#dev 2020-10-13

2020-10-13 UTC
geoffo, [Will_Monroe], [fluffy], [chrisaldrich] and djmoch joined the channel
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@floehopper How I've used @rem's https://webmention.app and @TheOwenYoung's https://actionsflow.github.io to automate sending Webmentions from my static website. https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/1315920513131311104)
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@freerange Freeranger @floehopper is on a blogging roll at the moment, 2 posts in as many days! Here's one on setting up a rails dev environment using Nix: https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-12-generating-and-running-a-rails-app-with-postgresql-using-nix-on-ubuntu. And another on automatically sending Webmentions from a static site: https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website. (twitter.com/_/status/1315937381581828096)
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@winsontang Automatically sending Webmentions from a static website https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter (twitter.com/_/status/1315961491951034369)
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@hn_frontpage Automatically sending Webmentions from a static website L: https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website C: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24763587 (twitter.com/_/status/1315961188321243139)
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@HNTweets Automatically sending Webmentions from a static website: https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website Comments: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24763587 (twitter.com/_/status/1315962998943514625)
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@DenverProphitJr ↩️ #webmentions are starting to flow from https://brid.gy/twitter/DenverProphitJr# onto my content at https://denverprophit.us/technical-seo/using-science-philosophy-organize-semantic-web.html I still have some CSS styling to do! Modify JS to get interaction type & count into JSON+LD for schema. @bill_slawski @AndrzejZasowski Read More: https://indieweb.org/ (twitter.com/_/status/1315964148677840896)
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@DenverProphitJr ↩️ #webmentions are starting to flow from https://brid.gy/twitter/DenverProphitJr# onto my content at https://denverprophit.us/technical-seo/using-science-philosophy-organize-semantic-web.html I still have some CSS styling to do! Modify JS to get interaction type & count into JSON+LD for schema. @bill_slawski @AndrzejZasowski Read More: https://indieweb.org/ (twitter.com/_/status/1315964148677840896)
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@HackerNewsTop10 Automatically sending Webmentions from a static website Link: https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website Comments: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24763587 (twitter.com/_/status/1315963501932883968)
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@newsycombinator Automatically sending Webmentions from a static website https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website (twitter.com/_/status/1316001142502051840)
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aaronpk lol cue the "but is anyone actually using it" comments on HN 🙄
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[Denver_Prophit] You guys must grab #webmentions from twitter. I didn't know it would post my tweet in here.
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@betterhn50 Automatically sending Webmentions from a static website https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24763587) (twitter.com/_/status/1316032821618716672)
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@hackernewsj 静的WebサイトからWebmentionsを自動的に送信する https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website (twitter.com/_/status/1316033823742799872)
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@DenverProphitJr ↩️ Now have integrated webmentions from any other website or social silo. I'll have to rewrite the provided code for better presentation. It grabs twitter activity as well as responses from ANY website that uses webmentions. More about that at https://indieweb.org/ (twitter.com/_/status/1316035099599818753)
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[Denver_Prophit] Why are all my tweets being blasted to this channel?
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aaronpk in case it wasn't obvious from all the other tweets here, the bot searches for tweets mentioning "webmention"
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[Denver_Prophit] Ah should just grab hashtags instead of words I think lol
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aaronpk nah :)
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[Denver_Prophit] So, I got the Heroku webmention script to work. The hosted script is crappy for presentation. So, now, i'll have to write script to pull the data =(
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@triptych http://Webmention.io https://webmention.io/ receive webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/1316040930458181632)
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@triptych Automate your outgoing webmentions https://webmention.app/ (twitter.com/_/status/1316040795762253824)
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@triptych Automatically sending Webmentions from a static website - James Mead https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website (twitter.com/_/status/1316040242231611395)
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[KevinMarks] you can style the hosted stuff yourself, it has lots of classes on
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[KevinMarks] flex your CSS skills
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[prtksxna] `flex`, get it?
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[Denver_Prophit] [KevinMarks] what I did see is the hosted stuff from the herokuapp wasn't in a microformat for a repost or like or even h-cite u-response
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[KevinMarks] true, but as it's a js injection that is less of an issue.
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[KevinMarks] Simon Willison mentioned pingback so I added docs https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24765158
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Loqi [simonw] I helped create pingback [https://simonwillison.net/tags/pingback/], which eventually made it into WordPress and hence achieved pretty widespread distribution. My concern here is spam. With hindsight both Pingback and Trackbacks (which Pingback was a...
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[Denver_Prophit] In WP, I did an allow/deny to xmprpc.php and allow allowed trusted domains to do a pingback
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[Denver_Prophit] I can get a json response from the heroku app. I just may need to create a file routine to update a data file in Jekyll for each post and cut down the time to daily maintenance so I can do for loops and get interaction counts and such for json+ld and microformats2
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[Denver_Prophit] [KevinMarks] what ya think of that approach? Shave off render time and do more with the response data?
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[KevinMarks] So when you get a webmention notification you update the file? Then have a separate cron to do the counting?
