#dev 2017-07-20

2017-07-20 UTC
davidmead and snarfed joined the channel
#
@Trim_App Implementing Webmentions - https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/887830698639450112)
#
tantek cool, I'll brainstorm some possible minimal UI and let you iterate from there
#
aaronpk i'd be curious what you think
#
aaronpk i'm trying to decide if i should list recent webmentions, let you browse all of them, or require that you type in a URL to see webmentions just on that post
#
aaronpk or no UI, and you have to make an API call
#
tantek listing recent webmentions with [x] buttons would be an added bonus for sure. suggested MVF of paste in a URL in a field
#
@hiep_co Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/887831718799060992)
#
tantek https://github.com/aaronpk/webmention.io/issues/86#issuecomment-316561166
#
Loqi [tantek] brainstorm possible "minimal" UI: * IndieAuth login * form field to enter a webmention source to "delete" * Delete button - deletes all webmentions from that source (exact URL match only) to all targets with the domain that was IndieAuth verified
#
aaronpk a URL to a particular comment?
#
aaronpk ah thx
#
@App_sw_ #CSSTricks Implementing Webmentions. Read Blog: https://www.owler.com/reports/css-tricks/implementing-webmentions/1500504240275 (twitter.com/_/status/887831878748717056)
#
tantek the "list recent webmentions" would certainly make it easier in many/most cases, as would then auto-filtering that list based on the text field
#
tantek e.g. typing in brid.gy would then show only recent webmentions where source URL has (string subset) brid.gy
#
tantek but that's all enhancement beyond an MVF I think
#
aaronpk wow i forgot how minimal this UI is
#
tantek and assuming that (minimum text field UI) worked with a form submission, then I could on my end (on my site) have a buttons (visible only when logged into my site) on each webmention displayed on my site that I could click to delete which would do a form post to the UI on wmio
#
tantek would be nice if the result could confirm the # of webmentions deleted
#
tantek then that form submission becomes a defacto API of sorts as well (though the client has to be cookie'd in already via IndieAuth)
#
aaronpk (assuming i don't do CSRF checks on the form)
#
tantek oh that's interesting, I'm going to run into that same challenge building a "Got an indie RSVP? Enter the URL here: ______" form that submits to wmio
#
aaronpk that form is intentionally not supposed to have a CSRF check for exactly that purpose
#
tantek wonders if anyone else has that UI already
#
tantek looks at /event implementations
#
@LazyConsultant Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions #cybersecurity (twitter.com/_/status/887835701160673280)
#
@clairvoyant_the LazyConsultant: Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions #cybersecurity (twitter.com/_/status/887836289806077952)
#
tantek "cybersecurity" hashtag wow
#
tantek so many infographics
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /Falcon (+139) "/* event posts */ enter RSVP URL form" (view diff)
#
@pro_webhosting Implementing Webmentions stylesheet https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/887847053472268290)
KevinMarks and eli_oat joined the channel
#
aaronpk man i am not in a UI mood today
#
Ruxton could be worse, you could be programming PDF's in iText :P
#
aaronpk ?
#
Ruxton with broken bone pictures and such, yay
#
Loqi woot
[kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
tantek it's ok aaronpk, postpone it (assuming #86) til tomorrow
#
aaronpk nah i'm almost done
#
aaronpk it just doesn't look pretty
#
tantek pretty is not needed for this MVF. I'm expecting something like a rudimentary admin UI
#
aaronpk pretty much
#
tantek stmbu is a good example of such, not pretty but usable and works just fine
KevinMarks, tantek and davidmead joined the channel
#
aaronpk here goes nothing
#
www.boffosocko.com edited /IndiePub (+147) "link to plugin; moved to core" (view diff)
j12t_ joined the channel
#
aaronpk wow
#
www.boffosocko.com edited /Known (-48) "redlinks; user templates" (view diff)
#
www.boffosocko.com edited /User:Boffosocko.com/sandbox/knowntemplate (+406) "syndication plugins, other resources" (view diff)
#
www.boffosocko.com deleted /User:Boffosocko.com/sandbox/knowntemplate "Author request: content was: "{{Navbox |title = [[Known]] |image = {{{https://withknown.com/img/logo_k.png}}} |rows = {{Navbox-row |title = Topics |content = Getting S..." (and the only contributor was "[[Special:Contributions/Www.boffosocko.com|Www.boffosocko.com]]")"
#
www.boffosocko.com edited /Known (-319) "added template; cleaned up plugins section" (view diff)
#
www.boffosocko.com edited /Known (+186) "Chris Aldrich community version" (view diff)
mblaney joined the channel
#
mblaney dobrado can play all 3 roles in SWAT0. it's linked to on that page.
