#dev 2020-05-08

2020-05-08 UTC
[chrisaldrich], KartikPrabhu, nickodd, swentel, [LewisCowles], loicm, jjuran, jeremych_, [jgmac1106], [KevinMarks], hs0ucy, ben_thatmustbeme and geoffo_ joined the channel; OberstKrueger[m] left the channel
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Zegnat
anyone know if there is a simple way to test a new TravisCI config for https://github.com/microformats/php-mf2/ or is my best bet to just make a commit & PR to trigger a run and go from there?
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swentel
hmm I think they have a docker image to run locally
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swentel
but I think doing a PR is less work :)
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swentel
although I'm not sure who comes first: the patch, or the config ..
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Zegnat
From what I think I have seen it clones the repo and then moves it into the environments stipulated by the config
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Zegnat
GWG: how angry will you get if I add an extra commit to your PHP5.6 branch to test my Travis fix once I get home from work? ;)
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GWG
Did we merge that?
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GWG
I'm not against it regardless
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Zegnat
Not yet merged, but I may have figured out why your earlier change to `composer update` did not work. Just need some way to test. And adding a commit so Travis re-runs seems easiest.
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Zegnat
If I was wrong, we simply revert my commit again :)
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Zegnat
And I think I can push to your branch, unless you specifically told GitHub otherwise they default to allowing contributors to push commits on PR branches
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nekr0z
as far as I remember, Travis CI allows to trigger a build while supplying (by pasting into a form) a yml file
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nekr0z
it is kinda beta and doesn't always work as expected, but I remember using it successfully to debug a config without dozens of .travis.yml commits
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[jgmac1106]
how could I do something similar from my own website, have links to media as hotspots to regions on an image: https://www.thinglink.com/scene/1315166870969516033 feels be intimidating
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jeremycherfas
Blank page with no js; is that what you want?
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[jgmac1106]
no I want to link media files to specific regions of an image
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[jgmac1106]
probably way too hard but I wanna keep that one....web is littered with tons of art that is now nothign more than a 404
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jeremycherfas
I remember in the old days, people would slice up an image into the cells of a table, and some of those cells were links;
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jeremycherfas
I did that myself, to make a page that looked like a card index have index tabs that "worked".
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[jgmac1106]
table with a background img.....would still work...awful on mobile but maybe I could think of query that could resize....hmmmmmm
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[jgmac1106]
Can I do same with CSS Grid? link an entire cell and have a background img on the grid?
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jeremycherfas
I don't know enough about CSS grid.
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[jgmac1106]
may play with this idea this weekend...too intriguing need to walk away now before suddenly it is dark and I did nothing
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[jgmac1106]
be hard though with resizing on mobile with a background img, may have to do a media query to strip links and display in a ul there...
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jeremycherfas
Wouldn't the background img just be 100%?
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jeremycherfas
That looks cool too [jgmac1106]
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[jgmac1106]
yeah, but if the links were in grid cells...ohhh this is where i wish I knew more of the mathy kind of CSS Grid
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[jgmac1106]
yeah but how do you know the cords just peck and guess? knew it be above me, but may have a website goal, need to do a Grid activity or much of the knowledge will fade
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[jgmac1106]
I could lay grid lines in photoshop to determine regions...not something one could do often, seems quite labor intensive, but this maybe doable
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jeremycherfas
No need to hunt and peck. If you draw what you want on gridded paper. If you look at the CSS for that demo, it is pixel based.
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jeremycherfas
As I recall, in the old days PS had a function that would automagically slice and dice an image for you for exactly that purpose.
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[jgmac1106]
cool...bad weather weekend project...we could even wake up to snow
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jeremycherfas
There it is. Still there after all these years.
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[jgmac1106]
jeremycherfas++ thx for brainstorming with me...I need to stop.....ugggh lame OGP stockphotos
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Loqi
jeremycherfas has 7 karma in this channel over the last year (28 in all channels)
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jeremycherfas
No worries; fun to dig deep into the memories.
