)
#
voxpelli aaronpk: If you run the registerProtocolHandler() on the same page that's already registered nothing will happen – it will know that everything is registered as it should
#
tantek.com edited /indie-config (+325) "add FAQ section with "Ok to registerProtocol handler every time" yes" (view diff)
#
aaronpk oh here's why I don't want this on my home page
#
aaronpk because then every time I view someone's site that has web+action:// links it will load an iframe with my home page
#
tantek what? no it should only load the iframe if you *click* one of those links
#
aaronpk I thought the method voxpelli described is embedding an iframe with src="web+action://"
#
aaronpk which means it'll load that right away
#
tantek and it should load *your handler* not your homepage
#
aaronpk my handler only needs to be the JS that runs postMessage. so you didn't intend on me also putting that on my home page?
#
voxpelli aaronpk: right now my script lazy loads the iframe
#
voxpelli I had a problem in Chrome when quickly prototyping where it insisted on only loading the index page, that's why i opted for the index page in my code
#
voxpelli didn't have time to dig deeper into it and understand why
ShaneHudson joined the channel
#
tantek indeed. aaronpk, interestingly enough this protocol handler / webaction stuff worked/works better in Firefox - so you might want to try it out with that first while you're working with it
#
tantek once you have it working there like it should, then we can document the Chrome problem(s) and file bugs accordingly.
#
voxpelli yeah, I will look into separating out my indie-config stuff from my web-component to aid with that, the web component is much more complex and should take all the stuff we talked about in Brighton into consideration
#
voxpelli the stylability and everything
alanpearce and npdoty joined the channel
#
aaronpk firefox prompt looks different
#
tantek.com edited /events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (+1) "/* Where */ 8ish" (view diff)
#
aaronpk http://aaronparecki.com/uploads/firefox_protocol_registration-20140910-103120.png
#
aaronpk oh right this is system-wide
#
aaronpk which means if I click any reply links in chrome, it's gonna open firefox
#
voxpelli aaronpk: not system wide on OS X at least
#
tantek that's a good reason to *not* put it on a separate page
#
aaronpk I don't understand why having it on a separate page has anything to do with that
#
tantek because "Add Indie Config (aaronparecki.com) as an application for web+indie links?" makes less sense
#
tantek it should say
#
aaronpk that is what happened when it's on my home page
#
tantek (I mean, if you put it on your home page)
#
tantek "Add Aaron Parecki (aaronparecki.com) as an application for web+action links?"
#
tantek where did the "Indie Config" text come from?!?
#
aaronpk "Indie Config" is just the text from the register handler call. has nothing to do with the page it's on
#
tantek oh ok
#
tantek well, good reason to use just your name there then
#
aaronpk now we see if repeated calls will update that
#
aaronpk hm chrome somehow has a stranglehold on this protocol
#
tantek aaronpk can you document what you did here so we can debug it? http://indiewebcamp.com/indie-config#How
#
aaronpk yeah one sec
#
sammachin evening all, IndieAuth question, is there any way to get the client id param in the callback ?
#
aaronpk sammachin: you should get the client_id when you verify the auth code
#
aaronpk it can't be trusted if it's from the callback
#
tantek.com edited /create (+54) "/* Jeremy Keith */ also cite dribbble link" (view diff)
#
sammachin aaronpk: ah so its in the response whe I get the code
#
sammachin but I need to also send the client_id in that request don't I?
#
voxpelli Chrome docs for how to find custom protocols within the app: https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/1382847
#
alanpearce Finally got my second mf2 parser unit test to pass :D
#
aaronpk sammachin: yes you're right lol sorry
#
@t Going to @xoxofest to celebrate indie art & tech? Is your indie website ready? Make it tonight! http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (ttk.me t4Y31) (twitter.com/_/status/509758813235597313)
#
aaronpk this is the reason for the state parameter
#
aaronpk you can set a session ID as the state parameter so that you can store the client_id for your request server-side
#
sammachin aaronpk: is there any way to pass additional parameters through indieauth, say have a page on site A but you indie auth with site B and then get redirected back to site A
#
sammachin but there could be multiple site A's and only one site B so it needs to know where to send you back to
#
aaronpk you should be able to do what you need with a combination of redirect_uri and state parameters
#
sammachin hmm, I'll keep digging :)
#
sammachin ah I can pass a query string in the redirect_url :)
#
@t Going to @xoxo to celebrate indie art & tech? Is your indie website ready? Make it tonight! http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (ttk.me t4Y31) (twitter.com/_/status/509759463625355265)
#
aaronpk sure!
#
sammachin that should work
#
aaronpk keep in mind that you'll (eventually) need to "register" the redirect URLs, so you might be better off finding a way to do this with "state"
#
voxpelli aaronpk: tantek: if using a absolute URL in registerProtocolHandler then any URL seems to work in Chrome, with relative it seems to always resolve to the top path
#
sammachin aaronpk: hmm that might be harder as for this I won't always know the redirect urls, the idea is that a user can drop a widget onto their site that uses my backend app and indie auth
#
aaronpk sammachin: that's what the state is for!