#
mblaney I was pretty careful not to say that it "passes SWAT0" in the blog post I've linked to there, as my example is obviously not "Social" enough.
#
mblaney ^ also updated my entry on the SWAT0 page to follow the new recommend guidelines.
#
mblaney hopes he passes the guidelines test.
tantek joined the channel
#
@rolandjean Implementing Webmentions http://www.scoop.it/t/web2partner-html5/p/4081851235/2017/07/20/implementing-webmentions https://twitter.com/rolandjean/status/887894406375907329/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/887894406375907329)
tantek joined the channel
#
@CodiggerDotCom Implementing Webmentions • #CSSTricks • https://codigger.com/snippet/implementing-webmentions/ https://twitter.com/CodiggerDotCom/status/887899058798563328/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/887899058798563328)
Defenestrate joined the channel
#
@superxteam Implementing Webmentions - http://www.superxteam.com/blog/implementing-webmentions-5/ (twitter.com/_/status/887904097587924992)
#
tantek.com edited /read (+225) "/* Tantek */ multiple authors started example" (view diff)
cweiske, barpthewire and AngeloGladding joined the channel
#
@Smashou Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions #veille #webdev (twitter.com/_/status/887925852293484553)
#
@IntegralWeb69 Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions #webdev (twitter.com/_/status/887925854147407873)
[pfefferle] joined the channel
#
[pfefferle] good morning
#
Loqi *yawn*
[kevinmarks], j12t, Kongaloosh and tantek joined the channel
#
@mikestreety @drewm This looks awesome, definitely be looking into it when I re-do my site https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions from @drewm (twitter.com/_/status/887956024430391296)
#
@mikestreety This looks awesome. Definitely looking into it when I re-do my site. I hate Disqus… https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions from @drewm (twitter.com/_/status/887956243968651264)
#
@clivewalker @mikestreety Just been adding that to a couple of my sites. Only one problem, I don't have as many webmentions as @drewm! (twitter.com/_/status/887956702125019136)
[pfefferle], KevinMarks and KevinMarks_ joined the channel
#
@imasterale Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions #webdesign #feedly (twitter.com/_/status/887965054594936832)
#
@daveismynamecom Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/887975450307440640)
jeremycherfas joined the channel
#
sebsel with Micropubs 202 Accepted + Location header, we might end up with '4XX Wait for it': resource found but not ready to show :P
#
petermolnar HTTP 721 Known Unkowns
#
petermolnar "I know it's not there yet" :D
davidmead joined the channel
#
@mickaelruau La nouvelle recommandation du W3C pour le web social : Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions https://twitter.com/mickaelruau/status/887990694144606208/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/887990694144606208)
Zegnat, j12t_ and [barryf] joined the channel
#
[barryf] sebsel I made a little retry/spinner page in Micropublish if the post isn't ready: https://barryf.s3.amazonaws.com/202-redirect.mov
#
[barryf] I added it because my site's software returns a 202 while it's building the new post.
[kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
@5amwiltshire "Implementing Webmentions" https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions #coding #feedly (twitter.com/_/status/888001937941168132)
#
prtksxna.com created /User:Prtksxna.com (+65) "Created page with "<span class="h-card">[http://prtksxna.com/ Prateek Saxena]</span>"" (view diff)
#
@refreshdetroit Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions Webmentions describes a system for one site to notify another when it links to it (twitter.com/_/status/888008143153844224)
#
prtksxna.com edited /User:Prtksxna.com (+487) (view diff)
#
sebsel [barryf] nice! But it assumes 3 seconds, right? I guess that's enough for most sites, but you don't KNOW if the post is ready
#
@mojagedbot "Implementing Webmentions" https://javascriptkicks.com/r/159964?url=https%3A%2F%2Fallinthehead.com%2Fretro%2F378%2Fimplementing-webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/888019282101231616)
eli_oat, singpolyma, Defenestrate and jeremycherfas joined the channel
#
jeremycherfas Aaronpk: Is it possible to use curl from my local development to get things from xray?
