#dev 2023-10-10

2023-10-10 UTC
#
epoch
is anyone using pyld for json-ld stuff?
#
epoch
I was thinking about using it, but it fails to pull in the activitystreams... whatever it is called.
#
epoch
found some behavior that I didn't expect from w3.org's website
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epoch
curl -sIH "Accept: application/ld+json, application/json;q=0.5, text/html;q=0.8, application/xhtml+xml;q=0.8" https://www.w3.org/ns/activitystreams | grep content-type
#
epoch
what do you expect to be the content-type with that Accept header?
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epoch
I expected ld+json because it doesn't have a q, so it defaults to 1, right?
#
epoch
for some reason it gives text/html
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epoch
not sure who to tell about this.
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epoch
so, this channel gets it too
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aaronpk
conneg--
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Loqi
conneg has -26 karma in this channel over the last year (-34 in all channels)
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aaronpk
add it as an example of a conneg fail on the wiki?
#
epoch
what's weird is, if the q for the ml content-types is set to below 0.5, it starts returning ld+json
#
epoch
0.5 or less*
#
epoch
like their default q value is set to 0.5
#
epoch
checks their server
#
epoch
> cloudflare
#
epoch
might be their bug
#
epoch
someone is asking if a german word that ends in "eiten" is singular, or plural
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epoch
this is the wrong channel.
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sebbu
there *was* a channel about thoses kind of question in freenode, that was #tatoeba. they still have a nice website/forum
#
epoch
I keep finding bugs in stuff but I don't want to create an account on github again to report them
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epoch
so maybe I'll just make posts about them on my own website
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epoch
and if someone else wants to link to the bug report...
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sebbu
you could make a temp or new email, and make thoses accounts on big sites, and never check them except if you need a 2fa code or some other verification thing
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sebbu
and keep a mostly empty github account, and only make bug report from the website (not even with git installed on your pc)
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epoch
eh. they'll find the bug eventually.
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epoch
I had an account like that for a while, and most of the bug reports went nowhere anyway
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epoch
sometimes feel like I'm shadowbanned from the internet
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[snarfed]
conneg--
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Loqi
conneg has -27 karma in this channel over the last year (-35 in all channels)
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epoch
cache taking into account accept header is not supported
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epoch
as if I needed another reason to dislike cloudflare
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aaronpk
conneg--
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Loqi
conneg has -28 karma in this channel over the last year (-36 in all channels)
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epoch
cloudflare--
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Loqi
cloudflare has -1 karma in this channel over the last year (-2 in all channels)
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epoch
weird that it is somehow able to return different content based on the accept header, just not with the q values that pyld uses.
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epoch
\o_o/
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[snarfed]
the usual way to do that is with the Vary header, looks like they support that
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[catgirlinspace]
[tantek] h-entrys on my website don't have the same issue i think. only class on those is the h-entry, everything else is inside it. looks like it does parse fine though, and apparently i forgot some properties >.< https://indiewebify.me/validate-h-entry/?url=https://catgirlin.space/posts/building-an-image-splitter/
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Loqi
conneg has -29 karma in this channel over the last year (-37 in all channels)
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c​apjamesg
My first laugh of the day was seeing conneg here 🤣
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GWG
[capjamesg]: I see the ticket auth response
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c​apjamesg
If you are talking about Melvin, I will address this.
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GWG
I figured I'd let you
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c​apjamesg
Feel free to respond to my initial message but disregard Melvin’s comments unless you want to weigh in.
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GWG
Done
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c​apjamesg
Will review!
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GWG
It's honestly what I believe
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GWG
I was here for private webmentions, autoauth, etc... Ticket Auth is the simplest idea I've seen
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GWG
That's why I wanted to map out a plan to smooth out the edges and start some better implementations
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c​apjamesg
I am unsure why but I have found the spec a bit hard to understand.
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c​apjamesg
I think more supporting materials would be helpful.
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GWG
[capjamesg]: I've unofficially edited the text, so that could be me. But the issue is that people expect things to be in scope that aren't usually
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sknebel
one could also say that the issue is that the spec doesn't cover things you need for a practical application ;)
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GWG
For example, it doesn't say how you as a consumer might ask for a ticket... because asking is out of scope. I believe one implementation sent one to anyone who had an endpoint
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GWG
sknebel: Such as?
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sknebel
such as what you just mentioned, figuring out what tokens are valid for, ...
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sknebel
but thats really in the "needs to be tried out" realm
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GWG
Yes, which I think is part of the goal in getting a group effort together
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sknebel
before "writing more spec"
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GWG
My proposal is just having a brief discussion, agree to work on some implementations and test together, then iterate.
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sknebel
yeah. not convinced going through the CG isn't more distraction than help, but yes, group effort certainly helps with experimenting
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GWG
sknebel: I am willing to discuss it in any forum
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GWG
Including here to identify what we are working on collectively.
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GWG
In my opinion, it is the sending/redeeming of tickets and their usage. Requesting one, save any debugging solution we put in for testing, should be out of scope as well as how/what uses the token once redeemed... once we get the ticket flow tested we can discuss more around the periphery.
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c​apjamesg
sknebel I made the Issue just so other people who may be interested in private posts can see we're working on it.
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c​apjamesg
sknebel "figuring out what tokens are valid for," can you clarify?
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sknebel
right now there is only one url given, does the token work for other urls? which ones? (bunch about that in questions section on the page already)
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sknebel
also "how do tokens get from the endpoint to the apps that want to use them"
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rubenwardy
Finally published my blog post on my experience joining the indieweb, I appreciate any feedback: https://blog.rubenwardy.com/2023/10/10/hello-indieweb/
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Loqi
[preview] [rubenwardy] I have joined the IndieWeb
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jeremycherfas
Food piece, on first reading, and I'm sure there are solutions to your authorship issue. rubenwardy++
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Loqi
rubenwardy has 5 karma in this channel over the last year (6 in all channels)
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jeremycherfas
Good, obvs.
