KevinMarks joined the channel
# 00:07 snarfed aaronpk: do you use DataMapper.auto_migrate or auto_upgrade to create the wm.io schema? or did you originally do it by hand and it hasn't changed? or…?
Rev_Illo joined the channel
# 00:19 j12t When's the next SF homebrew? Not tomorrow?
# 00:24 tantek KevinMarks: kylewm's backup venue of "The Creamery" near 4th & Townsend is a good one too
# 00:25 bret and all the other regs who are not in irc
richardlitt joined the channel
# 00:39 caseorganic bret: thanks. i'm going to get a flu shot. got one last year and had no issues at all
brianloveswords, tilgovi and gRegor` joined the channel
# 01:03 gRegor` KartikPrabhu: On for HWC tomorrow?
gRegor`_ joined the channel
# 01:06 gRegor` Sweet. Hoping I can actually make some progress tomorrow.
tantek joined the channel
Rev_Illo_, arlen, caseorganic, snarfed, reedstrm, mdik, tilgovi, chalettu, gRegor`_, KartikPrabhu, gRegor`, j12t, KevinMarks, brianloveswords, lupinedev and tantek joined the channel
loic_m, KevinMarks, tantek, cweiske, friedcell, eschnou, lupinedev, krendil, KevinMarks_, wowaname, Sebastien-L, j12t, Pierre-O, julian``, adactio, stream7 and Garbee joined the channel
veselosky, stream7, j12t, benjamin-agaric, friedcell, reedstrm, cweiske and eschnou joined the channel
alexhartley, cweiske, veselosky, benjamin-agaric, iboxifoo, GWG, stream7, shiflett, j12t, Pierre-O, reedstrm, petermolnar, yakker, snarfed, gRegor` and brianloveswords joined the channel
# 15:37 gRegor` Morning, indieweb
KevinMarks__ joined the channel
# 15:52 gRegor` No, it's a local comment.
# 15:53 gRegor` I'm just baffled that it appears to be an actual business.
# 15:53 gRegor` Though the text is the typical BS "great article! blah blah blah"
# 15:55 Pierre-O Yes, typical spam, I think that the first spam on webmention will mean "it is popular"
brianloveswords joined the channel
# 15:56 petermolnar Pierre-O not webmention spam, local comment through webmention spam
# 15:57 gRegor` Yeah, my site still accepts local comments - comment form at the bottom.
# 15:57 petermolnar I've turned that off a while ago; yesterday the whole xmlrpc as well after a friends site I'm hosting collected 2k pingback spam within a week...
# 15:58 gRegor` Since I fixed the Akismet plugin a couple weeks ago, this is the only one that's gotten through
# 15:59 gRegor` Definitely have those turned off :)
# 15:59 petermolnar akismet was working fine, leaving the spam folder with 2k messages there, so pingback spam is more an annoyance than a real threat
# 16:04 petermolnar wonder how long it's going to take to have real spam with webmention
# 16:04 Pierre-O this is where we'll see that webmention is popular \o/
# 16:05 Pierre-O Do you know if there are some discussion about replacing pigback with webmention as a default for wordpress?
# 16:05 petermolnar we just need to add the webmention plugin to the core wordpress and we would be done spreading webmentions basically
# 16:05 Loqi petermolnar meant to say: everyone would adopt it
# 16:08 gRegor` There's already some good progress on webmention anti-spam, like /Vouch
j12t, snarfed and lupinedev joined the channel
# 16:31 GWG petermolnar, is webmention ready for core?
tantek joined the channel
# 16:32 petermolnar my personal experience: with the current releases of the webmention and the semantic linkbacks plugin I have not seen any issues in the past 3 months
barnabywalters joined the channel
# 16:35 GWG petermolnar, it is proposed, starts as a plugin.
# 16:36 GWG After the issue with the post format UI, they mandated new features be developed as plugins.
stream7 joined the channel
# 16:39 GWG petermolnar, I would not mind getting some people who are involved heavily in the Wordpress community to give webmentions a try.
wolftune joined the channel
# 16:46 barnabywalters tantek: actually I never fixed that problem on Taproot, only Shrewdness, by stripping the protocol off the URLs when using URLs as unique identifiers for things
brianloveswords joined the channel
# 16:50 GWG petermolnar, you recommended the apcu object cache plugin?
npdoty joined the channel
# 16:58 GWG I'm redoing my site and might give it a try
# 17:00 petermolnar it's pretty straighforward although I did have one or two times where I had to restart the fpm server to clean some stuck-in stuff
j12t joined the channel
# 17:01 GWG I was using memcached for a while. I also heard things about redis
# 17:02 petermolnar redis is a good thing if you use the functionalities it provides; apcu is enough for me :)
# 17:04 GWG I needed it for a different site, but it is gone
reederz, loic_m, iboxifoo, brianlove_swords, martinBrown, danlyke, Sebastien-L, richardlitt, benjamin-agaric, shiflett and Pea1 joined the channel
Pierre-O and Pierre-O1 joined the channel
lukebrooker joined the channel
wowaname, snarfed and GWG joined the channel
# 18:03 aaronpk do we have any notes/docs on who does a manual POSSE step vs automatic POSSE at the time the post is created?
