#dev 2017-01-12

2017-01-12 UTC
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tantek.com edited /rsvp (+548) "note "went to " example, "missing " brainstorm with data point, note automated webmention sending in Falcon! (instead of just "plan")" (view diff)
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KartikPrabhu reading up on the micropub spec. it seems "Update" can only be done via a JSON-type request?
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tantek correct
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KartikPrabhu hmmm that is strange. so why support form-encoded at all?
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tantek because it is MUCH easier to implement, and there are plenty of "create only" use cases that benefit from that lower barrier to implementation
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KartikPrabhu as in why should I write code to accept form-encoded for other actions and then also JSON for updates?
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KartikPrabhu hmmm
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tantek IIRC only create accepts form-encoded
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loqi.me created /.blog (+157) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by KevinMarks" (view diff)
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KartikPrabhu the only other actions are "Delete" and "Undelete" which do not need JSON
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tantek thought they did
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KartikPrabhu https://micropub.net/draft/#delete no
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KartikPrabhu you can do it with a POST request and parameters
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aaronpk delete and undelete only pass the URL of the post being deleted so it's trivial to do in both JSON and form-encoded
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aaronpk form-encoded is easier to implement from both the client and server perspective, and there are enough create-only use cases to justify both clients and servers that can only create
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KartikPrabhu hmm it seems if the entry to be Created has nested microformats then JSON needs to be used anyway
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www.boffosocko.com edited /events/2017-01-11-homebrew-website-club (+45) "Virtual quiet writing hour" (view diff)
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aaronpk yeah
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aaronpk i *think* we've reached the right balance between easy-to-get-started and allowing more flexibility once you want to start doing advanced things
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david.shanske.com edited /events/2017-01-11-homebrew-website-club (+34) "/* Where */" (view diff)
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KartikPrabhu possibly, I simply have been out of the micropub loop for quite a while
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KevinMarks Can't you post html with nested microformats?
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david.shanske.com edited /events/2017-01-11-homebrew-website-club (+28) "/* Where */" (view diff)
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aaronpk KevinMarks: that's totally different
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aaronpk sure you can, but you're not gonna get a server to create fancy mf2 objects that it actually understands that way
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aaronpk but if all you care about is getting the mf2 markup to appear on the web page then that's fine
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aaronpk i couldn't create my travel posts that way tho
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KevinMarks Gotcha. It is a way to tunnel mf2 into silos though
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KartikPrabhu just realised that he does not even know how to send JSON as a POST request
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aaronpk haha yeah that's why form-encoded is for the basic stuff :)
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Loqi aaronpk: lol
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tantek Hmm my webmention discovery code is having trouble finding sebsel's endpoint here: https://seblog.nl/2017/01/11/1/homebrew-website-club
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Loqi Homebrew Website Club
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tantek whereas I see it in the source!
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sebsel oh, I see it in pin13's mf2 parser too?
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tantek sebsel wow your site is returning 404 to my server!
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tantek but 200 to my browser!
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sebsel is translating IndieNews to Dutch in order to submit a blogpost tomorrow
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sebsel ehhh
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tantek do you have some sort of useragent check?
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sebsel that's strange. I have no idea where I should find those things.
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tantek your server HTTP error logs should have it
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tantek (including my requesting user agent etc.)
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sebsel My test is usually: do Xray and pin13 work :P
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sebsel I'll dig now!
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tantek e.g. "head_http_rels function" :)
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tantek look for that in your logs
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sebsel yeah, i have that
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sebsel HEAD /2017/01/11/1 HTTP/1.1" 404 3772 "-" "head_http_rels function"
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sebsel (let's not paste all the things)
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tantek specifically, your server seems to be returning a 404 for a HEAD request
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tantek a-ha!
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tantek I think that's an error to return a 404 for a HEAD request that would work as a GET
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sebsel next up: what to do with it.
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tantek !tell aaronpk does the webmention.rocks receiver test suite have a test for if a post permalink returns a 404 for a HEAD request but a 200 for a GET request?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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aaronpk I thought HEAD requests were supposed to return all the same headers as a GET request but with no body
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tantek bingo
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tantek so if they don't, then it's an error on the server's part
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tantek that's why it's a good test
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tantek specifically because I just found one :)
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aaronpk i don't think that specific test is in webmention.rocks but pretty sure I have HEAD tests there
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sebsel ohhh, wait, maybe...