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rubenwardy
thanks :)
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rubenwardy
I can't seem to log into telegraph, just says " The authorization endpoint for the returned profile URL (https://rubenwardy.com/) did not match the authorization endpoint used to begin the login. "
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rubenwardy
oh lame, it's http:// vs https://
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c​apjamesg
Oooh, I love your website!
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[tantek]
rubenwardy++ for a well-written and thoughtful post. appreciate the sharing of experiences good & bad and hope we can use that to improve docs & tools
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Loqi
rubenwardy has 6 karma in this channel over the last year (7 in all channels)
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[tantek]
rubenwardy, I fear the answers to your authorship questions here (in chat) may have been given from a plumbing perspective rather than a publishing perspective, and I'd like to fix that.
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[tantek]
there's a very unfortunate webdev habit of providing plumbing-centric answers to publishing-centric questions. two very experienced members of this community just did that exact thing in #microformats channel recently.
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rubenwardy
What do you mean by plumbing Vs publishing?
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[tantek]
publishing is what you are doing with your blog
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[tantek]
plumbing is what tools (like validators) implement to consume things
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[tantek]
they are two very different perspectives with very different use-cases, and thus very different approaches to solutions
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GWG
[capjamesg]: When might you want to sync chat?
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[capjamesg]
Probably not this week. I have a lot already on my metaphorical plate. Next week?
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GWG
[capjamesg]: No rush. We've been waiting for a while to do it
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[tantek]
[snarfed] literally all of my early POSSE work was figuring out how to take relatively "rich" post types and "downscale" them into plain text notes on Twitter, then limited to ~117 characters (leaving space for original post permalink in the 140)
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[tantek]
what is plain text design
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Loqi
Text-first design refers to the practice of designing information and UIs so they are readable/usable/actionable at least as basic plain text https://indieweb.org/plain_text_design
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[tantek]
so in the specific example of: "eg the fediverse, Bluesky, and Nostr don't understand bookmarks (among others), we can't yet POSSE them there, but we can happily post them on our own sites" (as [snarfed] noted in #indieweb earlier), the answer is to allow cross-posting of bookmarks to those other destinations with the plain text equivalent of a bookmark post
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[tantek]
plain text equivalent of a bookmark post -> we have experience with & designs for this: https://indieweb.org/bookmark#How_to_POSSE
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[snarfed]
yes! I'm definitely aware of all of your text-first design work. it's awesome!
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[snarfed]
I love that for people to choose on their own sites, but I was reluctant to lean far into it in Bridgy classic, since it has more potential to surprise users if they don't expect it
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[snarfed]
a la "keep Bridgy Publish dumb"
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[snarfed]
Bridgy classic has an option for publishers to provide the explicit text they want POSSEd, https://brid.gy/about#silo-content , I could do that in BF too
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gRegor
[capjamesg], Also interested in TicketAuth. Thumbsed-up on github.
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GWG
gRegor++
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Loqi
gRegor has 26 karma in this channel over the last year (80 in all channels)
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[manton]
Hey ActivityPub nerds… 🙂 So Mastodon recently added “Translate” links to posts that (I assume) don’t have a language set. It adds a lot of clutter because I don’t need to translate from English to English. I’m finally looking into this so I can update http://Micro.blog to spit out whatever JSON Mastodon wants.
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[manton]
From what I can tell, the only language set is using “contentMap” with “en” for the content… But that means duplicate the content text in every single JSON. Seems bloated. Anyone have experience with this? Maybe I’m missing something?
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[manton]
I’m seeing the same “Translate” links on Bridgy Fed posts too.
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sknebel
[manton]: is that whats done in the messages your server gets?
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[manton]
[sknebel] Yes, I’m looking at ActivityPub JSON from other Mastodon servers and it looks like this:
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[manton]
``` "content": "Text here.",
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[manton]
"contentMap": {
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[manton]
"en": "Text here again."
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[manton]
I also see some messages from PeerTube and it looks different:
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[manton]
``` "language": {
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[manton]
"name": "English"
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[manton]
"identifier": "en",
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sknebel
seems thats what AS says, its default-language form looks different (based on json-ld) than the peertube version
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[manton]
Ah, thanks. I was looking through activitystreams-vocabulary which only mentions contentMap.
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[manton]
I actually discard the @context values in my logging so I’m not totally sure what Mastodon is putting there. Will have to dig deeper.
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[manton]
When I request a post with Accept: activitypub, though, there’s no language in @context.
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[tantek]
[snarfed] agreed with keep Bridgy Publish simple! The special Bridgy markup makes sense. Another standards based way could be plain text p-summary markup.
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[tantek]
we have a long running thread about using p-summary for plain text fallback behavior in general, so I wonder if that's a good signal for Bridgy Publish to use on "unknown" post types as an explicit fallback
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gRegor
I've tried p-summary with BF before and I think opened a github issue. I think the main thing was Mastodon (or AS?) use of "summary" as the spoiler tag
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Loqi
[preview] [gRegorLove] #332 Idea: fallback to summary for other post types?
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[KevinMarks]
That's a mastodon quirk. AS name,summary,content match the microformats meanings, because we converged them in SocialWG
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gRegor
Yeah, seems like it would be ok for a bridge to use p-summary as fallback for content
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[tantek]
right, specifically as fallback for content for post types unrecognized by the destination
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[tantek]
not suggesting any use of Bridgy Fed to send p-summary -> Mastodon AP "summary", because that would be a disaster due to the content warning overloading 😕
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