# 18:04 aaronpk for example I know tantek first authors his notes on his site, then syndicates to twitter as a second step
# 18:05 aaronpk whereas my posting interface has a twitter checkbox and p3k posts it to twitter at the same time it saves the post to my site
# 18:05 aaronpk (and I even have an open issue on p3k to support syndicating posts after they're created)
# 18:07 tantek aaronpk - we have a "POSSE" section on each Silo's page where we describe How to do it and IndieWeb implementations of
# 18:07 tantek whether people do it manually or (semi)automatically
# 18:08 tantek in that Falcon does all the work to POSSE to Twitter for me, except for a single button press in my UI
# 18:11 tantek keeps forgetting that as one of the first silo and POSSE documentation pages, the /Twitter page doesn't have the same level of regular structure as other silos
# 18:12 aaronpk yeah but that's just about what kind of posts are being POSSE'd, not about the publishing flow
snarfed joined the channel
# 18:33 Loqi OAuth is an authorization protocol created to replace the need for client applications of a service (e.g. a silo) to ask for your username and password to the service in order to access the service on your behalf http://indiewebcamp.com/oauth
KevinMarks_ joined the channel
# 18:49 kylewm now I need to collapse my navigation UI so it fits on one line again...
caseorganic, friedcell, gavinc, richardlitt and benjamin-agaric joined the channel
# 19:20 aaronpk it has for a while. this is not the first invite-storm
# 19:21 aaronpk i just checked and the bridgy pings are coming in with significant time in between
# 19:23 aaronpk so the tradeoff in clustering the IRC notifications is delaying the notification
# 19:23 aaronpk I'd have to wait 15-30 seconds to see if another message comes in before sending it here
cweiske joined the channel
# 19:33 snarfed aaronpk: the all-at-once storms are usually just event invites. clustering those to ~1m or so would probably be fine
# 19:33 kylewm I wonder why the pings are spread out, does that surprise you, snarfed?
# 19:33 snarfed happy to add that to my list since i'm already diving into the wm.io side of this
# 19:33 aaronpk hm, you think it'd be worth clustering differently on post type?
# 19:34 aaronpk snarfed: thanks but I want to take a stab at clustering first, since I have some probably strong opinions on how to implement it :)
# 19:35 aaronpk snarfed: there's just like 10-15 seconds between webmentions sent. I can't tell why that's happening from my end
# 19:35 snarfed aaronpk: is it really that consistent and regular though?
# 19:37 snarfed i expect them to be serialized, but not that slowly. i may look into it, but not high priority yet
# 19:37 aaronpk i wouldn't worry about it. it's not really a problem
# 19:37 snarfed also, for event invites, you could probably cluster as broadly as 5m or so and it wouldn't hurt, since they're not high signal
# 19:41 snarfed aaronpk: kylewm: lol the delay was because the webmention to wm.io itself consistently took >10s to complete
# 19:42 kylewm assuming it processes them synchronously, that could still be bridgy's (or facebook's) lag
# 19:43 aaronpk oh you know what... webmention.io is processing them inline, including fetching the source
# 19:45 aaronpk so it fetches the bridgy source URL and bridgy makes the facebook API call
# 19:46 snarfed aaronpk: i don't know much about sinatra, ruby, etc, but if you parallelize incoming requests decently, and don't block anything important on i/o, it may not be a problem
# 19:47 aaronpk that's not the problem. it's just synchronously processing each webmention including verifying the source URL links to target. so it has to make an outgoing HTTP request before it can respond
# 19:47 aaronpk so while bridgy is making a request to wmio, wmio is then also making a request to bridgy
# 19:48 snarfed yup. it's the common pattern, since most wm handlers process synchronously
# 19:48 aaronpk yeah. i just need to stop processing them synchronously
# 19:49 kylewm oh but snarfed is saying process them synchronously but process multiple in parallel
sanduhrs joined the channel
# 19:49 aaronpk i'm pretty sure it does. but bridgy is sending them serially anyway right?
# 19:49 snarfed kylewm++ at least it's an option. i assumed it already served requests in parallel,
# 19:50 snarfed (but the difference btw serving requests in parallel at all and doing it *well* is pretty big)
# 19:50 aaronpk yeah I'm gonna put them on a queue and respond like p3k responds
# 19:52 snarfed fwiw, one nice part about handling synchronously and parallelizing effectively (i/o etc) is that you can return the status in the response and still scale