#
@clivewalker @Joel_Hughes Webmentions? (twitter.com/_/status/888029834278055937)
#
@JavaScriptKicks Implementing Webmentions by @drewm https://javascriptkicks.com/r/159964?url=https%3A%2F%2Fallinthehead.com%2Fretro%2F378%2Fimplementing-webmentions #css #javascript via @JavaScriptKicks (twitter.com/_/status/888030871609106432)
#
aaronpk jeremycherfas: yeah that should work fine
#
jeremycherfas Aaronpk: I was managing to send webmentions from one local site to another, but now I seem to be getting 404 back when I try to use curl.
#
jeremycherfas But with the webmention endpoint rather than xray.
#
jeremycherfas Is there a command to discover the webmention endpoint of a site?
#
aaronpk The PHP webmention client has a function for that. Not sure if anyone has turned that into a proper command line tool
#
jeremycherfas But I could use the example in your readme and make a little PHP program?
tantek joined the channel
#
@thewebvy Could ‘webmentions’ be the replacement for pingbacks? https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/888036678685917184)
#
aaronpk Yea!
#
tantek good morning #indieweb-dev!
#
sknebel good morning!
KevinMarks and KevinMarks_ joined the channel
#
Zegnat Good morning!
#
jeremycherfas Hell Zegnat
#
jeremycherfas Hello!
#
Zegnat I see you’ve been working hard on XRay again, jeremycherfas! :D
#
jeremycherfas I have been trying, but getting nowhere.
#
www.svenknebel.de edited /Private-Webmention (+690) "/* FAQ */ where to send? homepage "in-reply-to"" (view diff)
jeremycherfas_ joined the channel
#
jeremycherfas_ Zegnat: The problem seems to be that notifycommand.php hangs and does not finish executing, and I cannot see why.
#
jeremycherfas_ So it seems that no data are received from source URLs
#
Zegnat notifycommand is what? A tool for sending webmentions *from* Grav?
#
jeremycherfas Yes, sends webmentions. Trying to check the receiving tool again.
#
Zegnat It seems to read a file where it collects where it needs to send mentions to? I don’t see where that file is coming from though.
#
jeremycherfas Me neither!
#
jeremycherfas The file lives in user/data/webmention/data_sent.yaml
#
jeremycherfas And that gets written to when a source url sends a webmention.
#
Zegnat I am at a loss there… Do you really need to go through that tool though? Shouldn’t Grav automatically sent webmentions when you create a new post
#
Zegnat ?
#
jeremycherfas All Grav knows about webmentions it knows through that plugin. Natively, it does nothing. And the plugin must be run from the command line (or, if I ever get it working) as a cron job).
#
jeremycherfas I keep thinking that trying to fix this plugin is in the end not as efficient as building an entirely new plugin, but while I am sort of happy to tinker with something someone else has beuilt, I don’t think I could build something myself.
#
Zegnat Wait, it doesn’t autosend? That’s harsh.
#
jeremycherfas Hang on. Maybe it does. Rereading the documentation.
#
jeremycherfas There is a setting in the sender module for automatic. If true, it sends metions as soon as the page has been built. There is a warning that this will slow down the site if a page is link heavy. But most of my pages are not link heavy. So I might try changing that.
#
jeremycherfas I wonder whether that might avoid the hanging problem.
#
tantek.com edited /follow (+216) "more about differences with friending" (view diff)
#
aaronpk are you running into this problem on your dev machine or on the real site?
#
Zegnat It shouldn’t even really slow down your site, I think, jeremycherfas. If it is in the build process, the slowdown would only be visible to you when you first create a page, right? That can’t be too bad.
#
jeremycherfas Aaronpk on the dev machine
#
jeremycherfas Zegnat yes, I am about try try with automatic send now.
#
jeremycherfas Zegnat: do you mind if I test with a reply to a post at licit?
#
Zegnat Go ahead
#
aaronpk jeremycherfas: depending on how your local PHP is configured, it could be that the server is blocked serving the one request so isn't able to serve the request your server makes to itself to verify the webmention
#
aaronpk i've had that happen before, tho i think more often on ruby sites because of the way the dev environment is run
tantek joined the channel
#
jeremycherfas Aaronpk I’m afraid you’ve lost me. What would I check?