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tantek my webmention endpoint discovery code does a HEAD request first, and if it doesn't get a 200, it bails and doesn't bother with a GET
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aaronpk That seems reasonable
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tantek (that's in the open source PHP code I posted)
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aaronpk What is HEAD?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "HEAD" yet. Would you like to create it?
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tantek alright, I'm posting my post. apologies sebsel, you're not getting a webmention ;)
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tantek here goes a big multi RSVP no
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sebsel https://getkirby.com/docs/developer-guide/advanced/routing#methods
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sebsel It defaults to GET
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sebsel will file an issue there.
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sebsel It should work now :)
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tantek yay I helped find a bug!
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Loqi giggles
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tantek !tell gregorlove on https://gregorlove.com/2017/01/homebrew-website-club/ I get "Notice: Undefined variable: matches in /home/gregorlove/gregorlove.com/site/templates/event.php on line 10" at the top
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi Homebrew Website Club
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sebsel All them bugs!
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miklb since I'm building this server over again from scratch, anyone have opinion on whether should build with pagespeed module? Is it a pain to maintain a custom build of nginx?
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aaronpk I've been doing custom nginx builds for a couple years now
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aaronpk It's not that bad actually
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aaronpk I use the push-stream and http2 modules
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miklb I think http2 is now in standard build, but push-stream looks interesting
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aaronpk Ah yeah that's right
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aaronpk push stream makes doing realtime stuff sooo easy
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sebsel tantek I still see no webmention of your post. did you resend one and did I fail elsewhere, or is this just the HEAD thingy?
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sebsel ah he's gone.
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sebsel !tell tantek I still see no webmention of your post. did you resend one and did I fail elsewhere, or is this just the HEAD thingy?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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sebsel I created my pull requests and filed my issues.
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sebsel it's 3:21 at night here
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sebsel good night indieweb :)
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Loqi sleep tight!
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www.boffosocko.com edited /lulz (+70) "microformats for voting" (view diff)
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KevinMarks_ I had that head problem with things built on appengine, where you have to explicitly write the head handler or it 501s
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tantek.com edited /rsvp (+104) "/* Tantek */ Multi-RSVP no using text "missing "" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /rsvp (+38) "/* Text Design */ "missing " RSVP "no" text equivalent implemented" (view diff)
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@LeonieWatson #WebMention is now a @W3C Recommendation https://www.w3.org/TR/2017/REC-webmention-20170112/ (twitter.com/_/status/819471733723987968)
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calumryan.com edited /2017/Nuremberg/Guest_List (+267) "Added to Attending 2017/Nuremberg/Guest List" (view diff)
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j4y_funabashi .
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barryfrost.com edited /Micropublish (+31) "/* History */ Updates based on Tantek's edits." (view diff)
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@voxpelli Great to see! If someone wants to try, then it’s easy to get started with: https://webmention.herokuapp.com/ Would love more… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/819548246494367745 (twitter.com/_/status/819548246494367745)
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sebsel So I send a webmention to Indieweb.org and I receive a 201 with this location: https://webmention.io/indiewebcamp/webmention/VXupM-fpn2fRMobENjpU
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sebsel Does not sound good.
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sebsel But I can't figure out wether that's my fault or webmention.io's
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sebsel Ah, 502, that's probably not my fault then.
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sebsel It's actually there, so that's fine. http://webmention.io/api/mentions?target=https://indieweb.org
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loqi.me created /latency (+393) "prompted by sebsel and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /latency (+105) "linky a bit, context, see also" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /latency (+13) "posts show comments, etc." (view diff)
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loqi.me edited /performance (+14) "sebsel added "[[latency]]" to "See Also"" (view diff)
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aaronparecki.com edited /p3k (-15) "/* Libraries */" (view diff)
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loqi.me edited /performance (+14) "tantek added "[[latency]]" to "See Also"" (view diff)
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seblog.nl edited /performance (-14) "/* See Also */ removed the extra /latency and reorder" (view diff)
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tantek !tell snarfed,kylewm does Bridgy have its own blog or twitter handle (preferably both?)
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Loqi tantek: sebsel left you a message 16 hours, 3 minutes ago: I still see no webmention of your post. did you resend one and did I fail elsewhere, or is this just the HEAD thingy?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek sebsel: was just the HEAD 404 thingy, later I did a manual Webmention send via the form on your post
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sebsel I thought so :) then it's ok
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tantek GWG, any way to measure WordPress Webmention plugin deployment?
