#indieweb 2016-10-15

2016-10-15 UTC
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GWG
Gretings
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aaronpk
i just thought of a hilarious way to do "verified" indieweb checkins at a location
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GWG
How?
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aaronpk
i was looking for brainstorming on webmentions for checkins but i can't find it
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aaronpk
well it's not a huge leap to imagine including the venue's website in your checkin post, and then you'd send a webmention to their site to tell them you checked in
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aaronpk
that would let the venue know who is checking in, and do the thing that Bailey's taproom has where the TV shows the faces of everyone who's checked in there
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aaronpk
but of course it's easy to fake a checkin post. the foursquare app makes it a little difficult, but it's still possible.
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aaronpk
so imagine on the TV screen that shows who's checked in, that it also shows a 4-digit code on the screen, and you have to include the code in your checkin post. that code would then change as soon as it's been used.
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Loqi
[indieweb] "Brainstorming "verified" IndieWeb checkins" on 2016-10-15
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aaronpk
what whoa
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aaronpk
strange that it didn't find my url
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aaronpk
doesn't know how to debug RSS feeds
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miklb
waves hello
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Loqi
[indieweb] "Website Redesign" on 2015-05-26 https://benramsey.com/blog/2015/05/website-redesign/
KevinMarks, irisisgay, KevinMarks_, AngeloGladding, lukasros, pindonga, Ruxton_, bnvk_, brianlove_swords, Pierre-O, Gold, bear, rhiaro, terminalpixel, Salt, kants_, catsup_, friedcell and catsup joined the channel
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sknebel
good morning!
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Loqi
rise and shine!
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[kevinmarks]
Aaronpk - send your feed through unmung and see if you like the html that comes out?
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Loqi
[indieweb] "Check out the meet-up page for the Homebrew Website Club #Brussels #indieweb" by Rick Mendes on 2016-10-15 http://meetu.ps/c/2QcvM/wC0hz/d
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bear
@aaronpk the 4 digit code idea would annoy anyone who tries to checkin along with 3 or 4 others IMO - why not just have a barcode that they scan that then becomes the token used like in private posts
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aaronpk
Scannng a barcode is more obtrusive to the flow
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aaronpk
I've been in many situations where it would have been awkward to point my phone at something to check in, but just typing on my phone was fine
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bear
just thinking of a way to have a unique code but not make it easy to "share"
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bear
if people have name tags, then it's just part of the tag
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bear
just noodling
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bear
I would imagine it could be a spectrum of items - simple code on display, code on nametags, NFC spot...
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aaronpk
Yea true
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GWG
Anything can be spoofed.
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bear
sadly very true
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bear
I was even thinking for "high value" places the check in process would require a person at a desk, who is checking people in, to be the one to trigger the flow so the code can be kept secret
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GWG
I think the idea is to make it not easy, but not impossible to spoof.
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GWG
So, you add a cost to doing it which turns away most.
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bear
yep, which is why I like this webmention method - the cost being added is the cost of a personal domain that you use indieauth with to send the webmention
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bear
the small increase in complexity I'm adding just for my own examples of a higher value conference instead of something like a camp or meetup
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GWG
At a conference it is easy to have a temporary value. At a more permanent thing, it is harder
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bear
oh, your talking about foursquare like checkins to a place - sure. I was speaking only to the event type
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bear
for those I would just insist on geo coordinates and not worry about those folks who spoof gps
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GWG
bear: I was speaking of both more broadly. I don't usually check in to anywhere on anything, to be honest. The closest I get is posts when I visit interesting places. I would adopt those.
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GWG
But the idea of reporting attendance at a conference as well is intriguing.
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GWG
I also wanted to document Indorsements at some point, which we discussed at NYC2
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snarfed
ben_thatmustbeme, re hangouts, you may be interested in https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.googlecode.gtalksms
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snarfed
i use and like both
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GWG
Hello, snarfed
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GWG
Any excitement there? I have been writing Unit tests, which is now linked permanently in mind with you
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snarfed
glad to hear it!
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snarfed
work kid etc are busy here...but i'm almost ready to release the new version of the wp micropub plugin!
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snarfed
looking forward to you trying it
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GWG
I pulled it into my repository, but I was trying to get some Core TRAC tickets in before the deadline for 4.7
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GWG
They insist on unit tests and I am working on some really old code.
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GWG
It is related to the issue you just reopened, snarfed
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KevinMarks_
This checkin thing sounds like the pokemon with webmentions scenario tantek and I came up with
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KevinMarks_
The way to make it worth doing is to tie it to things the venue cares about, like table reservations, food orders or wifi access tokens
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KevinMarks_
Tantek, did you write that up?
