#dev 2018-11-19

2018-11-19 UTC
[jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
gRegorLove
Is anyone using rel=me in Link: HTTP headers?
deathrow1 joined the channel
#
gRegorLove
I have one example, just checking if there's others.
#
GWG
gRegorLove: What is the use case?
#
gRegorLove
Unsure, I'm primarily collecting data.
#
gRegorLove
In the one example I have, it's an Atom feed, so it could potentially be easier to expand indieweb/rel-me to check HTTP headers than to add XML support to php-mf2
#
GWG
Me for a feed seems odd to me
#
gRegorLove
It uses XSLT to present human-friendly. It is definitely an edge case, from what I've seen.
#
gRegorLove
So I thought I'd check if anyone else was using the Link header for that, whether on HTML or XML
#
GWG
I've been in parsing land all week
#
gRegorLove
GWG: In that php-mf2 issue about id, you said "Mostly because a URL like the one in the example, makes it easy to share feeds with others.
#
gRegorLove
" Are you referring to humans sharing feed URLs, or the software's internal representation of it?
#
GWG
Both
#
GWG
So, humans sharing feed URLs and the software storing it.
#
GWG
gRegorLove: While tantek is the most famous example of h-card with child h-feeds, there are other people with multiple h-feeds on the same page
#
GWG
So, I'd like to sort of solve that for h-feed discovery
#
gRegorLove
Makes sense
#
gRegorLove
If I enter tantek.com in a feed reader, it can present the names of the feeds, when I select "Recent Articles" it saves the feed as tantek.com#recent_articles
#
gRegorLove
And if I entered tantek.com#recent_articles in a feed reader, it can subscribe directly to that feed with no selection necessary
#
gRegorLove
With `#recent_articles` coming from the new `id` attribute in the parsed mf2
eli_oat1 joined the channel
#
GWG
gRegorLove: Is that going to merge? You are a regular php-mf2 committer
#
gRegorLove
I was going to wait a day or two for discussion, but yes I'm in favor of adding it. Should be pretty easy.
#
Loqi
[sknebel] #44 parse HTML id= property
#
GWG
gRegorLove: That is why I like the discussion. My original idea had issues we discussed.
#
GWG
I think that is part of the same proposal, isn't it?
#
gRegorLove
That is *the* proposal, afaik.
#
gRegorLove
Just checking your thoughts on it
#
GWG
I think it is better than my idea
#
GWG
Between that and the read-status thing...
#
gRegorLove
Not sure where that sentence is going, heh
#
GWG
If we solve both of those this month, I'll be happy
#
GWG
What did you decide on read-status?
#
jgmac1106
[gwg] I thought p-category was goiing to be used for status?
#
gRegorLove
That was the idea. Just need to think it through some more.
#
gRegorLove
And selfdogfood it first, of course.
#
GWG
jgmac1106: I was waiting for gRegorLove to dogfood it for me.
#
jgmac1106
working on my read post right now, didn’t write the php function for the p-category selection….gonna just live in the past tense for awhile
#
gRegorLove
jgmac1106++
#
Loqi
jgmac1106 has 7 karma in this channel over the last year (77 in all channels)
#
jgmac1106
and realizes adding an author field probably made everythign go batty as author is porbably used all over the place
#
gRegorLove
jgmac1106, author inside the h-cite makes sense for the book's author
#
GWG
I wanted to do POSSE to Pinboard and then work on importing my old Pinboard bookmarks, but importing 38,000 bookmarks is going to be a challenge
#
jgmac1106
yeah there wasn’t an author field I am taking a watch post type and trying to convert it...I want the sytem where I just write the html templates to do what I want
#
GWG
I want as full a citation as possible when I'm doing watch, listen, etc
#
jgmac1106
yeah, I may start over and rebuild the read plugin I am working on..missing some stuff I want like the h-cite for the author
#
jgmac1106
I really want a watch, read, and listen post type done before next semester
#
gRegorLove
Just replied to your post, jgmac1106. If it's easy to do in Known, @-mentioning gregorlove.com might catch my attention quicker than a Twitter mention.
