#dev 2018-09-17

2018-09-17 UTC
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loqi.me created /Unladen_Follow (+111) "prompted by dougbeal and dfn added by dougbeal" (view diff)
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loqi.me edited /Unladen_Follow (+60) "dougbeal added "https://github.com/apike/Unladen-Follow/" to "See Also"" (view diff)
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petermolnar morning all; so, quick question: are nested h-events allowed? Example: field trip during school years, hotel stays during holiday, etc.
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Zegnat petermolnar, I don’t think there is anything that says it isn’t allowed. But I don’t think we have a good way of parsing them? h-feed of h-events may be easier to parse? (Itinerary style.)
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petermolnar h-feed of h-events doesn't really work
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petermolnar well, it's not really what it is imo
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sknebel good question. sounds reasonable, but as Zegnat said not aware of an prior examples of it (but might be on the microformats wiki somewhere, surely people considered sub-events somewhere)
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sknebel well, aaronpk has the itiniary thing with trip legs, mixing in events there sounds like it might make sense
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sknebel (https://aaronparecki.com/travel )
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[jgmac1106] @petermolnar @sknebel I wanted to kind of do that mo my syllabi
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[jgmac1106] the start and stop of each event should be nested in the dates of the class
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[jgmac1106] http://fall18syllabus.edu307class.networkedlearningcollaborative.com/
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Loqi EDU 307: Children's Literature and Literacy
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[jgmac1106] but then I fall back on ...nobody is consuming it so does it really matter/
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petermolnar [jgmac1106]: you have to start somewhere :)
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petermolnar also, shouldn't providing something come before consuming it?
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[jgmac1106] I guess but it is a lot of effort when you realize nobody is going to parse your syllabus, I also heard infinite scroll pages with anchor links and multiple h-events or h-entries don't work
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[jgmac1106] ! Tell eddidehinkle I am not sure why but when I try to repost a post from your site it only shares the canonical url and not post url
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[jgmac1106] !tell eddidehinkle auto spacing caused you to miss a note I posted
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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sknebel lol, that's a useful message to receive...
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[jgmac1106] He is US east coaster won't get lost in the noise. Plus with infant no way Eddie is sleeping
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[eddie] 😆 You underestimate my abilities of being dead to the world in sleep
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[eddie] But like you said, easy enough to not get lost in the noose 🙂
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[eddie] Noise*
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[eddie] !tell jgmac1106 I’m not quite sure what you mean between canonical url and post url?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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swentel [eddie], got q=source working in android version with drupal plugin :D
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swentel I can practically completely manage my site now from indigenous hehe
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swentel need to add more support when updating, but it's amazingly cool
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[eddie] Wow that’s awesome swentel!!
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[eddie] swentel++
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Loqi swentel has 6 karma in this channel over the last year (15 in all channels)
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[eddie] That’ll be pretty cool. When I make a mistake currently I have to open an ide on my phone and navigate to my posts folder for the day and open the post and edit the yaml file directly
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[eddie] My site provides posts via the query, my current issue is I haven’t implemented the update method yet and there are some things about the current post format that is making it a little challenging for me to get working 💯
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[jgmac1106] [eddie] meaning in my reader when I went to go repost the link to your post about planning it went to eddiehinkle.com and not to the permalink of the actual post
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Loqi [jgmac1106]: [eddie] left you a message 44 minutes ago: I’m not quite sure what you mean between canonical url and post url?
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[eddie] Ohhhh strange
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[eddie] I just looked at my mf2 looks pretty good. The only thing I don’t think I’m seeing is a uid, so I might be missing u-uid
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Zegnat That property is rarely required, few people add it to their entries I think. So not sure if you should ever depend on its existence.
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sknebel unlikely that it's uid, yeah
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[eddie] hmmm
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[jgmac1106] could be somethign in aperture or indigenous...was that marked up as a podcast or anythign different?
