#meta 2018-05-01

2018-05-01 UTC
[jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "I am focused on trying to build our PLN in spaces we control while modeling good digital hygiene for our students. Currently participating in" by Greg McVerry on 2018-05-01 http://quickthoughts.jgregorymcverry.com/2018/05/01/i-am-focused-on-trying-to-build-our-pln-in
eli_oat and [unoabraham] joined the channel
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "@JeremyDBond It could be a hashtag, IRL, a movement like, #indieweb, a community like #ds106, an Open Source project, or volunteering to tutor reading. Spaces" by Greg McVerry on 2018-05-01 http://quickthoughts.jgregorymcverry.com/2018/05/01/jeremydbond-it-could-be-a-hashtag-irl-a-movement-like
#
tantek.com edited /events/2018-05-02-homebrew-website-club (-8) "/* San Francisco */ FB POSSE copy" (view diff)
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "Actually if anyone in my #edtechchat PLN ever thought about the process of turning your WordPress blog into something powered by #indieweb technologies (You are" by Greg McVerry on 2018-05-01 http://quickthoughts.jgregorymcverry.com/2018/05/01/actually-if-anyone-in-my-edtechchat-pln-ever-thought-about
#
tantek ^^^ who is using UTC dates?
#
tantek or what perhaps (software?)
#
tantek pretty sure [jgmac1106] is in PDT or at least US timezones
#
aaronpk looks like Known
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "5 a.m. here and I am listening to An Indieweb Podcast – Episode 3: Syndication. Never thought I’d..." by 939abraham on 2018-04-30 https://unoabraham.tumblr.com/post/173464279311
#
tantek looks like there is no 516 error, and 530 is proprietary (though means "Frozen" so we could have some fun with that)
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "@nathan_stevens Or you could go all John Connor on them and travel back in time to 1996-2007 using #indieweb stuff #edtechchat No reason we have" by Greg McVerry on 2018-05-01 http://quickthoughts.jgregorymcverry.com/2018/05/01/nathan_stevens-or-you-could-go-all-john-connor-on-them
#
tantek uh, I don't think it was John Connor who went back in time
#
GWG It was Kyle Reese, I think.
#
GWG It's been a while
#
GWG I was always more of a Back to the Future person
#
tantek yes
#
[jgmac1106] [kevinmarks]thanks for sharing lead me to the explanation thread thatgoes into greater detail: https://twitter.com/sarahmei/status/990968833547497472
#
@sarahmei More on why agile/XP so often fails heterogenous teams (started here: https://twitter.com/sarahmei/status/990594488052559874) https://pbs.twimg.com/tweet_video_thumb/DcCg5LjV0AAGoNg.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/990968833547497472)
#
GWG I suddenly want to watch Back to the Future.
#
[jgmac1106] [tantek] you are correct
#
[jgmac1106] I am wrong, shamed in my Terminator knowledge, Connor the spawn Kyle Reese the dad
#
tantek checked the various films on Wikipedia to make sure that Connor never did in fact go back
#
[jgmac1106] no he did not. @Guy I was talking to always drops Skynet references I wish I said go all John Connor on him and send Kyle Reese back to 1996. Was trying to also draw reference to the last principle
[kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
[kevinmarks] He goes forward in Sarah Connor chronicles
#
[jgmac1106] That show wasn't too bad
#
tantek schmarty I'm going to assume Bmore is meeting Tuesdays on regular HWC weeks the rest of May
#
tantek making may pages now
#
tantek because very soon now
#
schmarty tantek: thanks! i think that's a safe assumption
#
tantek It's Gonna Be May™
#
schmarty haha
#
tantek.com created /events/2018-05-16-homebrew-website-club (+7766) "stub from 2018-05-02" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /events/2018-05-16-homebrew-website-club (+91) "SF needs another host and venue on the 16th" (view diff)
#
tantek.com created /events/2018-05-30-homebrew-website-club (+7766) "clone from 2018-05-16" (view diff)
#
tantek.com created /events/2018-06-13-homebrew-website-club (+7766) "clone from 2018-05-30" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /events/2018-05-30-homebrew-website-club (+0) "bmore 29th" (view diff)
#
tantek.com created /events/2018-06-27-homebrew-website-club (+7897) "clone from 2018-05-30" (view diff)
#
tantek ok made May and June HWC pages
#
tantek.com edited /Events (-57) "pretty soon It's Gonna Be May" (view diff)
[snarfed] joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /2018 (+897) "add attractions and Blog section" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /2018 (-8) "subheads" (view diff)
[tantek], jgmac1106 and eli_oat joined the channel
#
kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs (+1344) "update from /Events" (view diff)
#
tantek hey aaronpk 2018 RSVP is live right?