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[LewisCowles]
jeremycherfas++
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Loqi
jeremycherfas has 8 karma in this channel over the last year (29 in all channels)
swentel, [KevinMarks], bear and [tantek] joined the channel
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[tantek]
imagemap++
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Loqi
imagemap has 1 karma over the last year
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[tantek]
[jgmac1106] if you go down the imagemap path, please keep track of any struggles or even papercuts you experience. This is something I'm looking into seeing if it can be improved (like in the fundamental platform)
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[KevinMarks]
Another way to do it would be svg, either by redrawing it or by overlaying shapes to define the links
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[LewisCowles]
imagemap++ I'm so surprised you liked them tantek
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Loqi
imagemap has 2 karma over the last year
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[LewisCowles]
The first WYSIWYG pages I made were image maps because microsoft publisher 97 only exported for web as image maps
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[tantek]
[LewisCowles] imagemaps are another declarative way to do interactivity that doesn't require JS
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[LewisCowles]
They sure are. I was certain they had accessibility issues though
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[rjpc]
Hey all! Curious about some "not secure" warnings about images I'm getting browsing the wiki. Do you think it's worth it having those images under https? I feel the "not secure" warnings on certain browsers can scare people off. Anyway, glad to help in any way and two cheers for the indie web
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[LewisCowles]
rjpc, if you have your own site setup to use via indieauth, you can login and make edits
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jeremycherfas
I've not used it to do this job, and it is yet another thing to add friction, but pandoc can create good HTML from a word file.
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[LewisCowles]
I think otherwise links in meta might help
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[LewisCowles]
jeremycherfas. Ah Interesting. I'd not considered that. It's going to take me ages to go through existing posts in editor flow
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[LewisCowles]
and there are only about 50 of them
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jeremycherfas
No, wait. I may be wrong on that.
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[LewisCowles]
TBH I'm not certain it has feature parity with even the limited HTML I'm using
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jeremycherfas
It doesn't seem to be there on the dropdown at the pandoc live demo site. Need to check full documentation.
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[LewisCowles]
i know unoconv moves between HTML and docx
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jeremycherfas
Pandoc might not do it in one step. But it will go docx -> markdown -> HTML
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[LewisCowles]
oh that is wonderful
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jeremycherfas
How clean is the unoconv output?
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[LewisCowles]
it'd preserve my headings
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[LewisCowles]
and get rid of some noise
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[LewisCowles]
unoconv is a mess, it's the kind of output that needs manual processing
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[LewisCowles]
I use it to convert government PDF's to docx, so that they are text searchable
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jeremycherfas
Yeah; presentation probably doesn't matter that much with those. I reckon the two-step process is probably the best you will get.
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[LewisCowles]
Right now I'm dual screening, so I'm taking the HTML I author flat, opening it in a browser, and copy->pasting to word to check
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[LewisCowles]
it's not ideal
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jeremycherfas
One other suggestion; go from HTML to Markdown. Convert the markdown to docx (easy!) look at the docx in Word and go back to Markdown with Pandoc. That would give you good HTML
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Zegnat
Alright, comitted to your PHP 5.6 branch, GWG. Travis pending. Lets see if my theory was correct.
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jacky
so I'm doing some testing of lighthouse (my webmention app)
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jacky
and this is what it gets back for sending webmentions for things on a page
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Loqi
black.af
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Loqi
[a long one so I wrote it on my site]: Threads don’t follow natural conversation - unless you speak in quips and short statements. Coming from a family that encouraged verbosity over brevity; threads would end up with number prefixing/suffixing sin...
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jacky
does that make sense to y'all?
