#dev 2020-07-03

2020-07-03 UTC
dckc, [tantek], nickodd, [tw2113], B, gRegorLove_, [chrisaldrich], [schmarty], gRegorLove__, gxt, [fluffy], cweiske, [jeremycherfas] and swentel joined the channel; nickodd left the channel
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[jeremycherfas] Huh? Garmin US no longer allows login via VPN. I can almost under that for tv streaming, but for an activity monitor?
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@iamhirusi Yay! I have added support for mention-of #webmentions on my site! :D It was so simple to extend it from how I handle a webmention reply. Structured data from an API + structured development = win. :) (twitter.com/_/status/1278955984023482368)
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sknebel Github has an interesting detailed list of "what happens when you block a user": https://docs.github.com/en/github/building-a-strong-community/blocking-a-user-from-your-personal-account
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cweiske "The user's forks of your repositories are deleted" - this makes it too easy to remove some software completely from github
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petermolnar that's completely wrong
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petermolnar that goes against git itself
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petermolnar I run this regularly, though originally for scenarios if the source repository disappears, not because I thought gh will cascade-delete repos
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petermolnar https://gist.github.com/petermolnar/4299b0ae03b8692e89e5b0dd36fb9ce6
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petermolnar oh, that's actually a good question: is it a cascade-delete?
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petermolnar say A has an abandoned repo, B forks it, C forks it from B, A blocks B, GH auto-deleted B's fork, what happens to C?
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cweiske my problem with fetching git repositories for backup is force-pushes that empty the history
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petermolnar hm? it'll empty it, but it won't delete the history, will it? So checkout HEAD^ is possible, no?
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cweiske if you reset the local branch to the remote ones, then the local commits will be gone as well
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cweiske they will be in reflog until git decides to collect garbage
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petermolnar I wasn't aware of that
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petermolnar although it's logical
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sknebel thats something I also haven't found a really satisfying solution for. one way could be moving branches to unique names before overwriting them (and maybe accept the risk of there being conflicts later if the name is random enough), or using the data-sharing options for local clones to create a new copy of the repo and only update on of them, keepign the old states around
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sknebel (https://git-scm.com/docs/git-clone has a bunch of options for referencing the data files from other local clones of the same repo, so having multiple ones doesn't necessarily mean duplicating all files. or use lower-level dedupe.)
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sknebel but its all stuff that needs careful figuring out
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cweiske I solved that the same way I do for normal server backups: full backups that use hardlinks if files are identical to save space. rsnapshot does this.
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cweiske that allows me to go back to earlier versions
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sknebel right, that's an example of lower-level. and a good candidate for being reliable
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sknebel just rsnapshot before pulling updates
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[fluffy] That’s what time machine does too. Unfortunately it has potential problems with bitrot.
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sivy morning.
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sivy what is annotations
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Loqi Annotations are comments (including marginalia), highlights or any other interactions that add to (part of) a post, typically added by individuals other than the author https://indieweb.org/annotations
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jacky ugh I'm trying to remember the name of the API that Google uses to fetch your account for signing in
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jacky it's like the sign in functionality that appears on Medium
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jacky I want to see if there's a way to spec that into something that's friendly to federation to make signing into a IndieWeb site a bit simpler (a click instead of having to explicitly type in your domain name)
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aaronpk what is subtome?
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Loqi SubToMe is a button that content publishers can put on their sites which enables users to subscribe to their feed in whatever reader they choose — sort of a universal follow button https://indieweb.org/SubToMe
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aaronpk jacky: see that for some prior art on a way to do it
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aaronpk there's no good answer unfortunately
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aaronpk it could be done with a browser extension too
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sknebel wasn't there some indieaction based demo at one point?
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aaronpk oh yeah probably
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aaronpk what is indieaction?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "indieaction" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "indieaction is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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jacky hmmm okay
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[KevinMarks] What is webaction?