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Loqi
[indieweb] "Notes from Day 2 of Dodging the Memory Hole: Saving Online News | Friday, October 14, 2016" by Chris Aldrich on 2016-10-15 http://boffosocko.com/2016/10/15/notes-from-day-2-of-dodging-the-memory-hole-saving-online-news-friday-october-14-2016/
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bear
opens up micropub.rocks and gets ready to cry a little at how many tests he has to catch up with
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snarfed
hugs bear
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bear
<3 thanks
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bear
hmm, is it working for y'all?
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bear
ah - there it is
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bear
\o/ syndication endpoint tests - now I can finally see what my code is doing wrong since quill would never recognizie mine
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tantek
Aww no photos in https://indieweb.org/this-week/2016-10-14.html - hey Jeena were there really no photos at your IndieWeb talk at PHP Göteborg Meetup 5?
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tantek
!tell aaronpk the extra 4-digit code thing sounds like "work", and as a user I'd always just blow it off, or blow off anything that required it, unless there was a very good incentive to bother with it (e.g. coupon / discount at the venue)
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi
aaronpk: tantek left you a message 1 minute ago: the extra 4-digit code thing sounds like "work", and as a user I'd always just blow it off, or blow off anything that required it, unless there was a very good incentive to bother with it (e.g. coupon / discount at the venue)
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tantek
!tell aaronpk also, "easy to fake a checkin post" is hardly any sort of a high-priority problem to solve, it's one of those minutae things that either only devs worry about (not really a UX problem), or is only a problem once a service hits some massive scale. So I'd punt on it, or if you prefer, capture it in a "Brainstorming" section and move on
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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aaronpk
i was starting with the assumption there was a situation in which the user is getting some extra value by publishing "verified" checkins
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Loqi
aaronpk: tantek left you a message 1 minute ago: also, "easy to fake a checkin post" is hardly any sort of a high-priority problem to solve, it's one of those minutae things that either only devs worry about (not really a UX problem), or is only a problem once a service hits some massive scale. So I'd punt on it, or if you prefer, capture it in a "Brainstorming" section and move on
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tantek
concrete example of the 4 digit code laziness problem. Coffee Bean & Tea Leaf (California based coffee / cafe chain) used to have a 4 digit code on their TVs for logging into their captive portal for their free wifi. They eventually got rid of it.
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aaronpk
add that to the wiki!
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tantek
where? add your brainstorm first, then I'll add it there as a datapoint
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aaronpk
already did :)
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tantek
no you added a link to it :P
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tantek
also https wiki links please so we're logged in by default ;)
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tantek
aaronpk - are you seeing a lot of fake checkins somewhere that inspired you to work on this?
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aaronpk
nope just random thought in passing
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tantek
my big itch with checkins is still https://indieweb.org/checkin#offline_checkins
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tantek
like on my trail run this morning, there were a bunch of spots where I wanted to check-in, but no service (not to my mifi etc.)
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aaronpk
offline posting in general is a big itch for me
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tantek
I literally run into this problem every week, multiple times.
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tantek
offline posts where you're doing all the authoring I feel like is "not a big deal", e.g. ben_thatmustbeme has solved it with his client
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aaronpk
i have a pretty long backlog of food posts I need to dump from my Notes app to my website from plane flights
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tantek
ah! that makes sense
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aaronpk
my goal is to have this new offline flow working before my next flight
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tantek
definitely add "offline food posts" to https://indieweb.org/food#Brainstorming !
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tantek
that makes so much sense
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tantek
I would have used that when calorie counting / tracking
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aaronpk
i'm about half way through building "Wunderpub" which is essentially a Wunderlist-to-Micropub proxy app
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aaronpk
Wunderlist has very good offline editing/syncing, so I'm going to create my food posts (and other posts) in a special wunderlist list
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tantek
what is Wunderlist?
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Loqi
Wunderlist is an app for managing todo lists, is available for many desktop and mobile platforms, and has an API https://indieweb.org/Wunderlist
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tantek
interesting!
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tantek
in that case
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tantek
what is Wunderpub?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "Wunderpub" yet. Would you like to create it?
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aaronpk
i just rewrote the imgur upload of glowing-bear to be a micropub client instead!
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aaronpk
now when I upload images through my IRC client they get uploaded to my site instead of imgur :)
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tantek
sweet!
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KevinMarks_
Foursquare allowed fake checkins for years
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KevinMarks_
People would checkin to places to communicate their mood
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KevinMarks_
Or to places they were paying attention to
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bear
ah - nothing like spending a couple hours down the rabbit hole of post-OS upgrade dev environment breakage
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bear
goes to find dinner
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tantek
I admit that's one of my big fears of OS upgrades
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bear
this latest round of glitches from apple is making me regret not keeping my linux laptop working
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bear
but I also have to remember that it was the round of os issue with it that drove me to apple
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GWG
bear: I always keep an old working thing around for that reason.
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tantek
GWG++
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Loqi
gwg has 186 karma (171 in this channel)
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GWG
I keep a laptop in my trunk that I bought cheap for that reason