#dev 2020-02-24

2020-02-24 UTC
#
[tantek] [David_Bryant] I got a photo grid embed working on my homepage!
#
[tantek] Had to fight PHP vs JS and only a little bit of CSS
#
[tantek] but now have a nice 3x4 photogrid of thumbnails in my right sidebar!
#
[tantek] All linked to their respective posts, and automatically marked up with the alt text for each photo too!
#
[tantek] A stand-alone photos page would be next
#
[tantek] Now I’m just annoyed about JS being weird about arrays compared to PHP
#
[ColinMorris] Weird how?
miklb joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106] Quite relieved that you can have an h-entry without a p-name, and dt-published...I found myself always wracking my head in terms of layout thinking how to display all that in a visually pleasing way
#
[KevinMarks] PHP is very weird about arrays, as they're dictionaries with magic indexes
tbbrown, [aaronpk] and [David_Bryant] joined the channel
#
[David_Bryant] I noticed the new photo grid, [tantek] - very nice! Keen to hear how you implemented it. I've built one that takes advantage of a bunch of 11ty features -- YAML front matter, tags, collections, and Nunjucks templating. ATM it automatically generates a separate page (https://www.disquisitioner.com/photos/) of whatever photos I tag appropriately in any of my posts, but it would be cool to make an embeddable widget out of that.
[Brian], linext, tbbrown and [Erika_W_] joined the channel
#
@cheribaker ↩️ I’ve been happy with Wordpress. With indieweb plugins and http://brid.gy I’ve been able to pull most external replies (twitter and MB) back into my blog as comments. I do miss the simplicity of blogging on http://micro.blog. It has such a nice clean interface. (twitter.com/_/status/1231757280850239488)
geoffo, oh_that_courtney and [gRegorLove] joined the channel
#
aaronpk ahh just realized my live html parsing demo that i thought was wrong was actually not wrong, it was the case that i decided to stop caring about
#
aaronpk well at least i can sleep tonight
#
jacky haha
[chrisaldrich] joined the channel
#
[chrisaldrich] jacky++ for http://follow-as-intended.glitch.me/
#
Loqi jacky has 18 karma in this channel over the last year (75 in all channels)
#
aaronpk OHHH i didn't realize micro.blog was doing the same thing with the photo markup
#
aaronpk now these look right
#
[chrisaldrich] jacky, I think I saw that you got cut short in working on it, but I suspect you'll add other feeds as well? I'd actually intend people to follow my own website first and then use rel-me to find other possible ways of following me.
#
aaronpk https://xray.p3k.app/parse?pretty=true&url=https%3A%2F%2Fmicro.blog%2Faaronpk%2F8486655
#
GWG aaronpk: This was the discussion during the session about photo in content plus as a photo property?
nickodd joined the channel
#
aaronpk kind of, it's a spinoff of that
#
aaronpk today, sonicrocketman found a bug in xray where it was completely dropping the "content" property for the markup <p><img src="/photo.jpg"></p> in the e-content
#
GWG And what was the conclusion on the one discussed in session? I meant to make a note on that
#
aaronpk there wasn't
#
aaronpk requires further discussion
#
GWG I have that problem, so I was trying to follow
[dave] joined the channel
#
jacky [chrisaldrich]: I can! as long as they provide a 'intent' page or some guessable/discoverable route for following people
#
jacky once i get my site's version of rel=subscribe working then I'll update the app
#
[chrisaldrich] What is rel-subscribe?
#
Loqi rel-subscribe is an experimental rel value for linking from your home page to your subscription endpoint, and is currently prototyped by Aaron Parecki on aaronparecki.com; try the Follow button in the right side of the footer of his home page or any permalink https://indieweb.org/rel-subscribe
#
jacky I'm going to add my thoughts/flow to /Koype and then link to that page
#
[chrisaldrich] I feel like you may be adding the idea that I intend people to follow me to the fact that I have rel-me tags on certain silos though. Rel-subscribe seems like a more interesting thing to support for that tool.