#
aaronpk i might be misunderstanding the problem
#
jeremycherfas I suppose I could try it in the producrtion environment
KevinMarks and KevinMarks_ joined the channel
#
petermolnar Zegnat grav builds in the fly
#
petermolnar that was my big problem with it
#
Zegnat I can’t imagine it will resend URLs on every build though. And I seem to recall seeing some pretty heavy caching
#
petermolnar it ate up all the io when I tried to load an image heavy site after a cache clean
#
petermolnar yep, but on post, you clean the cache...
#
Zegnat The *entire* cache?1
#
petermolnar used to, maybe it now depends on config
#
petermolnar grav is one of those too good to be true ones
#
petermolnar brilliant, for tiny sites
#
petermolnar which doesn't change regularly
snarfed joined the channel
#
@SkweezeDesign CSS Tricks of the trade: Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/888062956528971776)
#
petermolnar (it also had one of the crappiest on-demand dynamic image resizing things when I tried it ~2 years ago)
#
petermolnar sidenotes: I'm getting rather unhappy with my site design; suggestions welcome, if anyone feels to take a look what could be prettier
#
jeremycherfas Petermolnar: i’m definitely not pushing the boundaries
#
jeremycherfas Aaronpk: seems to hang on the live site too. :(
#
aaronpk strange!
#
jeremycherfas Something is definitely broken!
#
aaronpk yeah the thing i was thinking of was a stretch
#
jeremycherfas I’m coming to the conclusion that, impossible thought it may seem now, I need to think about this from the ground up. Steal what I can, simplify where I can. Break it down ibnto units I can maybe manage.
#
jeremycherfas And then throw myself on the mercy of all you good people.
#
Zegnat Looking forward to your demo on Wednesday jeremycherfas ;)
#
jeremycherfas No way. I’m going away on monday and tuesday. I suppose I might have some sort of old skool flow diagram.
snarfed joined the channel
#
Zegnat Bring a flip for visual presentation! :D
#
jeremycherfas Will do.
#
@etportis @adactio (one of these days I'll finally start POSSE-ing and set up WebMention-ing but for now enjoy some silly markup-in-a-Tweet) (twitter.com/_/status/888067448036925440)
#
@redcrew What the New Webmention and Annotation W3C Standards Mean for WordPress https://premium.wpmudev.org/blog/webmentions-annotations-web-standards/ (twitter.com/_/status/888067999760101376)
#
sknebel lol
snarfed, jeremycherfas and KevinMarks joined the channel
#
@adactio @bluesmoon No need for trackback with webmention: https://webmention.net/ (twitter.com/_/status/888084230005288961)
KevinMarks_ joined the channel
#
@felixzapata Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/888088873527586817)
tantek and snarfed joined the channel
#
ben.thatmustbe.me edited /HubZilla (+255) "/* Current Issues */ very confused setting up a HubZilla account" (view diff)
#
tantek interesting hashtag results on mastodon technology https://mastodon.technology/tags/indieweb
#
loqi.me created /d* (+21) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
[kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
loqi.me created /aspects (+267) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
#
tantek aspects << https://diasporafoundation.org/getting_started/aspects
#
loqi.me edited /aspects (+74) "/* See Also */ new section" (view diff)
#
Loqi ok, I added "https://diasporafoundation.org/getting_started/aspects" to the "See Also" section of /aspects
#
tantek aspects << [[Google+]]
#
loqi.me edited /aspects (+14) "tantek added "[[Google+]]" to "See Also"" (view diff)
#
Loqi ok, I added "[[Google+]]" to the "See Also" section of /aspects
#
tantek interesting recent request for Webmention support in Mastodon (cc: ben_thatmustbeme )
#
tantek https://mastodon.social/users/johnjohnston/updates/2348094
#
Loqi [John Johnston] Wondering of there could be #webmention support in mastadon? even it the same way bridgy added it to twitter? Still figuring out various #indieweb things on my blog and micro.blog.
#
prtksxna.com edited /User:Prtksxna.com (+1137) (view diff)
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
ben_thatmustbeme https://social.umeahackerspace.se/notice/1250616
#
Loqi [MMN-o ✅⃠] GNU Social
#
@rubygems jekyll-webmention_io (2.6.0): This Gem includes a suite of tools for managing webmentions in Jekyll: * Tags -… https://rubygems.org/gems/jekyll-webmention_io (twitter.com/_/status/888103744755212288)
KartikPrabhu and gRegorLove joined the channel
#
@herrseilerbitte </> Implementing Webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions #frontend #developers #webdesign #webdevelopment #coding #wordpress (twitter.com/_/status/888104748087296001)
#
tantek nice ben_thatmustbeme - worth adding to /GNU_Social!
snarfed joined the channel
#
gRegorLove Loqi, messages?
