#indieweb 2020-06-03
2020-06-03 UTC
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MrHyde_ jacky: lazybear.io/posts/indeed-git-is-great/
# MrHyde_ trying to make a reply to this one : https://kevq.uk/i-now-know-how-to-use-git
# MrHyde_ [tantek]: havent asked since I've not been there :)
kensp, nickodd, wolftune, marcusr, opal, yar, [tw2113], KartikPrabhu, [fluffy], [LewisCowles], KindOne, seekr, jussi^, markopasha, jeremy, cweiske, [Sadik_Shahadu], gRegorLove and jeremycherfas joined the channel; nickodd left the channel
# Guest67619 Good morning IndieWeb
# Guest67619 I really need to spend the time to understand IRC rather than merely use it.
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# [itsjustk] morning all 🙂
# Guest67619 Morning
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# [LewisCowles] Morning all
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jeremycherfas Morning [LewisCowles]
# [LewisCowles] Morning jeremycherfas
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[KevinMarks] Understand irc how? The protocol or the customs around it?
# [LewisCowles] KevinMarks, if you had awesome links to things from sysops and standards to customs, I wouldn't complain. I literally use slack out of ignorance of IRC, which I can use, and have used, but have never felt familiar with.
# jeremycherfas I have difficulty understanding why I am sometimes GuestNNNNN and sometimes my nickname, and how to switch to my nickname.
# jeremycherfas Yeah, I could go for those too.
# jeremycherfas The error messages I get are very terse, and also completely accurate and helpful.
# jeremycherfas I guess my primary difficulty is how I can be present as a guest without, apparently, having to log on.
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# [LewisCowles] I believe the signed in as you is the client remembering to auth you
# [LewisCowles] `/msg NickServ identify [password] [email]`
# [LewisCowles] should sign you in from who you are instead of GuestNNNNN
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# jeremycherfas Thanks. The client does occasionally forget who I am, and that's part of the mystery.
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@extraface I’ve been studying nonreactivity in buddhism. It’s one of the tactics of the path and also a goal. Today I noticed that Twitter and Facebook are built around literally giving a voice to your reactivity. Blogs were too, but they weren’t as effective. (twitter.com/_/status/1268141616717537280)
# [itsjustk] I'm not 100% sure what you mean by that, but i always thought that it would be cool to have CMS "packages" or distributions as drupal calls them for indieweb enabled sites, modules, theme etc. Or is that not quite what you are asking? 🙂
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# [itsjustk] arrr i failed to realize it was a riposte to the other comments 😳
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# 
Loqi reactions refer to the subset of responses/interactions with a post that are quicker, more impulsive, but still a conscious act, typically a simple UI gesture without writing any content, such as likes (reacji), reposts, bookmarks, or perhaps multiple simple UI gestures, such as selection a text range and posting a quotation of part of a post, or picking a person from a list to post an invitation as a response to seeing an event https://indieweb.org/reaction
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[jgmac1106] I avoid the phrase "giving a voice" "finding" marginalized have a voice, its a matter of removing your boot from their throat
# Loqi reacji is an emoji reaction, the use of a single emoji character in response to a post, introduced as a feature by Slack[1] https://indieweb.org/reacji
# [jgmac1106] why I prefer "owning voice" not sure...have a bunch of reflections on the term. It is a matter that argument got defined as the highest form of intellectual discourse
# [jgmac1106] I am just catching up and reading links now, I may have been a tangeant
# [jgmac1106] yes but in that design be deliberate abotu demographics
# [jgmac1106] ahhh okay
# [jgmac1106] good thread
# [jgmac1106] I misunderstood, apologies, reading the thread now
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[tantek] Aaronpk, this calls into question the entire UX around /reactions
# [jgmac1106] why manton doesn't display them
# [jgmac1106] been watching reactions on Tumblr...there is so little engagment, you see posts with 1,000s of notes but they are just likes...no note at all
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# [jgmac1106] I think the friction of the webmention is a good UX around reactions...I have to do it from my site, own it, invest in the time
# [jgmac1106] not a protocol for friction, friction was the wrong word, as social readers make it just as easy
# [tantek] Reaction << Criticism, thread: https://twitter.com/extraface/status/1268141616717537280
# @extraface I’ve been studying nonreactivity in buddhism. It’s one of the tactics of the path and also a goal. Today I noticed that Twitter and Facebook are built around literally giving a voice to your reactivity. Blogs were too, but they weren’t as effective. (twitter.com/_/status/1268141616717537280)
# Loqi ok, I added "Criticism, thread: https://twitter.com/extraface/status/1268141616717537280" to the "See Also" section of /reactions https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=70182&oldid=46853
# [jgmac1106] I guess its more a bit of cognitive pause, a responsibility, caused by owning the domain
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# [jgmac1106] Nobody leaves a bag of poo on their own door step
# [jgmac1106] I guess it all likes, reposts, and a smap comment: https://indieweb.org/File:TumblrReactionScreenshot2020-06-03_at_8.57.01_AM.png
# [jgmac1106] many reposts though include a snippy comment, that is just tumblr culture...which is so many awesome little niche cultures
# [jgmac1106] I follow a lot unique folks...trying to grab some SFW shots
# [tantek] More, note specifically the mention of blogging: https://twitter.com/extraface/status/1268158826580267010
# @extraface @andrealee_b I left Facebook. I have drastically reduced my Twitter time but it has kicked up in the current moment. I've always thought the reifying of reactive blog writing and commenting was suspect, lol. On the other side, you have to work at cultivating nonreactivity daily. Recommended: (twitter.com/_/status/1268158826580267010)
# [jgmac1106] ahh the interwebz...didn't somebody mess around with a token system, mean having only so many reactions in a day to give?
