#indieweb 2016-09-08
2016-09-08 UTC
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# 
ChrisAldrich KevinMarks: known gives you the ability to add multiple in-reply-to urls, so you can technically reply to your own original so that all of your conversation stays there, but it also means that others in the thread do the same thing (essentially salmentions by hand)
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# ChrisAldrich GWG: You always ask me but it's difficult coming up with new substantive stuff for you.
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@ChrisAldrich #indieweb: Setting up http://www.noterlive.com/ for tonight's Homebrew Website Club http://stream.boffosocko.com/2016/homebrew-website-club-la-2016-09-07 (twitter.com/_/status/773679238360735744)
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# 
KevinMarks does that install for anyone?
# KevinMarks this http to https thing is annoying
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# KevinMarks interesting - the indieauth homescreen confused stacey as the green buttons were not obviously buttons
# KevinMarks on the wiki, the HWC page was also confusing - the link to rsvp is below the fold
# KevinMarks and then the template thing was also confusing
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# 
@kevinmarks #indieweb @sdepolo: what is the difference between a static site and a dynamic site? (twitter.com/_/status/773694455522193408)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I'd say that a dynamic site runs code on the server, but a static site doesn't (twitter.com/_/status/773694572803264512)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: from the user's point of view, a site that is the same every time you go there is static (twitter.com/_/status/773694729578016768)
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# @kevinmarks #indieweb @sdepolo: I'm Stacey, I'm with GoDaddy, and I've been building websites in San Francisco for 23 years (twitter.com/_/status/773696202231644160)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @sdepolo: My site is at http://staceydepolo.com/ and it is a minimal as can be, but I got rel="me" working (twitter.com/_/status/773696367453700096)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @sdepolo: I used to hate GoDaddy, so they hired people like me to tell them how to behave better (twitter.com/_/status/773696665979129856)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: Every business knows they want to be on the web, but nobody has the slightest idea how to do this (twitter.com/_/status/773697048130576385)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @sdepolo: If you can see the info from other companies like you, we can advise people on what to do - we want to connect that (twitter.com/_/status/773697362480992260)
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# 
@Johannes_Ernst @sdepolo is convincing me that @godaddy is a much more interesting company than it used to be, #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/773698037004640256)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @danlyke: I wrote my first HTML browser in 1993 - I blogged before it was called blogging. (twitter.com/_/status/773698082387161088)
# 
gRegorLove Hello from Bellingham HWC. Looks like just me tonight.
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @danlyke: I have 20,000 outbound links from my blog and most of them are dead and I want to fix that (twitter.com/_/status/773698413691101184)
# gRegorLove This last week I got a posting activity visualization thingy set up: http://gregorlove.com/2016/08/experimenting-with-a-github-style-posting/
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: this is where my hasing stuff at http://svgur.com/dweb?url=http%253A%252F%252Fsvgur.com%252Fi%252F80.svg comes in (twitter.com/_/status/773699831126749184)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @danlyke: we are no longer in place where we have self contained documents (twitter.com/_/status/773699917235847168)
# 
Loqi [indieweb] "Missing Conversation" on 2016-05-13 https://gregorlove.com/2016/05/missing-conversation/