#
aaronpk you can put whatever you want in there
#
aaronpk like if you wanted you could JSON-encode data even
#
sammachin what do you mean by state?
#
sammachin is there something specific in indieauth?
#
aaronpk it's part of OAuth
#
aaronpk http://indiewebcamp.com/login-brainstorming#Request
#
aaronpk it's one of the parameters you include in the original redirect to the auth server
#
sammachin ah didn't see that in the docs!
#
sammachin https://indieauth.com/developers
#
aaronpk ahh
#
@EllaDurham Excited to get to dig through the #known beta and jump back into #indieweb endeavors. http://withknown.com (twitter.com/_/status/509761217942941696)
#
tantek.com edited /2014/UK/Guest_List (+0) "/* Participants */ fix a twitter link" (view diff)
#
aaronpk my bad!
#
sammachin that does just what I want though :)
#
aaronpk I now have a 10mb gif showing the whole flow
#
aaronpk of indie actions
#
aaronpk also video https://www.flickr.com/photos/aaronpk/15014012428/
julien51 and techlifeweb joined the channel
#
tantek aaronpk, Flickr says: "We are experiencing technical difficulties" inside a black box where the video would be.
#
aaronpk wat
#
techlifeweb Got my Known invite. Now to find some time...
#
aaronpk thanks flickr
#
tantek try it not logged in
#
aaronpk works for me in firefox not logged in
#
tantek maybe it's just not deployed to the content farm in this geo
#
aaronpk I suppose I could put it on my site
#
KevinMarks who were we supposed to invite to https://www.facebook.com/events/1475412386074562/
#
aaronpk should I be using web+action:// in this example?
#
aaronpk in the docs I mean
#
tantek yes
#
tantek since voxpelli said he's fine with it, let's switch it all over to use web+actin:
#
tantek s/web+actin/web+action
#
aaronpk ok. voxpelli can you update your code relatively quickly to use web+action?
#
aaronpk otherwise this will not work withy your example if someone else tries this
#
tantek I think he's on a train
#
aaronpk relatively
#
tantek can you fork it?
#
aaronpk it's on his site
#
aaronpk I don't even know how that half of this works
#
KevinMarks can you show us this working at IWC tonight, tantek?
#
aaronpk can show my video
#
voxpelli aaronpk: Pushing change now
#
aaronpk it's 30sec
#
aaronpk voxpelli++
#
Loqi voxpelli has 5 karma
#
tantek KevinMarks: I would if I had a reply-posting-endpoint on my site :(
#
kylewm I can, I think
#
tantek voxpelli++
#
Loqi voxpelli has 6 karma
#
tantek kylewm: yeah? can you also switch to using the "web+action:"
#
kylewm sure
#
KevinMarks hm, known does, so we can try with that
#
tantek this is why it's important to get the "How to" setup steps documented by someone who has successfully done so but was *not* @IndieWebCampUK - I think aaronpk's notes will be essential
#
aaronpk almost got it
#
KevinMarks sounds good
#
aaronparecki.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:web-action-permission-prompt.png]]""
#
neuro` I really should give known a try, it looks great
#
aaronparecki.com edited /indie-config (+1466) "/* How */ add setup instructions" (view diff)
techlifeweb joined the channel
#
techlifeweb Anyone know if bridgy will work with a FB page instead of personal account?
#
aaronpk unfortunately this is completely broken in chrome
#
tantek not the first time something has worked first in Firefox
#
voxpelli aaronpk: it is only broken on my page
#
aaronpk i'm trying just launching web+action:// links on my own, and it's really messede up
#
voxpelli yes, much more messed up, but I'm able to load it when trying locally
#
aaronpk because I have both the chrome and firefox versions registered to open web+action:// urls, firefox prompts me to ask which I want to use to open it
#
@badgermind RT @digitalblissltd: Just wanted to thank everyone at @IndieWebCampUK for a great weekend once more. See you next year! http://t.co/QF0ClX… (twitter.com/_/status/509766537142878208)
#
aaronpk it's pretty slick when it works
#
voxpelli aaronpk: here's a quick simple indie-config loader: https://gist.github.com/voxpelli/b448e9d095f655000a46
#
aaronpk needs comments
#
aaronpk lol
#
voxpelli yeah :P 3 secs, I'll add some
#
KevinMarks the US thing was around this https://www.fightforthefuture.org/fixcopyright/
#
aaronpk speaking of web actions, tantek did you see my update this weekend for posting bookmarks? http://aaronparecki.com/notes/2014/09/07/1/indieweb-bookmarks ( actually has nothing to do with web actions ;) )
#
KevinMarks wrong window
#
tantek aaronpk - yeah! we were all abuzz about that at the camp!