#
prtksxna.com edited /User:Prtksxna.com (+694) (view diff)
#
ben_thatmustbeme tantek, also https://social.umeahackerspace.se/notice/1203827
#
Loqi [MMN-o ✅⃠] Björn Schießle
#
ben_thatmustbeme that whole thread
[cleverdevil] joined the channel
#
ben.thatmustbe.me edited /GNU_social (+106) "/* Requests */" (view diff)
#
loqi.me created /Discourse (+218) "prompted by [cleverdevil] and dfn added by [cleverdevil]" (view diff)
j12t joined the channel
#
ben_thatmustbeme huh
#
ben_thatmustbeme what is isso?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "isso" yet. Would you like to create it?
#
ben_thatmustbeme isso is a commenting server similar to disqus https://github.com/posativ/isso
#
loqi.me created /isso (+105) "prompted by ben_thatmustbeme and dfn added by ben_thatmustbeme" (view diff)
#
Loqi ok
#
Loqi [posativ] isso: a Disqus alternative
#
ben_thatmustbeme isso < https://posativ.org/isso/
#
gregorlove.com edited /Discourse (-22) "link dfn" (view diff)
j12t_ joined the channel
#
Zegnat eli_oat any reason you use the <title> rather than the p-name of the post you are replying to?
#
eli_oat do you mean in my u-in-reply-to?
#
Zegnat Yep, the text. It says “In reply to: Martijn’s permalinked post”
#
kaja.sknebel.net edited /isso (+3) "linkify" (view diff)
#
www.svenknebel.de edited /isso (-1) "fix" (view diff)
#
eli_oat SO, the major reason I use <title> is laziness. It is easier to parse the <title> in PHP than the p-name. I've played with some of the libraries for that, but wasn't pleased with the consistency
#
aaronpk eli_oat: check out XRay. I've done a lot of work there to get a good "name" value for posts. https://github.com/aaronpk/XRay
#
Loqi [aaronpk] XRay: X-Ray returns structured data from any URL
[chrisaldrich] joined the channel
#
eli_oat I've played with it aaronpk, but should most certainly take another look
#
eli_oat thanks!
#
aaronpk i also recently repackaged it as a library so you can integrate it directly into a project instead of using it as an api
tantek joined the channel
#
Zegnat It is fine of course, might even be the best way to get a title on notes where name === content.
#
Zegnat Was mostly wondering about the reason :)
#
gRegorLove schmarty: Is your .ics generation on github perchance?
#
schmarty sadly nope. it is part of my jekyll site.
#
eli_oat alas, Zegnat. My reasoning is almost always laziness :|
#
Zegnat All reasons are reasons !1
#
Zegnat For longer posts, like https://licit.li/595611f87aae1, I specifically add a p-name for people to use. I should probably put those in <title> …
#
schmarty i can tell you that all it does is look for posts with h: event, normalize the start/end properties, convert the description into a single line with \n characters, and then renders a template
#
schmarty that template is based on a "save to calendar" that i did from an eventbrite event
#
schmarty which i considered "good enough"
#
prtksxna.com edited /User:Prtksxna.com (+2255) (view diff)
#
aaronpk i played around with ics generation a bit. it's surprisingly hard to make an .ics file that is able to be opened in google/iOS/mac
#
prtksxna.com edited /User:Prtksxna.com (+8) (view diff)
#
loqi.me edited /Discourse (+81) "/* See Also */ new section" (view diff)
#
prtksxna tantek: I have a use case in which I want the post to be interpreted both as a like and a photo - https://indieweb.org/User:Prtksxna.com#Scrapbook.2FPinterest
#
prtksxna tantek: What would be the right approach for something like this?
#
tantek I'm still using h2vx.com for ics generation - link right there on my homepage
#
tantek and aaronpk is right - making a good ICS file is hard which is why we captured those smarts in a service
#
tantek (open source obv)
#
tantek prtksxna: like + photo doesn't really make sense because they're pretty different
#
prtksxna tantek: Then what would you suggest for that use case I linked to?