# Loqi [indieweb] "IndieWeb Summit Day 1" on 2016-06-05 https://gregorlove.com/2016/06/indieweb-summit-day-1/
# gRegorLove Hm, odd.
# gRegorLove I didn't think PuSH would cause notifications for old posts like that ^
# gRegorLove The post IDs in the Atom feed shouldn't have changed
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# gRegorLove Ah, the ids changed from http to https
# gRegorLove Well, there's my project tonight, go to https-only
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I also helped Dan Gillmor get his old sites static and working again http://citmedia.org/ and (twitter.com/_/status/773702529217683457)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @sdepolo: how many people here have been twitter verified? (only @flm_girl) - who else wants it? (twitter.com/_/status/773702704296300544)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I also made a distributed verification tool to show rel-me links on my site http://www.kevinmarks.com/ it shows ticks (twitter.com/_/status/773702937390485504)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I also made a browser plugin to do this everywhere (twitter.com/_/status/773703034010501121)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @film_girl: verification was a media outreach thing or a celebrity thing, now anyone can ask for it (twitter.com/_/status/773703223874088960)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @film_girl: you used to have to lock your profile once verified and reverify if you changed it, but you could change emails (twitter.com/_/status/773703326626115585)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @film_girl: I wouldn't put a brand in my twitter handle - I know better (twitter.com/_/status/773703437536075776)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: the point of rel="me" is saying that you have control over both websites and can point both ways (twitter.com/_/status/773703971911458817)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @film_girl: someone created a public page for me, and people followed it; facebook even made pages from wikipedia (twitter.com/_/status/773704190237564928)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: I'm building a linux distribution called UBOS - which is also Ugandan Bureau Of Statistics and I get their likes (twitter.com/_/status/773704402532175872)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: ReadWriteWeb accidentally became the top link for "Facebook Login" and people tried to log into facebook and comment (twitter.com/_/status/773705061134397440)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: we write a lot of stuff and explain why we believe things- no-one gets to the conclusion. (twitter.com/_/status/773705311312019460)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: what if I just wrote the conclusion first and make the arguments in smaller type - can we do that? (twitter.com/_/status/773705475112173568)
# 
@film_girl #indieweb meetup! (@ GoDaddy SF in San Francisco, Calif) https://www.swarmapp.com/c/821zKhITzFQ (twitter.com/_/status/773706274672377856)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: in effect you have the Inverted Pyramid structure that a classic New York Times article would use (twitter.com/_/status/773706711639228420)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @danlyke: If I were going to enable transclusion, you need to link to posts or paragraphs (twitter.com/_/status/773706897060929537)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @danlyke: the problem with semantic markup is that as no-one can see it so it gets broken (twitter.com/_/status/773706976878530560)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @danlyke: what if I put sha1 of every paragraph (twitter.com/_/status/773707036840325124)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: that's why we use fragmention to link to the text we are quoting instead - see https://indieweb.org/fragmention (twitter.com/_/status/773709368122544128)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @sdepolo: are you using 2 factor auth for your accounts? (twitter.com/_/status/773709782909849601)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: the problem is that you may not have your phone number any more -it happened to my son today: https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/773676072869040128 (twitter.com/_/status/773709934588461056)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @film_girl: the other challenge is that your SMS can be sent to all your devices, and I've seen it hit the relay first (twitter.com/_/status/773710809298038784)
# @kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: if GPG didn't exist I wouldn't be married - I had to talk to my future wife in DC from Germany via encryption (twitter.com/_/status/773711351197863937)
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# @kevinmarks Is there a way to get people to understand how their networks connect? #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/773715004604297216)
# Loqi [indieweb] "Is there a way to get people to understand how their networks connect? #indieweb" by Kevin Marks on 2016-09-08 http://known.kevinmarks.com/2016/is-there-a-way-to-get-people-to-understand-how
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# 
@cstrauber @film_girl Would love to hear some indieweb chat on @_RocketFM sometime. (twitter.com/_/status/773717096291307520)
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# @kevinmarks Notes from SF Homebrew Website Club tonight: http://www.kevinmarks.com/hwc2016-09-07.html #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/773732936910647297)
# Loqi [indieweb] "Notes from SF Homebrew Website Club tonight: http://www.kevinmarks.com/hwc2016-09-07.html #indieweb" by Kevin Marks on 2016-09-08 http://known.kevinmarks.com/2016/notes-from-sf-homebrew-website-club-tonight-hwc2016-09-07html-indieweb
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# KevinMarks so, we're considering trying a south bay HWC next week instead
# gRegorLove Heh. "or by sending a coma separated list or url-encoded URLs like this hub.url=<url1>;<url2>" from https://documentation.superfeedr.com/publishers.html
# gRegorLove So is it comma-separated, or semi-colon separated?
# 
@JimTyhurst Good discussions at Portland @IndieWebCamp Homebrew Website Club tonight. #OwnYourIdentity #OwnYourData (twitter.com/_/status/773740245510565890)
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# 
KartikPrabhu semi-colon separated!