#
jgmac1106
yeah gRegorLove I have to get used to the fact that I can send native webmentions
#
jgmac1106
…but writing the idno plugin just got a little bit more involved, gonna have to start from scratch, write the template files and work my way backwaords through the php functions….which means I need to learn about how to “work my way backwaords through the php functions”
#
gRegorLove
GWG, can you list those additional examples on https://github.com/microformats/php-mf2/issues/206, particularly if the multiple feeds don't have u-uid
#
Loqi
[dshanske] #206 Add optional ID for h-* elements
#
GWG
Which additional examples?
#
@jgmac1106
↩️ Well I wrote a @withknown post that sent a webmention to your original post, I also syndicated my post to Twitter using plugins. Now I am replying just to your tweet, but it shoudl sow up on our both our sites. You need the Twitter and Bridgy… https://quickthoughts.jgregorymcverry.com/2018/11/19/edheil-well-i-wrote-a-withknown-post
(twtr.io/1kbmGVvVSkM)
#
mblaney
GWG you mentioned examples of multiple h-feeds on a page earlier, would be good to list them as we only know of tantek's.
#
GWG
I was thinking of [jgmac1106] telling me he was just doing it
cambridgeport90, [tantek] and [eddie] joined the channel
#
[eddie]
!tell aaronpk I think telegraph might be broken. I have a handful of webmentions that are in “queue to send” Mode
#
Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
snarfed joined the channel
#
aaronpk
Hm weird
#
Loqi
aaronpk: petermolnar left you a message 18 hours, 13 minutes ago: is there any api or import way to populate aperture from an extermal source with subscriptions?
#
Loqi
aaronpk: [eddie] left you a message 17 minutes ago: I think telegraph might be broken. I have a handful of webmentions that are in “queue to send” Mode
#
aaronpk
I just kicked it and it looks like it's going again but it's being kind of slow
#
aaronpk
can't tell right now, but maybe it's gettting stuck on a particular webmention. I've seen some sites timing out before and I'm not sure how well this is set up to handle that right now
#
[eddie]
Ohhh interesting
#
[eddie]
Makes sense
[tantek], treora and [asuh] joined the channel
#
Loqi
[mro] #5008 .Owner.Website with rel="me" ?
#
aaronpk
what exactly is the goal here?
#
aaronpk
oh hey apparently there are also Microformats on the issue pages?
#
aaronpk
Oh that was a GitHub link lol nvm
#
aaronpk
thought it was gogs because the project is gogs
[eddie] and barpthewire joined the channel
#
@WalterStephanie
↩️ Webmentions lets you ping back to your website and post the comments and mentions and responses back to the original post. - https://webmention.io/ - https://brid.gy/ #vdthess18
(twtr.io/1kcP7e6b7tb)
#
@WalterStephanie
↩️ Webmentions lets you ping back to your website and post the comments and mentions and responses back to the original post. - https://webmention.io/ - https://brid.gy/ #vdthess18
(twtr.io/1kcP7e6b7tb)
#
@geoffrey_crofte
↩️ Discovering https://brid.gy and http://Webmention.io thanks to @adactio talk at #vdthess18
(twtr.io/1kcPEQzmnFC)
#
@geoffrey_crofte
↩️ Discovering https://brid.gy and http://Webmention.io thanks to @adactio talk at #vdthess18
(twtr.io/1kcPEQzmnFC)
cweiske and [Vincent] joined the channel
#
@BriceCq
RT @stephaniewalter@mastodon.social Webmentions lets you ping back to your website and post the comments and mentions and responses back to the original post. - https://webmention.io/ - (1/2)
(twtr.io/1kcQ7cDAbWw)
[kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
@tomcritchlowBOT
V curious about webmentions and the textual waveform:
(twtr.io/1kcWfeSRoeU)
[jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
@nhoizey
And Webmentions allow us to remove Disqus and own the interactions data: https://nicolas-hoizey.com/2017/07/so-long-disqus-hello-webmentions.html
(twtr.io/1kc_Ja_c2nU)
jjuran, [Vincent] and jeremych_ joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106]
How do I compile a default CSS sheet into a mini css sheet. Tired of making chanoin two places... Also what does having a mini sheet do? Make load times faster?
