#indieweb 2017-03-01

2017-03-01 UTC
anglophilic, [kevinmarks], wolftune, afrogeek[m], [chrisaldrich], snarfed, nitot, ben_thatmustbeme, leg, Lana, KevinMarks, KevinMarks_, tantek, davidmead, mlncn and [eddie] joined the channel
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[kevinmarks] Workflow is like applescript
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[kevinmarks] You can read it but it's really unclear how to write it
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@acegiak @Balketh how about starting a blog? I could even help you make it indieweb friendly! (twitter.com/_/status/836844732701683712)
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dgold oof. AIM to no longer use the OSCAR protocol.
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dgold that's the end of that, then.
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Zegnat Are they closing down or switching to a different protocol, dgold? Link?
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Zegnat What is AIM?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "AIM" yet. Would you like to create it?
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Zegnat AIM is [[AOL]] Instant Messanger
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Loqi ok
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Zegnat AIM << [[messaging]]
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Loqi ok, I added "[[messaging]]" to the "See Also" section of /AIM
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dgold https://arstechnica.co.uk/business/2017/03/aol-will-cut-off-third-party-app-access-to-aim/
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dgold and https://www.aim.com/faq
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dgold 'the new AIM'
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Zegnat Those first three FAQ answers explained literally nothing
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GWG Guess it is time to pressure the 5 people I know who still use AIM and see if they have adopted something else.
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dgold GWG: I've been using it _forever_
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dgold hell, I even remember using GAIM when it was capitalised
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GWG dgold, I built a bitlbee installation so I could forget about dealing with it and convert it into a format that I was still using. But all good things must come to an end
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dgold not sure you could call AIM/Oscar 'good'
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dgold </aside>
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GWG dgold: There were people I talked to on there a lot.
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GWG But either way, on to the future.
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GWG Maybe Indiemessenging will become popular
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Zegnat I just need Facebook to aggregate their IMing. Most people I know have switched to either Messenger or WhatsApp, if those two merge I can get rid of yet another app.
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frzn Zegnat: if they merge facebook would lost like 100bi dollars.
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frzn I think it might never happen
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Zegnat If they merge Facebook would have made a competitor disappear for 100bi. That might be worth it on their books.
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petermolnar Indiemessenging - matrix?
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frzn Zegnat: right, but they already did it buying whatsapp for 30bi
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frzn or 20, dont remember well
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petermolnar that's an incredibly stupid move from aol
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Zegnat Then how do they lose 100bi? I thought you were referring to the price of WhatsApp.
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petermolnar whoever still uses it are most probably via 3rd party by now
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petermolnar this is essentially sunsetting AIM
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Zegnat Unless they move AIM to XMPP. But I guess that isn’t what they have done.
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frzn Zegnat: because it would be the price of whatsapp today if it was an independent app with more than 1billion users
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frzn if they merge messenger and whatsapp, one of these two userbases would be "financially" lost
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frzn in their accounting
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Zegnat I don’t agree, because Facebook does not plan to sell WhatsApp at all. And I don’t think WhatsApp has publicly traded stock either, so there isn’t actually any real value there other than the assets and the userbase. Facebook would keep the entire userbase by merging with Messenger.
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Zegnat Unless I am mistaken and WhatsApp is currently trading?
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frzn Zegnat: Facebook treats whatsapp, oculus and instagram as different companies
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frzn Zegnat: not yet, but could
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dgold Zegnat: they did have AIM using XMPP, for most of 2008
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dgold then they stopped again
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@voxpelli @aral Will surely attend and happy to contribute with any wanted IndieWeb knowledge ? (twitter.com/_/status/836973111539036160)
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petermolnar oh dear
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petermolnar careful there, voxpelli
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Zegnat Oh, end of March, terribly tempted to accompany you there voxpelli!