#
tantek we saw your demo!
#
aaronpk sweet
#
aaronpk this weekend has been a blur
#
aaronpk it's like a slightly different approach to web actions
#
aaronpk in my screenshot there's a little arrow icon, that's my "reply" url
#
aaronpk s/url/button
#
Loqi aaronpk meant to say: in my screenshot there's a little arrow icon, that's my "reply" button
#
tantek yup - we talked about just using icons for webactions in a stream
#
tantek per precedent being set by Twitter
#
aaronpk which effectively does the same thing as this web+action thing, but is part of my browser instead of part of voxpelli's page
#
tantek there's plusses/minuses to both the "icon in the browser toolbar" and the "icon near the content it's actually acting upon"
#
aaronpk the browser one obviously only works on post permalinks
#
tantek and is out of view / out of flow when you're reading
#
aaronpk whereas the inline one would work in a reader or someone's feed
#
tantek also why it makes sense to put Reply actions at the bottom of a post
#
tantek (that was part of my initial UI/UX analysis of webactions back in the day)
#
aaronpk just realized I don't have reply buttons at allll on my site
#
voxpelli aaronpk: a bit more comments now: https://gist.github.com/voxpelli/b448e9d095f655000a46
#
aaronpk yay thanks
#
Loqi does a happy dance!
#
aaronpk what does the last step do? document.getElementById('result').textContent = JSON.stringify(loadedConfig);
#
aaronpk oh that's just an example
#
aaronpk ok cool. so in reality you'd use the config to change URLs on the "reply" links on posts?
#
voxpelli aaronpk: yeah
#
ben_thatmustbeme oh, lots of talk of webactions? i shall have to read this all back later
#
ben_thatmustbeme haha, it works. ability to add syndication links to a post after the fact. DONE
#
ben_thatmustbeme just need to actuallly display the syndication links on posts now.
#
ben_thatmustbeme via micropub that is
#
@indiewebcamp RT @t: Going to @xoxo to celebrate indie art & tech? Is your indie website ready? Make it tonight! http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (ttk.me t4Y31) (twitter.com/_/status/509770074446499842)
#
aaronpk ben_thatmustbeme: you win!
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
ben_thatmustbeme yay!
#
Loqi giggles
#
aaronpk ben_thatmustbeme: did you switch to url=?
#
ben_thatmustbeme yeah
#
aaronpk i'll update the page
#
ben_thatmustbeme it just seemed to make the the most sense to me
#
@kevinmarks RT @t: Going to @xoxo to celebrate indie art & tech? Is your indie website ready? Make it tonight! http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (ttk.me t4Y31) (twitter.com/_/status/509770831593893888)
#
aaronparecki.com edited /Micropub (-364) "change to url=X instead of u=X and remove fuzzy language" (view diff)
#
@FigureFlo RT @clayton_bush: Free single from my new album! Check it out http://www.claytonbush.com #neednewmusic #indiewebcamp @JaxAcoustic @jaxbeachbuzz… (twitter.com/_/status/509772199775858689)
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/509759463625355265/235193328 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/508567952527212545/235193328 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/webactions (webmention)
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/repost/twitter/t/509759463625355265/509770074446499842 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
#
voxpelli aaronpk: Replaced the indie-config loader example with a much better Promise based loader: https://gist.github.com/voxpelli/b448e9d095f655000a46
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/repost/twitter/t/509759463625355265/509770831593893888 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/509759463625355265/14233500 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/kevinmarks/509437687250440192/235193328 linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-09-10 (webmention)
#
tantek.com edited /webactions (+383) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ add adactio" (view diff)
#
aaronpk I don't even know what promises are
#
tantek aaronpk, re: lacking reply links - add them and join us! http://indiewebcamp.com/webactions#IndieWeb_Examples
#
aaronpk hahaha
wolftune joined the channel
#
aaronpk i'll get there eventually :)
#
tantek aaronpk, don't worry about the details of Promises for now, just know that they work better :)
#
aaronpk it's a somewhat significant change cause I have to think about the UI
#
tantek that's the right answer :)
#
tantek fortunately there's been lots of thinking about the UI by various folks
#
tantek and this weekend I just figured out decent UI for in-stream web actions
#
tantek more like researched / determined based on prior art (e.g. Twitter)
#
tantek funny thing is, I got stuck in needing to update some storage code to make this work on my home page, so now I'm considering a pretty big overhaul there.
#
aaronpk well the good news is it didn't take me long to add support for web+action links on the author side
#
voxpelli Thinking I should add the loading exmaple somewhere, would linking to the Gist work or do we want it into the wiki itself?