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sknebel what feed are you following?
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[jgmac1106] lemme check
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[eddie] Yeah, I was wondering what post it was that didn’t work
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jgmac1106 now I have to go out to my car and get my phone as I can’t find it on your website..wondering if it was just an older post that got crawled
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[eddie] Hmm interesting, maybe
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swentel [eddie], yeah, currently updating is limited to post-status, title (name) and content
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swentel need to experiment with more properties
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swentel but it's handy now at least for comments
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swentel webmentions which are a 'reply-to' create unpublished comments
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swentel but now my site sends a noticiation to a channel in aperture
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swentel and from there I can publish it :)
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swentel or from the posts list
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swentel it's freaking awesome hehe
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[eddie] 👏 Sounds like some really great work, swentel! These type of breakthroughs are what makes owning your data SO much more realistic
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swentel yeah absolutely
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jgmac1106 @eddie its weird I can find no post data, it is calles “author’s note 2: research and mind mapping, description written like a podcast
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[eddie] Oh yeah that’s a super old post from last year
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[eddie] ohhh actually that might have been exactly a year ago
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[eddie] maybe you subscribed to my on this day feed?
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[eddie] oh nope, Oct 17, 2017
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[eddie] hmm
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sknebel yeah, which feed is it?
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jgmac1106 your next post in my feed or going to the church of the redeeemer
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sknebel the podcast tag page has no mf2 at all: https://eddiehinkle.com/tag/podcast/, but then it also wouldn't show up in a reader at all
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Loqi Eddie Hinkle
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jgmac1106 just eddiehinkle.com rss, I would have subscribed to microformats if a choice, figuring yours were proper, I could try the rss
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[eddie] ohhh my rss is probably all jacked up
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[eddie] I need to fix it
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jgmac1106 thx, will delete and readd you
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[eddie] My most consistent feed is https://eddiehinkle.com/timeline/
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[eddie] which is also an h-feed
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snarfed lol of the day, in which bridgy tries to send a webmention to a dat:// url: https://brid.gy/log?start_time=1537204732&key=aglzfmJyaWQtZ3lyNgsSCFJlc3BvbnNlIih0YWc6dHdpdHRlci5jb20sMjAxMzoxMDQxNzA1NjUyNDA4NjM5NDg4DA
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Loqi snarfed: jackjamieson left you a message 2 days, 4 hours ago: BTW, I followed up on Moa's removal of @ mentions to Twitter and got a bit more information https://github.com/foozmeat/moa/issues/53#issuecomment-421427659
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snarfed "InvalidSchema: No connection adapters were found for 'http://dat//skulls.hashbase.io/'" 🤷‍♀️😆
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eddiehinkle.com edited /site-deaths (+788) "/* Upcoming */ +Path" (view diff)
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[eddie] Bye bye Path 👋
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voxpelli has actually been thinking of publishing webmentions to dat ;P
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voxpelli Related issue: https://github.com/voxpelli/webpage-webmentions/issues/49 :)
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Loqi [voxpelli] #49 Expose webmention lists on Dat?
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voxpelli too bad dat only has a js-implementation – makes it kind of hard to have as a generic protocol to fetch html over
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sknebel been meaning to integrate dat into my webmention endpoint
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jgmac1106 voxpelli there are a few folks playing with dat and webmentions
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jgmac1106 thought I saw some first attempts at Summit with some demos…would have to back and look
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@jgmac1106 @anildash searching @glitch (used indieweb, webmention, indieauth, cms, storage) find almost all  #IndieWeb building blocks one needs to build and launch a CMS. Let’s create this pathway. If you are willing to pay bet customers will too. (http://jgregorymcverry.com/6964-2/) (twitter.com/_/status/1041776322001993728)
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jgmac1106 @aaronpk when we add our podcast to microcast.club we use the podcast url but many links (including mine) go to the canonical url and not the podcast url. Are people doing something wrong?