# KartikPrabhu who does that?
# gRegorLove shrugs
# gRegorLove KevinMarks: Re: https://github.com/indieweb/indiewebify-me/issues/54 I'm not sure what "should" be done. Indiewebify.me was set up to give that response.
# gRegorLove It was probably set up so the ajax would get 400, fail, and show "doesn't link back"
# 
@sdepolo Great group of #indieweb advocates @Godaddy #SF tonight. Thanks @kevinmarks for instigating! https://twitter.com/sdepolo/status/773745220240289792/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/773745220240289792)
# gRegorLove Strike the last line; misspoke.
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# gRegorLove I thought t.co links were all https now? Appears not; only when the destination is https?
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# gRegorLove KartikPrabhu: Speaking of semicolon-separated, just ran into that with meta refresh elements. :) content="0;URL=http://example.com"
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# gRegorLove Yeah, and Link headers
# 
cweiske see http://cweiske.de/tagebuch/php-http-negotiation.htm for some examples
# cweiske link headers also use comma; see https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5988#section-5.5 the 2nd example
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@loicmathaud @yanntheret ☠j'avais fait ça : http://loic.mathaud.fr/presentations/2014/presentation-indieweb/ et je me tâte á proposer des HWC sur sainté (twitter.com/_/status/773785661090500609)
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# 
sensiblemn who is freekurt.com?
# sensiblemn loqi, who is freekurt.com?
# sensiblemn loqi, who is sensiblemn?
# sensiblemn booya
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# 
petermolnar I finally figured this one out: if my post is a reaction ( reply, like, etc ), than there should be no title but the reaction itself, including the url and the u- whatever should be the post title
# petermolnar it solves all my problems of where to put the reaction
# petermolnar and it even makes sense
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# petermolnar I haven't yet figured out how to store it better than in the content, but for the representation, it works quite well
# sensiblemn aaronpk: is https://quill.p3k.io/email still working? i only found the url bc i remembered using it before, and found it in the source code. doesn't seem to be linked to anywhere on the site though, and i just tried sending an email to it and it didn't seem to go through. if it doesn't currently work, is it something that would work if I self hosted quill?
# petermolnar right; the p-name (aka title) for replies will be the re: [url], but for favs/reposts, I'll have the regular title left; otherwise it's rather meaningless
# sensiblemn cweiske: i assumed he'd check the logs and respond in the morning
# sensiblemn should i use loqi instead?
# sensiblemn !tell aaronpk: is https://quill.p3k.io/email still working? i only found the url bc i remembered using it before, and found it in the source code. doesn't seem to be linked to anywhere on the site though, and i just tried sending an email to it and it didn't seem to go through. if it doesn't currently work, is it something that would work if I self hosted quill?
# sensiblemn thx cweiske
# sensiblemn i want to be on +#indieweb
# sensiblemn loqi: add me to +#indieweb
# sensiblemn cweiske: https://indieweb.org/irc#Voice
# sensiblemn i did
# sensiblemn who is sensiblemn?
# sensiblemn cweiske: you're probably right
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# gRegorLove sensiblemn: It takes a few minutes, and usually re-joining the room and saying something before Loqi voices
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# 
Zegnat Apparently it is my hosting. There will be a reboot tonight to add more RAM. https://twitter.com/ubernauten/status/773811353903566848
# 
@ubernauten @schmittlein77 Ja, leider. Sorry, sollte gleich wieder da sein. Und heute Nacht, gibt es mehr RAM. https://twitter.com/ubernauten/status/773594104538230784 (twitter.com/_/status/773811353903566848)
# Loqi [indieweb] "Ran a successful first full test of my Flickr to @withknown photo and video import tool (http://mapkyc.me/1JWJE1X) overnight! #indieweb" by Marcus Povey on 2014-12-29 https://mapkyca.withknown.com/2014/ran-a-successful-first-full-test-of-my-flickr-to
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# 
@jkphl Oh how lovely you were, #Brighton! See you again in 2 weeks for @indiewebcamp Now: On or way to Cambridge ... https://twitter.com/jkphl/status/773844614981754880/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/773844614981754880)
# Loqi aaronpk: sensiblemn left you a message 3 hours, 47 minutes ago: is https://quill.p3k.io/email still working? i only found the url bc i remembered using it before, and found it in the source code. doesn't seem to be linked to anywhere on the site though, and i just tried sending an email to it and it didn't seem to go through. if it doesn't currently work, is it something that would work if I self hosted quill?
