#indiewebcamp 2015-09-11

2015-09-11 UTC
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rhiaro and moredhel wrapping up HWC Edinburgh after 8 hours
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tantek that's like a mini camp!
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rhiaro passes out
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Zegnat Good morning IndieWeb!
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@andigalpern #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/642234080185028608)
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@LukasRosenstock @levelsio Start on Instagram and then, in #Indieweb jargon, PESOS to your own self-hosted blog. There's a tool called OwnYourGram for that. (twitter.com/_/status/642236652958674944)
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Loqi [indienews] New post: http://wirres.net/article/articleview/7785/1/6/ http://news.indiewebcamp.com/de/wirres.net/article/articleview/7785/1/6/
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Zegnat !tell aaronpk any reason why Loqi notifies us using 2 URLs rather than, say, the post title and a single URL? http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-09-11/line/1441957178858
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi Welcome, indie-visitor! Set your nickname by typing /nick yourname
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Loqi [mention] Peter Molnar wrote a post that linked to http://indiewebcamp.com https://webmention.io/notification/C_8OpsGiCC5GvfH7DXINFw
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Loqi [mention] Matthias Pfefferle posted "Bild von: https://indiewebcamp.com/2014-review#This_Is_A_Movement Tantek Çelik fasst in einem Artike..." https://notizblog.org/2015/07/25/indiewebcamp-2014-this-is-a-movement/ that linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/2014-review#This_Is_A_Movement and https://indiewebcamp.com/ https://webmention.io/notification/itzH5-6jipqDn-E94Kov4w
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Loqi [indienews] New post: http://notizblog.org/2015/07/25/indiewebcamp-2014-this-is-a-movement/ http://news.indiewebcamp.com/de/notizblog.org/2015/07/25/indiewebcamp-2014-this-is-a-movement/
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Loqi [indienews] New post: http://notizblog.org/2015/07/23/interview-mit-aaron-parecki/ http://news.indiewebcamp.com/de/notizblog.org/2015/07/23/interview-mit-aaron-parecki/
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Loqi [indienews] New post: http://notizblog.org/2015/05/03/mein-indieview-fuer-deutschlandradio-kultur-breitband/ http://news.indiewebcamp.com/de/notizblog.org/2015/05/03/mein-indieview-fuer-deutschlandradio-kultur-breitband/
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Loqi [indienews] New post: http://notizblog.org/2015/04/02/indieweb-die-daten-sind-wir/ http://news.indiewebcamp.com/de/notizblog.org/2015/04/02/indieweb-die-daten-sind-wir/
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[kevinmarks] Breakfast in portland this morning http://aaronparecki.com/events/2015/09/11/1/indieweb-xoxo-breakfast
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raucao aaronpk: i could only find this one: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Thrasher6670~mediawikiwiki/IRC_RC_Bot#Caveats
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raucao it's linked from https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Configuration_settings
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raucao but that's not entirely in core then, right?
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raucao looks like we'd need to run an additional server script
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Loqi [mention] Ben Werdmüller wrote a post that linked to http://indiewebcamp.com https://webmention.io/notification/O59uatk1wOcoT7ADKtg1bg
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Loqi [mention] Matthias Pfefferle posted "Die Renaissance des Pingbacks" https://notizblog.org/2013/07/08/die-renaissance-des-pingbacks/ that linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/pingback, http://indiewebcamp.com/comments, and http://indiewebcamp.com/responses https://webmention.io/notification/PRfWe9ECN0QoBFxGj4UXew
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Loqi [indienews] New post: http://notizblog.org/2013/07/08/die-renaissance-des-pingbacks/ http://news.indiewebcamp.com/de/notizblog.org/2013/07/08/die-renaissance-des-pingbacks/
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Loqi [indienews] New post: http://notizblog.org/2013/06/18/the-rise-of-the-indieweb/ http://news.indiewebcamp.com/de/notizblog.org/2013/06/18/the-rise-of-the-indieweb/
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Zegnat Hmm, not sure if I like how IndieNews lists articles based on when they were submitted rather than when they were originally posted. I could totally see how more recent blog posts could be drowned out by someone adding a backlog of posts like pfefferle just did.
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voxpelli On the other hand it's hard to find newly submitted posts if they aren't added on the top :/ Have that problem with FeedBin – lots of "new" blog posts are added among old ones I've already receives – making them easy to miss
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voxpelli Tricky that – I have on my todo to enable webmentions from my endpoints to be listed by receive date in addition to the claimed publish date it has now
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Zegnat Yeah, I guess that could be problematic. But for some reason I would expect to see the latest news on news.indiewebcamp.com, not "old" news
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Zegnat How do the old-school "planet" sites do this?
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Zegnat Note to self: check planets after dinner (planet mozilla, planer firefox, planet performance, come to mind)
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Zegnat Hmm, it seems to me that most planets work based on RSS, and then sort by publishing date, but not sure :(
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voxpelli When they add a new feed they probably don't import retroactively – which results in only getting new posts
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Zegnat that could definitely be it, yes
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Zegnat So I guess the question is, does aaronpk want us to submit "old" posts to News?