#
sknebel
what is a "mini css sheet"?
#
Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "mini css sheet" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "mini css sheet is ____", a sentence describing the term)
swentel joined the channel
#
jgmac1106
sknebel sorry I have default.css and default.min.css and I know most systems do, just never understodd why you have to mantain two style sheets
#
sknebel
yeah, that's just to save on some data transfer/load times
#
petermolnar
that's the myth
#
petermolnar
gzip, and you're done
#
sknebel
the key word you're looking for is a CSS minifier, but you can also just not bother with minimzed CSS, especially if you're still working on it
#
jgmac1106
how though, do those extra spcaes characters truly slow down modern browser engines?
#
petermolnar
minification, in theory, goes further
#
jgmac1106
problem is with Known it only recognizes the minified sheet, I find myself changing both
#
petermolnar
it should join similar statements, shorten class references, etc
#
petermolnar
but that's need support on the HTML side as well
#
Zegnat
Just change your theme to link to the non-minified version, jgmac1106
#
petermolnar
generally speaking it doesn't worth bothering with it
#
petermolnar
just make certain you turn server side gzip on
#
Zegnat
You should never be editing the .min.css file by hand anyway
#
petermolnar
unless you like the main
#
petermolnar
s/main/pain
#
jgmac1106
okay thanks everyone, have a goal for the day I hate mini css sheets, so useless for a person to read
#
Loqi
it is probable
#
Zegnat
minifying might be good practice if you are inlining critical css. Don’t know what the recommended best practice is on that
#
jgmac1106
I had to edit by hand it was the only way the changes registered like the idea of just pointing to the other sheet
#
Zegnat
But generally, I am with petermolnar, don’t bother with it unless that is the final part that needs optimising
#
jeremycherfas
All-in-oneifying is supposed to be a good idea too, but I've never known how to do that.
#
petermolnar
*unless you're Google
#
petermolnar
jeremycherfas: you mean inline all the things?
#
jeremycherfas
Nah. There is a way of combining all the CSS sheets into one, which I have seen described as a good thing.
#
Zegnat
Or concatting all the CSS files together? Which is also a thing. But that is just to keep down on simultaneous HTTP requests
#
petermolnar
cat *.css > all.css ?
#
Zegnat
Yeah, that is an HTTP request optimisation, jeremycherfas. Again, probably not actually a bottleneck on your personal website
#
petermolnar
Zegnat: depends
#
petermolnar
HTTPS from australia is slow
#
petermolnar
imo reducing the number of calls makes more sense, then minifying
#
Zegnat
Browsers also do a maximum number of requests per domain. Which is why you also get the recommendations on offloading to cdn subdomains. So yeah, minimising calls is good.
#
Zegnat
But wether it is actually the first think you should think about on your personal website, I doubt, petermolnar
iasai joined the channel
#
jeremycherfas
I and jgmac1106 probably have many other more important things to think about. But Known really should be handling the minifying. Maybe it is being cached?
#
jgmac1106
perfect just need to change Themes/Kandinsky/css/default.min.css to Themes/Kandinsky/css/default.css
#
jgmac1106
if is not I remember Marcus saying soemthin glike “remember” if you change a tehme you need to compile your css
#
petermolnar
oh, it's certainly one of the last things down the pipe
#
petermolnar
jgmac1106: that usually applies if it's LESS or SASS
#
jgmac1106
alright that worked….now just one style sheet to mantain….never understood css compliling but I guess i dont have to really worry about performance
eli_oat1 joined the channel
#
Zegnat
If Known doesn’t handle it by itself, the theme should really have a README telling you how to do it
#
jgmac1106
..well winding down a company and spinning off and hoping codes lives on as open source aint easy README file probably fell through
#
jgmac1106
I will ping Marcus
#
GWG
swentel: What is the post list option in Indigenous supposed to do?
#
swentel
GWG, calls q=source - that response returns a list of posts
#
Loqi
swentel: jacky left you a message 1 day, 14 hours ago: I'm having some problems setting up Indigenous for Android for development; looking to use this app as my daily driver
#
GWG
swentel, what do you do with the list?
#
swentel
GWG, what do you mean ? Why I use it personally ?