#
aaronpk yes! I need to do an official announcement blog post about it but it's a go
#
tantek.com edited /2018 (+446) "/* RSVP */ additional listing calagator stub, opensource bridge update" (view diff)
#
tantek can you update https://indieweb.org/2018#RSVP with URLs? Do we have a Calagator too?
#
tantek looks like we have 6/28 off in between IWS and OSBridge
#
GWG What are you suggesting?
#
schmarty bonus day of making??
#
schmarty bonus day of karaoke?
#
tantek depends on what space we have
#
tantek if OSBridge folks have Elliot Center - we could do a cross-over day
#
aaronpk OSBridge isn't doing anything officially for thursday, but i'm not sure what the deal is with the space
#
tantek I'm also ok with taking a day off between the two
#
tantek and just hanging out in portland
#
aaronpk day off with optional karaoke? :D
#
tantek maybe we can suggest a breakfast meetup and a happy hour event to sync people up
#
tantek and yes, optional karaoke after too
#
tantek I was too tired after last time
#
tantek that is the day of devday / demo day
#
tantek aaronpk - note also the OSBridge blog post links to /2018
#
aaronpk oh I didn't see their blog post yet, just their email
#
tantek I just linked to it from /2018 :D
#
aaronpk I will ask them to update that to 2018.indieweb.org
#
tantek please do that AFTER you've blogged about it for the indieweb community
#
tantek would prefer that folks in the community get a chance to sign-up
#
tantek since we have even more limited space than OSBridge (which is already noting are limited to 200 for their BarCamp day on Friday)
#
aaronpk we have more limited space?
#
aaronpk we can fit way more this year than last year, the last thing i'm worried about is filling up
#
tantek ok!
#
aaronpk you know the room that osbridge uses for their main un-scheduled area with tables and all the activities? that's our main room
#
tantek still - I think it's better to blog it here as being official before having others link to it for sign-ups
#
tantek nice
#
tantek how many side-rooms will we have?
#
aaronpk i'm gonna have to double check but I think two classrooms on the first floor, plus that big room can be split into two
#
tantek that would be good - to have four discussion rooms
#
tantek especially if we can split up the main room so it "disappears" during the "breakout" sessions
#
tantek otherwise there tends to be some "main room" inertia
#
aaronpk yea we should be able to pull the wall out and turn it into two equal sized rooms
#
tantek awesome
#
tantek aaronpk, any chance that donutjs is going to be Tuesday night June 26?
#
aaronpk Yes it is!
#
tantek can we do some co-promotion?
#
tantek also are we charging $10 for IWS non-indie-rsvps?
#
tantek and thus could we do a ticket swap promo? tickets to either get you into the other?
eli_oat joined the channel
#
aaronpk I was planning on asking!
#
tantek.com edited /2018 (+278) "subhead Nearby Events, add donutjs" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /2018 (+167) "/* Schedule */ add a separate line for Monday pre-party" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /2018 (+126) "/* Nearby Events */ NP_PDX early Wednesday morning" (view diff)
#
tantek aaronpk week of IWS is shaping up to have a lot of complementary events: https://indieweb.org/2018#Nearby_Events
#
tantek want to ping the XOXO folks and see if they want to organize an informal XOXO meetup on Thursday?
#
tantek then we could have a full week Indie Open Web Source Creatives Festival!