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aaronpk hm https://wordpress.org/plugins/webmention/ only says "400+"
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aaronpk not sure the upper range of that +
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tantek that's a good enough citation and number
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tantek.com edited /selfdogfood (+14) "fix bullets" (view diff)
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@azaroth42 @csarven @rhiaro As LDN is to webmention, so ??? is to websub? Is there something more data friendly in the works? (twitter.com/_/status/819616633027104769)
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@bcsisg W3C News: Webmention is a W3C Recommendation https://www.w3.org/blog/news/archives/6052?pk_campaign=feed&pk_kwd=webmention-is-a-w3c-recommendation (twitter.com/_/status/819616882525405184)
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aaronpk pk_campaign? i don't have my own tracking software yet
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aaronpk oh it's piwik! http://piwik.org/docs/tracking-campaigns/
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aaronpk and here come the tweets!
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kevinmarks.com edited /events/2017-01-11-homebrew-website-club (+177) "/* The Netherlands Photo */ Add SF photo" (view diff)
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@t #Webmention first^1 @W3C REC 2017! https://www.w3.org/TR/2017/REC-webmention-20170112/ High bar * 14+ impls^2 * 10k+ sites^3 * 1 year ... http://tantek.com/2017/012/t1 (twitter.com/_/status/819618122101563395)
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@elpep Ça, c'est fait. Bravo @aaronpk https://www.w3.org/TR/2017/REC-webmention-20170112/ (twitter.com/_/status/819622496236347393)
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@kevinmarks #Webmention first^1 @W3C REC 2017! https://www.w3.org/TR/2017/REC-webmention-20170112/ High bar * 14+ impls^2 * 10k+ sites^3 * 1 year FPWD^4… http://tantek.com/2017/012/t1/webmntion-first-w3c-recommendation-high-bar (twitter.com/_/status/819622776289923072)
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@w3c Webmention is a W3C Recommendation https://www.w3.org/blog/news/archives/6052?pk_campaign=feed&pk_kwd=webmention-is-a-w3c-recommendation (twitter.com/_/status/819624363645353985)
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@ArsalanAKhan W3C: https://www.w3.org/blog/news/archives/6052?pk_campaign=feed&pk_kwd=webmention-is-a-w3c-recommendation - Webmention is a W3C Recommendation (twitter.com/_/status/819625992331399170)
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@igifischer Webmention is a W3C Recommendation https://www.w3.org/blog/news/archives/6052?pk_campaign=feed&pk_kwd=webmention-is-a-w3c-recommendation #Internet #w3c (twitter.com/_/status/819626303867514880)
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aaronparecki.com edited /How_to_publish_and_consume_PubSubHubbub (-20) (view diff)
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@ryf_feed Webmention is a W3C Recommendation https://www.w3.org/blog/news/archives/6052 (twitter.com/_/status/819629651312201730)
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@SecNewsBot Hacker News - Webmention is a W3C Recommendation https://www.w3.org/blog/news/archives/6052 (twitter.com/_/status/819630573081817091)
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aaronpk oh boy hackernews
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@techguard1 SecNewsBot: Hacker News - Webmention is a W3C Recommendation https://www.w3.org/blog/news/archives/6052 (twitter.com/_/status/819630745379598336)
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@TT_SemWeb #Webmention first^1 @W3C Recommendation of 2017! https://www.w3.org/TR/2017/REC… https://t.co/PxaraG0KrZ, see more http://tweetedtimes.com/topic/RWW/semantic-web?s=tnp (twitter.com/_/status/819633975257952256)
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aaronpk hey look a collection post https://aaronparecki.com/2017/01/12/14/webmention
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Loqi [Aaron Parecki] I'm pretty pleased with the timestamps of both of these posts. One year to the minute! https://aaronparecki.com/2016/01/12/14/webmention https://aaronparecki.com/2017/01/12/13/webmention-rec...