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sknebel what feed did you submit to add?
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aaronpk i'm not sure I understand the question
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jgmac1106 so I added this link to microcast.club https://jgregorymcverry.com/series/2toponder/ but when you click on my podcast it brings you to https://jgregorymcverry.com
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jgmac1106 happens to a bunch of the urls and makes the actual microcast tougher to find
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aaronpk it links to whatever the podcast feed has in the website field
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jgmac1106 …hmmm then people (including me) have some pretty bad feeds
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jgmac1106 clicking through them very folks link to the actual podcast url
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aaronpk https://jgregorymcverry.com/series/2toponder/ doesn't appear to be a podcast xml feed you shouldn't have been able to add that to microcast.club
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aaronpk https://jgregorymcverry.com/feed/podcast/2toponder is the xml feed
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aaronpk but that feed has "https://jgregorymcverry.com/" as the website
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aaronpk so any podcast player is also going to be linking to your home page if it displays a link
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jgmac1106 I also realize I need to learn to count as I am missing both episode six and 12, guess an excuse for a “lost episode” special
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aaronpk micro.blog likely also links to the person's micro.blog home page so that might also be what you're seeing
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aaronpk since micro.blog podcast feeds include only the audio posts from someone's micro.blog account
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jgmac1106 okay makes sense. i was going through many of them and its hard to find the actual podcast…I need to make my top nav more transparent
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aaronpk there isn't really anything I can do about that, especially since podcast apps themselves will be linking to the same thing since that's what is in the podcast feed
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jgmac1106 taught me something, that’s doing plenty,
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tantek__ I know jgmac1106 already knows about / has seen this, lots to unpack in this quote: https://twitter.com/Borthwick/status/1041459801094598656
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@Borthwick @kevinmarks @ricmac Its on medium, I gave up posting to my blog a while ago — given spammers, the hassle of maintence and better distribution and reading tools on medium. (twitter.com/_/status/1041459801094598656)
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tantek__ there's a mix of valid (or otherwise confirmed) reasons/experience, and the misconceived or at least arguable difference with Medium
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jgmac1106 yes and I am also trying to get at this idea I hear in dev communites “well if the writing ui was just simpler I would write more”….no…if you write mroe you write more
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tantek__ s/simpler/better
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jgmac1106 I also saw someone post a cms they made that was an indistinguishable medium clone
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jgmac1106 simple != easy in both writing words or code
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jgmac1106 I gave up on Medium as I was rate limited to 10 posts a day, but the difference in traffic is spot on.
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tantek__ Twitter is an example of a "simpler" writing UI, that did/does result in "writing more" but not necessarily better.
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jgmac1106 yeah and with three you kids, ain’t nothing simple about learning to ride a bike, takes years…
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tantek__ jgmac1106: I presume that's a paraphrasing however. If you have actual public posts from such dev communities, would be useful to capture / cite / analyze them.
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tantek__ the difference is traffic is debatable - different people have had different experiences
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jgmac1106 yeah just a thought been percolating as I see so many people not write as they strive to find or build the perfect environment..but in many ways the simpler UI lead to the cambrian silo explosion
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tantek__ and even there, the "better distribution" assertion cloaks a false dichotomy, that assumes post on your own site OR post on Medium, whereas the IndieWeb approach is POSSE, to do *both*, starting with your own site
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jgmac1106 yeah just my traffic…but I gave up on caring for analytics as I don’t need to write to eat. Those that do it is understandable. I have been with Medium through all their forks
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jgmac1106 ….up to ten a day and then Medium cuts you off tor 24 hours
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jgmac1106 I do have a series of post I will need to find comparing my site traffic a few years ago to Medium…Medium had anywhere from a 10x-100x difference in traffic
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jgmac1106 the “Why am I using this?” parapgraph confuses me though, its central thesis is web 2.0 is broken so I use a web 2.0 platform…but I think decentraliziation is the heart of the distrbuted web…that’s my bias
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tantek__ still doesn't invalidate using POSSE instead of making it an artificial self vs. Medium decision
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jgmac1106 no, not all…POSSE until cut off
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jgmac1106 I just decided to use the story importer, haven’t published to medium in a few months and still pick up 4k reads a day…if we trust what Medium calls a read…I have no analtyics on my website but I know there is no way i get 4k uniques a day
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jgmac1106 oops over thirty days…sounds more reasonable…way higher than my blog still…for stale content
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tantek__ that's a good question - how do you know if you can trust their own self-serving stats?
