#indieweb 2017-07-16

2017-07-16 UTC
[miklb] joined the channel
#
[miklb]
ooh. ScalaWilliam silo.pub has support for creating GH issues, might be able to use micropub to create an issue while creating the entry https://silo.pub/developers#vocab-github
leg joined the channel
#
TheGillies
irc template should input an id on a tag so people can #link-to-id in url for rel=me
tantek joined the channel
#
aaronpk
good idea
#
Loqi
thegillies has 4 karma in this channel (35 overall)
snarfed, tantek, j12t, eli_oat, [miklb], ScalaWilliam, wolftune, ScalaWIlliam_, friedcell and awolf joined the channel
#
tantek
Does anyone here have a "donate" or "donations" link / page on their site? (in UI and functionality - different from just having a /pay or /payment page)
awolf and gRegorLove joined the channel
#
aaronpk
I have a "tip jar" link on one article https://aaronparecki.com/oauth-2-simplified/
#
Loqi
[Aaron Parecki] OAuth 2 Simplified
#
aaronpk
It links to https://aaronparecki.com/tip/ which is different from my payment page
#
Loqi
[Aaron Parecki] Tip Jar
[jeremycherfas] joined the channel
#
[jeremycherfas]
I don't suppose it is possible to get a feed of the people I follow on Instagram without the adverts and in chronological order?
#
prtksxna
[jeremycherfas]: I think granary will give you all the data you need
#
[jeremycherfas]
Thanks. I'll look into that.
#
TheGillies
Have you guys thought of creating indieweb in a box that provides all the backend indieweb services. Then people can be free to create whatever front end they want?
#
TheGillies
And still be indie compliant
#
KartikPrabhu
TheGillies: there are many "backends" that do that for example Known
#
KartikPrabhu
or Wordpress withplugins
#
TheGillies
Ah. Yeah good point I guess I could just link to known for webmentions etc
[miklb] joined the channel
#
TheGillies
I'm more talking about static sites
#
TheGillies
Since that's what I usually build
#
TheGillies
They don't have ability for webhooks and such
#
[miklb]
The IndieWeb WordPress plugin has an installer to add the necessary plugins, there is discussion on how to improve that experience
#
TheGillies
That's awesomeness for the people who use WordPress
#
[miklb]
ongoing discussions
#
TheGillies
Which I hope never to be :p
#
KartikPrabhu
TheGillies: there are indieweb compatible things for static sites too.
drewinthehead joined the channel
#
TheGillies
What do you mean? Like known? Or other projects?
#
KartikPrabhu
what is static?
#
Loqi
A static site is a website that is served by a web server directly from the file system https://indieweb.org/static
#
KartikPrabhu
what is jekyll
#
Loqi
Jekyll is Ruby software that helps you create "Simple, blog-aware, static sites" suitable for static domain hosting https://indieweb.org/Jekyll
#
KartikPrabhu
I am sure there are more
#
[miklb]
what is hugo
#
Loqi
Hugo is a static site generator written in Go https://indieweb.org/hugo
[chrisaldrich] joined the channel
#
[chrisaldrich]
jeremycherfas I think that https://instagram-atom.appspot.com might also output this kind of feed for you.
j12t and sl007 joined the channel
#
sl007
hello, world
#
sl007
security issue: Shouldn't the W3C demand `https` from any official WHOIS service ? E.g. http://whois.nic.me has NO https …
#
sl007
Or the IANA or whoever is responsible ..
j12t, amz3`` and barpthewire joined the channel
#
Zegnat
sl007 aren't whois records basically public knowledge? Does public knowledge require an encryption layer?
#
Zegnat
Also: good morning IndieWeb!
#
sl007
Zegnat : The problem here is that when a domain request would be submitted and somebody sniffs it, they know about our desire for a domain and could park it.
#
sl007
it is not about content but about request
#
sl007
Zegnat : Not sure about the english term - "domain snatching" ?
#
Zegnat
Sure. But you could just use something like command line nslookup, right?
#
Zegnat
If nslookup gives you NXDOMAIN the domain is probably free, good enough cursory check. And this goes via your DNS provider, which you already seem to trust as you are using them to tell you what server goes with what domain.
#
Zegnat
brb, breakfast
jeremycherfas joined the channel
#
jeremycherfas
Good morning Indieweb
#
sl007
Zegnat But both can be entirely different. Whois finds the owner of the IP addresses (ARIN). Nslookup
#
sl007
queries DNS for the associated domain name. And there should be a possibility (not must) to query both secure.
#
Loqi
[[chrisaldrich]] jeremycherfas I think that https://instagram-atom.appspot.com might also output this kind of feed for you.
