#indieweb 2017-09-12

2017-09-12 UTC
KevinMarks and KevinMarks_ joined the channel
#
tantek
lol - I suppose that's about the right level of snark for a tweet reply
#
aaronpk
Oh good twitter search is still working *whew*
#
tantek
kevinmarks, here's the tweet to reply to as well if you want to thread: https://twitter.com/WIRED/status/906276009154052096
#
@WIRED
"There is no straightforward technical solution to the problem of platform monopolies." http://wrd.cm/2gOrLKs
(twitter.com/_/status/906276009154052096)
KevinMarks and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
@eevee
@kevinmarks cool how this internet website is reachable despite being its own thing independent of all the others
(twitter.com/_/status/907409403258691586)
renem, eli_oat, KevinMarks, leg, kapowaz, wolftune, tantek, rrix, sl007, Breadbasket_, DanC, barpthewire, loicm and jihaisse joined the channel
#
@acegiak
@briecode People involved with #indieweb stuff are kind of working some of that stuff out slowly?
(twitter.com/_/status/907501466889228288)
HTTP_____GK1wmSU joined the channel
#
Ruxton
I have some edits to clean them up sometime this week that ill contribute, and see what you think of those
#
Ruxton
stupid hit up and enter without paying attention
#
@acegiak
@gritfish @briecode Isn't it currently running on seed funding? Gosh I'm so sceptical, aren't I? I just want to be in the indieweb future already.
(twitter.com/_/status/907502755891232768)
#
@gritfish
@acegiak @briecode indieweb seems like... IFTTT and RSS feed stuff? Am I understanding this?
(twitter.com/_/status/907505048023744512)
HTTP_____GK1wmSU, [pfefferle], friedcell and Pierre-O joined the channel
#
[pfefferle]
good morning
#
Loqi
good morning
friedcell, KevinMarks, Pierre-O and Pierre-O1 joined the channel
#
@sl007
@acegiak @briecode ? why slowly - most is already W3C recommendation "micropub, websub, webmention" etc. + indieauth, mf2 + attend https://indieweb.org/events
(twitter.com/_/status/907528414277640193)
Pierre-O and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
@acegiak
@gritfish @briecode Replace corporately owned and hosted social networks with interlinked personally owned websites providing the same functionality
(twitter.com/_/status/907507852914286592)
KevinMarks, Rev_Illo and jeremycherfas joined the channel
#
@sl007
@ismail_kupeli Weil wir Technik und Philosophie nicht trennen können, bin ich gespannt auf https://indieweb.org/2017/Istanbul
(twitter.com/_/status/907550173353705472)
#
@kevinmarks
Decentralized systems are antifragile, they degrade a bit over time, rather than vanishing overnight http://epeus.blogspot.com/2012/12/the-antifragility-of-web.html #indieweb
(twitter.com/_/status/907551389739474944)
#
Loqi
[superfeedr] "Decentralized systems are antifragile, they degrade a bit over time, rather than vanishing overnight http://epeus.blogspot.com/2012/12/the-antifragility-of-web.html #indieweb" by Kevin Marks on 2017-09-12 http://known.kevinmarks.com/2017/decentralized-systems-are-antifragile-they-degrade-a-bit-over-time
Pierre-O, friedcell1, KevinMarks and MylesBraithwaite joined the channel
KevinMarks, [pfefferle], jeremycherfas and barpthewire joined the channel
#
jeremycherfas
G;day IndieWeb
glennjones, eli_oat, dominik_ and snarfed joined the channel
#
sebsel
lol, I like that indie-reacji can be any emoji, like [barryf]'s reacji to my post, and it just works :) https://barryfrost.com/2017/09/things-3
#
Loqi
[Barry Frost] ?
sl007 joined the channel
#
Zegnat
IndieWeb: “it just works” - sebsel
#
sebsel
remembers the HOURS that went into the rainbowflag-emoji without a real happy ending
#
Zegnat
Wait for Apple’s animated poop emoji to mess it all up again.
#
aaronpk
Oh gosh yeah how's that going to work
#
Zegnat
Maybe they add another modifier codebyte infront of the emoji to trigger animation. That would be a very clean way. And easy to ignore if your application doesn’t want to handle them and just display statics
#
Zegnat
But probably will not be a logical as that? :(
#
aaronpk
We'll find out soon
#
snarfed
aww sebsel you mean https://github.com/snarfed/granary/pull/108 ? it worked though! right?