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[aaronpk] I definitely want to keep indie news showing newly submitted posts first regardless of the post publish date
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[aaronpk] Nothing wrong with submitting old posts
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Loqi [aaronpk]: Zegnat left you a message 10 hours, 41 minutes ago: any reason why Loqi notifies us using 2 URLs rather than, say, the post title and a single URL? http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-09-11/line/1441957178858 http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-09-11/line/1441957815997
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Zegnat That’s fine then, [aaronpk], just so we know :)
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Zegnat Also, good on Loqi for showing [aaronpk] the message I left for aaronpk!
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Loqi who, me?
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Zegnat yes, you!
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[aaronpk] Zegnat: re above, it's because of the clustering, it's not practical to include more than one post name all the time. Also some post names are really long, so that's awkward.
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Zegnat Yeah, when I wrote that pfefferle hasn’t submitted http://news.indiewebcamp.com/de/notizblog.org/2015/07/25/indiewebcamp-2014-this-is-a-movement/ yet. I didn’t expect people to submit notes, and only titled articles, but my expectation was clearly wrong
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snarfed current cost of implementing https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/51 : 1kloc and counting
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snarfed if i knew then what i know now, i probably would have closed it with a vengeance instead and never looked back
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snarfed ah well :P
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rhiaro swings by to glare at anyone who doesn't use an author property inside their h-entrys
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rhiaro goes back to 'parsing' parsed microformats that are all different because everyone's site markup varies unpredictably
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GWG is being glared at
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kylewm rhiaro: this is why i always say you need a microformats parser and an interpreter
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kylewm for things like authorship
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rhiaro This is driving me mad. Is everything an edge case? There's no consistent way to know where to look for stuff? (aside from representative h-card thing)
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rhiaro I didn't realise expanding my reposts was going to be such a PITA
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rhiaro This was supposed to be a quick thing I could do so I felt like I accomplished something
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rhiaro 36 hours ago
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rhiaro Will just assemble a list of people whose markup I definitely don't want to deal with and never repost them :)
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Zegnat You should document as many edge-cases as possible on the wiki, rhiaro. I think people don’t mind changing their markup a bit if some consensus can be reached
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Loqi +1
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gRegorLove What is authorship?
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Loqi authorship is a claim about who the author(s) of a post are https://indiewebcamp.com/authorship
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rhiaro That'll work for as long as the community stays this size
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rhiaro for people who engage via the wiki
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gRegorLove I don't do reposts, but /authorship has worked well for me to find authors
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rhiaro Finding authors has been reasonably well thought out, so it's not so bad, but I still have to write a bunch of really boring author-finding code
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gRegorLove Which language? I can share my PHP authorship code if it helps
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rhiaro But there are other things too. People nesting things in feeds differently. No specific example from what I'm doing right now, but ran into this before a while ago. I think I was trying to find the most recent post on any homepage that had a location. Had to jump through so many hoops and look for so many cases
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rhiaro That would help, thank you gRegorLove
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gRegorLove rhiaro: https://github.com/gRegorLove/ProcessWire-Webmention/blob/master/Webmention/Webmention.module#L427 and see functions parseAuthor(), parseRelAuthor()
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rhiaro Thanks!
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rhiaro gRegorLove++
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Loqi gRegorLove has 33 karma
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gRegorLove Welcome. I need to double check /authorship. I may not capture everything in it. :) Feedback welcome, too.
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Zegnat My new goal for my feed will be to get perfectly compliant mark-up that gives everyone wanting to parse it a headache
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rhiaro Zegnat: the reward for that is being plagarised instead of reposted :)
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Zegnat It is not plagiarising if I post under an open licence. Ha. Take that, rhiaro.
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rhiaro Foiled!
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kylewm Zegnat: you joke, but technically compliant markup that exercises the edge cases is pretty much tantek's M.O.
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Zegnat kylewm: so what you are saying is I should aim to give tantek a headache?
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[kevinmarks] yes, Tantek made my hovercard code blow up a lot too (he has a list of orgs, one of which is an h-card)
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[kevinmarks] but maybe as well as consistent parsers across language implementations we need consistent utility functions for 'get representative h-card, get author , is this a note? etc
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Zegnat [kevinmarks]: interesting idea. So, formalise the algorithms for finding information?
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[kevinmarks] we kind of do that on the wiki already; so doing it with examples and testcases seems a logical extension
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M-Kodo formalising the algorithm would be very useful
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M-Kodo the whole here is the html here is the json is like, here are two circles, now draw the owl
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M-Kodo https://meaningamidstmeasurement.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/funny-owl.jpg
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kylewm M-Kodo: the algorithm for converting HTML to JSON is very well defined on the microformats wiki
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kylewm it's more the process of understanding what the JSON actually represents that could use formalising
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