#
Loqi
Set my photos free
#
Loqi
snarfed has 278 karma in this channel (290 overall)
#
Zegnat
sl007, but if you are afraid of squatters grabbing the domain before you, all you are interested in is if a domain is free. nslookup is *almost* as good at checking that as whois. Though I agree whois over HTPS would be nice.
#
Zegnat
jeremycherfas nice! Follow all the people where you want to follow them :D
catsup and sketchess joined the channel
#
sketchess
Good morning Loqi.
#
sketchess
Good morning Indieweb.
catsup and j12t joined the channel
#
jeremycherfas
Zegnat: I suppose Woodwind would let me like direct from the feed, but that’s too much for me now.
#
sketchess
I found your 'appear' link and tried the other service with my browser, Zegnat. Compared to jitsy it is not my first choice for HWC. Firefox and jitsi go better together.
Pierre-O and KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
Zegnat
sketchess how so? I use Firefox exclusively for WebRTC stuff and appear.in works as easily for me as jitsi meet does
#
Zegnat
jeremycherfas, sometimes consuming is the main goal by itself. I definitely consume a lot more media than I actively interact with
#
jeremycherfas
Zegnat: Oh, for sure. In IG I definitely look at far more photos than I like, and I like far more than I comment on. So that friction really isn’t an issue.
sketchess joined the channel
#
sketchess
I do not know why it restarts as soon as I touch something. I can not really use it, not even mute or unmute, Zegnat. And even if I gave permission to microphone and camera it acts odd.
#
Zegnat
Can you try in an anonymous browser window, sketchess?
#
sketchess
Please explain a bit further, I am not sure if I am on the right track of understanding.
#
sketchess
What do you mean by 'anonymous'?
#
sketchess
gives it another shot
#
sketchess
-.- at least it lets me mute the microphone this time without througing me out. Most buttons are dead, Zegnat.
#
Zegnat
opens firefox to see what it is called
#
Zegnat
“private window” is what Firefox calls it. That’s what I use for all the WebRTC stuff. Can’t tell you where it is in your menu, as you are on Windows and I am not
#
sketchess
Display is half cut of, too. Hmmm.
j12t joined the channel
#
sketchess
How is your experience with jitsi so far?
#
sketchess
tries private window mode
#
Zegnat
Jitsi’s camera view was weird once we got multiple people in there, and it seemed to really stress some CPUs (i.e. petermolnar’s)
#
Zegnat
So for our “photo” moment we switched to appear.in, and that made a difference both in quality and display
#
sketchess
Don't saw both in action yet.
#
sketchess
Woah. What a difference.... o.O
#
sketchess
checks the buttons
#
Zegnat
It does seem like the US guys are having a good time with Hangouts, so we might try that at some point. Maybe I am just inherently biased against Google.
#
sketchess
it still just let me mute audio and I still have half of the buttons below, but everything is on place now
#
sketchess
hah, I could create a room now, hahahaha.... that works too
#
Loqi
sketchess: lol
#
sketchess
-.- it throughs everything around again..... looks like I lost privat mode on the way then
#
sketchess
videyo was the best one so far for me
#
Zegnat
That’s client software though. The idea is not to require people to install software. Else sknebel and I would have been pushing mumble
#
sketchess
aha
#
sketchess
to google you will not get me back either tihihihihi
#
Zegnat
appear.in isn’t perfect either. It had the same issue as talky where not everyone in the call would be able to connect to eachother. (Especially Lukas and I.)
#
Zegnat
So if you know any better platforms for online video conferencing, do let us know and we can give it a try!
#
sketchess
I will be fine with appear + private mode. We will not get harmed by no camera access. ;)
#
Zegnat
I have my camera turned off almost always, to keep my internet costs down. So no problems there.
#
sketchess
And I am a shy person anyway, hahahah.
#
sketchess
Will the service be charged?
#
Zegnat
I am on a mobile data plan, so basically every MB is sacred
#
sketchess
ok, so that means appear is free to use
#
Zegnat
Yes, everything we discuss is free to use
#
Zegnat
Just your own internet costs apply, and mine are… high
gigitux joined the channel
#
sketchess
hmmm, looks like most services require to download something or at least making an account. interesting
#
sketchess
Had you to register for appear or jitsi, Zegnat?
#
sketchess
to keep the room
#
sketchess
ah, that's how it works (jitsi).... it's like a Demo^^
#
Zegnat
sketchess, I had no reason to register the room on my name, so no, I have not registered anywhere
#
sketchess
I see why you prefer appear.in, Zegnat. Ok.
#
sketchess
yeah not requested
#
sketchess
Didn't saw any other like the both so far.
j12t joined the channel
#
petermolnar
what is mumble?