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jacky
like right now, it pulls all of the mf2 items on a page to get that
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jacky
and then looks for any urls held by them
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jacky
it probably shouldn't send one to itself
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jacky
hmm I could make it specific only to some things (like only `h-card`, `h-event` and `h-entry`)
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jacky
lol now I only got the profile for replying to :(
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[snarfed]
technically you want to extract all links, not just ones with mf2, but sounds good for a first pass
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aaronpk
eh I don't really want to send webmentions to all the links in my site header/footer and stuff
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jacky
that's what `rel=nofollow` is for, no?
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jacky
or could be used for
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aaronpk
i guess?
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aaronpk
except that means something else
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aaronpk
cause i don't necessarily want to tell search engines to not follow those links
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jacky
I could be semi intelligent on a second pass
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jacky
right
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jacky
like I can get all links and then check if those links have webmention endpoints
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aaronpk
the goal is to send webmentions to links in my *post*
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jacky
oh yeah
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aaronpk
my post does not include all the links on the page
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jacky
for sure
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aaronpk
if my mf2 markup is good, then looking only inside the mf2 on my post permalink is a good way to do it
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aaronpk
but also my site could go look at the storage file of the post and send only to links inside that rather than looking at the external rendered HTML
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sknebel
guess it depends what "links with mf2" means too
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sknebel
i.e. yes, you don't just want links with u-* on them, but also those in content properties etc
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aaronpk
yeah you'd want to parse the html content of the e-content property looking for links in there too probably
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jacky
yeah that bit I def got down
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jacky
I think to make it clearer, I'll have regions showing _all_ of the links found then make it more narrower (and highlight which ones _actually_ will be the recipients)
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Zegnat
Also, if you are doing any form of salmentions, you want to send a ping to any people who have left comments, right? So you would also want to look through links of comments (that are probably not within your post’s e-content) and send to those?
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Zegnat
aaronpk: do you do that?
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aaronpk
i can't remember
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aaronpk
i think so?
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aaronpk
wait no
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aaronpk
that's not what that is
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aaronpk
what is salmention
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Loqi
Salmention is a protocol extension to Webmention to propagate comments and other interactions upstream by sending a webmention from a response to the original post when the response itself receives a response (comment, like, etc.) https://indieweb.org/Salmention
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aaronpk
salmention is the other way
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aaronpk
when my post gets a webmention and shows it as a comment, it re-sends the original webmentions it sent when it was first posted
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Zegnat
Oh, right, that is how that was
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aaronpk
and yes my site does that
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Zegnat
Hmm. I thought there was something about sending update mentions not just to links in your post but to people who had commented on your post too, but maybe I am just misremembering
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Zegnat
I do not display comments so I am not overly familiar, haven’t had to implement it
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sknebel
jacky: I guess bridgy publish links might be something that's not in an mf2 property but people want sent
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[snarfed]
or plain old mentions
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sknebel
would be inside the content typically?
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sknebel
(assuming we are talking a site that uses mf2 at all)
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sknebel
so thats in a property
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sknebel
whereas if I put the bridgy publish link somewhere in the HTML, it won't be in the mf2 parser output, but I want mentions sent
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jacky
if those are within mf2 (like within in a entry) then it'll be sent
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jacky
the mf2 of the post represented by the url
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sknebel
right, but it isn't necessarily
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jacky
why wouldn't it tho?
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sknebel
why would it?
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sknebel
bridgy docs says to put it somewhere on the page
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sknebel
it doesn't really have value to consumers except the webmention sending logic
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jacky
I don't see that mention of putting it anywhere on the page tbh
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sknebel
Your post HTML must also include that same target URL to verify your intent to publish. It doesn't have to be in your e-content or h-entry; it can appear anywhere on the page.
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jacky
but the post _right_ under it has an example of it being added in the mf2 of the related entry
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sknebel
you can of course say "Lighthouse needs it to be in a property, please put it in a u-x-bridgylink or whatever", but it is an example of something that wouldn't necessarily be in a property
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sknebel
<a href="https://brid.gy/publish/twitter"></a> <- that doesn't end up in parsing output
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sknebel
no property
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jacky
no I meant the next heading
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jacky
but yeah I think I might make that a requirement tbh
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sknebel
"How do I reply to a tweet from my web site?"