#
@LongHandPixels RT @t: Going to @xoxo to celebrate indie art & tech? Is your indie website ready? Make it tonight! http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (ttk.me t4Y31) (twitter.com/_/status/509774964883750912)
#
voxpelli tantek: aaronpk: thoughts on how to add the code? don't remember how it's typically done when it's kind of a reference code
squeakytoy joined the channel
#
tantek voxpelli: the wiki would be a good place e.g. on /indie-config
#
voxpelli tantek: ok, I'll try adding it there and you can move it somewhere better if you feel there's a betetr place for it
#
kylewm.com edited /webactions (+312) "/* Web Action Browser Support */ added greasemonkey script" (view diff)
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/repost/twitter/t/509759463625355265/509774964883750912 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
#
kylewm OK cool I added a static indieconfig.html page that reacts to voxpelli's Reply link: https://kylewm.com/test/indieconfig.html
#
aaronpk interesting new phishing attack becomes possible with this http://aaronparecki.com/uploads/kylewm-reply-hijack-20140910-115313.png
#
kylewm ha
#
sammachin aaronpk: is state implemented in indieAuth? I'm setting it on the initial form but it doesn't seem to be in the callback or the response when I validate the code
#
aaronpk hrm... I thought it was
#
aaronpk yeah it should be...
#
aaronpk yeah it does come back in the query string
#
aaronpk try this with your domain https://indieauth.com/auth?me=aaronparecki.com&client_id=https%3A%2F%2Findieauth.com&redirect_uri=http://localhost/&state=foo
#
aaronpk you'll get redirected back to localhost and state=foo will be there
#
kodfabrik.se edited /indie-config (+1723) "Added a sample indie-config loader" (view diff)
#
voxpelli kylewm: very nice!
eschnou joined the channel
#
sammachin ah as a query string on the redirect uri not as its own param like http://indiewebcamp.com/login-brainstorming#Request says
#
aaronpk the request there *is* a query string
#
sammachin hmm so why doesn't it work on http://sammachin.com/talk/
#
sammachin ah it was there that time
#
aaronpk you sure it's not? it would be in the query string for the request to talk.sammachin.com/app/auth
#
@doctor_decade Alpaca or lama? Can’t stand the drama! http://www.youtube.com/ #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509778327524364288)
#
sammachin right I gor it, I was looking in the response to the code validation
#
aaronpk ah yeah
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/509759463625355265/2281087117 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
#
@voxpelli Things are getting interesting: https://gist.github.com/voxpelli/b448e9d095f655000a46 Will write a proper post about what happened at IndieWebCamp UK when I get time (twitter.com/_/status/509778572098424832)
#
tantek.com edited /indie-config (+83) "/* How */ made clearer what strings to replace" (view diff)
#
aaronpk side effect of making that screencast... I now have video support
#
voxpelli !tell barnabywalters We decided to change the "web+indie" protocol to "web+action" instead, so you will need to update your code
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
#
aaronpk http://aaronparecki.com/
#
voxpelli nice!
#
aaronpk UI inspired by flickr
julien51 joined the channel
#
kylewm so the thing I'm confused about now is why does web+action need to do the configuration back and forth... as opposed to registering the intent url itself as a handler for web+action?
#
aaronpk i think for fallback support?
#
aaronpk otherwise you'd have something like <a href="web+action://reply"> and that link would be dead if you didn't have a handler for it
#
aaronpk does that sound right voxpelli?
#
aaronparecki.com edited /indie-config (+80) "/* Turn it on */ add example" (view diff)
fourtonfish joined the channel
#
voxpelli yeah, what aaronpk said
#
voxpelli now you can have a timeout mechanism, cache or something where you decide to revert to a fallback like Twitter
#
kylewm voxpelli: could you use navigator.isProtocolHandlerRegistered ?
#
voxpelli kylewm: there is no such thing though?
#
kylewm and if it is registered, enhance the Reply link with the web+action link?
#
aaronpk https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=440620
#
kylewm hahah, doh
#
voxpelli also, isProtocolHandlerRegistered is a potential privacy leak
#
aaronpk yeah totally is
#
aaronpk you can find out what iOS apps are installed on a phone that way
#
aaronpk cause a lot of apps register their own URIs, like facebook:// twitter:// etc
#
voxpelli with this solution, as I confused aaronpk with earlier, you can instead control your own privacy by yourself deciding if you want or don't want to do the postMessage on a site by site basis
#
voxpelli but I guess we shouldn't be thinking about that too much that until people get used to the simple concept :)
#
kylewm thanks for explaining!
#
tantek kylewm - those are good questions, and I'm still trying to understand them (and the answers)- could you add them to http://indiewebcamp.com/indie-config#FAQ ?