#
[chrisaldrich] Though even that seems to have a slighly different connotation... hmmm.
#
[chrisaldrich] Nothing on microformats.org except an older looking http://microformats.org/wiki/subscribe-hcard
#
jacky yeah this bit is a bit greenfield imo
#
jacky and I'm hoping that I can use that site (when it's more polished) to drop my showing of silo icons and opt for 'explicit' linking (or encourage people to follow in another wayt)
#
jacky it's like sub2me(?) but with social media silos added
gRegorLove, shiraeeshi, [tantek], KartikPrabhu, cweiske, plut4rch, [chrisaldrich] and [KevinMarks] joined the channel; nickodd left the channel
#
[KevinMarks] your app timed out on kevinmarks.com (possibly because I have rel=me links to dead sites?)
swentel, mblaney and [jgmac1106] joined the channel; mblaney left the channel
#
[jgmac1106] in terms of pagination in your h-feed does each additional page need to be wrapped in an h-feed or do readers know to follow the rel=orev back to the start
[datashaman] joined the channel
#
[datashaman] wondering about that too...
swentel and [tantek] joined the channel
#
[tantek] What is pagination?
#
Loqi pagination is a UI pattern for navigation across (typically chronologically) sequential pages that show one or more posts such as permalink post pages, archives, search results, and lists of tagged posts https://indieweb.org/pagination
#
[tantek] [jgmac1106] any existing examples there ^^^ do one thing or another?
[KevinMarks] joined the channel
#
[KevinMarks] I would put h-feed around each page yes, though maybe we could codify the pagination variables the way activity streams/gdata etc did
miklb, linext, hs0ucy, tbbrown, [dave], aaronpk and [jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106] Yeah checked pagination. I didn't quickly find the answer on that page. It goes from database to APIs. No clear h-feed examples
#
[jgmac1106] Thx @kevinmarks will do
[schmarty] joined the channel
#
[schmarty] this came up recently with the "indieweb best 9" photo post tool. i modified it to work with my archive pages which _don't_ have h-feed wrapping the collection of h-entry. i made a quick post about it. https://martymcgui.re/2020/02/04/154329/
#
Loqi [Marty McGuire] Thanks for taking a look at the changes! And thanks for the response! While I agree that I could wrap the entries on my archive page in an h-feed, I disagree that every collection of h-entry “is a feed”. The microformats2 spec for h-feed is sti...
#
[schmarty] tl;dr - in my opinion "h-feed" is saying "this is a feed and i encourage you to follow it in your reader because it will get updates"
#
[schmarty] archive pages are ... not that.
#
jacky ^ good point
#
[schmarty] i think at some point folks started treating h-feed more like a generic container for other items (h-entry, h-card).
#
jacky aaronpk: so w.r.t rel=subscribe, does your site interact with your microsub endpoint?
#
jacky currently, mine will end up going to a pre-defined url for my microsub client to handle the -actual- subscription work
#
jacky thinking about some UX stuff
#
[jgmac1106] [schmarty] but how many items them too many for one feed? like if someone wanted to subscribe to the h-feed for my notes or more articles? When do you remove from a feed to an archive?
#
jacky it's not necessarily about size but more about the purpose
#
jacky archives are implictly meant to be all encompassing where-as feeds don't have to be (and to be honest, shouldn't be, perf wise)
#
[schmarty] ^^ yep agree with jacky
#
[schmarty] i think as soon as you're onto "page two", however you conceive that, is a good time to drop the h-feed.
#
[jgmac1106] okay, that make sense
#
jacky goes make that change re: dropping h-feed past the first page
[datashaman] joined the channel
#
[datashaman] rss feeds don't usually include every post ever made, it's often limited to X
#
[jgmac1106] that does make me need to rethink my url structure though...so page 1 is always the same
#
[jgmac1106] I was gonna use months
#
[schmarty] for my site i have https://martymcgui.re/posts/ as my main feed. the "Older Posts" link at the bottom points to the next page in my monthly archives that /posts/ didn't contain all of.