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# [kevinmarks] I had to reauth last time I used it
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# petermolnar I'm having a disturbing thought: with receiving webmentions, I'm allowing a remote content to enter my X programming language when I'm pulling it into the mf2 parser. At this point I may start to fear that certain remote content tries to exploit the receiver with it's contents, and I'm not certain if I should care, or try to take precautions against this, and if yes, how?
# petermolnar this is, of course, the problem with crawling anything
# petermolnar but the webmention receiver is automatically crawling anything that sends a valid looking mention
# petermolnar do we have a discussion on this already?
# 
myfreeweb well, if your html parser is written in a memory safe language (well, not C/C++), the attacker is very unlikely to get remote code execution
# petermolnar PHP is written in C, how does that count? :)
# petermolnar I didn't only mean memory, I meant more like language bugs
# myfreeweb DoS is easy with XML, but if you're using an HTML5 parser, you should be fine
# myfreeweb https://pypi.python.org/pypi/defusedxml so much crap is possible with XML
# petermolnar XHTML for the wins
# 
voxpelli petermolnar: probably some fun stuff to throw at your endpoint in https://github.com/minimaxir/big-list-of-naughty-strings
# petermolnar yeah.. apparenty inlining is becoming a google thing now
# petermolnar and some will do it without the brains
# petermolnar and the page it links to: https://varvy.com/pagespeed/wicked-fast.html
# petermolnar in this very case, it's fone
# petermolnar fine
# petermolnar I did some tests with inlining my CSS, just to realize, it's an absolute overkill
# petermolnar if the page is structured well enough, it should be readable without any css
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# KevinMarks_ Does quill editor still put images in as data urls if there's no media endpoint?
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# 
@jgmac1106 @film_girl yeah be careful increasing its cool factor may make project implode though I venture you had most domains at #indieweb. (twitter.com/_/status/773908946075746304)
# @jgmac1106 @sdepolo Looking for resources on hacking the php of my theme to make it #indieweb compliant. Any documentation/resources? (twitter.com/_/status/773910578339405824)
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# KevinMarks_ So would it make sense for a micropub server given content with images in to cache them using its media endpoint and rewrite content accordingly?
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# @jgmac1106 @dshanske my mozfest plans had to be canceled due to out of town guests. #indieweb in nyc same time (empty building) maybe make it for day (twitter.com/_/status/773913736180539392)
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# @jgmac1106 been playing with dynamic sites: http://networkedlearningcollaborative.com/ and static sites: http://edu307class.networkedlearningcollaborative.com/ in effort for #indieweb course design (twitter.com/_/status/773918555431731200)
# KevinMarks_ Ben, inkstone doesn't like my known login "known.kevinmarks.com" does not match the logged in user "http://known.kevinmarks.com/profile/kevinmarks".
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# KartikPrabhu what is micropub?
# Loqi Micropub is an open API standard that is used to create posts on one's own domain using third-party clients https://indieweb.org/Micropub
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# 
[schmarty] aaronpk KevinMarks_: i don't have a media endpoint, so my micropub handler extracts the data URLs into files and rewrites the content.
# KartikPrabhu where do I read more on this media endpoint thing? can't find it on \micropub
# KartikPrabhu thanks
# KartikPrabhu aaronpk: very nice! like the async user-flow
# KartikPrabhu realises he has been out of the micropub loop for a long long time
# KevinMarks_ I think I need to make a micropub endpoint to understand this
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# [kevinmarks] If I do a multipart post with images, can the content refer to the images?