#
gRegorLove Yeah, and tinkering with h2vx for mf2 is on my itches list
#
tantek that use-case you linked is not really a photo
#
tantek it's a visual quotation
#
tantek 2D quotation as it were - "screenshot of the element that I liked"
#
prtksxna nods
#
tantek it's someone else's content, not yours, so not a photo
#
tantek nor is it a repost of a photo because it's not the whole thing
#
tantek that's more the reply-context of what you're posting
#
gRegorLove This is for a work-work project, so I might bump that up a bit, or at least some minimal viable thing
#
tantek your *actual* content is perhaps the like-of, and then the "small note and tags"
#
tantek which sounds closest to a /bookmark post
#
tantek which is also a response
#
tantek you're essentially "responding" to the subset of the page indicated by the "screenshot of the element that I liked", thus that latter part makes sense to use as your reply-context
#
prtksxna tantek: I understand. And to maintain a grid of all such replies, I'll just have to make explicit tags that I use internally?
#
prtksxna.com edited /User:Prtksxna.com (+24) (view diff)
snarfed joined the channel
#
tantek a grid? presentationally? do you have a sketch/mockup of what you mean by that?
#
prtksxna tantek: Like pinterest
#
tantek oh boy - that's certainly not a "grid". I don't know what that layout style is called
#
prtksxna tantek: Essentially a masonry grid layout
#
tantek vertical bricks?
#
tantek on its side?
#
prtksxna tantek: https://masonry.desandro.com/layout.html
#
tantek that looks more like a mosaic
#
tantek well the top red examples. the bottom are the vertical bricks I meant
#
tantek (if you rotate them 90deg they look sorta like actual masonry bricklaying with overlaps across horizontal layers)
#
tantek I think aaronpk was exploring doing something like that for his photos? or photo gallery posts? I forget which
#
prtksxna tantek: Right, so my question was, I'd have to use internal tagging to decide what to show on such a page, right?
#
tantek depends on what you want the page to show!
#
tantek hence I don't understand the "have to use internal tagging" requirement
#
tantek there are lots of ways to show a subset of your posts
#
tantek tags are just one
#
tantek dates, implied types etc.
#
petermolnar css grid still can't do flickr-like justified gallery, which, in my opinion, is a shame
#
tantek again, aaronpk has many examples of "subsets of his posts" on his site
#
tantek good place to look for design ideas
#
prtksxna But I am not looking for design ideas :( I am trying to figure out the correct technical way to do this.
#
aaronpk i have a separate mechanism from tags for deciding what posts appear in which lists
#
aaronpk i call it "channels"
#
tantek prtksxna: it's not clear which subset of your posts you want to show why, hence the questions / suggestions before leaping to "have to use"
#
prtksxna tantek: The subset would be the posts that belong to the scrapbook in general. As you made me understand, those would be ones which are 'like-of' and have a 'reply-context' that has in <img>.
#
prtksxna aaronpk: Would that be akin to 'categories'?
#
aaronpk i think it's similar to wordpress categories
#
tantek prtksxna: ok that helps a bit - however do you really want to limit to snaps you like? sometimes it's useful to collect examples of things to avoid too ;)
#
aaronpk since wordpress has a separate idea of categories and tags
#
tantek or things that are just "meh" from otherwise supposedly good designers or corps
#
tantek I'm skeptical of conflating "like" with "scrapbook"
#
prtksxna aaronpk: You aren't using u-photo instead of reply-context for your /bookmarks?
#
prtksxna aaronpk: Right
#
tantek what is a media fragment
#
Loqi media fragment is a way of linking to a part of a longer media file https://indieweb.org/media_fragment
#
prtksxna tantek: Right, so as the use case mentioned, they could be bookmarks or likes. Whether they are #meh or #wow can be easily delegated to tags.
#
tantek prtksxna: ^^^ check that for some info / pointers on linking to parts of media (audio, video, images)
#
tantek prtksxna: agreed re tag usage or even "antipattern" "darkpattern" etc.
#
aaronpk i hadn't thought of showing the thing i'm bookmarking in the reply context
#
tantek aaronpk totally! I thought you did that with screenshots of pages you bookmarked!
#
tantek screenshot thumbnails that is
#
aaronpk yeah but as part of *my* post, not as a reply context
#
prtksxna tantek: I think I've read that while reading the new WebAnnotation spec. I don't think it solves stuff for me. For example a screenshot of a website, or an animation for an interaction.
#
aaronpk i guess i don't really think of my bookmarks as replies to the posts
#
prtksxna Me neither
#
tantek prtksxna: a-ha - where there is no actual media *file* of the original
#
prtksxna Right!
#
tantek bookmarks are totally responses!
