#dev 2018-10-12

2018-10-12 UTC
[asuh] and snarfed joined the channel
#
jacky do y'all store h-entry and h-card info differently in your systems?
#
jacky I don't see them (h-geo, h-adr, h-entry) as things you can just stuff in the same place
#
jacky (or rather, my implementation allows for it but I'd end up making a separate table for these)
#
jacky yeah imma store them separately
#
jacky is working on this at 31,678 ft!
renem, [jgmac1106] and [tantek] joined the channel
#
[tantek] Jacky I use well formed HTML5 with micro formats as my storage format. In memory I use PHP arrays of arrays etc which map very well to the parsed mf2 model
[jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106] My issue with HTML5 I keep running up against is the infinity scroll website that may have many links to h-entry on same page.
#
KartikPrabhu that isn't an issue with HTML5
#
KartikPrabhu it is people having JS infinite scroll
#
Ruxton what's wrong with having multiple h-entry per page?
#
KartikPrabhu nothing. [jgmac1106] is talking about loading additional content on scroll
#
KartikPrabhu with javascript
#
Ruxton ahh
#
KartikPrabhu so yeah, nothing to do with HTML%
#
KartikPrabhu 5
#
dansup nothing wrong with infinite scroll if you implement it properly ;)
#
Ruxton infinite scroll pages that have footers are fun :P
#
Ruxton i..just..want.. to.. see..the..footer!
#
KartikPrabhu dansup: any guidelines on what "properly" means?
#
KartikPrabhu otherwise it is a tautology
#
dansup as a progressive enhancement, you should still allow regular pagination if js is disabled and not require js or the use of infinite scroll
#
dansup thats what I did for https://pixelfed.social
#
KartikPrabhu dansup: yup! sounds good :)
#
KartikPrabhu again it is about bad JS implementations and not HTML5
#
dansup I am working to add more indieweb support, it does support rel=me! https://pixelfed.social/dansup
snarfed, [tantek], [pfefferle] and [Rose] joined the channel
#
[Rose] I'm really excited about the idea of pixelfed. I'm hoping I can have one site and just have my image posts become my Pixelfed feed (I'm already going to set up https://fed.brid.gy, which hopefully will put me in good stead)
chrisaldrich joined the channel
#
dansup [Rose]: It does support Atom too! https://pixelfed.social/users/pixelfed.atom :)
#
[Rose] Woot! Grav will let me create a second atom feed (or hundreds!), so grabbing my pictures should be easy.
#
Loqi yay!
#
dansup [Rose]: I am releasing a feature called Collections which is like Twitter Moments for Instagram posts. That will make it easy to make albums of albums or single photos or videos. They will be included in the atom feed too. https://mastodon.social/@dansup/100829384487521497
#
Loqi [dansup] :pixelfed: Collections will be ready for the Oct 17th launch 😉 #pixelfed https://files.mastodon.social/media_attachments/files/006/815/437/original/d502732127ea001a.png
#
[Rose] Is there a feed where I can follow all of this? I already follow you on Mastodon I hope
#
[Rose] Ahem, I am indeed following you on Mastodon (rectified!)
#
[Rose] I think I want to stop using OwnYourGram, and instead use Shortcuts to post to Instagram, my Micropub endpoint, and Mastodon, that might be a good start.
[asuh] joined the channel
#
dansup [Rose]: Pixelfed will support the mastodon API so cross posting will be easy :)
jjuran, helloworld and [Rose] joined the channel
#
[Rose] 😄
[pfefferle] joined the channel
#
[pfefferle] good morning
#
Loqi greetings human
[deeden], swentel, [chegalabonga], [chrisburnell], [Rose], [Vincent], [jgmac1106] and renem joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106] FYI https://matomo.org/
[grantcodes] joined the channel
#
Zegnat What is Matomo?