#
tantek also this is making me want to book my hotel ASAP
[John], [tantek], chrisaldrich, [chrisaldrich], [jgmac1106], tomasparks, tantek and [unoabraham] joined the channel
#
river.cat edited /2018/Düsseldorf/Guest_Book (+230) "/* Guest Book */" (view diff)
#
river.cat created /User:River.cat (+239) "Created page with "I am currently working on my homepage, built in Ruby on Rails. Previously I used Jekyll, but I wanted something with which I could do access control for friends only posts and..."" (view diff)
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "IndieWeb Collection" by John Evdemon on 2018-05-01 http://boffosocko.com/research/indieweb
tantek and swentel joined the channel
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "perlancar: List of new CPAN distributions – Apr 2018" by perlancar on 2018-05-01 https://perlancar.wordpress.com/2018/05/01/list-of-new-cpan-distributions-apr-2018/
[unoabraham] and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
vanderven.se martijn edited /2018/Leaders (+4795) "RSVP and bring in some more points from [[Leaders#Issues]]." (view diff)
[jeremycherfas], jeremycherfas, [unoabraham], [jgmac1106], [snarfed] and [John] joined the channel
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "You’re right Sandro Hawke, there are a bunch of experimental social network apps using a…" by Danyl on 2018-05-01 https://medium.com/@Strype/youre-right-sandro-hawke-there-are-a-bunch-of-experimental-social-network-apps-using-a-54ae10ba5ced?source=rss-------1
eli_oat, kaushalmodi and jgmac1106_ joined the channel
#
www.svenknebel.de edited /2018/Leaders (+33) "/* Regrets */ $me" (view diff)
#
petermolnar !tell aaronpk as a worst case scenario ( /me reading https://www.voidlinux.eu/news/2018/05/serious-issues.html ) does anyone else has access to, say, indieweb.org, the domain?
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
tantek joined the channel
#
Zegnat That's actually a question on the leaders page, petermolnar.
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "I am really enjoying the #indieweb Indigenous app." by Greg McVerry on 2018-05-01 http://quickthoughts.jgregorymcverry.com/2018/05/01/i-am-really-enjoying-the-indieweb-indigenous-app
[miklb] joined the channel
#
aaronpk Worth talking about at this year's leaders summit
#
Loqi aaronpk: petermolnar left you a message 37 minutes ago: as a worst case scenario ( /me reading https://www.voidlinux.eu/news/2018/05/serious-issues.html ) does anyone else has access to, say, indieweb.org, the domain?
#
tantek aaronpk which?
#
aaronpk petermolnar's question
#
tantek domain access or community infrastructure bus factors in general?
#
aaronpk All of the above
#
tantek yes
#
Zegnat I have added it as a point to the page.
#
tantek aaronpk, perhaps related, similar challenges with microformats.org
#
Zegnat Should have started the "interested" section, but forgot.
#
aaronpk And notice that that post says they're working with an existing organization to handle those things going forward
#
tantek well re: github and freenode we have multiple admins for those common resources so we're covered there
#
aaronpk But at least as a separate legal organization there is then the ability to share and recover things like a GitHub org
#
tantek not sure aaronpk, I think that just moves the bus factor to that "non profit org"
#
tantek and as we all know from site-deaths, orgs die all the time
#
tantek so I don't actually believe that makes it any more "reliable" or "robust"
#
tantek than a single responsible person
#
petermolnar can a domain have multiple natural people as owners?
#
Zegnat Petermolnar, I expect no.
#
tantek petermolnar: sort of. email contacts for the domain can be aliases that forward to multiple people
[schmarty] joined the channel
#
petermolnar tantek: orgs can have multiple people with "sign" power, eg. a proxy to handle problems like this
#
aaronpk There are a few different contact types listed in the Whois for a domain but I'm not sure which are considered to be owners
#
tantek petermolnar: as soon as you make it a "legal" thing it costs much more, and thus is more vulnerable to dying over time (those costs are periodic over time)
#
petermolnar valid and fair
#
tantek also if it is a matter of changing DNS etc.
#
tantek then sharing access to a specific DNS provider account solves that
[jonathanprozzi] joined the channel
#
Zegnat The problem with GitHub orgs is that there is no way to see who actually is the admin. There was a bit of that when I asked who could grant me access to the php-mf2 repo on the microformats org. Lots of members are hidden, so who do you contact?