#
Loqi
[sebsel] #108 add facebook pride reacji
#
sebsel
snarfed oh yes, it worked! I think the sad thing I remembered was that Facebook ditched the function after a few weeks. But indie-reacji still works for the rainbowflag for me!
#
sebsel
Next year it might come back :)
[kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
@elongreen
Twitter is wonderful in many ways, but as a means to get your stories read, rather useless. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJhaZbBUEAAdrU3.jpg
(twitter.com/_/status/907574723265138689)
#
petermolnar
welp, my solution is simple: ignore emoji. It'll pass. It has to.
#
Zegnat
It is a little weird how that rainbowflag availability is gatekept by Facebook. I couldn’t use it at Pride this last weekend :(
#
petermolnar
#ownyourrainbowemoji
#
schmarty
good morning, indieweb!
#
Loqi
schmarty: sknebel left you a message 4 days, 16 hours ago: we talked about interview streaming, this (while still under development) could be interesting: https://github.com/getfireside/fireside / https://dev.fr.sd/ streams low-quality, records high-quality in local browser and merges both sides afterwards
#
schmarty
sknebel: thanks for the link! looks very interesting!
vivus joined the channel
#
vivus
Is this the channel for discussing decentralized alternatives to social-media companies, etc. ?
#
schmarty
what is the indieweb?
#
Loqi
The IndieWeb is about owning your domain, using it as your primary identity to publish on your own site (optionally syndicate elsewhere), and owning your data https://indieweb.org/IndieWeb
#
sebsel
Yes and no, this is the channel to discuss IndieWeb, which can be described as an decentralized alternative to social-media companies :)
#
vivus
why has adoption of decentralized alternatives been so lacklustre ?
#
schmarty
vivus: there is a channel focused on more generalized discussion of (re-)decentralization at #redecentralize
#
vivus
schmarty: is that the correct name? it's empty
#
schmarty
oh no, my bad. it is a channel on matrix rather than an IRC room. #redecentralize:matrix.org
adactio joined the channel
#
vivus
I was thinking of getting Matrix. Perhaps the time has arrived
#
petermolnar
vivus matrix isn't a silver bullet either :)
#
vivus
well it's a better option to a centralized chat platform like slack, no?
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
petermolnar
good question - since it's quite hard to set up your own server instance; once that is out of reach most are going to be using a centralised hub anyway with a simple client setup
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
petermolnar
so... in some terms, yes, because in theory, everyone is free to set their own server up
#
petermolnar
in reality see mastodon
#
petermolnar
indieweb approached from a view: we believe the more diverse the web the better, so we only try to interconnect existing stuff
#
petermolnar
eg. make websites talk to eachother, like pingbacks did
#
vivus
I have no issue using a semi-decentralized option where there is a community working in tandem. Slack is not that. It doesn't even want to be a purveyor of OSS
#
petermolnar
I never said slack is better
#
petermolnar
but then you have xmpp
#
petermolnar
and I still don't completely get what matrix has over xmpp and/or sip and voip
#
petermolnar
apart from sitting on HTTP instead of semi-forgotten protocols
#
petermolnar
so, with indieweb, your handle, your main online personality is your domain and your website
#
petermolnar
which is probably the most essential difference
Kevinmarks1 and Pierre-O joined the channel
#
vivus
why has adoption of something like h-card been so low? do people not have interest to use it?
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
petermolnar
that I don't know. Google has a tendency to come up with their own (NIL?) then sunset it (see: https://aaronparecki.com/2016/12/17/8/owning-my-reviews ), there is Dublin Core and a few others as well, but in reality, I have no idea
#
Loqi
[Aaron Parecki] Why Microformats? Owning My Reviews
#
aaronpk
people don't tend to care about formats unless there is a concrete use case for them. this can take the form of "SEO" where people will implement whatever google says they will index, or facebook/twitter's meta tags so that links will look good when shared on facebook/twitter
#
aaronpk
in indieweb terms, we implement protocols like h-card and h-entry so that we can comment on each others' sites and the comments look like more than just plain links. they can show the author name and photo and such.