#
aaronpk as much as linking to some other post in a note or article is sure
#
tantek as I display likes (with counter), I'm definitely looking at displaying # of times bookmarked as well
#
aaronpk but i don't want to display them like my replies
#
aaronpk they're responses from the PoV of the thing i'm bookmarking, but not for me
#
tantek especially for long form articles, I see it as useful feedback how many people have bookmarked it
#
prtksxna I don't think of bookmarks as responses as they are personal. I feel no need to inform the other person of my action, unlike a reply or a like.
#
tantek aaronpk: not sure how you can say they are not responses? you're posting something in response to something you saw
#
prtksxna I am saving what I saw in a list, not responding to it.
#
tantek you're literally responding rather than just creating
#
aaronpk because i think of it as making my own content
#
aaronpk because i add tags and such, and sometimes pull quotes
#
tantek that's not mutex
#
prtksxna thread locking?
#
tantek logical mutual exclusivity
#
tantek thread locking is just one example
#
aaronpk also i feel more ownership over my set of bookmarks than i do the set of things i "like"
#
tantek of course, it's a more deliberate act
#
tantek I feel more ownership over my set of replies than I do the set of things I like
#
tantek they're still both "responses" to someone else's stuff
#
schmarty this sounds on-topic for the main channel?
#
aaronpk well i don't care what you think my bookmarks are, i'm going to display them how I want #indieweb :P
#
tantek display them however you want obv! point being it's more than "just" a mention
#
aaronpk of course it's more than a mention, especially from the perspective of the thing i'm bookmarking
#
aaronpk but i dont think displaying it like my replies is appropriiate
#
tantek "like my replies" wasn't intended
#
tantek but I can see how you got that from "show a reply-context"
#
tantek perhaps I should have said, show a link-preview
#
aaronpk yeah i don't think a reply context is appropriate for my bookmarks
#
prtksxna A critique or a review would be a response to a book, a bookmark is just your state in the book.
#
aaronpk link preview on the other hand... basically my screenshots are a cheater version of a link preview
#
tantek I meant more the techinques in a reply-context rather than literally
#
tantek a screenshot thumbnail is a plenty fine implementation of the concept of a link preview
#
tantek you're literally showing a preview of what is at the link when you looked at it
#
prtksxna Thanks a ton aaronpk and tantek. I think I have a better understanding of this now <3
#
prtksxna tantek++
#
Loqi tantek has 11 karma in this channel (372 overall)
#
prtksxna aaronpk++
#
Loqi aaronpk has 66 karma in this channel (1382 overall)
#
tantek prtksxna: great use-case exploration - really appreciate it
#
tantek especially a design-related use-case
#
tantek the funny thing is, we screenshot and post parts of web pages like that all the time! but to the IndieWebCamp wiki
#
tantek obv it makes sense how to best do that to your own site either instead, or first, and then POSSE it to the Indieweb.org wiki
#
tantek what is a screenshot
#
Loqi A screenshot is an image of a computer screen or a website https://indieweb.org/screenshot
#
prtksxna tantek: Like when noting UI patterns on silos?
#
tantek is there a term for that kind of capture, the click & drag screenshot of part of a screen
#
tantek yes!
#
tantek I'm sure aaronpk and I have posted dozens of such mini captures
#
tantek ... to the indieweb wiki
#
prtksxna.com edited /screenshot (+43) (view diff)
#
prtksxna tantek: Not sure what you mean? Click & drag screenshot?
#
prtksxna tantek: A sceenshot of a part of the screen is still as screenshot?
#
Zegnat !tell jeremycherfas looks like I got a webmention from your main site? Not sure if that was the notify script or something else.
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
tantek prtksxna: maybe? I always considered "screenshot" to imply the whole screen or window by default
#
tantek feels like there should be a different design term for such a mini screenshot
[cleverdevil] joined the channel
#
aaronpk i think partial screen captures are normally called screenshots
#
prtksxna screen grab/screenshot, I've never differentiated between the terms, or full or partial captures :/
#
prtksxna had questions for tantek about the post type discovery algorithm but is too sleepy now
#
aaronpk e.g. https://www.flickr.com/photos/factoryjoe/431050358/in/album-72157600017279965/
#
tantek hilariously self-refrential
#
aaronpk i thought it was appropriate :)
#
prtksxna is a strange loop
#
snarfed <3s doug hofstadter
#
tantek I feel like if we asked some designer folks they would have a term for this
#
dgold aaronpk: tiktok works great for me now - thanks for yesterday's bugfix session
#
tantek aaronpk: makes sense that Flickr would simplify the UI down to three choices rather than try to come up with a massive taxonomy :P
#
dgold can I ask tho - can TTB 'voice' the response from a webhook back into the channel?