# [jgmac1106] yeah just trying to think of the model, especially from a bhuddist point of view, goal is to write without the desire or as reaction
# [jgmac1106] other models...
# [jgmac1106] but what if a reader had a pop up after five likes under certain time?
# [jgmac1106] my blog is pretty much reaction free, why I encourage people not to install analytics (if not monetizing). I dont want to write to numbers
# [jgmac1106] reaction free as not many comments...but the reactions and blog comments you see in teacher spaces are always a bit different.
# [jgmac1106] I actually don't have the reaction plugin iinstalled
# [jgmac1106] I do likes on Twitter, but it is pretty m,uch a h/t for poems or toencourage younger scholar and teachers
# [jgmac1106] it is, but isn't the author writes for engagement, reaction drives enagements, analytics measure...just sharing some of my strategies
# [jgmac1106] yeah just explaining how I do it becuase you asked me
# [jgmac1106] I don't own my likes I am saying, let them go by the wayside
# [jgmac1106] no liking poetry and encouraging people, I am cool with...the like is ephemeral for me...do I know I am feeding Twitters machines..yes...but can't be perfect
# [jgmac1106] I also still put stickers on papers and use the reactions in my classes as social presence
# [jgmac1106] reactions can build communities as well
# [jgmac1106] dopamine is fun
# [jgmac1106] when crafting a community of writers, I may have 30 people in the class, reactions also allow me to save time, my biggest personal cost
# [jgmac1106] I have done that but I am also talking reactions in Microsoft teams, or on our cl;ass websites, like Known
# [jgmac1106] I get the authors point a reaction is a craving, a craving goes against fundamental Bhuddist principles
# [jgmac1106] but I think I can react to content in positive ways...and I will fully admit as a teacher I take advantage of the human craving for connection
# [jgmac1106] I am also not vegetarian still, even though I know that is right,
# [jgmac1106] no but you can use reactions to build the community spaces that lead to connections IMO
# [jgmac1106] I still try to do manually h/t mainly because I can search them in plain text and it is a reaxtion I own
# [jgmac1106] folks have called #ds106 cultish....
# [jgmac1106] and the communities on Tumblr aren't cultish but their are quite niche
# [jgmac1106] did you see my screenshot of LinkedIn calling for unsolicited @ mentions?
# [jgmac1106] Found it strange as every other network clamping down on that
# [itsjustk] I've found that if you have built a community through a reactive medium like twitter, it inevitably grows too large to stay there (or at least use it as their daily driver) and so explores other tools to better facilitate that community?
# 
petermolnar "reaction" in this context, is a forced replacement for what your body (feromons), your body language, and your mimics would do to a certain scenario. Most people are not good enough with writing and words to replace them, and in most cases, it's not possible to fully susbtitute for them. That said, I believe they are useless, and a cheap imitation of a reality-feature that doesn't (yet?) exist online.
# [jgmac1106] [itsjustk] we were on G+ which was actually really good community and kinda webmentiony (blogger only). Now just a web ring and an rss planet, and a twitter hashtag, and a facebook group: https://clmoocring.jgregorymcverry.com/
# [jgmac1106] one sec uploading image now
# [jgmac1106] I want the communtiy off our domainand on the clmooc domain but nobody knows who registered it where...gotta track it down