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[Denver_Prophit] Yes like once or twice a day check for updates. Overwrite the json data file and partial rebuild of jekyll
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ren se
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ren ese
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ren s
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[KevinMarks] If a full rebuild is slow, you are effectively building a queue to handle it. Separate out the different bits into routines and decide how often you run them separately. You could trigger a rebuild daily or after so many come in, for example.
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[KevinMarks] at that point you're getting closer to doing your own webmention implementation.
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[KevinMarks] with mention.tech I rely on the appengine scheduler to do the deferred updates for me
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[KevinMarks] one of the neat things webmention.herokuapp.com does is the realtime updates if the page is open
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[Denver_Prophit] [KevinMarks] at least I'm cutting out milliseconds in response time waiting for the hosted app to respond?
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[KevinMarks] it may make sense to fork that for yourself and use it to write to your preferred storage
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[Denver_Prophit] [KevinMarks] perhaps. I'm just a front-end dev. I mind the TTFB and paint time. I can do more with a json response. I'm still wet behind the ears with mentions. It is a game changer to get away from social silos
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[Denver_Prophit] In my teens, I ran a FIDOnet BBS on a baud modem. It also relied on comments posted in one bbs to be xmitted over to another.
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[KevinMarks] it's in node, so if you're used to js that may be a good fit https://github.com/voxpelli/webpage-webmentions
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Loqi [voxpelli] webpage-webmentions: A hosted Disqus-like comment service that enables WebMention receiving on any kind of site
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voxpelli Hey 👋
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voxpelli [Denver_Prophit]: I value TTFB and paint time as well :)
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[Denver_Prophit] Vox sites would hammer your app less often maybe if doing local storage of your json response
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voxpelli [Denver_Prophit]: I don’t mind them hammering my site, quite the opposite: I encourage them to connect and listen for updates in real-time
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[Denver_Prophit] ↩️ Your hosted app adds anywhere from 1.7 to 2.5 seconds to pageload speed
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[Denver_Prophit] ↩️ Pages MUST stay under 2 seconds as a ranking factor.
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Zegnat Heroku taking 2 seconds average to return JSON? That sounds ... odd. Wonder what is up there.
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[Denver_Prophit] [Zegnat] I am using gtmetrix to measure site after adding hosted js.
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[chrisaldrich] Provocative question for development/chewing on: If I were a service company like Grammarly.com or Yoast SEO, what would be the best way to integrate my services into a micropub workflow? Is there a way (extension) to easily leverage the service into a broad array of pre-existing posting clients, or would I be better off making my own client?
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Zegnat [Denver_Prophit]: yeah, not wanting to say your numbers are off! Makes me feel that Heroku itself is not on top of its game
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[Denver_Prophit] [Zegnat] moreover, all remote apps are at the mercy of network speed and processing. That's why I wanted to collab on creating cron jobs to write a json response, locally.
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Zegnat Sounds like something like ... was it Morris?
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Zegnat What is Morris?
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Loqi Morris is a self-hosted PHP service for storing Webmentions from webmention.io in a JSON format that static sites can use to render them without querying webmention.io on each build https://indieweb.org/Morris
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Zegnat Script that runs on your server and fetches the data, so your build system can go off of the data that is already there
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Zegnat You use it as a client and give it access to post to your "real" endpoint (e.g. WordPress). Then you use the client you actually want to use (e.g. Quill) and connect that to the service's endpoint.
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Zegnat You can then write something as normal, and the service gets to transform things about your request before passing it on to your site. This can chain infinitely with different services.
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Zegnat [chrisaldrich]: it depends. I do not know those services. But do they require user input? I have thought about doing sort of proxy-services (for lack of a better word). The service is both a Micropub endpoint *and* client.
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[chrisaldrich] [Zegnat] Most of what I'm thinking of are add on services to posting clients that do helper sorts of functions, so in the case of grammarly, you would post your content in an editor and then run grammarly on it to highlight things like spelling, grammar and usage issues which you'd then want to fix within the editor prior to posting. In the case of Yoast, it looks at your post and helps you to consider expanding/shortening it, using
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[chrisaldrich] better keywords, etc for improved SEO prior to posting it to your server.
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[chrisaldrich] I'm wondering how those sorts of middleware services can improve/flourish within the greater micropub space.
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Zegnat Those sound more like client side things to me
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[KevinMarks] if your app is what wakes up the heroku service it could add some load time, but you should defer that anyway
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sknebel TIL transpilers to older versions are also a thing for PHP: https://blog.logrocket.com/transpiling-php-code-from-8-0-to-7-x-via-rector/
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jacky I slightly remember that re: transpiling PHP
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Zegnat I have never seen it before. The closest thing that came to my mind was Haxe. But that is cheating as that is a different language that then transpiles into PHP
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jacky I figured HHVM/Hack being something similar (but under that same new language thing)
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Zegnat Facebook wrote their own vm/interpreter for Hack though, right? So it did not neccessarily transpile into clean PHP?
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@RiverVanRain Automatically sending Webmentions from a static website #IndieWeb via https://o.wzm.me/river/v/133544 https://jamesmead.org/blog/2020-10-13-sending-webmentions-from-a-static-website (twitter.com/_/status/1316117506256494593)
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