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jgmac1106 maybe not 100-150 a day probably about my dailys….avoids temptation to add google analytics or jetpack back
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tantek__ hmm "POSSE until cut off" is interesting, perhaps that's a hint that more custom text is needed in the POSSE copy, warning people that they're seeing n of 10, and that for more articles they need to go to (original site URL)
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jgmac1106 and I meant like FB and Instagram cut off….seems writing on the wall is there for Twitter as well
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jgmac1106 I thought I added a screenshot to the medium section of possse with my cut off, if not I will add….time to leave office and start trek home
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tantek__ wait I though you said you could only post 10 posts per day to Medium?
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jgmac1106 yes, so there is the daily cut off…and the lifetime end of POSSE (facebook)
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jgmac1106 I thought I documented the 1o post per day cut off to medium, if I haven’t will when home
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tantek__ yes, please screen capture and post later!
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tantek__ just checked /Medium and didn't see the "post per day cut off to medium"
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@jgmac1106 Finally new social readers like @aaronpk  built  unify reading & writing space combined with standards like webmentions and this addresses your need for a cleaner reading/writing space. The #indieweb stuff so cool. Its the web we all want (http://jgregorymcverry.com/6987-2/) (twitter.com/_/status/1041796274729693184)
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@tomcritchlow ↩️ yes! completely agree - there's something missing for sure. I thought webmention might be part of the answer but sheesh it's easy to get started with....! Let me know if I can help or just chat about the vision. Been thinking about it a lot also. (twitter.com/_/status/1041803439578259456)
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aaronpk https://twitter.com/inevernu/status/1041802919048359937?s=20 That sounds like webmention for sure :-)
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@inevernu @tomcritchlow Comments are dead in large swaths of the blogosphere, I’m thinking more of some kind of global @ notification system and a social feed like RSS without the mechanics and wording of RSS. (twitter.com/_/status/1041802919048359937)
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aaronpk Webmention + Microformats
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tantek__ precisely
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tantek__ what is global @ notification system
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "global @ notification system" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "global @ notification system is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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tantek__ global @ notification system is /Webmention
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Loqi ok
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loqi.me created /global_@_notification_system (+23) "prompted by tantek__ and redirect added by tantek__" (view diff)
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tantek__ what is social feed like RSS without the mechanics and wording of RSS
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "social feed like RSS without the mechanics and wording of RSS" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "social feed like RSS without the mechanics and wording of RSS is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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tantek__ social feed like RSS without the mechanics and wording of RSS is /h-feed
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Loqi ok
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loqi.me created /social_feed_like_RSS_without_the_mechanics_and_wording_of_RSS (+19) "prompted by tantek__ and redirect added by tantek__" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /IRC (+145) "/* Advanced / Admin notes */ Turning off auto op for yourself" (view diff)
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tantek__ .
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Iciloo10 Аllah iѕ doing
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tantek__ Loqi is apparently failing to +v me in #microformats: we have made very good progress on https://github.com/microformats/microformats2-parsing/issues/2 - rough consensus on https://github.com/microformats/microformats2-parsing/issues/2#issuecomment-392608361 , an implementation, and yet I think we still need test cases for verification, plus worth discussion text alternative content in audio, video, etc.
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Loqi [aaronpk] #2 image alt text is lost during parsing
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