# [itsjustk] oooooo look at that spicey background
# [jgmac1106] that is a gif of the computer model developed to photograph the first black hole
# [itsjustk] amazing!
# [jgmac1106] https://www.jpl.nasa.gov/edu/news/2019/4/19/how-scientists-captured-the-first-image-of-a-black-hole/ the woman who did much of the calculation got flames online for "taking too much credit"
# [itsjustk] arrr yes i remember that 😕
# [jgmac1106] and writing, and art, and music have sucha gravitational force...plus it felt a bit 1990ish, especially tiling the gif...huge waste of resources
# [jgmac1106] this is more chat but if anyone ever needs a postcard just ask about #clmooc anywhere and request and you will get one
# [itsjustk] I would take tiling gifs over full background ads :face_vomiting:
# [jgmac1106] [tantek] images uploaded will edit wiki later need to go help some students
# [jgmac1106] I did add a webmention guestbook to my website but like my old guestbook nobody signed it. commented it out for now
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# [tantek] Ooh I still need to update the /silo-quits intro and instructions
# [tantek] Another one (W3C colleague of mine) https://twitter.com/leoniewatson/status/1268169353956114434
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@LeonieWatson I deactivated my #facebook account months ago because facebook could not be trusted. I've now deleted it because Mark Zuckerberg will not take a stand against racism and violence. (twitter.com/_/status/1268169353956114434)
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# [tantek] A different kind of solo-quit: (more literal?) https://twitter.com/owenresistor/status/1267568422327447552
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@OwenResistor I am proud to announce that as of the end of today, I am no longer a Facebook employee. (twitter.com/_/status/1267568422327447552)
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# [snarfed] sounds like what i did. left only my last POSSEd post to https://snarfed.org/2019-01-08_goodbye-facebook-goodbye-google for a year and change, then recently deleted that post too
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# [jgmac1106] some quick thoughts on Bhuddism and reactions: https://quickthoughts.jgregorymcverry.com/2020/06/03/stuff-i-reposted-or-liked-in-the-last-24-hours
# [jgmac1106] spelling fixed...so wrong to misspell someone's religion
# Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "bio.fm" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "bio.fm is ____", a sentence describing the term)
# Loqi About.me is a homepage hosting silo https://indieweb.org/about.me
# Loqi ok, I added "Alternative: bio.fm" to a brand new "See Also" section of /about.me https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=70187&oldid=69868
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# Loqi [indienews] New post: "Jumping Into Webmentions With NextJS" https://css-tricks.com/jumping-into-webmentions-with-nextjs-or-not/ (from https://aaronparecki.com/2020/06/03/15/)
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# Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "feed fatigue" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "feed fatigue is ____", a sentence describing the term)
# [tantek] Hmm. Wondering if we should document this https://www.instagram.com/p/CA0_G0zDXTr/
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# [KevinMarks] my friend who programs telescopes objected to 'architecture astronomy' as a term of derision, and to astronautics
# [KevinMarks] which is fair comment as those both need successful long term collaboration dealing with real limitations
# [KevinMarks] so can we come up with a better term for abstraction escalation to the point of uselessness?
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# [LewisCowles] [tantek] RE: thoughtfulness, I think encourage editorial pipelines and the process we used to see in papers with spell checking, a11y, etc but also retractions would be wonderful. I've a long list of where I would like to get to. Diagrams, features and accessible content has to be a part of it, and that by nature requires thoughtfulness.
# [LewisCowles] KevinMarks. I Object to Architecture astronomy as a former contract architect I'd often see developers who were ruining products use the term to get out of change. Unfortunately all attempts at anything but steam-rollering them failed.
# [LewisCowles] KevinMarks. I Object to Architecture astronomy as a former contract architect I'd often see developers who were ruining products use the term to get out of change. Unfortunately all attempts at anything but steam-rollering them failed.
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# [LewisCowles] For twitter I feel like their centralisation is the limiting factor to such things in a much more easy to see way than owning our own websites
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# [KevinMarks] Tools for tummlers?
# [LewisCowles] not sure I follow, but after googling tummlers seems to be comedy related.
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# [KevinMarks] See j.mp/tummler
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# [jgmac1106] Hey everyone we are forking Elm City Webmakers into a remote tech camp for teens...It is all passion based from yoru own website
# [jgmac1106] it is passion driven (meaning your goals and interest) and you choose podcasting, video, photo, web desgin and everyone gets coding classes
# [jgmac1106] students are asking for help learning how to organize, and we need mentors, if you have anyone who might be interested in donating a few hours a week please send my contact
# [jgmac1106] involvement and yotuh interest so far is ~90% IBPoc children so would really like Black and Brown mentors with experience or willing to model how they learn with the children, please feel free to share my contact info with anyone in your network
# [jgmac1106] teens just as fired up as anyone...want to learn digital organizing skills not using facebook....every kid hates facebook right now because of their support for Trump on free leash
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# [jgmac1106] ...IBPOC...sorry for education jargon Indigenous Black and People of Color
# [LewisCowles] Ah. [KevinMarks] I was not suggesting hegemonic control or centralisation, which I believe were two of the issues touched upon, nor community moderation, management, catalysts or Troll whispering, although I'm going to read all your links at some point in the future.
# [LewisCowles] Had to google "de haut en bas".
# [LewisCowles] I started writing up a blog post but short-form or long form.. Very hard to do around editorial control. Perhaps another area of my blog to break-out.
# [LewisCowles] By break-out I have an experiment where I've created an area for some posts, which are also listed on my main blog index. At some point I'll need to think about discoverability, but ironically or not, I need to sort out some of my editorial control before doing so.
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