#
[schmarty] lol loqi grabbing my h-feed name.
#
sknebel hm, I'm not sure I agree with the logic of "an archive is not a feed"
#
sknebel things falling of the first page does not mean they aren't part of the feed anymore
[jeremycherfas] joined the channel
#
[jeremycherfas] I think an Archive could be a feed, as new items are added to the archive, but a feed need not be a complete archive.
#
[datashaman] but we agree that page is not a feed
#
[datashaman] page2 oops
#
[jgmac1106] now this sounds like a bookmark and likes conversation....
#
[jgmac1106] I was doing articles by month: https://jgregorymcverry.com/articles/2020/02 but and add rel=next and prev....just didn't know if this should stay in feed
#
[jgmac1106] ....maybe I am making an archive and the h-feed should just be the last three on my homepage...but I agree with sknebel
#
sknebel I guess you don't follow the page and want to avoid that a tool accidentially does so is an argument
#
[jgmac1106] when I subscribe to someone in my RSS feed, I often scroll wayback through their work
#
[jeremycherfas] Every time?
#
[jgmac1106] not everytime, but lots, I like to dig into folks hsitory
#
sknebel but that's seems like a solvable discovery thing, and if you want to be able to backfill a feed you need other changes, so both have consequences for consumers
#
[jeremycherfas] I’m more likely to scroll back the first time I see it, maybe 10 entries, maybe 50, whatever. From then on out, I only really care about what’s new.
#
[jeremycherfas] I would dig into their history on their site. And do.
#
[jgmac1106] yeah skenbel that is where I got stuck, what if someone tries to put page three in in apaginated feed into their reader
#
[jgmac1106] well off to teach class...someone smarter then me should try to capture this in a brainstorming section on pagination
#
[jgmac1106] sknebel I honestly didn't know reading the feed reader that if they parse something with a rel=prev if they go backwards to try to find the h-feed
#
[jgmac1106] or if every page in a paginated feed needs to be set up as an h-feed on the page
#
[jgmac1106] i meant reading /pagination
#
[jgmac1106] if I go last month is an archive, I will just use jgregorymcverry.com/thismonth for notes...that would still be a feed of anywhere of 50-100 h-entries.....probably 100-1000s if I only used my website and not Known
[gRegorLove] and [KevinMarks] joined the channel
#
[KevinMarks] Atom defined link relations for pagination https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5005
#
[KevinMarks] Those work for h-feed too
#
[KevinMarks] Also see https://github.com/dewitt/opensearch/blob/master/opensearch-1-1-draft-6.md
#
[KevinMarks] For a reasonable query api for feed results and possible naming for pagination details
#
[KevinMarks] With an h-feed, putting the link relations on a tags rather than link headers is reasonable
[Michael_Beckwit, [grantcodes], M59NAA8GT7111114, gRegorLove, SpencerDub, KartikPrabhu and [tantek] joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106] For people who were in the community sesion talking about how you use location for discovery, here is something I just discovered in Tweetdeck, prolly there long time
[schmarty], [yo], [manton], geoffo, jeremycherfas, [Michael_Beckwit and jolvera joined the channel
#
sknebel Anyone know if Google Groups has an API?
leg, [Sadik_Shahadu], [calumryan], phpbooob and [KevinMarks] joined the channel
#
[KevinMarks] I did but I think it was lost in the great g+ embrace
#
sknebel yeah, searched a bit more on desktop now and seems like it only exists in G Suite Groups (which I have no idea if they are like public Google groups in any way)
TraptedMind, jeremycherfas, [gRegorLove], geoffo, [schmarty], [tantek], [jgmac1106] and [manton] joined the channel