#
ben_thatmustbeme yess. last piece is done. added syndication url viewing
#
kylewm this is what made me think that method existed, btw https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web-based_protocol_handlers#Example
#
voxpelli My train is arriving back home now so I have to leave
#
tantek aaronpk - really re: "you can find out what iOS apps are installed on a phone that way" ? - that would be very handy for my People Focused Comms UI
#
ben_thatmustbeme it should be super simple for me to implement full editing via micropub now
#
tantek can you show me a code snippet illustrating what you mean? E.g. is "facetime:" registered -> hide/show Facetime button
#
aaronpk tantek: that is totally possible from within an iOS app. not sure if safari implemented the isProtocolHandlerRegistered thing
#
tantek oh
#
aaronpk http://stackoverflow.com/questions/836777/how-to-detect-browsers-protocol-handlers
#
tantek navigator.msLaunchUri lol
#
aaronpk unfortunately most people who want to do this are trying to launch their mobile app when someone with their app views their web page
#
tantek that's f'd
ShaneHudson joined the channel
#
Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/509759463625355265/53556469 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
#
kylewm.com edited /indie-config (+869) "/* FAQ */ add Q's about isProtocolHandlerRegistered" (view diff)
#
gRegor` !tell KartikPrabhu Just a heads up that I will be out of town for the 9/24 HWC
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
#
tantek gRegor`: any luck reaching out to Mari?
#
gRegor` I've cc'd her on each HWC announcement tweet. She's starred a couple of them, but hasn't showed up yet.
#
gRegor` I believe she's friends with Marcy, who provides our venue, so maybe just a matter of time.
#
tantek ok I'll keep pinging her too :)
npdoty joined the channel
#
@pfefferle RT @voxpelli: Things are getting interesting: https://gist.github.com/voxpelli/b448e9d095f655000a46 Will write a proper post about what happened at IndieWebCamp UK when … (twitter.com/_/status/509791366537564160)
#
gRegor` Since /indie-config was a UK session as well, should I create a section on the page for the etherpad dump?
#
gRegor` Or should there be a /2014/UK/indie-config session-specific page?
#
tantek the latter
#
tantek thanks gRegor!
#
gRegor` Just looking at the grid and noticed no etherpads appear to be dumped yet :)
#
gregorlove.com created /2014/UK/indie-config (+1633) "etherpad dump from https://etherpad.mozilla.org/indiewebcamp-config" (view diff)
#
tantek gRegor`: I haven't even had time to incorporate the Hack Day Demo logs into the wiki! http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK/Demos#Hack_Day_Demos
#
@jasonwhat @withknown Does the hosted service offer any way to have custom domain? Love idea of using it for IndieWeb personal home, but wld need that (twitter.com/_/status/509792816877559811)
#
gRegor` Heh, well you just got home yesterday :)
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/Schedule (-38) "/* Saturday 2014-09-06 */ #indieconfig link" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/indie-config (+20) "categorize" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com created /2014/UK/indie-cms (+1071) "etherpad dump from https://etherpad.mozilla.org/indiewebcamp-cms" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/Schedule (-37) "/* Saturday 2014-09-06 */ #indiecms link" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com created /2014/UK/indiecomms (+5948) "etherpad dump from https://etherpad.mozilla.org/indiewebcamp-indiecomms" (view diff)
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/Schedule (-43) "/* Saturday 2014-09-06 */ #indiecomms link" (view diff)
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
gregorlove.com created /2014/UK/indielocation (+1372) "etherpad dump from https://etherpad.mozilla.org/indiewebcamp-location" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/Schedule (-38) "/* Saturday 2014-09-06 */ #location link" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com created /2014/UK/indiesecurity (+1587) "etherpad dump from https://etherpad.mozilla.org/indiewebcamp-security" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/Schedule (-38) "/* Saturday 2014-09-06 */ #security link" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com created /2014/UK/transmat (+1089) "etherpad dump from https://etherpad.mozilla.org/indiewebcamp-transmat" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/Schedule (-43) "/* Saturday 2014-09-06 */ #transmat link" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com created /2014/UK/webactions (+4140) "etherpad dump from https://etherpad.mozilla.org/indiewebcamp-webactions" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/Schedule (-43) "/* Saturday 2014-09-06 */ #webactions link" (view diff)
#
@kevinmarks RT @benwerd: Just made webmention, indieauth and micropub available to thousands of people. So much more to come. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509797357299302401)
#
gRegor` Etherpads for UK #indiephotos and #clients don't exist. The others have been dumped.
#
tantek for indiephotos, ping adactio
#
tantek for clients, ping barnabywalters
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/webactions () "(-2008) rm 2013 notes, +see also with link to 2013" (view diff)
#
gRegor` !adactio Was there an etherpad for the indiephotos session?
#
gRegor` !tell barnabywalters Was there an etherpad for the clients session?