#
Loqi analytics is the collection, analysis and reporting of a websites traffic https://indieweb.org/Matomo
#
Zegnat Looks like we got that one
#
[jgmac1106] Sweet, me deliberately avoids analytics. Learning I do all this work for 7 uniques per post would be scart
#
[jgmac1106] Scary
#
[jgmac1106] I'd end up writing 7 ways your teacher will use this unbelievable technique for new synergies
[kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
jgmac1106 well looks I won’t be able to get syndication back on Twitter from Known anytime soon: Hello,
#
jgmac1106 “Your Twitter account (or accounts associated with you) currently has multiple registered applications, in potential violation of Twitter's rules on the use of multiple API keys for a single use case. You can learn more about those rules here.
#
jgmac1106 If these applications serve distinct use cases under our policies, please reply to this email with a specific use case for each registered application."
#
jgmac1106 Twitter
#
[kevinmarks] [jgmac1106] the case against analytics on your students https://speakerdeck.com/dsalo/we-surveilled-and-afraid-in-a-world-we-never-made
#
jgmac1106 thx yeah folks are starting to track things like how many meal points are used compared to GPA, why I like teaching IndieWeb school gets no analytics on my students
KartikPrabhu and [schmarty] joined the channel
#
Zegnat You have separate API keys for all those things, jgmac1106?
#
Zegnat Just use the same API key for Known & WordPress & w/e?
#
[jgmac1106] I have like 47.3 blogs, I just deleted old ones
dougbeal|mb1 joined the channel
#
Zegnat jgmac1106, was just reading #indieweb. Something you may want to think about if you are going to play ambassodor: what is the road off of Glitch like?
#
Zegnat If I start hosting tools on Glitch, how do they survive if Glitch closes? There is the GitHub export I have heard about, but that doesn’t automatically equate to being able to use the tool
#
jgmac1106 it’s good people, folks I have known long time Marc Lesser from Mouse, bunch of friends from Girls Who Code, it will be all exportable and has to ne node.js. You get to assign any license to your product
#
Zegnat I get that it is Node. But is the export emediately executable in plain Node, would be my biggest question
#
[jgmac1106] ask someone with real dev knowledge or try it now
#
[jgmac1106] @schamrty here is how they currently support custom domains: https://fly.io/
#
[jgmac1106] but that really isn't custom domains but app hosting
#
[schmarty] I use fly.io for the indie webring. I believe it’s a proxy service in front of my glitch-hosted project.
#
Zegnat [schmarty], if you export a project, can you immediately run it? Or does it depend on some glitch-native libs?
#
[schmarty] Zegnat: I haven’t tried to run on locally yet but it looks like plain old node. In theory could npm install and go. Maybe even put it on Heroku or similar. I am speculating until I try it.
[manton], snarfed, eli_oat, [pfefferle] and [grantcodes] joined the channel
#
[grantcodes] Yes, it's basic node. With some environment variables basically
#
Zegnat [grantcodes], that’s good to hear!
#
[grantcodes] Yep, should be fairly straightforward to migrate if you know what you're doing with node.
#
[grantcodes] Oh the only thing I think is hidden is they load a .env file into the environment variables, so you'd have to do something with that if you used them
benwerd and snarfed joined the channel
#
@grantpotter ↩️ @edtechfactotum https://webmention.rocks/ is a useful way to test out #webmention bits (twitter.com/_/status/1050769071594266625)
[jgmac1106] and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
litwaDX bucketbot pls
#
litwaDX _Coffee, do you understand the difference between users, groups, programs and hostnames
#
KartikPrabhu !kick litwaDX
[tantek] joined the channel
#
@jgmac1106 It’s Coming Webmentions vs Zombies https://wmvsz.glitch.me/ #doo #digped #literacies #ds106 #clmooc #edu106 Join me on @glitch http://glitch.com/edit/#!/join/7326b19e-7619-4ffe-a72b-1606e4b3ddd as a remix the OG #tvsz game for the web. (http://jgregorymcverry.com/7868-2/) (twitter.com/_/status/1050771423726325764)
#
[jgmac1106] what is postmill?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "postmill" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "postmill is ____", a sentence describing the term)
#
[jgmac1106] worth adding? anyone know anything? *https://postmill.xyz/*
#
Zegnat Never heard of it :/
#
@edtechfactotum ↩️ Thanks! I was reading your blog post last night and see that you have added the plugins to http://networkeffects.ca/ You are also using Ghost theme. Are any of the Webmentions displaying on your site? (twitter.com/_/status/1050777666897424384)
[eddie] and swentel joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106] [schmarty] [kevinmarks] [grantcodes] people wanted to know if we could get close to having all the building blocks for lightweight indieweb blogging tool that would go to fly.io
[grantcodes] joined the channel
#
[grantcodes] why on fly.io?