#
petermolnar so shared mail + shared accounts, that is good enough for me
#
tantek right, a simpler hack of a technical solution is cheaper, and does not introduce another layer of abstraction (another org) which itself is vulnerable in likely more opaque ways
#
tantek note that they didn't even name or link to that non profit org
#
tantek which means even they are not confident enough in it to name it
#
tantek this is the common "add a layer of abstraction" error
#
tantek whereby adding a layer of abstraction looks like it solves the problem, because it moves the problem to somewhere more opaque
#
tantek developers do it all the time with frameworks, APIs etc.
#
tantek and yes, people do it with delegating things to orgs
Jeena joined the channel
#
[jgmac1106] Orgs come with defined leaders rather than porous leadership opportunities. I think that can be problematic as well
#
Jeena Ok, I think I get it a little bit, but it seems like Zegnat said that not all slack people show up, I tried to tab for [manton] and it didn't work
#
Jeena but that might be because he is not online or something?
#
Zegnat Yeah, IRC doesn't know about those.
#
Zegnat A separate IRC connection is opened for a slack user when they send a message. But those bots don't stick around indefinitely
#
Zegnat Also means their first message comes with a delay.
#
Jeena hm ok
#
Zegnat What is slack bridge?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "slack bridge" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "slack bridge is ____", a sentence describing the term)
#
Zegnat What is IRC bridge?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "IRC bridge" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "IRC bridge is ____", a sentence describing the term)
#
Zegnat :-(
#
Zegnat Jeena: https://github.com/aaronpk/Slack-IRC-Gateway
#
Loqi [aaronpk] Slack-IRC-Gateway: Bridge Slack rooms to IRC channels
#
Jeena I'd like to know where aaronpk gets his time from to implement such a huge amount of different tools and things
#
Zegnat I am on the fence between him using a time turner or owning a TARDIS.
#
Jeena hehe
#
tantek Zegnat: see last year's 100 days of indieweb
#
tantek see also: breaking things down into small problems to solve one at a time
#
tantek speaking of which...
#
Jeena also, do we have the same problem as those guys https://www.voidlinux.eu/news/2018/05/serious-issues.html where one person dissapeared and now they don't have access to a lot of servers, domains (github) organizations, etc.?
#
Jeena I mean forking is a good option but takes a lot of effort to get everyone on board with the new name
#
Zegnat Possibly. We were actually discussing that above.
#
Zegnat There is an item on the agenda for the leaders summit to discuss it.
#
Zegnat Quick, organise some HWC and join the leaders summit remotely, Jeena! ;-)
#
Jeena hehe
#
Jeena as far as I remember the only thing I have write access to is https://github.com/indieweb/microformats-ruby for historical reasons
#
Loqi [indieweb] microformats-ruby: A Ruby gem to parse HTML containing one or more microformats and microformats2 and return a collection of dynamically defined Ruby objects, a Ruby hash or a JSON hash.
#
Zegnat I can probably travel to Gothenburg for free next week on Thursday and Friday, because of Ascension Day. But that might not suit a HWC, Jeena? ;-)
#
Jeena isn't thursday a red day and friday a klemmdag?
#
Jeena ah hehe Ascension Day is the name of that day in english
#
[jgmac1106] ohh okay just about to ask
#
[jgmac1106] A different Easter than the Gregorian Calendar?
#
Jeena no, it's 40 days after easter
#
Jeena when Jesus left the earth and ascended to heaven I guess
#
Zegnat I don't know. I only know my brother doesn't have school in Gothenburg so I can use his travel card those days. I have been brought up extremely heathen and know not what any of these days are about.
#
Zegnat I had to Google the English name of the day, so take that with a grain of salt.
#
Jeena hehe
#
Jeena About a HWC on those days, yeah I'm not sure, I am taking the friday off so I might be on vaccation somewhere
#
Zegnat I am hoping they'll have me travel there sooner for job application anyway. Just thought I'd throw the option out there.
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "My most important Twitter Messages #23" by admin on 2018-05-01 http://blog.derhess.de/2018/05/01/my-most-important-twitter-messages-23/
[Thom_M] joined the channel
#
jeremycherfas.net edited /User:Jeremycherfas.net (+182) "/* Itches */ Want to retrieve reading notes more effectively" (view diff)
#
tantek what is .app?