#
GWG
Yes
#
GWG
The utility of it
#
swentel
currently mostly publishing
#
swentel
comments are moderated on my site
#
swentel
when a webmention comes in
#
swentel
I get notified
#
swentel
then list it, update
#
swentel
or delete
#
jgmac1106
petermolnar here is how I color I randomly pick a number and hope it looks close to the color I think it looks like and then google and pick my accents and buttons from the pallete #6B6B6B so will go through and use that as my base color as I change my buttons and theme
#
GWG
You moderate your Webmentions from the post list? I just see minimal data there
#
GWG
Maybe I am not sending the right properties?
eli_oat1 joined the channel
[jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
Zegnat
2nd and 6th (last) colours are super close to eachother through certain colour blindness filters. As long as those do not have to be immediately discernable it looks good
#
Zegnat
jgmac1106, if you are on macOS: https://michelf.ca/projects/mac/sim-daltonism/ (or `brew cask install sim-daltonism` on the terminal)
#
jgmac1106
hmm wonder what happens when a color blind person uses a filter to make you look color blind? does that fix everything?
#
jgmac1106
its why i color by number and ask other peopel…and use a lot of grey and brown earth tones
[Vincent] joined the channel
#
[Vincent]
I would recommend this browser plugin for simulating accessibility needs: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/funkify-disability-simula/ojcijjdchelkddboickefhnbdpeajdjg
#
Zegnat
I like Sim Daltonism because it applies the filter to any part of your screen. Including your graphics tool, photo display, etc
#
[Vincent]
It looks good, I’ve not seen it before!
[kevinmarks], eli_oat1 and NinjaTrappeur joined the channel
#
swentel
GWG, I validate posts yes, but it's true, the post list needs more properties to be printed
#
swentel
there's an issue still open for that in the queue
[jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
@mapkyca
@jgmac1106 Minimisation is done via a grunt task. This also minimises javascript.
(twtr.io/1kchEyDbw28)
#
Zegnat
Aah. You have to do `npm install` on the root folder and then run grunt.
#
Zegnat
Because of course you need a node based build package for a PHP based application. ;)
#
sknebel
and that of course does not cover the css in themes
#
sknebel
(to be fair to mapkyca, the question wasn't clear that it is about themes, and the css files even explicitly say they need to be minified with an example on how to do that)
#
Zegnat
Interesting, most base themes seem to include a grunt file. So they could also minify on the fly using grunt
[Csongor] and iasai joined the channel
#
petermolnar
anyone has deeper experience with python's asyncio asyncio.ensure_future and run_until_complete ?
#
sknebel
define *deeper* :D
#
petermolnar
I'll try to:
#
petermolnar
I have a class, which, in theory, collects async tasks, and executes them when it's run function is called - collection starts here: https://github.com/petermolnar/nasg/blob/master/nasg.py#L1730 the class is here: https://github.com/petermolnar/nasg/blob/master/nasg.py#L1009
#
petermolnar
For webmention sending, I used to define an instance of this class to collect them and execute them after the end sync, but for my surprise, before calling run(), just after the task gets defined, it was called.
#
petermolnar
it kinda looks like that regardless my efforts trying to create an async queue, I made async fire-and-forget calls all the time
#
petermolnar
and I don't understand, why
[kevinmarks] and eli_oat1 joined the channel
#
petermolnar
if I don't call run()
#
petermolnar
they won't fire at all
#
petermolnar
which doesn't make sense if they aren't actually executed when I call run
#
sknebel
looks right to me... can you link me the commit that had the issue?
#
sknebel
there you use task = self._loop.create_task(job)
#
sknebel
that schedules execution immediately
#
petermolnar
I replaced it with self._tasks.append(asyncio.ensure_future(job)) later, but that didn't work either
#
petermolnar
or I forgot to test that version
#
sknebel
and I was wrong, ensure_future also schedules execution
#
sknebel
just get rid of the ensure_future and add the coroutines to the list
#
sknebel
I think
#
petermolnar
lemme try
#
petermolnar
that's how it should be
#
petermolnar
thank you
#
petermolnar
sknebel: I'm wondering about that 972 starred projects of yours on github - I keep a backup of my starred projects from there, because I saw a few of them disappear during the years
#
petermolnar
is anyone else doing that, keeping git clones of starred projects?