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sknebel
that's where I coped that from
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jacky
wishes the heading were links to themselves :)
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jacky
hmm I see what you're saying
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sknebel
it's inside the div with h-entry, but not the parser output
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jacky
mine does b/c I put `u-syndication` on them and I've seen that in other places
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sknebel
what is u-syndication?
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Loqi
u-syndication is a way to discoverably link from your original posts to syndicated copies on other sites like social media silos https://indieweb.org/u-syndication
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sknebel
but it's not a link to a copy
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sknebel
you can of course do it, especially if you replace it afterwards with the published link, but its not really a requirement to do so
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jacky
right
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jacky
that's my assumptions leaking out :)
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sknebel
yeah. my first instinct was too "everything from the parser output should be enough", but thats a special case
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[snarfed]
also afaik most existing webmention sending services don't require mf2 at all, full stop
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jacky
time to be the change then :)
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jacky
going to toy with both
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Zegnat
I thought Telegraph also went with links in mf2, [snarfed]? There are not too many sending services, so that is a big percentage already if I recall it correctly
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aaronpk
i thought it did too
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[snarfed]
maybe! not sure
[tw2113], [jeremycherfas], swentel and [KevinMarks] joined the channel
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[KevinMarks]
Mention.tech looks for h-entry iirc
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[chrisaldrich]
This New Yorker cartoon kind of captures how I feel about how my website may look versus the view source version that people hopefully never look at... https://media.newyorker.com/cartoons/5eb2ba0869e8cb02813d5f98/master/w_600,c_limit/A24226.jpg
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jacky
that's exactly how I feel too
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jacky
I do want my HTML to get to a point where people can kinda learn from it (same way I got in)
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[tw2113]
ahahaha…remember when we used so little javascript that it was actually readable and didn’t need minified?
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Loqi
[tw2113]: lol
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jacky
the good days
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fuzzyBear
hey guys
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fuzzyBear
nybody still up? I got a daft question if somebody wishes to indulge a student
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[tw2113]
we have some active people here right now
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fuzzyBear
consider this function
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fuzzyBear
function reverseStringOne(string){ let reversed = ""; //Where the reversed string will be held for(index = string.length-1; index >=0; index--){ //Starting the loop at the end of the string, ending when the string hits 0, we are decreasing the count reversed += string[index]; //Adding each letter to the reversed string } return reversed;//Returns the string reversed }
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fuzzyBear
(that didnt work)
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fuzzyBear
function reverseStringOne(string){ let reversed = ""; //Where the reversed string will be held for(index = string.length-1; index >=0; index--){ //Starting the loop at the end of the string, ending when the string hits 0, we are decreasing the count : reversed += string[index]; //Adding each letter to the reversed string } return reversed;//Returns the string reversed }
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[tw2113]
maybe a github gist or pastebin?
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fuzzyBear
ahh
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fuzzyBear
cheers man, read my mind
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[tw2113]
that said, it looks like you’re just trying to flip a string into reverse order
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fuzzyBear
@[tw2113] yeh man,
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fuzzyBear
I hope that link workd
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fuzzyBear
in the second method I used the string higher functions which I am still trying to get my head around
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[tw2113]
since you have a comment about efficiency, unless you’re trying to reverse the entirety of moby dick or the harry potter series, I’m not sure you’re ever going to see any detectable performance differences
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[tw2113]
.split() with just quotes i believe turns every character into its own index
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fuzzyBear
does the order which you write out the return string.split().reverse().join() go in that order
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fuzzyBear
lol
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[tw2113]
reverse flips the resulting array
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fuzzyBear
i get your point man
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[tw2113]
and then join rejoins them
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[tw2113]
yes the order would matter
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fuzzyBear
cheers bud
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[tw2113]
you got this