tantek joined the channel
#
petermolnar
oh come on
#
Loqi
ok, I added "https://fillmem.com/post/fast-secured-and-free-static-site/" to the "See Also" section of /Getting_Started
#
[kevinmarks]
Talking of opaque syntax with > in
#
petermolnar
[kevinmarks] that should be either >, >> or <<<
#
petermolnar
but << doesn't make sense
#
Loqi
Sorry, I couldn't find a page named "but" or similar
#
tantek
petermolnar - is that really a good reference for "Getting Started"? Seems very developer centric
#
petermolnar
sorry, Loqi
#
tantek
it even starts with the disclaimer accordingly: "Note: Unless you’re a developer or you want to learn how to do sites, my first advice is to avoid to build your own static site. "
#
tantek
/Getting_Started really should be focused on at least Generation 2 by now, and developer-specific stuff should get moved to a separate page
#
petermolnar
fair point
#
petermolnar
splitting /Getting_Started is a good idea
#
tantek
even many developers do not want to hassle with installing their own software for this stuff
#
tantek
much less "Setup the development environment" (!!!) (actual heading from the article)
#
petermolnar
eg. "Fast, simple, clickthrough? Goto X" "developer, CLI, gory details? Goto Y
#
tantek
petermolnar: no, "Fast, simple, clickthrough" should just be there, in-line
#
tantek
no extra nav
#
petermolnar
need to go now, but I'll look into splitting it
#
tantek
developers know enough and are patient enough to do the extra nav and find more details
#
tantek
petermolnar: no, not splitting. forking all the dev-specific stuff to a separate page
#
tantek
seems similar but it's a matter of perspective
#
tantek
this is a bit meta so I'll go there
jmelesky joined the channel
#
vivus
can h-card be seen as an alternative to linkedin?
#
tantek
vivus, more like h-resume, but yeah
wolftune and snarfed joined the channel
#
vivus
tantek: why h-resume? I was thinking that for general networking between professionals, you keep your h-card (and interoperable between your phone-contacts, vcards, etc.) and when you want to apply for a job, you have h-resume
#
vivus
2 million euros is a drop in the ocean for FB
#
tantek
vivus because LinkedIn is primarily about building an online resume / professional history profile, and that's what h-resume best represents.
#
tantek
nearly all silos / social media are "for general networking between professionals" - that's not unique to LInkedIn, hence yes, start with using your own site with an h-card for that
#
vivus
valid point
sl007 joined the channel
#
vivus
I don't wish to use h-card to be site-centric. I want to make it mobile phonebook friendly.
#
tantek
wanting to use it for whatever your own purposes -> site-centric which you control
#
tantek
it starts with site-centric, that enables you to expand beyond that to whatever specific use-cases ("mobile phonebook friendly", etc.) that you come up with over time
#
tantek
vivus, speaking of, add yourself to https://indieweb.org/irc-people so your log entries link to your site! https://chat.indieweb.org/2017-09-12#bottom
#
Loqi
[veganstraightedge] h-card-as-a-service
#
vivus
your blog is fascinating tantek
#
Zegnat
That used to be hosted. But I think Shaun might have taken it down because of spam (?)
#
vivus
noted. I'll continue the discussion in #microformats
snarfed, eli_oat1, KartikPrabhu, KevinMarks, dougbeal|mb1, gigitux, gRegorLove and jeremycherfas joined the channel
#
tantek
hey thanks vivus. just trying to publish at least semi-often the things that come to mind. :)
tbbrown, friedcell, wolftune, snarfed, Rev_Illo, [kevinmarks], stevepdp, eli_oat, loicm, barpthewire, JulianFoad[m], KevinMarks_, KevinMarks, Pierre-O, BrAsS_mOnKeY, EmreSoku_ and [cleverdevil] joined the channel
#
[cleverdevil]
!tell aaronpk recently, performing likes/reposts on Quill for Twitter permalinks isn't performing the associated action on Twitter... not sure if this is a Quill thing or a Known thing.
#
Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
EmreSoku_, KartikPrabhu1 and Victorium|BNC joined the channel
#
aaronpk
[cleverdevil]: hmm
#
Loqi
aaronpk: [cleverdevil] left you a message 6 minutes ago: recently, performing likes/reposts on Quill for Twitter permalinks isn't performing the associated action on Twitter... not sure if this is a Quill thing or a Known thing.
#
aaronpk
quill does like/repost things itself if you've configured twitter in Quill
#
[cleverdevil]
Let me double check that I still have that configured.
nikivi joined the channel
#
[cleverdevil]
Yup, that's it, somehow it lost my Twitter connection.
#
aaronpk
strange!
#
aaronpk
hm maybe signed in as a different user? like no-www vs www
#
[cleverdevil]
Who knows, now I will know how to fix it if it happens again ?
JasonO and eli_oat joined the channel