#
sknebel
I don't. been meaning to set something up to mirror repos, but haven'T gotten around to it
#
Zegnat
No git clones. But most of the things I have starred also live in my browser bookmarks.
#
Zegnat
Basically starring is paying-it-forward. Much like how I subscribe to YouTube channels I follow through RSS, etc. I find it important to star on GitHub because it might be of value to the repo owner.
#
petermolnar
I need to delete a line from there
#
aaronpk
I stopped inlining css and js once I turned on http2 since that does effectively inlining but at the transport layer
#
petermolnar
that is actually a fair point
[jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106]
Would there be an issue with parsers if I used a listen-of, watch-of or read-of inside an h-entry set up like an article?
#
[jgmac1106]
I would assume micropub clients might have trouble mapping but the three experimental post types not used in Indigenous yet anyways
#
Zegnat
I am not sure what you are asking. In general, no, extra properties are never an issue
#
Zegnat
In fact, because CSS classes sometimes end up in the mf2 objects, the general standard is to just ignore properties you do not understand
#
[jgmac1106]
well I do a post in Known to use HTMl it has to be an article, the Ui doesn't allow HTML in notes...so while I work on writing plugins if I just published an article with the title listened to X and in the body included I just finished <a class="listen-of p-name href="https://example.com">Podcast</a> I won't need plugins...but it will be inside an <article> html tag
#
sknebel
nothing cares about you using an article tag or something else
#
[jgmac1106]
cool....plugin release date..pushed waaaaay back then
#
sknebel
<a class="listen-of p-name href="https://example.com">Podcast</a> doesn't make sense though
#
[jgmac1106]
yeah I was writing quick, will check for best(ish) answer later, unl;ess of course you want to tell me now
#
sknebel
ok, just making sure that's not the actual example
#
[jgmac1106]
i would probably wrap the title maybe host into an h-cite\
#
[jgmac1106]
I just <div class="listen-of p-category="finished">listened to<span class="h-cite"><span class="p-author h-card">AUTHOR</span>: <cite><a class="u-url p-name" href="URL">TITLE</a></cite></span></div>
[Csongor] joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106]
or would the listen-of go inside the h-cite? I listened to <span class="h-cite"><span class="p-author h-card">AUTHOR</span>: <cite><a class="listen-of u-url p-name href="URL">TITLE</a></cite></span></div>...not sure how to use p-category here for status
#
Zegnat
You probably want the h-entry to be a “listen-of”, so no, it would not go inside the h-cite
#
Zegnat
The h-cite is the thing you listened to, I presume
#
[jgmac1106]
crap....back to making a plugin then...life is so much easier just using html
#
[jgmac1106]
yes so could this work inside an h-entry? I just <div class="listen-of p-category="finished">listened to<span class="h-cite"><span class="p-author h-card">AUTHOR</span>: <cite><a class="u-url p-name" href="URL">TITLE</a></cite></span></div>
#
aaronpk
there's something wrong with the html there
#
[jgmac1106]
except the quotation mistake
#
aaronpk
I don't understand where "finished" is supposed to be
#
[jgmac1106]
yeah neither do I. I may hold off on p-category until I see what gRegor does
#
[jgmac1106]
thinking p-category could be "want-to, *-ing, and finished" for read, watch, listen posts
#
[jgmac1106]
so if I can put the "listen-of" on a div and not on h-entry I can do all this without having to muck about in plugins for a bit, but if needs to go on the h-entry...then its plugin time
[dave], snarfed, miklb and [schmarty] joined the channel
#
[schmarty]
should "listen-of" have an mf2 prefix to indicate what type of value is expected? u-listen-of if a URL, p-listen-of if just the text name of the thing, etc.?