# snarfed towards red warnings on all non-https sites: http://blog.chromium.org/2016/09/moving-towards-more-secure-web.html
# KartikPrabhu interestingly that page is not https!
# KartikPrabhu but has a https couterpart
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# 
[shaners] kevinmarks Did you just try to edit your h-card on https://h-card-as-a-service.herokuapp.com ?
# KevinMarks_ Yesterday I did
# KevinMarks_ But it didn't import most of it
# KartikPrabhu snarfed: very interesting
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# cweiske curl -i -H 'Authorization: Bearer abc' -F 'h=entry' -F 'content[]=image test' -F 'file=@/home/cweiske/Bilder/openid-large.png;filename=photo;type=image/png' http://known.bogo/micropub/endpoint
# cweiske curl -i -H 'Authorization: Bearer abc' -F 'h=entry' -F 'content=openid image' -F 'photo=@/home/cweiske/Bilder/openid-id.bogo.png' http://known.bogo/micropub/endpoint
# gRegorLove Sounds like #indieweb-dev stuff :)
# gRegorLove no worries
# sensiblemn aaronpk: thanks for the response. i'll try again
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# sensiblemn when does loqi verify me as a +#indieweb person?
# sensiblemn who is sensiblemn?
# sensiblemn !tell tantek that i'm sorry for not RSVPing for the last MIT indiewebcamp before or during the event. i'm on there now.
# gRegorLove sensiblemn: Try re-joining the channel, sometimes it takes that.
# sensiblemn thx gRegorLove
# gRegorLove Though it's odd your photo isn't showing up in the logs either
# Zegnat I also think you need to be added to /IRC_People
# gRegorLove That should usually just take a few minutes
# gRegorLove They're on there
# sensiblemn i did
# sensiblemn my picture shows up here: https://indieweb.org/irc/2016-09-08
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# gRegorLove Interesting. It's not on the new logs https://chat.indieweb.org/2016-09-08#bottom
# gRegorLove I think aaronpk was doing something with caching on the new logs, so maybe related.
# sensiblemn okey dokey
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# cweiske shpub 0.0.3 with note and file/url upload support is available on https://github.com/cweiske/shpub/releases/tag/v0.0.3
# gRegorLove snarfed: I seem to be getting a 400 from Bridgy Publish when I try to publish an https url. Worked normally with http. No logs for it on my profile page.
# gRegorLove URL is https://gregorlove.com/2016/09/jeremiahrags-or-an-audio-jack/, publishing to Twitter
# gRegorLove Let me double-check something on my end... the http library might be doing something wrong.
# gRegorLove Hm, no, it appears to be getting a 400 from bridgy
# snarfed gRegorLove: i don't see the publish attempt in https://brid.gy/twitter/gRegorLove#publishes
# gRegorLove Yeah, it's weird
# snarfed ah it says "Publish is not enabled for your account. Please visit https://brid.gy and sign up!"
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# gRegorLove Ah. Would updating my twitter profile link make it work?
# gRegorLove This http library apparently makes retrieving the headers easy but not the body. Lame.
# gRegorLove Well, it's a custom-built one in ProcessWire, so... :)
# gRegorLove It mostly does what the author needed the internals to do, but we've been improving it as more plugins use it.
# gRegorLove Should I click the Twitter icon on the homepage to re-auth?
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# gRegorLove I'ma break all the things today.
# gRegorLove There it goes.
# gRegorLove Thanks!
# Loqi [indieweb] "Homebrew Website Club Silicon Valley 2016-09-14" by Kevin Marks on 2016-09-08 http://known.kevinmarks.com/2016/homebrew-website-club-silicon-valley-2016-09-14
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# KevinMarks who's in the South Bay then?
# Loqi [indieweb] "Homebrew Website Club Silicon Valley 2016-09-21" by Kevin Marks on 2016-09-08 http://known.kevinmarks.com/2016/homebrew-website-club-silicon-valley-2016-09-21
# 
@beep One has to opt *out* of sending read receipts with DMs, but opt *in* to providing accessible captions for uploaded images. Defaults matter. (twitter.com/_/status/773931756403777536)
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# KevinMarks so should I put my rel-me extension code in indieweb or microformats?
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