#dev 2023-02-19

2023-02-19 UTC
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[tantek] jacky++ thank for sharing that about moderation, that's a great thread
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Loqi jacky has 26 karma in this channel over the last year (69 in all channels)
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[tantek] moderation << Federated/decentralized considerations: https://hachyderm.io/@hrefna/109887787033151885
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Loqi ok, I added "Federated/decentralized considerations: https://hachyderm.io/@hrefna/109887787033151885" to the "See Also" section of /moderation https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=86723&oldid=84604
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[tantek] moderation << ^ Of particular interest for [[diversity]] & inclusion per second post in thread: https://hachyderm.io/@hrefna/109887787074284617
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Loqi ok, I added "^ Of particular interest for [[diversity]] & inclusion per second post in thread: https://hachyderm.io/@hrefna/109887787074284617" to the "See Also" section of /moderation https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=86724&oldid=86723
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[tantek] re: Mastodon's habit of making "instance-local" permalinks for any post that goes to any inbox on that instance, do those URLs return a rel=canonical link back to the original at least so one can automatically detect the original?
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gRegor they're js;dr now right? So I doubt it. Don't think they did before though, either
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gRegor Aside from stylesheets and icons, only rels I see are dns-prefetch and manifest on one of my BF status pages
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[tantek] sorta. I don't think js;dr and link rel=canonical have any particular correlation or not
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[tantek] I checked https://xoxo.zone/@tantek.com@tantek.com/109877487288621969 for example (which works because I'm still logged in there somehow) and no rel=canonical which is too bad. That feels like an "easy" upgrade of such instance-local-permalinks
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gRegor I guess if the fetching client actually runs the JS to get the HTML, but how many do that?
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aaronpk mastodon does different things depending on whether you're logged in
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aaronpk if you visit the URL while logged out it returns a 302 redirect, which is arguably better than rel=canonical
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aaronpk it mostly "just works", in that if you send that link to someone else, they will get redirected to the original, but if you visit it yourself, you'll see it in your instance so you can interact with it
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gRegor Does that apply for native Mastodon posts too, not indieweb setups?
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gRegor Alice posts on xoxo.zone, view it while logged out on mastodon.social, does it redirect?
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aaronpk yes, there isn't a distinction as far as mastodon is concerned
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gRegor oh, didn't realize that
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[tantek] good to know aaronpk, yes the 302 is better than a canonical
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[tantek] gRegor, Mastodon can't "tell" the difference between "native Mastodon posts" and "indieweb setups" federated via Bridgy Fed, that's part of the point 🙂
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gRegor It's mostly magic to me so I wasn't sure XD
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[tantek] Bridgy Fed is definitely sufficiently advanced technology to me too 🙂
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IWDiscordRelay <c​apjamesg#4492> I listened to an interesting podcast earlier...
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IWDiscordRelay <c​apjamesg#4492> https://www.theverge.com/2023/2/14/23598344/mozilla-firefox-ceo-mitchell-baker-microsoft-edge-bing-google-apple-ai
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gRegor Whoa, big GoDaddy WordPress breach. https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/godaddy-hackers-stole-source-code-installed-malware-in-multi-year-breach/ "affecting 1.2 million Managed WordPress customers ... They gained access to the email addresses of all impacted customers, their WordPress Admin passwords, sFTP and database credentials, and SSL private keys of a subset of active clients."
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[tantek] GoDaddy << Massive managed WordPress breach: 2023-02-17 [https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/godaddy-hackers-stole-source-code-installed-malware-in-multi-year-breach/ GoDaddy: Hackers stole source code, installed malware in multi-year breach]
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Loqi ok, I added "Massive managed WordPress breach: 2023-02-17 [https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/godaddy-hackers-stole-source-code-installed-malware-in-multi-year-breach/ GoDaddy: Hackers stole source code, installed malware in multi-year breach]" to the "See Also" section of /GoDaddy https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=86725&oldid=77937
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[schmarty] yiiiikes
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[tantek] yeah that deserve to go on their permanent record
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aaronpk wow
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prologic aaronpk re contend addressing woes and edits. you can detect an edit and deal with that really, its complete deletes that are more interesting to deal with
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prologic Someone able to show me (at all) what an Accept object looks like to accept a Follow request?
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aaronpk prologic: https://gist.github.com/aaronpk/cc13c305ae2e8ac4fb194e8dd1889bc9
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prologic Ahh!
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prologic Thank you very much!
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prologic Can you also explain how the ID should match the original Follow request recieved?
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prologic Is it the outter activity id that needs to match? or the inner object?
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aaronpk i think only the actor urls need to match?