#
aaronpk dgold: awesome. what do you mean "voice"?
#
aaronpk maybe this isn't obvious enough in the readme, but is this what you mean? https://github.com/aaronpk/TikTokBot#inline-responses
#
Loqi [aaronpk] TikTokBot: TikTokBot is a bot framework for Slack and IRC.
#
@wpmudev What the new webmention and annotation W3C standards mean for #WordPress https://premium.wpmudev.org/blog/webmentions-annotations-web-standards/ via @wpmudev (twitter.com/_/status/888126370735210496)
#
@wpsheeteditor wpmudev: What the new webmention and annotation W3C standards mean for #WordPress https://premium.wpmudev.org/blog/webmentions-annotations-web-standards/ via wpmudev (twitter.com/_/status/888126502176309249)
#
@muc_webdesigner What the new webmention and annotation W3C standards mean for #WordPress https://premium.wpmudev.org/blog/webmentions-annotations-web-standards/ via wpmudev (twitter.com/_/status/888126515090554881)
#
dgold ah, never mind - I misread the response URL documentation as meaning something else.
#
prtksxna aaronpk: I've asked at the Wordpress and Wikimedia Foundation design channels. Will let you know about responses :) (context: screenshot)
#
dgold I have hooks on the brain
#
tantek prtksxna: awesome
#
tantek prtksxna: separately, do you know anything about the microforrmats or mf2 related projects at Wikipedia? I think ben_thatmustbeme and/or gRegorLove were looking into it
#
ben_thatmustbeme shakes head, was not I
#
prtksxna tantek: Could you share links? I could figure out if something needs moving.
#
prtksxna https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Microformats this?
#
Loqi gRegorLove
#
gRegorLove Haha
#
gRegorLove Yeah, this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Microformats#Add_microformats2.3F
#
Loqi rofl
#
prtksxna Interesting, I subscribed to https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T10633 2 years ago :O
#
gRegorLove I'm the one h-card (vs hCard) on the project page, so Loqi picked that up :)
#
prtksxna Loqi++
#
Loqi loqi has 3 karma in this channel (435 overall)
#
prtksxna hrm
#
prtksxna gRegorLove: We are going to have infoboxes be populate through Wikidata some time soon™. I think it'd be best that the extension responsible for creating the markup uses mf2.
#
prtksxna gRegorLove: I'll look at the wikiproject closely tomorrow :)
#
gRegorLove prtksxna: Cool! I'm quite new to that wiki project so I don't know much about it. Just kinda familiar with setting up wiki templates
#
gRegorLove Would be awesome if infoboxes started automatically having mf2
#
prtksxna gRegorLove: Indeed
#
prtksxna gRegorLove: mf2 in templates like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Coord would be great too. Will surely require discussion.
#
Loqi Moscow
#
aaronpk lol
#
tantek perhaps the templates for templates need better mf2 as well ;)
#
prtksxna gRegorLove: See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Module:Coordinates too (lua module)
#
prtksxna heh
#
gRegorLove yo dawg
KevinMarks and KevinMarks_ joined the channel
#
www.boffosocko.com edited /Indieweb_for_Education (+119) "KQED group platform example" (view diff)
#
www.boffosocko.com edited /Indieweb_for_Education (+282) "article A Domain of WithKnown" (view diff)
[cleverdevil] and snarfed joined the channel
#
@hermloot Now that I’ve got Micropub working, my next hurdle is figuring out how to send and receive Webmentions. This Jekyll… https://dylanon.com/blog/2017/07/17/1/ (twitter.com/_/status/888166674146480132)
#
@hermloot Now that I’ve got Micropub working, my next hurdle is figuring out how to send and receive Webmentions. This Jekyll… https://dylanon.com/blog/2017/07/17/1/ (twitter.com/_/status/888167711007756288)
#
@webmatr1cs Implementing Webmentions https://plus.google.com/113202356806732806312/posts/7ZqgANr5aBx https://twitter.com/webmatr1cs/status/888172023553327105/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/888172023553327105)
#
snarfed plus.google.com ??
leg joined the channel