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
#
KartikPrabhu is log catching
#
Loqi KartikPrabhu: gRegor` left you a message 40 minutes ago: Just a heads up that I will be out of town for the 9/24 HWC
#
aaronpk KartikPrabhu: most of the web actions discussion has already ended up in a wiki page so you can skim that part of the logs :) http://indiewebcamp.com/indie-config
#
KartikPrabhu neat! :)
#
KartikPrabhu gRegor`: aah if no one else RSVps then we can skip that one
#
ShaneHudson Both Kevin and Ben are on TWiT right now http://twit.tv/#playstream
#
gRegor` Yeah, that page definitely helped more than reading the logs. I still think I only understand 3/4 of it, though. :)
#
gRegor` Seems pretty cool, though
#
aaronpk wow what studio are benwerd and erinjo in? they have great lighting
#
kylewm aaronpk: I think this: https://twitter.com/WeWorkSF/status/509576529119281152
#
@WeWorkSF .@benwerd check out our Soma location @WeWorkSF! You can test out the screening room. What time would you need? Thanks @drnugent! (twitter.com/_/status/509576529119281152)
#
@kevinmarks Live now on TWiG with @benwerd and @erinjo talking #indieweb with @leolaporte and @jeffjarvis http://live.twit.tv (twitter.com/_/status/509800674737938432)
#
aaronpk ah nice
#
ShaneHudson Yeah the lighting is really good
#
aaronpk also the stream is super good. i'm impressed.
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/indie-config (+3) "UK cat" (view diff)
#
ben_thatmustbeme ben and erin are on This week in Google right now
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/indie-cms (+3) "UK cat" (view diff)
#
ben_thatmustbeme twit.tv
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/indiecomms (+3) "UK cat" (view diff)
#
aaronpk benwerd needs a slightly better mic tho. sounds a little tinny.
krendil_ joined the channel
#
ShaneHudson At least he is using it :) I've bought a nice mic etc but don't have the confidence to use it often!
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/indielocation (+3) "UK cat" (view diff)
#
aaronpk wow 1215 viewers on the stream right now
friedcell joined the channel
#
rascul is it recorded? can't watch it right now :(
#
ben_thatmustbeme yeah, they'll have it all posted tomorrow
#
rascul ok i shall look for it tomorrow then
#
ben_thatmustbeme we'll have to post the link on the wiki
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/indiesecurity (+3) "UK cat" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/transmat (+3) "UK cat" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com edited /2014/UK/webactions (+3) "UK cat" (view diff)
iboxifoo and realzies joined the channel
#
@jeffjarvis RT @kevinmarks: Live now on TWiG with @benwerd and @erinjo talking #indieweb with @leolaporte and @jeffjarvis http://live.twit.tv (twitter.com/_/status/509805878334472193)
tilgovi joined the channel
#
@domenicoperri RT @kevinmarks: Live now on TWiG with @benwerd and @erinjo talking #indieweb with @leolaporte and @jeffjarvis http://live.twit.tv (twitter.com/_/status/509806884539625472)
#
ben_thatmustbeme just published my code for adding syndication links after the initial post. I win!
#
ben_thatmustbeme haha
#
ben_thatmustbeme i said that already, just did my git push though, so it feel real
#
aaronpk also now it's backed up :)
#
ben_thatmustbeme exactly
#
ben_thatmustbeme though i had it on several testing machines already
#
kylewm ben_thatmustbeme++ 1000
#
Loqi ben_thatmustbeme has 9 karma
#
ben_thatmustbeme haha
#
ben_thatmustbeme ben.thatmustbe.me/new, just need to get your server to support it
#
aaronpk whoa
#
aaronpk i'm already logged in from last time, but it says "You must log in with Post access to use this page"
#
aaronpk very well done
#
ben_thatmustbeme still very little in terms of "edit" but more coming soon
#
aaronpk prompting me to upgrade the scope
#
ben_thatmustbeme :)
#
KartikPrabhu is really falling behind in the micropub client race
#
aaronpk hm I got a white screen after submitting
#
aaronpk the note posted tho!
#
aaronpk http://aaronparecki.com/notes/2014/09/10/2/test-from-bens-site
#
ben_thatmustbeme yeah, i've had that issue. I'm setting Location: in the header. but i also echo out any response from the micropub endpoint.
#
@kevinmarks talking @withknown now on http://live.twit.tv #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/509809415684239360)
scor joined the channel
#
ben_thatmustbeme huh, note to self, micropub endpoint doesn't check if http is that the start of the URL for in-reply-to
#
ben_thatmustbeme definitely tried to reply and it thought it was a local reply
#
gRegor` ben_thatmustbeme: looks like your comment to leo has the permalink messed up
#
ben_thatmustbeme yeah, i noticed that
#
aaronpk quick send another webmention!
#
aaronpk to update!