#
[grantcodes] What is fly.io?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "fly.io" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "fly.io is ____", a sentence describing the term)
#
jgmac1106 currently that is there only way to supply a custom domain…theoretically someone could hopefully download the building blocks and try it themselves
#
[grantcodes] Can you not just do a cname? Or nginx reverse proxy?
#
jgmac1106 no cname, didnt ask about nginx reverse proxy because I have no idea what that is
[schmarty] joined the channel
#
[schmarty] grantcodes: an nginx reverse proxy can work if you fudge the headers upstream
#
[schmarty] that is essentially what fly.io does
#
[grantcodes] Eh doesn't really matter too much, but just a building blocks based thing with a custom domain
#
[schmarty] jgmac1106: it's possible to build a blog made of indieweb building blocks like micropub on glitch, with fly.io providing a domain name in front. the pieces i built for ghostparty.today could be reused (my port of selfauth to handle indieauth) or remixed (the micropub endpoint that saves to neocities could save to glitch instead).
#
jgmac1106 now you have me wondering if I could do it in time for: https://wmvsz.glitch.me/
#
[grantcodes] I have this https://micropub-endpoint.glitch.me/ which is a bit more fully featured and can run entirely on glitch, still needs work though
#
Zegnat tries to find the rules for wmvsz
#
jgmac1106 want them in html
#
jgmac1106 https://wmvsz.glitch.me/rules.html
#
jgmac1106 yeah and [kevinmarks] made this: https://indiewebblog.glitch.me/
#
jgmac1106 grrrrr why would gDocs export html to a single line of code.??????
#
Zegnat run it through tidy, if you have it on your machine
#
[kevinmarks] Except I didn't do login as I was confused how, but if they do add indielogin to their accounts that would make it easier. Otherwise will need an external account.
[cleverdevil] joined the channel
#
Zegnat http://www.html-tidy.org/ - jgmac1106
#
jgmac1106 [schmarty] figured out indielogin with webring
#
Zegnat Looking forward to how you are going to translate rule #1 to indieweb, jgmac1106 :D
#
jgmac1106 (u-syndication-of) to somewhere
#
jgmac1106 and every link will be a reply-to, the first one being patient zero
#
jgmac1106 thinking, bite, dodge, swipe, will each be their own syndicated feed, and you change p-organization in your h-card for human or zombie
#
Zegnat I’d use something like p-wmvsz-role or something for that. Not overloading previously accepted labels.
#
jgmac1106 zombies aren’t allowed to organize?
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
jgmac1106 I am giving them h-cards: https://glitch.com/edit/#!/wmvsz?path=thezombies.html:14:10
#
jgmac1106 oops
#
Zegnat Oh, uh, I guess. I was thinking players might be playing as themselves from their own blogs. But if that isn’t what is happening, sure
#
[jgmac1106] it is just having fun, want them writing a narrative as well
#
[jgmac1106] but I will probably just use human and zombie as a tag as well
[tantek] and petermolnar joined the channel
#
jgmac1106 what is the difference between pre and code
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "difference between pre and code" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "difference between pre and code is ____", a sentence describing the term)
#
Zegnat In HTML?