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@mermshaus Tantek Çelik: Starting a modest #IndieWeb #100Days of Positive Posts […] http://tantek.com/2017/020/t3/indieweb-100days-positive-posts-100dopp (twitter.com/_/status/836974381075206144)
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petermolnar I actually went to https://ind.ie/archive/summit/ and met some interesting people, but never, ever saw anything actual coming into existence that was "announced" there (not just the @aral stuff)
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Loqi Indie Tech Summit
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petermolnar so I'd recommend to go to and leave from Decent without expectations
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voxpelli petermolnar: I'm just going because it's a decentralized meetup here in Malmö and feels like the work I do should be represented there
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petermolnar I completely agree with that
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Zegnat couldn’t you have announced IndieWeb stuff at the Indie Tech Summit, petermolnar? Then something would have come out of it
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petermolnar I wasn't in indieweb back then yet
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petermolnar and since, @aral blocked me (as well)
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[eddie] #POSSEallTheThings http://eddiehinkle.com/indieweb/ my IndieWeb profile page content, with Syndication link to my IndieWeb profile. ?
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Loqi Indieweb
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aaronpk hah awesome
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tantek what is OSCAR?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "OSCAR" yet. Would you like to create it?
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tantek what is AIM?
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Loqi AIM is AOL Instant Messenger https://indieweb.org/AIM
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tantek what is WhatsApp
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Loqi WhatsApp is a proprietary mobile messaging application and is owned by Facebook https://indieweb.org/WhatsApp
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tantek what is Oculus
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Oculus" yet. Would you like to create it?
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petermolnar will resist to say Oscar is the chauffeur
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tantek catches up on today's logs
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Zegnat I don’t think Oculus is of any value to be added to the wiki. The Oculus Rift is one of the two major PC players in VR gaming headsets right now, and they were bought by Facebook because Facebook VR (???)
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tantek what is VR?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "VR" yet. Would you like to create it?
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tantek Zegnat, fair
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tantek until someone starts posting VR content on their site
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Zegnat VR is Virtual Reality, usually this means blocking your sight for true reality and showing something different.
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Loqi ok
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Zegnat A global definition of VR should be fine.
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tantek lol
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aaronpk TIL you can't change your twitter username when your account is suspended
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tantek VR << [[Oculus Rift]]
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Loqi ok, I added "[[Oculus Rift]]" to the "See Also" section of /VR
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tantek aaronpk -> Twitter#Issues
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Zegnat The other major PC VR headset:
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Zegnat VR << [[HTC Vive]]
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Loqi ok, I added "[[HTC Vive]]" to the "See Also" section of /VR
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aaronpk and now getting a 500 internal server error trying to update the website
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aaronpk on twitter
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tantek 500s on silos / services are worth screenshots IMO
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tantek again, helps to dispell all the myths about uptime, reliability etc.
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tantek which I hear all too often as why people "just" depend on silos instead of using their own domain, website etc.
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dgold tantek: its a search for a mythical ease of use
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tantek though related, I think ease of use is different from dependability
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dgold tantek: I think its the same wellspring.
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dgold I hear people all the time saying they 'just' want something that 'just works'
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dgold then they leap through hoops to make the silos work like you wouldn't believe
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snarfed1 re uptime, shades of gray are also important
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snarfed1 nothing has 100% uptime, but the differences btw e.g. 99.9%, 99.0%, and 90% are real and meaningful
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aaronpk the differences in disclosure and handling of downtime are important too
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snarfed1 sure!
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snarfed1 as a good example, both twitter and woodwind are down and return errors sometimes, but they clearly have *qualitatively* different uptime and reliability :P
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tantek snarfed, the low reliability (high downtime, high latency, high error rate) of Twitter in 2009 is what pushed me over the edge to DIY and (re)build my own posting support with POSSE to Twitter etc.
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snarfed1 tantek: understood!
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[chrisaldrich] Wikipedia has a nice chart on what the percentages mean in hours/minutes/seconds per year/month/week/day https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_availability
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tantek yeah no more 5 nines for AWS
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[eddie] #TrueWords
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bear ugh - the pain that is involved to move from 2 9's to 3 9's
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[cleverdevil] Hope to see some of you there ?
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[cleverdevil] On the plane up to Portland for tonight's Homebrew Website Club at the DreamHost offices,
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aaronpk [cleverdevil]: \o/ you should tweet that so I can RT it!