#
gRegor` Dangit. I need to figure out what my site is doing that is throwing a bad request when I wm Known sites
#
gRegor` Nice! "I'm replacing my blog platform with this as soon as possible." Leo Laporte on withknown.com
#
ben_thatmustbeme oddly, it should have sent the correct webmention URL on that code. odd that the permalink is so messed up
#
@bingobaa http://indiewebcamp.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/509813190621167616)
#
tantek.com edited /2014/UK (-2) "link to indiewebcamps" (view diff)
#
ben_thatmustbeme http://leoville.withknown.com/2014/ben-and-erin-on-live-right-now-talking-about-known#comments looks more like a bug with known that is allowed that
#
ben_thatmustbeme it thinks i posted from his site oddly
#
tantek.com edited /MediaWiki:Sidebar (+1) "Cambridge MA" (view diff)
#
aaronpk i forgot how to manually send bridgy webmentions
#
aaronpk but would love to get leo's tweet replies backfed to this post!
#
tantek.com edited /next-iwc (+7) "next one is Cambridge!" (view diff)
#
gRegor` ben_thatmustbeme: seeing two versions of your comment on your site, but yeah the permalinks look fine
#
tantek.com edited /MediaWiki:Sidebar (+39) "Mass" (view diff)
#
ben_thatmustbeme the first one had a bad 'in-reply-to' link, so i reposted
#
tantek.com edited /MediaWiki:Sidebar (-35) "-abbr (somehow doesn't work)" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /2014/Cambridge (-2) "link to indiewebcamps" (view diff)
#
ben_thatmustbeme hmm, i did just update the MentionClinet
#
ben_thatmustbeme wonder if that caused any issues
#
@ShaneHudson Both @leolaporte and @photomatt are testing out @withknown (#indieweb)... who said the golden age of the web is over? :) (twitter.com/_/status/509815936787161088)
#
@benwerd RT @ShaneHudson: Both @leolaporte and @photomatt are testing out @withknown (#indieweb)... who said the golden age of the web is over? :) (twitter.com/_/status/509816617220718592)
tilgovi joined the channel
#
aaronpk twit.tv show sent about 3x traffic spike to indiewebcamp.com
#
gRegor` Sweet!
#
ShaneHudson Nice :)
#
aaronpk brief spike, but was definitely there
#
ShaneHudson Wonder how many signed up for Known
#
@endi Picking up another @RaspberryPi to get a #LAMP stack running for @withknown. Excited to be a part of #indieweb :) (twitter.com/_/status/509817147543920640)
#
aaronpk i bet benwerd knows
grantmacken joined the channel
#
tantek.com created /Template:tommorris (+215) "create since I'm using" (view diff)
#
@kevinmarks Chatting to @leolaporte about #indieweb and posting from mobile https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/509818295550103552/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/509818295550103552)
#
tantek.com edited /IndieWebCamps (+896) "add IndieWebCampUK 2014" (view diff)
#
kylewm ben_thatmustbeme: the problem is that you have u-url on your u-in-reply-to
#
kylewm and so the microformats parser is concatenating them
#
kylewm maybe
#
tantek ok I've updated the sidebar for Cambridge!
#
tantek and archived UK to http://indiewebcamp.com/IndieWebCamps#IndieWebCampUK_2014
#
tantek huh, still need to update http://indiewebcamp.com/Main_Page#IndieWebCamp but I have to run.
#
tantek could someone here update http://indiewebcamp.com/Main_Page#IndieWebCamp with the details from http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/Cambridge ? Thanks!
#
tantek.com edited /IndieWebCamps (+1) (view diff)
#
ShaneHudson Sure I can do that :)
wolftune joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /2014/UK (+57) "add photo" (view diff)
#
shanehudson.net edited /Main_Page (+116) "/* IndieWebCampUK 2014 */" (view diff)
#
ShaneHudson That should do it, took me a while to realise it was Cambridge US not UK :P
#
tantek.com edited /Main_Page (+38) "/* IndieWebCamp */ most recently" (view diff)
#
tantek thanks ShaneHudson !
#
ShaneHudson I didn't add Brighton to Past Events as there is no photo, want me to add anyway?
#
ShaneHudson Ah found a photo :)
#
tantek ShaneHudson: http://indiewebcamp.com/File:IWC_UK_2014_group_photo.jpg
fmarier joined the channel
#
tantek ShaneHudson: could you also hotlink the IWC UK photos (most recent 9) from this https://twitter.com/search?q=indiewebcamp%20OR%20indiewebcampuk&src=typd&mode=photos into http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK#Photos ?
#
ShaneHudson Sure
#
ShaneHudson On the front page, do you want a new row or drop the oldest event?
npdoty joined the channel
#
tantek on the front page, add tom's photo from 2014/UK, and turn it into 3 rows of 3 :)
#
ShaneHudson Ok :)
#
shanehudson.net edited /Main_Page (+140) "Adding Brighton to the Event table" (view diff)
lukebrooker joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /Main_Page (+32) "/* Past Events */ main previous" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /Main_Page (-9) "/* IndieWebCamp Cambridge 2014 */ fix main" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /Events (+1) "move IWC UK to past" (view diff)
#
ShaneHudson How do you hotlink with wiki syntax?