#
Loqi App likely refers to native app, typically a less functional version of a web site that is usually restricted to one or more proprietary platforms, but may also refer to the .app top level domain https://indieweb.org/app
#
tantek aaronpk note that there is a /.app page yet Loqi shows the /app page for that query. Not sure how much work that would be to fix.
#
aaronpk me either
[eddie] joined the channel
#
[eddie] “Less functional version of a website?” I think that while sometimes being true is not ALWAYS true
#
aaronpk what is a snarkinition?
#
Loqi A snarkinition is a portmanteau of (and meaning both) snarky and definition, often used to start wikifying a technology or piece of jargon which is not necessarily well regarded, sometimes as an implicit challenge to advocates to step-up and say why otherwise https://indieweb.org/snarkinition
#
tantek [eddie] hence "typically"
#
tantek == not ALWAYS true
#
[eddie] Yes, it just feels very heavy handed
#
tantek [eddie], given that nearly every media etc. rando site has a less functional "app" version (usually they screw up copy/paste, URLs, etc.) these days, the "typically" statement is accurate
#
tantek apps really are that bad in aggregate
#
tantek we could also add how apps typically ask for far more privacy violating device permissions
#
Zegnat On the other hand, a lot of public transit websites need a bajillion js libraries to tell me when the next bus goes. Those apps are a lot smoother in my experience
#
tantek Zegnat public transit websites are definitely an area due for a global improvement
#
tantek the one here (bay area?) is called nextbus / nextmuni.com and has both JS SPA version and permalinks for particular route-direction-stop
#
tantek (which work server-side, then update client-side)
swentel, AngeloGladding, [miklb] and swentel_ joined the channel
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "Luxury and privilege" by Colin Walker on 2018-05-01 https://colinwalker.blog/luxury-and-privilege/
jgmac1106__, [Thom_M], sebsel, jgmac1106_, [jgmac1106] and vivus joined the channel; vivus left the channel
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "Facebook-ception & The Quest to Save the Graph" by Emre Sokullu on 2018-05-01 https://medium.com/@emresokullu/facebook-ception-the-quest-to-save-the-graph-7cc3bd0e0106?source=rss-c201972d2658------2
[colinwalker], [chrisaldrich] and [Thom_M] joined the channel
#
Loqi [superfeedr] "A pencast overview (with audio and recorded visual diagrams) of IndieWeb technologies" by Chris Aldrich on 2018-05-01 https://boffosocko.com/2018/05/01/a-pencast-overview-with-audio-and-recorded-visual-diagrams-of-indieweb-technologies/
#
aaronpk whoa
#
Zegnat Hahaha, I thought that said “a pencase overview”, as in https://wiki.zegnat.net/pen-case
#
Loqi hehe
[jgmac1106] and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
[chrisaldrich] Oh, definitely doing that next... 😉
#
[chrisaldrich] wonders why Zegnat hasn't put his pen-case data into his massive h-card? For me the pens and pencils you use = true identity.
[ryan339] joined the channel
#
Zegnat Maybe I’ll make it a nested h-review of my favourite pen
#
Zegnat If you do document it, [chrisaldrich], be sure to send me a webmention (like sebsel did) so I can link to you from the page :D
#
sknebel hcard > p-inventory h-feed > h-review?
#
Zegnat This is going to require a whole new redesign of my h-card!
#
Zegnat Maybe make it an IWS project :P
#
grantcodes aaronpk: any update on that mediawiki plugin? Not that there's any rush
#
aaronpk i haven't had a chance to test it out yet sorry
#
grantcodes No problem!
tantek and [snarfed] joined the channel; Jeena left the channel
#
[kevinmarks] I think the English name is still Pentecost
#
schmarty HWC Baltimore starting our quiet writing hour
#
GWG schmarty, who is in attendance?
eli_oat joined the channel
#
schmarty grantcodes, [eddie], [jonathanprozzi] , maryreisenwitz.com, bouhmad.com, and myself.
tantek, [cleverdevil], [manton], [Thom_M] and eli_oat joined the channel