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tantek whoa awesome cleverdevil!
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tantek cleverdevil++
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Loqi cleverdevil has 8 karma in this channel (9 overall)
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[cleverdevil] Good idea ?
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tantek anyone understand this French thread about indiewebcamp? https://twitter.com/mazenovi/status/834029660690403328
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@mazenovi @aeris22 de plus le selfhosting se perfectionne avec @yunohost ou @indiewebcamp ne pas miner leurs intentions pourrait aussi être un plan (twitter.com/_/status/834029660690403328)
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@cleverdevil On the plane to Portland for tonight's Homebrew Website Club at the @DreamHost offices. Hope to see you there! #IndieWeb #HBWC (twitter.com/_/status/837019191546941445)
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Zegnat You can ask one of the guys from HWC Brussels to look into it, tantek. Though neither seem to be in this channel right now :(
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[chrisaldrich] tantek: It looks like a blogpost about Free Software, but with the caveat that free software does have "costs". the next tweet is that self-hosting and indieweb can be a solution, with the reply that they too can have costs. (To me it looks like middling dev philosophy that nothing good ever comes easy...)
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[chrisaldrich] the tail end of the conversation is general grousing...
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[chrisaldrich] My French isn't great, but should give at least an idea of what they're saying.
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[keithjgrant] https://twitter.com/keithjgrant/status/837026473307406336
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@keithjgrant @cleverdevil @DreamHost in reply to a post on https://twitter.com Also, congratulations, these are the first replies to twitter… http://keithjgrant.com/replies/2017/03/71084/ (twitter.com/_/status/837026473307406336)
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[keithjgrant] Looks like I've got a little extra metadata in the e-content there, but the extension is working and stable!
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[chrisaldrich] I think their conversation boils down to the software question of "How Free is Free?" and does it really make us more "Free" (in the freedom sense.)
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tantek or which free(s) are you optimizing for? money? time? space? choice?
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GWG Afternoon
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[chrisaldrich] afternoon GWG
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[cleverdevil] Whew. Landed and happily settled in at DreamHost PDX.
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tantek wow instagram is getting mad fast at striking down reported spam. just reported an account as spam and it was taken down within minutes!
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tantek I don't know if that's because they're improving in general or if I've somehow acquired a high(er) reputation for spam reporting (so they fast track my reports)
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tantek what is report
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "report" yet. Would you like to create it?
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tantek report is [[report abuse]]
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Loqi ok
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aaronpk [cleverdevil]: awesome! i was thinking about heading downtown a bit earlier and grabbing a happy hour drink nearby if you're interested
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[cleverdevil] I'm down for that!
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[cleverdevil] I need to walk next door and check into my hotel at some point before the meetup.
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aaronpk awesome! /me takes it to #indieweb-chat
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@ChrisAldrich Time for the quarterly update of my Twitter archive http://boffosocko.com/twitter/ How you can do it http://boffosocko.com/2016/12/05/how-to-own-display-your-twitter-archive-on-your-website-in-under-10-minutes/ #Indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/837069790518792192)
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Loqi [indieweb] "Time for the quarterly update of my Twitter archive http://boffosocko.com/twitter/ How you can do it http://boffosocko.com/2016/12/05/how-to-own-display-your-twitter-archive-on-your-website-in-under-10-minutes/ #Indieweb" by Chris Aldrich on 2017-03-01 http://stream.boffosocko.com/2017/time-for-the-quarterly-update-of-my-twitter-archive-twitter
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Loqi [indieweb] "Comment on How to Own & Display Your Twitter Archive on Your Website in Under 10 Minutes by Chris Aldrich" by Chris Aldrich on 2017-03-01 http://boffosocko.com/2016/12/05/how-to-own-display-your-twitter-archive-on-your-website-in-under-10-minutes/#comment-34021
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@manton2 Excited to be in Portland tonight for Homebrew Website Club! Details here: https://indieweb.org/events/2017-03-01-homebrew-website-club (twitter.com/_/status/837079936129200130)
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GWG I forgot, it is an HWC night
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