#
aaronpk if the URL ends in .jpg or .png it'll turn it into an img tag
#
tantek ShaneHudson: [URL IMAGEURL]
#
ShaneHudson Ah thanks :)
#
tantek where URL is the link to the full post/tweet
#
tantek and IMAGEURL is the thing that ends with .jpg .png .gif
#
tantek and if the IMAGEURL you found doesn't have an image file extension, then add ?x=.jpg to the end for example
benwerd joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /Events (+0) "highlight Cambridge" (view diff)
#
tantek well done benwerd!!!
#
tantek benwerd++
#
Loqi benwerd has 36 karma
#
tantek erinjo++
#
Loqi erinjo has 1 karma
#
benwerd Whoa. Erinjo needs more karma than that.
#
benwerd erinjo++
#
tantek KevinMarks++ all for doing great on TWIT
#
Loqi dude
#
tantek yeah seariously
#
benwerd kevinmarks++
#
tantek s/seariously
#
benwerd And thank you!
#
benwerd That was so much fun.
#
tantek when Loqi dudes you he's done
#
Loqi is done
#
tantek :D
#
benwerd And KevinMarks did a super-great job talking indieweb after we'd left. Was awesome.
#
benwerd I kept trying to break in and make an Oxford-Cambridge joke and I think it's probably a great thing that I didn't manage to.
#
shanehudson.net edited /2014/UK (+835) "Adding images from Twitter" (view diff)
#
ShaneHudson Yeah you all did great, got some interesting discussion going in irc :) I think some people were starting to get the point of it, Leo certainly did
#
sammachin another indieweb question, can I have more than one domain but sign in using the same twitter account?
#
sammachin s/indieweb/indieauth
#
Loqi sammachin meant to say: another indieauth question, can I have more than one domain but sign in using the same twitter account?
#
tantek sammachin: your twitter account only has one "Website" field, so no
#
sammachin thanks tantek thats what I thought, will have to use a 2nd twitter account as well to have a test domain
#
kylewm this should be in http://indiewebcamp.com/indieauth#FAQ
#
kylewm sammachin: you can use twitter for one domain and github for another
#
kylewm or PGP for any number
#
tantek if your OAuth provider lets you put in multiple rel=me links to websites, then you can use it for multiple IndieAuth logins :)
#
sammachin kylewm: yeah I just need a 2nd domain setup for testing some stuff
#
kylewm tantek: could you use Persona on multiple domains?
#
tantek yes
#
kylewm.com edited /IndieAuth (+309) "/* FAQ */ indieauth for more than 1 domain" (view diff)
#
kylewm please see if that's ok ^
#
@qadmon FreedomBox, para los interesados en el movimiento #Indieweb: https://freedomboxfoundation.org/ #personalcyberinfrastructure (twitter.com/_/status/509836242515951617)
#
kylewm.com edited /IndieAuth (+207) "/* What if I have more than one domain */" (view diff)
#
@qadmon Más en la línea de #IndieWeb: el proyecto Indie Box http://www.wired.com/2014/05/out-in-the-open-indie-box/ (twitter.com/_/status/509836512058671104)
ben_thatmust_ joined the channel
#
ben_thatmust_ hey guys
#
kylewm hey ben_thatmustnotbenamed
#
kylewm ben_thatmust_: did you see my note about your u-urls?
#
ben_thatmust_ ahh, okay, i'll fix that
#
kylewm you can see that I parsed it wrong in a different way :) https://kylewm.com/reply/2014/09/10/3/i-think-the-issue-is-that-you-have
#
@elroyjetson "The once and future IndieWeb" A great presentation by @t http://www.youtube.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/509839804884742144)
benwerd joined the channel
#
ben_thatmust_ damn. now my webmentions aren't sending
tantek joined the channel
#
KevinMarks__ So Google+ is handy for indieauth
#
ben_thatmust_ fixed it!
#
ben_thatmust_ yeah, i use G+ for all my indieauth, just seems faster
#
aaronpk i'm a fan of keyboard shortcut GPG signing :)
#
ben_thatmust_ huh, now bridgy doesn't seem to be getting my webmentions
#
ben_thatmust_ but i know that last one went out
indie-visitor joined the channel
#
Loqi Welcome, indie-visitor! Set your nickname by typing /nick yourname
ShaneHudson and snarfed joined the channel
#
snarfed HWC tonight!
#
snarfed aaronpk: re sending bridgy wms manually, https://www.brid.gy/about#source-urls
#
aaronpk oh yay thanks
#
snarfed ben_thatmust_: looks like your last wm to bridgy publish didn't work because the bridgy link had a ` at the end
#
ben_thatmust_ thats weird. its not anywhere in the source code or my DB
#
aaronpk blame gRegor`
#
snarfed ben_thatmust_: hmm ok. maybe that wasn't you
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu wassup! indiewebcamp!
#
snarfed yeah enthusiasm