#
Loqi
Mumble is an open-source voice chat platform https://indieweb.org/Mumble
#
petermolnar
:sigh: mumble download button is js...
#
petermolnar
Zegnat if mumble is simple voip, why not linphone?
#
petermolnar
although I'm uncertain if linphone knows confcals
gigitux joined the channel
#
petermolnar
ok, it's not a simple voip client for certain
#
petermolnar
forget it
#
petermolnar
(linphone)
#
petermolnar
so for me, mumble would be fine
#
sketchess
I would not mind to install something. *thought
#
petermolnar
a long while ago I thought I'll be a webrtc advocate, but it's been weird and - probably due to codecs and hd/fhd webcam resolutions - way too cpu insensive
#
petermolnar
I'm slowly realizing I'd rather go back to qvga res and the old skype, just please someone get it working easily, reliably and without burning down or drainig the battery in 1 hour of a laptop
#
Zegnat
I imagine clients should be able to let the user pick at what bitrate they want to push their webcam right? They just don’t allow for it most of the time, defaulting to “best possible”, which is both heavy on encoding (CPU) and bandwidth
#
petermolnar
they should, just noone bothers doing it, since everybody wants the best resolution!
#
petermolnar
battery life, meh
#
sketchess
Did you use vidyo yet, petermolnar?
#
petermolnar
yes, I did
#
petermolnar
surprisingly pleasant experience
#
sketchess
you were faster ;)
#
sketchess
for me better than skype ten times
#
Zegnat
I too was surprised by Vidyo. Loads of bandwidth settings available too, which I appreciated a lot. But Vidyo isn’t really consumer software.
#
sketchess
why not?
#
sketchess
only thing that bothered me that it automactically wants to start when pc gets turned on
#
Zegnat
Vidyo is enterprise software, AFAIK. It probably cost Mozilla a non-insubstantial sum to get all their conference rooms outfitted. I don’t believe we can set-up a Vidyo conference for IndieWeb just at the snap of our fingers.
#
sketchess
how pity
#
sketchess
hmmmm what about good old chat software.... wasn't it later possible to do it with ones like msn or icq or so?
#
Zegnat
Sure, that’s what petermolnar means with wanting the old Skype back ;)
#
sketchess
I like the 'old skypes' way better than the new ones. grrrrr they changed it once again. It tries to force me into google or microsoft accouts now.... no thank you, I rather die.
#
Zegnat
IndieAdvertisement: https://daringfireball.net/2017/07/df_display_ads - I hope Gruber succeeds on that model
#
sketchess
has no own skype, let the account deleted 5 years ago ;)
#
sketchess
I do not even have to watch youtube videos into youtube anymore. xD No Silos for me.
#
sketchess
having a beark
j12t and sketchess joined the channel
#
sketchess
re
#
sketchess
Huh, appear does have a short cut to mute or unmute audio, but does not have any for video. How odd.^^
#
Zegnat
For muting and unmuting yourself? That might be their way of supporting push-to-talk
#
sketchess
Well now I have at least a letter, if the buttons disappear. *lol*
snarfed, j12t, tantek, Pierre-O, wolftune, gigitux, [eddie] and sketchess joined the channel
#
petermolnar
that article of [chrisaldrich] got me thinking that though posts are definitely a problem for filter bubble algorithms maybe events are just as much of a problem, yet event cross-posting is niche even within the indieweb community; I'm guessing mostly because of the lack of tools
#
petermolnar
none of the WordPress event plugins I know of have capabilities to do this, for example
#
@scott_gruber
@indiewebcamp are web mentions appropriate for numerous content types like articles, books, recipes and pages, or primarily for blogs?
(twtr.io/1TyZR3G9umQ)
j12t joined the channel
#
@petermolnar
@scott_gruber @indiewebcamp #webmention is not restricted to content types, it's only a notification and… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/886598952044433408
(twtr.io/1Ty_sVSPVGo)
#
@petermolnar
@scott_gruber @indiewebcamp also see http://indieweb.org/post_type#Kinds_of_Posts for current solutions, including RSVPs, recepies, reads, checkins, etc.