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tantek aaronpk++
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Loqi aaronpk has 25 karma in this channel (1177 overall)
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@distributedone Webmention is a W3C Recommendation https://www.w3.org/blog/news/archives/6052 #distributedNews (twitter.com/_/status/819635083611095041)
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tantek too bad it wasn't post # 6502 ;)
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tantek glances in bear's direction for a reaction ;)
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bear hahaha
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Loqi ahahahaha
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bear I love that CPU
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tantek :)
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tantek.com edited /Diaspora (+742) "/* Criticism */ General Criticisms / Why I am quitting Diaspora" (view diff)
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GWG tantek, you need pfefferle to log in to get detailed stats. I can do it for the Indieweb plugin or mine, but I am not listed as an author of Webmentions. Maybe I should ask.
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tantek GWG, then it's not good as a citation, as other people need to be able to click on the link and verify the numbers
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tantek that is, requiring log in is not helpful
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GWG tantek, most people only get the range.
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GWG But what alternative data is there?
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tantek it says 400 right there without logging in
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GWG Yes, that is active installs.
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GWG Only the author can track more granular data
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GWG Like downloads, if you wanted to know how many people tried it
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@progscrape Webmention is a W3C Recommendation https://www.w3.org/blog/news/archives/6052 (twitter.com/_/status/819640957381525504)
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voxpelli downloads are here: https://wordpress.org/plugins/webmention/stats/
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GWG voxpelli, the logged in version is a little more detailed, but the basic stats are there.
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voxpelli are the install numbers of wordpress reliable? I know they were not a 100% in Drupal as not everyone has the update lookups it relies on turned on
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GWG I do wonder about those big spikes in June.
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GWG I am told they arr.
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GWG are.
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bear.im edited /DNSimple (-11) "update dfn" (view diff)
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voxpelli bear++
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Loqi bear has 11 karma in this channel (175 overall)
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kodfabrik.se edited /DNSimple (+323) "Add link to platform announcement" (view diff)
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www.boffosocko.com edited /chicken (+85) "Tantek had given emoji to all the other /posts#Kinds_of_Posts, so why not this one? ;)" (view diff)
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Zegnat aaronpk, what parser sits behind pin13?
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tantek php-mf2 AFAIK
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aaronpk Yeah. Check the parsed result of any page ;-) it's in the json
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KevinMarks_ Unmung.com uses the python one, if you want to compare
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www.boffosocko.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:own all the things.gif]]""
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tantek wat
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loqi.me edited /Hover (+45) "/* See Also */ new section" (view diff)
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ncollig.net edited /Homebrew_Website_Club (+271) (view diff)
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ncollig.net created /Template:Ncollig (+1085) "Created page with "<div class="h-card">[https://ncollig.net/ <img src="https://ncollig.net/file/29fb5b71090d7a6f18e3941bd9d73b3d/thumb.jpg" style="width:128px;float:right;margin-left:1em"/>'''<span..."" (view diff)
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ncollig.net edited /Template:Ncollig () "(-1078) Replaced content with "NCollig"" (view diff)
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ncollig.net edited /Template:Ncollig (+85) (view diff)
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ncollig.net edited /Template:Ncollig (+73) (view diff)
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ncollig.net edited /Homebrew_Website_Club (+71) "/* Brussels */" (view diff)
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www.boffosocko.com created /own_all_the_things (+1423) "definition, example, see also's" (view diff)
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www.boffosocko.com edited /everything (+25) "+own all the things to see also" (view diff)
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tantek what is everything?
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Loqi “Everything is awesome!” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StTqXEQ2l-Y https://indieweb.org/everything
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tantek wat
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www.boffosocko.com created /ownallthethings (+32) "created redirect" (view diff)
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ncollig.net edited /Homebrew_Website_Club (+14) "/* Brussels */" (view diff)
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ncollig.net created /Template:NCollig (+165) "Created page with "<span class="h-card" style="white-space:nowrap">{{sparkline|https://ncollig.net/file/29fb5b71090d7a6f18e3941bd9d73b3d/thumb.jpg}} [[User:NCollig.net|NCollig]]</span>"" (view diff)
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ncollig.net created /Template:RMendes (+172) "Created page with "<span class="h-card" style="white-space:nowrap">{{sparkline|https://www.rmendes.net/file/9f0747742998d53a7fd32e575fd64e19/thumb.jpg}} [User:Www.rmendes.net|RMendes]]</span>"" (view diff)
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ncollig.net edited /Template:RMendes (+1) (view diff)
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www.boffosocko.com edited /Template:t (+405) "Added noinclude text to provide additional details/pointers for creating templates with sparklines since /Template:t is a common example" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Events (+42) "/* May */ highlight both IWCs" (view diff)