# 19:52 kylewm snarfed: does GAE allow running multiple workers to process the task queue?
# 19:52 kylewm so that you could be sending multiple mentions simultaneously, even if the receiver takes a while to respond
# 19:52 aaronpk oh also... wmio doesn't have its own microformats parser right now so it's making *another* HTTP request to parse the microformats
# 19:52 snarfed kylewm: yup. it does by default; i explicitly made the queue serial
# 19:54 snarfed bridgy's outgoing queue rarely gets big, and wms don't really need to be too timely, so i optimized for being able to scale arbitrarily while keeping resource usage constant-ish
# 19:55 aaronpk I disagree about the "timely" thing, but that's just me :)
eschnou joined the channel
# 19:55 kylewm haha, well you're already waiting ~5 minutes for the reply from bridgy
# 19:55 snarfed aaronpk: heh, i should have stated units. the difference is usually seconds to 10s of seconds
# 19:56 snarfed and yeah, the poll delay usually swamps any wm delay
# 19:56 kylewm (although i guess aaronpk maybe you *aren't* waiting for the poll)
# 19:57 kylewm you're not restricted by the task queue at all then
# 19:57 snarfed aaronpk: you use that to trigger favorites, rts, and direct replies?
# 19:57 snarfed kylewm: he probably still is for indirect replies, unless he wrote a lot more code than i expect
# 19:57 aaronpk just replies right now, it's searching for "aaronpk" rather than using the mention stream or whatever
# 19:58 snarfed tangent: damn twitter for *still* not exposing faves via the api
# 19:58 snarfed (and we're definitely overanalyzing at this point…but hey, entertaining)
shiflett and KartikPrabhu joined the channel
# 20:02 kylewm a heads up for anyone wanting to jump on #26 -- the parser service that webmention.io uses is doing a bit of interpretation too (authorship and whatnot), replacing it won't be as simple as just swapping out the parser
# 20:03 kylewm (I stumbled on that trying to figure out why it didn't resolve relative paths in e.g., my author image)
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
richardlitt joined the channel
# 20:23 ben_thatmustbeme i've ended up modifying my own version of just about every one of those libraries i use
# 20:26 gRegor` Hahaha, @TweetACoffee is like Clippy
# 20:27 gRegor` It looks like you're trying to send a coffee
# 20:27 gRegor` (Dangit, not in #indiechat. oops)
krendil, cweiske, KevinMarks and friedcell joined the channel
# 20:45 aaronpk just ran apache bench against webmention.io and it was able to handle 10 concurrent requests without blinking
tantek, lukebrooker, KartikPrabhu, reederz, verdi_, shiflett, iboxifoo, npdoty, eschnou, wolftune, yakker and richardlitt joined the channel
# 22:05 aaronpk wow there's a spam comment on a facebook social plugin thing created from an account that signed in via yahoo
tantek joined the channel
# 22:11 kylewm wth, you have to be logged into flickr to see images now?
# 22:13 kylewm I clicked that link and it took me to flickr.com/signup or somesuch
# 22:22 julian`` anyone else ever thought about this feature in chrome? when typing an address youve been to it should give a visual indicator that youve visited this page before somewhere
# 22:22 aaronpk not sure what you mean... I use chrome's auto-complete all the time to go back tgo pages i've visited
# 22:24 julian`` if you've visited multiple pages with the same starting characters eg a.com aa.com aaa.com and aab.com it only shows a certain amount so maybe itd show all except aab.com and then when you type in aab.com you have no visual indicator if youve been on here before just a small ux feature i think would be useful
# 22:26 julian`` actually in this example you would get a visual indicator, but if you're typing the end of a url eg url.com/blogpost1 11 111 etc you wouldnt see 112
caseorga_ and friedcell joined the channel
# 22:48 gRegor` Chrome's auto complete will also match later parts in the URL. I've used it a handful of times when I remembered part of a URL but not the domain
fiatjaf, cweiske and verdi_ joined the channel
# 23:14 snarfed aaronpk: have you ever had the wmio schema creation hang on you?
# 23:15 aaronpk I don't understand why you're having so much trouble with this!
# 23:15 snarfed (i can't guarantee i instrumented every statement)
# 23:16 snarfed i tried with 2.1.5 from homebrew, but that didn't get nearly as far
# 23:17 snarfed but again i think most of this hasn't changed from mavericks
# 23:18 aaronpk my setup is ruby and mysql installed from homebrew. (ruby-install and chruby)
# 23:18 snarfed hard to believe ruby version would cause strange all these strange failure modes, but who knows
# 23:19 aaronpk I dunno, it's not that hard to believe. There have been a lot of changes to ruby
lukebrooker, stream7 and tantek joined the channel
# 23:50 Jeena good question, I never needed more then a pin
# 23:51 rascul you can also use leafly to get a map and just not put any controls on it, effectively a static map
# 23:51 Jeena that is why they wanted everybody to cache their images I assume
# 23:52 aaronpk the point of a static map is to be able to put it in an img tag
# 23:52 rascul leafly is something different and unrelated ;)
# 23:53 aaronpk oh true, i put the geometry functions in a separate file