#
Zegnat pre if for preformatted text (keeps whitespace), code is just semantically saying the text is computer code
#
jgmac1106 trying to display a reply link here: https://wmvsz.glitch.me/rules.html
#
[schmarty] [jgmac1106] if it's a multi-line block of text, you probably want to wrap it with a pre tag, to preserve whitespace when it's rendered in the browser.
#
jgmac1106 can you not use them within a list item?
#
jgmac1106 pre><link href="#" class="u-in-reply-to"></pre>
snarfed joined the channel
#
jgmac1106 maybe its just glitch its rendering this as well <pre><p><em>This was also posted to
#
jgmac1106 <a href="https://indieweb.xyz/en/bite" class="u-syndication">/en/bite</a>.</em></p></pre>
#
jacky how was https://indieweb.org/post-type-discovery#Algorithm discerned?
#
jacky is working on implementing this at the moment
#
Zegnat Using a <pre> or <code> element doesn’t suddenly render HTML, jgmac1106. If you want to show the tags you need to encode the < and > symbols
#
jgmac1106 just used to EWordPress you want a code snippet youjusthighlight the text and select preformatted, fun fact I can’t do it in plin text editor only rich
#
jacky yeah you'd have to swap < with &lt; and > with &gt;
#
jacky html entities ftw
#
Zegnat “I can’t do it in plin text editor” - depends on your editor of choice
#
Zegnat Hmm. I thought mine could do it, but it doesn’t seem to be able to. Ha
snarfed and benwerd joined the channel
#
jgmac1106 there really isn’t an html tag that says “hey this is a code snippet don’t render but display it as palin text?”
#
swentel that would be a killer tag :)
#
jacky I mean you could cheat with <textarea> lol
#
jacky and set it to be readonly
#
swentel hehehe
#
Zegnat You may also be able to cheat with <script> ? Can you set display:block; on those?
#
Zegnat hasn’t tried that wrangling in a while
#
jacky that might throw an error
#
jgmac1106 this works yeah you'd have to swap < with &lt; and > with &gt;
#
jgmac1106 its easy
#
jacky unless you set the type to be `text/plain`
#
Zegnat jacky, yeah, that’s what I was thinking. Don’t leave type on JS
#
Zegnat Now I want to try and figure this out, ha
#
jacky lolol
#
jacky gonna bump my question re: post-type discovery once more tho
#
jacky did that just kinda spawn on its own?
#
jacky or is it like an interpretation of each h- type from microformats.org?
#
Zegnat I think it came up as a question of how to render things you are reading. It is modelled on mf2 properties, but it isn’t actually dependend on those. E.g. you could find whatever schema properties are equal and use the same algo on those
#
Zegnat But exact history, [tantek] will be able to tell you if it isn’t already on the wiki
#
jacky ack
#
jacky just as I did that
#
jacky there's a whole spec on it
#
jacky http://ptd.spec.indieweb.org
#
Loqi [Tantek Çelik] Post Type Discovery
#
jacky oh wait this is interesting
#
jacky it looks very simple to map MF2 -> AS2
#
jgmac1106 https://wmvsz.glitch.me/rules.html would love feedback on rules, especially thinking about timing and webmentions, thinking I may have to drop bridgy webmentions as those can take time correct?