#
[schmarty]
without an mf2 prefix "listen-of" is not going to get picked up by any mf2 parser. maybe i missed the point and that was intentional. :}
[tantek] and [eddie] joined the channel
#
petermolnar
!tell Zegnat I realized I can get rid of the 'auto' in my theme switcher: default is dark or media query; if user wants the other, add localstorage, if clicks on the original again, remove it
#
Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
#
[eddie]
I use u-listen-of on my listen posts
#
[eddie]
so that it parses the url of the podcast episode as listen-of
#
[eddie]
jgmac1106 I think this is generally what you are looking for: https://eddiehinkle.com/2018/11/19/4/article/
#
Loqi
[Eddie Hinkle] listen-of-example.html
#
jeremycherfas
Aaronpk Is there any way I can get hold of the payload the OYG sends?
#
[eddie]
aaronpk++ for building code snippet generation into Quill 😄
#
Loqi
aaronpk has 97 karma in this channel over the last year (303 in all channels)
#
aaronpk
jeremycherfas: unfortunately not really, it's not really set up to be able to do that
#
aaronpk
I was looking into that the other day
#
aaronpk
it'd take quite a bit of refactoring in order to make that possible
#
jeremycherfas
I have this problem with Known adding two copies of a single image, and mapcyka wants to see the payload, because he says he cannot reproduce with curl.
#
aaronpk
but this describes it pretty well https://ownyourgram.com/docs
jackjamieson joined the channel
#
jeremycherfas
I looked at that; I guess if some property is missing then it's value is just ""
#
[eddie]
jgmac1106 the key pieces from the example above is p-category is within the h-entry, u-listen-of and h-cite are on the same element.
#
aaronpk
it should be possible to add some debug stuff into Known to have it report what it received
#
[eddie]
p-category has to be a css class and finished as to be a value, not a class. So I'm using the data object for that unless you wanted to actually use the word "finished" listening to, then you could just wrap the word finished with a span that has p-category as the class
#
jeremycherfas
I suppose it would be in logs too.
#
aaronpk
possibly, tho it might not log it by default
[zak] joined the channel
#
[zak]
inb
#
Loqi
eddie has 47 karma in this channel over the last year (74 in all channels)
#
aaronpk
huh ownyourswarm is suddenly processing a lot more checkins
#
[jgmac1106]
just saved me from trying to rebuild three plug-ns, now I can just use post
#
aaronpk
"suddenly" over the last 3 weeks
#
aaronpk
whoa, it processed 2270 checkins in october
benwerd and swentel joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106]
2261 from you, tantek, and Marty...aaron checked in to home, aaron checked in the cupboard, aaron checkedin upstairs
[schmarty] and snarfed joined the channel
#
[tantek]
Wat. I’ve not signed up with ownyourswarm afaik
#
aaronpk
I think he was joking
snarfed joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106]
yeah come to think of it I even wonder if I added tantek.com to my feeds...I don't see your checkins
#
[jgmac1106]
but joking....but still I could see that number with all the checkins from Berlin I saw
eli_oat and snarfed joined the channel
#
[tantek]
I don’t do public checkins in general and I haven’t figured out private posts yet
#
Zegnat
private sharing is super high on my wishlist right now. Especially now that I have some of the tech already in place after Berlin
#
Loqi
Zegnat: petermolnar left you a message 1 hour, 50 minutes ago: I realized I can get rid of the 'auto' in my theme switcher: default is dark or media query; if user wants the other, add localstorage, if clicks on the original again, remove it
#
aaronpk
samsies
#
Zegnat
petermolnar: what would “other” mean? You would detect media query and invert whatever value you discover?
#
aaronpk
i've been realizing I've been avoiding posting stuff because I know it's going to be public and broadcast out everywhere
#
Zegnat
I am happy I made the call to have a public and private post in my posting client from the start. But I do not log as many things as I would like to because I have no way of accessing the private ones.
#
Zegnat
(Thus I end up not posting them at all. Even though they would be stored.)
#
aaronpk
I think the challenge for me is figuring out what kind of interface I want to select who can see the post i'm about to make
#
aaronpk
I *think* something like how facebook handles it might be what I want
[eddie] joined the channel
#
Zegnat
That would be what I want to work towards. But for a start, I am actually happy just granting myself access, haha
#
[eddie]
I've always been a HUGE fan of Facebook's interface, when I used Facebook it felt very fluid
#
aaronpk
it takes some work to set up the friend lists, but I like that it has the on-the-fly options too, like "specific friends" or "friends except"
#
aaronpk
and of course just "friends", which in this context isn't actually obvious
#
jacky
like a list approach?