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Loqi A web action is the interface and user experience of taking a specific discrete action, across the web, from one site to another site or application https://indieweb.org/webaction
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jacky Hm subtome is an interesting way to do it
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jacky (though it's subscription specific)
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aaronpk the concept behind subtome could be used for anything like that
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aaronpk i'm not a huge fan of the fact that it relies on a single domain, even though at least the data is all stored client side
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[KevinMarks] The way mastodon does it is a bit annoying
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jacky there's potentially a way to make subtome _not_ rely on a upstream domain
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jacky thanks to Custom Elements
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jacky you could pack it all in some JS and have a <universal-follow-button> component
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aaronpk but where is the data stored, that's the problem
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aaronpk the reason it works with subtome is because the data is stored associated with the central domain, so when it's embedded in other sites those other sites can get access to it
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aaronpk without the central domain, each domain would have its own isolated storage container for that custom element
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jacky Right and I don't know if that's a bad thing? Like it can be very small (like just a JSON dictionary) and it can call out to a index if it needs to "refresh" its index
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aaronpk no i mean that you come to a new site and it has no way to show you your domain until you enter it
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aaronpk also doing anything like this in JS is actively fighting the anti-tracking stuff browsers are starting to lock down on, so I would be wary of investing too much time into it
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jacky fair
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jacky hmm
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aaronpk in other words, if this is possible in JS, then ad tracking is possible
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aaronpk and the recent cross-domain cookie changes mean lots of stuff like this will break
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aaronpk ultimately it needs to be built into browsers so that it can be protected by the browser too
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aaronpk and a browser extension is a reasonable way to prototype future browser features
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jacky thinks intensively about this
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[tantek] this topic needs intensive thinking 🙂
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[KevinMarks] The url auto fill does seem like the right affordance
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[KevinMarks] Browsers already auto fill far more privacy sensitive things
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aaronpk didn't i see a post about this recently?
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sknebel jhttps://martymcgui.re/2020/05/25/a-hole-in-browser-autofill-support/ ?
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sknebel https://martymcgui.re/2020/05/25/a-hole-in-browser-autofill-support/ ?
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@johanbove ↩️ Ik dacht, waarom heeft Jeroen een mooie domein naam maar nog geen webmentions of doet hij niet aan POSSE https://indieweb.org/POSSE (twitter.com/_/status/1279146181000658947)
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[chrisaldrich] I've noticed that a few things I (and others) have bookmarked to news.indieweb.org recently have come through without much context. Is there some secret microfomat and data we're missing that would remedy this?
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[chrisaldrich] here's a recent example: https://news.indieweb.org/en/www.taniarascia.com/another-website-redesign/ from me and another example from Jamie https://news.indieweb.org/en/kevq.uk/how-to-create-an-indieweb-profile/
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jacky I think for bookmarks, it takes the content of it
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aaronpk that's odd
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jacky because https://news.indieweb.org/en/marinintim.com/2020/your-data/ shows my content versus the upstream
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Loqi [marinintim.com] Interesting points on some stuff we’re looking into the IndieWeb, when it comes to handling meta-data.
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aaronpk oh, i think it uses the "name" of your own h-entry, not looking inside the h-cite
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aaronpk https://news.indieweb.org/how-to-submit-a-post
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aaronpk sounds like i should fix that tho
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[chrisaldrich] I've had a few examples like Jacky's recently too... but I wouldn't really want it picking up my commentary on something I've bookmarked.
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[tantek] lol
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[chrisaldrich] If people want to read that, they could click through my link, but the point is to highlight the other person's post.
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[chrisaldrich] I also need to look into how I'm marking up my read posts so that I can syndicate those as bookmarks to indienews. I suspect indienews doesn't parse for read-of, so if I added a secondary bookmark-of, it would catch that as a fallback for post type discovery and I'd be okay? Or maybe I could leave it off and it may default to bookmark-of finding nothing else?
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[chrisaldrich] Generally when it comes to these things, I'm almost 99% sure I'm not doing it right though...
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aaronpk i think i could reevaluate how indienews gets its content
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aaronpk it was a very early project before many of the other tools were very mature, so the assumptions I made back then may no longer apply
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[tantek] [chrisaldrich] more importantly we should make sure that the markup reflects the publishing intent. And only secondarily work on how should things like indienews consume them
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[chrisaldrich] does resubmitting bump the submission date and time and put things back to the top of the list or just update the old post?
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aaronpk i believe it will re-parse everything
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[tantek] I'll suppose ask here too for any dev-perspectives, does this provide a more welcoming option to web devs without harming "obviousness" to folks that want to focus on publishing? https://indieweb.org/Getting_Started#Get_your_own_site
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aaronpk i like it
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[tantek] aaronpk, for you in particular, I'm hoping this is enough of an update hah
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[tantek] you beat me to it
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[tantek] my goal was to give you something you could follow-up with on https://twitter.com/aaronpk/status/1279083522481729537
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@aaronpk @dcuttridge We've been working hard on fighting the idea that being on the IndieWeb is only if you build a website from scratch, so we may have gone a bit far in the opposite direction with that page. Will try to clear it up! (twitter.com/_/status/1279083522481729537)
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[chrisaldrich] tantek, I had sketched out a grid version a while ago at https://indieweb.org/User:Boffosocko.com/homepage, useful for that page perhaps?
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[chrisaldrich] Didn't we have a page with a Tumblr recommendation at one point, or did we deprecate that as it's become crumblr?
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[tantek] We deprecated it 😕
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