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aaronpk wait
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aaronpk so this is one that my server received
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aaronpk mastodon put my object ID in the object
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aaronpk so it's saying "yes I accepted your follow object" so the inner ID is *my* object ID
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aaronpk the outer ID is the ID of the new accept activity
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prologic yeah so the inner ID has to match the originally received Follow Id
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prologic 👌
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aaronpk i don't think i'm actually checking that on mine, i wonder if that's bad
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prologic who the hell knows
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aaronpk i don't really care about the activity, i care about the person
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prologic I'm also wondering at this point about ids
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aaronpk a lot of this stuff seems unnecessary
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prologic I'm not really doing anything with them, because I simply don't care
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aaronpk and if it is actually necessary, then it is really poorly explained
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prologic same here
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prologic If this doesn't work for whatever reason
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prologic I'll just use uuid or ulid as ids and call it a day
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prologic I literally gives zero shits about tracking activities
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prologic I'm even going to try very hard to avoid building an "Outbox"
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prologic :)
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aaronpk i think you are coming to the same conclusion that many people who start building this stuff realize, which is that there is actually a very small subset of the activitypub spec that is actually needed and useful for shuffling this data around
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aaronpk lol this is my outbox https://gist.github.com/aaronpk/1d32456be813ad21f4224255e5ee1031
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aaronpk it just reports the total number of posts. which i don't think is even used anywhere, because the post count you see from mastodon is coming from my actor profile JSON
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prologic Yeah
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prologic this is what happens when you over engineer a spec I guess :)
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aaronpk over in some places, under in others
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prologic love it 😝
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prologic yeah some of the specifics are rather sparse
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prologic hence my dumb ass questions
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prologic But I'm taking notes, so hopefully I can update the IndieWeb wiki page on this soon
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aaronpk and everyone's "test against mastodon until it works" approach
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prologic and maybe even build a few CLI tools for static websites
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prologic yeah in this case I'm testing against GTS
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prologic because standing up Mastoon is "too hard"™
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prologic seriously its insane
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aaronpk i did it using docker once and i never want to do that again
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prologic Also I've found an issue already with micro.blog, it doesn't seem to lookup my actor
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prologic despite no failures on my side
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prologic If it takes more than ~5mins to spin something up you've lost me already
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prologic plain and simple
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prologic if it requires a freak'n SQL/RDMB database, I'm out
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prologic :D
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prologic (at least an external one that is)
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prologic now let's see how badly I've gotten some of this
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prologic I've ended up writing so much untested code now :)
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prologic but mostly borrowing from my websub impl, because I started to realize hos similar the two patterns really were/are
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prologic except that I use websub to notify pods of twtxt feeds that are updated (its primary use case realy for websub, "hey thing X is updated!")
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prologic moment of trust 🤞
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prologic see how many things I got wrong 🤣
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prologic after fixing up a few stupid typos and b ugs
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prologic yarn_yarn.1.utgotvynowsb@dm6.mills.io | time="2023-02-19T06:08:28Z" level=error msg="error parsing object" error="error: unsupported object \"Undo\""
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prologic yeah okay not sure that I care all taht much about Undo activites righ tnow :D
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aaronpk That's what you get when someone deletes a post
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aaronpk I ignore them right now 🙈
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prologic I pretty much will be to
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prologic maybe I might do something with Undo+Follow
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prologic But that's about it
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prologic Dunno, we'll see :)
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prologic The problem with Undo btw... in case no-one has brought this up before, is you can't trust it at all
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prologic There is absolutely no way you can tell (unless you also track the originating Note) that the Actor who sent the Undo for a Note actually owns said Note
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prologic and then you can get into all kinds of bad actor bs (no phun intendeed) :D
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prologic Ahh hell
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prologic I'm getting 401 Unauthorised responses from doing lookups on actors on GTS again :/
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prologic Debugging this is gonna be hard, so many flows back 'n forth :(
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prologic Maybe someone can help me spot wha tI'm doing wrong :D
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prologic https://gist.github.com/prologic/9dbe97e68f70b0bc4a827d7b421ca1c1
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prologic So Follow requests (inbound) and Accept+Follow (outbound) and Note (outbound) are working now between Yarn and micro.Blog
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prologic However I don't see my post on micro.Blog :/
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prologic so no idea wtf is going on there (seems to be going into the void /dev/null :/ )
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prologic How else can I test my AP impl?
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prologic 🤔
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prologic https://twtxt.net/twt/divyumq
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@stevenwoodson Joining the IndieWeb with Webmentions and Microformats @ https://stevenwoodson.com/blog/joining-the-indieweb-with-webmentions-and-microformats/ #indieweb #webdevelopment #webdeveloper #webdev #howmanyhashtagsforwebarethere (twitter.com/_/status/1627445311122599938)
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@stevenwoodson ↩️ There's been a lot written about Webmentions and Microformats by really smart people. Rather than rehash all the details of getting it working, I think it’s better to list all the resources that helped me understand and/or integrate Webmentions instead. Hope it helps you too! (twitter.com/_/status/1627445313064534016)
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