#
jacky
(is curious about this too)
#
[eddie]
Yeah, I don't think I'll bother with "friends", I'll likely do single individuals or lists
#
aaronpk
(ironically this discussion is better for the main channel)
#
[eddie]
I think my initial is just going to be individuals. My audience parameter in my posts is an array of h-cards. For public posts that just displays who it was meant for, but for private posts, the plan is a private post with an audience will determine who sees it
#
aaronpk
hm probably worth doing another round of screenshots from facebook to capture it
#
aaronpk
ah there's one facebook screenshot on https://indieweb.org/audience too
#
Zegnat
sknebel’s prototype post has an audience consisting of a list of URLs
#
jacky
[eddie]: that sounds like a lot lol
#
jacky
like I could even see lists being converted to a means for mailing lists
#
[eddie]
I have a Micropub query for my nicknames cache returns h-cards, and any h-card inside the audience property array of a post would be restricted if the post is private.
#
sknebel
yeah, I have just a property called "audience" with a list of URLs. guess I could easily add non-URLs as list names that get looked up somewhere else
#
sknebel
a reference to a nickname cache would be interesting too, true. don't think I'd copy the h-card in the property though
#
[eddie]
I want h-cards because I'd like to be able to display the persons name nicely and use the url to verify they should be able to see it
#
jacky
hmmmm nifty [eddie]
#
[eddie]
plus I can make the UI look really nice with little avatars if I add an avatar to the h-cards in my nicknames cache
#
sknebel
I'd reference the nicknames cache for that. i.e. I don'T want the avatar attached to the post
#
[eddie]
hmmm true,
#
[eddie]
That might be a good optimization
#
[eddie]
audience as an array of urls then you pull the name and avatar from the nickname cache
#
[eddie]
I guess one potential benefit of the h-card is things don't HAVE to be in the nickname cache
#
[eddie]
although that might be counter intuitive and it might be better to always have those be in a nicknames cache
#
sknebel
hm, I should hook up my public autoauth testing post to an alert for me if someone else manages to authenticate to it :D
#
sknebel
what is token revocation?
#
Loqi
token revocation is the process of revoking an OAuth token https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7009 https://indieweb.org/token_revocation
snarfed and [jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
sknebel
apropos AutoAuth: aaronpk Zegnat I remember you had thoughts on this question: does the token endpoint get passed through the client_id triggering the original request?
#
Zegnat
I think you mean: does the authorisation endpoint pass the client_id to the other parties token endpoint?
#
Zegnat
I go back and forth on that. It lets the other party blacklist certain apps, on the other hand, it also leaks information on the user’s app usage.
#
Zegnat
And the token-endpoint owner can’t know if the user’s auth endpoint is lying.
#
Zegnat
Those things combined I am not sure *I* would pass the client_id on. And if I am not planning to do it, I don’t see why I should add it to the spec if I am helping to figure this out.
#
Zegnat
I guess
#
sknebel
hm, I'd guess the app usage reveals itself likely anyways through the requests that use the token
#
sknebel
if one really wanted to track that against the users wishes
#
sknebel
not sure how to evaluate the auth endpoint lying
#
Zegnat
app usage wouldn’t reveal itself unless the app uses an identifiable UA string when doing its HTTP requests later
#
sknebel
and no unique IP and ...
#
[jgmac1106]
ha ha Eddie I was going to use your template to do my first Listen post for two dads talking and then I see that IS the template....just made my life easy
#
Zegnat
Sure, if you know what IP hosts Watchtower you can know the software that way I guess
#
[eddie]
jgmac1106 😆
#
[jgmac1106]
my MacOS stickies note is just becoming a collection of post type templates
#
Zegnat
Still, I think client_id not being verifiable by the endpoint is almost reason enough not to bother sending it
#
[jgmac1106]
gonna publish it now and see how bad tinyMCE screws up microformats....it really really hates them
#
sknebel
potential use cases: forbid specific applications, under the assumption that the auth endpoint doesn't lie (i.e. if I don't trust the operator of a hosted reader I can ban it). cut off known-bad applications if there's a security problem.