(twtr.io/1Ty_xGrFXcb)
#
@scott_gruber
@indiewebcamp Sending a Webmention is not limited to blog posts & can be used for additional kinds of content & res… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/886599368236650497
(twtr.io/1Tya1QezJUH)
snarfed joined the channel
j12t, davidmead, wolftune and [eddie] joined the channel
#
sketchess
see ya around
[miklb] joined the channel
#
Loqi
[Drew McLellan] Implementing Webmentions
deep-book-gk_ and wolftune joined the channel
#
@sl007
@drewm webmention, websub and micropub belong to the building blocks of http://indieweb.org - join us https://indieweb.org/2017/Dortmund ? CAMPFIRE
(twtr.io/1TyoK4VmwCp)
davidmead, wolftune, sl007, gRegorLove, j12t and tantek joined the channel
#
Loqi
[superfeedr] "Virtual HWC Europe" by Jeremy Cherfas on 2017-07-12 https://stream.jeremycherfas.net/2017/virtual-hwc-europe
[miklb] and [eddie] joined the channel
#
Loqi
[superfeedr] "Hi Chris, I unfortunately must correct my opinion about my solution of "having read posts" by means of google books iframes - these posts load" by Andreas Petersell on 2017-07-16 http://www.petersell.com/2017/hi-chris-i-unfortunately-must-correct-my-opinion-about-my
#
Zegnat
Thank you superfeedr, but that event has gone.
tantek, leg, KartikPrabhu, j12t and sl007 joined the channel
#
TheGillies
what's a good tool for sending webmentions?
#
TheGillies
only one tool under tools on webmention wiki page hrm.
#
[miklb]
that’s a little trickier with static sites as the post needs to exist before the mention can be sent
#
Zegnat
telegraph is good
#
Zegnat
What is telegraph?
#
Loqi
Telegraph is an open source API and service for sending webmentions, part of the p3k suite https://indieweb.org/Telegraph
#
[miklb]
when I ran Jekyll, used a Rake task to send the mention after the build/deploy
#
Zegnat
Telegraph lets you send Webmentions for any page. Though I am unsure if it has an API or if you must du it manually
#
TheGillies
I want to do it manually
#
TheGillies
all my content is hand crafted. I don't even use a static site generator like jekyll
#
aaronpk
there are some command line tools
#
aaronpk
the hardest part is finding the webmention endpoint, other than that it's just a POST request
#
TheGillies
telegraph looks like what I'm looking for
#
TheGillies
I like telegraph because it's hosted. I'm avoiding code on purpose heh
j12t joined the channel
#
petermolnar
or just use cURL
#
Zegnat
I have used Telegraph too, when I wanted to send multiple webmentions at once. Else I use cURL.
davidmead joined the channel
#
TheGillies
anyone have a minimal snippet of webmention post that includes requisite fields to display properly? like username avatar etc?
#
TheGillies
Looking at linked posts non of that is in the h-entry itself yet still manages to propagate
#
TheGillies
none of that*
#
aaronpk
like to receive comments?
#
TheGillies
to send comments
#
TheGillies
I'm crafting a like to someone
#
TheGillies
but it's not showing up
#
aaronpk
oh, you can try testing with https://webmention.rocks to see at least whether you're sending it correctly
#
Zegnat
Just example HTML for a like? https://licit.li/592dbd6c53caa
#
TheGillies
aaronpk: which test #?
#
TheGillies
Zegnat: thnx
#
aaronpk
any of them will work for this purpose
#
aaronpk
they're actually more about testing whether your webmention client can find the webmention endpoint correctly, but if you're sending via telegraph it does that all for you
#
TheGillies
the problem is my markup
#
TheGillies
your site accepts it, but it looks like shite because it's just an empty avatar with no text anywhere lol
#
@pgbovine
I feel really old. I just learned that this was a thing https://indieweb.org -- I had just assumed everyone did this
(twtr.io/1Tz5qu26rA3)
#
aaronpk
hmm, i don't think we have a validator specifically for these types of posts
#
aaronpk
https://indiewebify.me/validate-h-entry/ is close but won't check for the "u-like-of" property
#
TheGillies
most of my mentions are going to be likes since I can't be bothered to write a proper post
#
Zegnat
Does XRay do likes, aaronpk? That might be the nicest testing tool for how your markup is parsed
#
aaronpk
yeah it'll parse likes. it won't tel you waht's wrong but at least it's a bit easier to test that way
#
aaronpk
tho it'll cache what's at the URL so you'll have to enter the HTML into the box if you're making changes quickly https://xray.p3k.io/
#
Zegnat
TheGillies: try your markup (or link to post) here http://xray.p3k.io/
#
Zegnat
Aah, alright, do what aaronpk says and don’t use link :p
davidmead, snarfed, snarfed1, botka1 and [miklb] joined the channel
wolftune, [kevinmarks], matthewtrask, MylesBraithwaite, gigitux, ScalaWilliam, snarfed and AngeloGladding joined the channel
#
Loqi
[superfeedr] "Hi Chris, I unfortunately must correct my opinion about my solution of "having read posts" by means of google books iframes - these posts load" by Andreas Petersell on 2017-07-16 http://petersell.com/2017/hi-chris-i-unfortunately-must-correct-my-opinion-about-my