#
snarfed jgmac1106: you're just considering bridgy's hosted blog webmentions, right? ie blogger, wordpress.com, tumblr? those should be pretty quick
#
jgmac1106 okay, yeah that is what most people were doing, I set turns to 20 minutes instead of the five they were for twitter,trying to come up with a fun halloweenish activity for my students
[pfefferle] and KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
@jgmac1106 @jessifer hope you can us for webmentions versus zombies: https://wmvsz.glitch.me/ or at least spread the word. Haven’t picked date yet. (http://jgregorymcverry.com/7874-2/) (twitter.com/_/status/1050810804918988800)
#
snarfed jacky: feel free to try granary's mf2 -> as2 conversion. https://granary.io/?input=mf2-json
#
snarfed (also as1, atom, etc)
#
jacky niceeee
#
jacky snarfed++
#
Loqi snarfed has 68 karma in this channel over the last year (120 in all channels)
#
jacky tempted to use this to pipe my site's content
#
snarfed other people here do too
#
Zegnat jacky, I think rhiaro wrote a mapping once, if I remember right
[schmarty] joined the channel
#
[schmarty] uses granary to generate the atom feed for his site
benwerd and [jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
sknebel [schmarty]: is fly.io free for that domain-for-glitch use case?
[grantcodes] joined the channel
#
sknebel ah, found their pricing page.
[asuh] and snarfed joined the channel
#
gRegorLove newbie nginx question: I'm trying to turn off autoindex for all directories and it appears you can only do that with location directives. I tried a regex, but no dice: `location ~* /(.*)?/$`
#
sknebel no, you can put that on all levels
#
sknebel not quite right: all below "http"
#
gRegorLove sorry I don't follow?
#
sknebel you can put the autoindex off directive outside a location block
#
gRegorLove I tried that. Oh, I bet I didn't restart nginx
#
sknebel in the docs they quite nicely list where you can use something "Context:" https://nginx.org/en/docs/http/ngx_http_autoindex_module.html#autoindex
[schmarty] joined the channel
#
[schmarty] [sknebel] fly.io is free for that purpose as far as i understand
#
sknebel oh, ok. looked to me you just get $25 to start off with
#
sknebel of course, that's going to last a bit since there's no monthly minimum, unlike most other CDNs one could use
#
gRegorLove sknebel++ thanks! totally overlooked that. Working now.
#
Loqi sknebel has 27 karma in this channel over the last year (78 in all channels)
#
gRegorLove I must say, so far I'm liking the formatting of the nginx config files vs Apache htaccess
#
jacky nginx config > apache
#
jacky .b 51
#
[schmarty] sknebel: i'm using fly.io to point kapowski.schmarty.net at the glitch app that actually runs it. no billing info on file.
#
[schmarty] i *think* fly.io CNAME -> glitch app is free.
#
[schmarty] (note: CNAME means you can't use bare domains like example.com)
#
jgmac1106 then again maybe I wait until we get all the pieces going in Glitch and use that for my stream, would just want article, note, reply, quote, bookmark, photo at a minimum
#
jgmac1106 but atleast we would have example in the wild
#
jgmac1106 …though I would probably juist throw a node.js app on a subdomain
benwerd, [cleverdevil], [tantek] and tantek__ joined the channel
#
[tantek] jacky++ for building your own engine the way you want!
#
Loqi jacky has 3 karma in this channel over the last year (10 in all channels)
#
[tantek] reads https://jacky.wtf/weblog/building-koype/
#
Loqi [Jacky Alciné] I’m Working on a New Engine for My Site
swentel and snarfed joined the channel
#
@jackbarber Just testing something https://northyorkshireforestschool.co.uk/blog/2017-12-29-welcome-to-north-yorkshire-forest-school #webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/1050872453583568897)
gRegorLove and tantek__ joined the channel
#
gRegorLove what is fly.io?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "fly.io" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "fly.io is ____", a sentence describing the term)
snarfed joined the channel
#
[tantek] what is .io
#
Loqi io may refer to: input/output .io short domain Google's annual IO conference https://indieweb.org/io
benwerd joined the channel
#
@JRDingwall ↩️ I’ve been trying to comment along the way as well, but opted to use ping backs and write my comment on my own site. Saw your webmention test today and am interested but don’t know much about that approach (twitter.com/_/status/1050880809706483713)
tantek__, snarfed, strugee and [kevinmarks] joined the channel