#
aaronpk
it seems like the thing issuing the token would need some assurance of which client it's issuing it for then
#
Zegnat
yeah, but as we drew it out, the issuer is only talking to the requester’s auth endpoint, not client
#
sknebel
that's the question, can that be trusted enough
#
aaronpk
doesn't seem like it
#
sknebel
why would the user make their auth endpoint lie?
#
aaronpk
normally when I issue a token I know which client is going to get it based on the redirect_uri matching the client_id hostname
#
aaronpk
isn't there a way here for a malicious client to impersonate another client?
#
aaronpk
the user may not even know
#
Zegnat
Note that the user has first authorised the client with their own endpoint already, before this flow even starts
#
sknebel
the client can't lie to the auth endpoint about the client_id, because it needed to complete a normal IndieAuth flow to obtain a token
#
Zegnat
Exactly. So as a user, I expect I am already trusting the client
[dave] joined the channel
#
Zegnat
That’s also why I let the client request tokens through my endpoint in the first place.
#
Zegnat
The question is then, do you as the token endpoint need to trust the client as well, or is it enough that you trust me?
#
Zegnat
(brb car ride)
benwerd, jackjamieson and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
petermolnar
Zegnat re themeswitcher: so mac comes either light or dark, which will be auto-detected, if the user comes the opposite - not the auto-detected - they click on the 'dark' or 'light' button, and I set the localstorage value. If they click on the "native" scheme ever again, I removed the storage value. For others, the default is dark.
#
sknebel
hm, so while I'd like the site to have the client_id, it's probably better to not include it if it isn't entirely validated.
#
[eddie]
Zegnat sknebel I am interested in looking into experimenting with autoauth a bit but alas, I can't read handwriting (pretty much any non-block letter handwriting is indecipherable to me). Could we get https://indieweb.org/2018/Nuremberg/autoauth#headline_for_requests and https://indieweb.org/2018/Nuremberg/autoauth#Notes_from_Dinner merged into typed text? 😄
#
sknebel
[eddie]: working on it, that's why I'm asking these questions
#
sknebel
guess I could try to throw a rough pass up soon-ish
#
[eddie]
don't mind me then 😄
#
[eddie]
I won't be able to work on it on my side until sometime next week likely so no rush
#
sknebel
yeah, I had next few days, not next few hours in mind with soon-ish :D
#
jacky
lol holiday times allow for more hacking
#
[eddie]
:thumbsup:
#
[jgmac1106]
so did a future and past tense, can't imagine too many listening posts except for music and shows: https://quickthoughts.jgregorymcverry.com/2018/11/19/gonna-check-out-lingthusiasm
#
[jgmac1106]
though without links to host websites I dropped the h-cards
#
[jgmac1106]
grrrrrr.......stupid TinyMCE is stripping out <data> the data tag
#
Zegnat
wysiwyg--
#
Loqi
wysiwyg has -1 karma over the last year
#
[jgmac1106]
really just one?
#
[jgmac1106]
wysiwyg--
#
Loqi
wysiwyg has -2 karma over the last year
tantek joined the channel
#
swentel
jacky, you left me tell re: indigenous right ? forgot a bit what it was tbh :/
#
jacky
lol I was having issues getting the local dev build going but i figured it out!
#
jacky
aiming to (hopefully) contribute to it in the near future
#
swentel
oh, ok cool :)
#
jacky
yeah! I was looking to test out how my list of posts would look on there
#
jacky
I'm also beginning to test if I want some post types to be available for some clients
#
jacky
like I wouldn't be making articles on mobile but I would on my desktop machine
[tantek] and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
[kevinmarks]
anyone good at chai tests? I am being confused by function bindings
[jgmac1106], wagle_, [tantek]1, kisik211, Ruxton and snarfed joined the channel
#
[kevinmarks]
nm, someone else helped me - making things 'const' in js is apparently a really good idea.
#
jacky
the best :)
#
gRegorLove
That's the pattern for /read posts, yeah: `u-read-of h-cite`
#
gRegorLove
(oops, was scrolled back)
[eddie] joined the channel