#meta 2020-03-17

2020-03-17 UTC
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[jgmac1106] I almost replied with the image from my bandwidth today....and I am only doing 720p
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[jgmac1106] started to add torrents for my video, want to look into a peer tube instance
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[jgmac1106] I still think early access is better than video quality, especially for my potato videos
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jacky torrenting as a video hosting solution is a bit insenstitve to one's bandwidth capabilities
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jacky I used to run a peertube instance
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jacky but after they were steadfast on not allowing conventional video streaming from a server, I gave up and removed it
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[jgmac1106] just need to start convincing people to share media like its 1999
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aaronpk mailing cd-roms?
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jacky yeah nah lol
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gRegorLove 500 free hours!
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[jgmac1106] sorry, making a spotify list doesn't show the same love as a mixtedtape...even if it is a burnt CD...
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[tantek] catching up. or trying to
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aaronpk immediate question is HWC SF
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[tantek] gRegorLove, were you intending the online HWC SD to be SD only? Or would you be open to making it a HWC PDT?
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aaronpk possibly just point people to join virtual HWC san diego
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[tantek] (do we need to segment online meetups by city?)
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gRegorLove I don't mind changing the name at all
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gRegorLove I thought of that earlier when aaronpk asked about SF
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[tantek] Great. I figured we can hold a combined online one for us in the PDT
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gRegorLove I think some past meetups were "Virtual HWC West Coast" or something
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[tantek] I'll cancel HWC SF then
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[tantek] wonders if that feature got added...
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[tantek] Thanks gRegorLove. I'm seeing the "ONLINE: " pattern on https://events.indieweb.org/ so that's probably good to stick with and for location, "West Coast" is fine, better than a named timezone 😛
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gRegorLove Feel free to rename and edit any description text
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[tantek] I figure it's your event so I'll leave renaming in your hands 🙂
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[tantek] Then I'll be happy to contribute to description text
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs (+34) "update from events.indieweb.org" (view diff)
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gRegorLove Is it safe to link to a zoom room from the event in advance or should I wait till closer?
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gRegorLove Updated title https://events.indieweb.org/2020/03/online-homebrew-website-club-west-coast-bSBT0ZceMIHo
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aaronpk I'd wait til closer cause our rooms aren't set up as individual events
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aaronpk If they were set up as meeting IDs that only existed during the event time then it'd be fine but that's a lot more admin work
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gRegorLove sounds good
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs (+2) "update from events.indieweb.org" (view diff)
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@ChrisAldrich IndieWeb for trying times! https://boffosocko.com/2020/03/16/old-fashioned-2/ https://twitter.com/tmcw/status/1239345947143884800 (twitter.com/_/status/1239797351230758917)
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itsjustk.com created /User:Itsjustk.com (+59) "Created page with "<span class="h-card">[https://itsjustk.com K Foster]</span>"" (view diff)
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itsjustk.com edited /User:Itsjustk.com (+211) (view diff)
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itsjustk.com edited /chat-names (+52) (view diff)
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itsjustk.com edited /User:Itsjustk.com (+96) (view diff)
gRegorLove, swentel and [jgmac1106] joined the channel
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[jgmac1106] okay I am struggling with giving Karma to Slack users, keep messing up
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@jgmac1106 I use yourls as my url shortner...stopped working on me, will try to reinstall it, anyone else have a fav url shortner? #edtechchat #IndieWeb (https://quickthoughts.jgregorymcverry.com/s/2hf2Zo) (twitter.com/_/status/1239860826259042304)
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loqi.me created /HAR (+218) "prompted by [LewisCowles] and dfn added by [LewisCowles]" (view diff)
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www.lewiscowles.co.uk edited /HAR (+83) (view diff)
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www.lewiscowles.co.uk edited /cURL (+667) (view diff)
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[jgmac1106] thank you folks for building out those pages, just terms people bandy about often
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs (+138) "update from events.indieweb.org" (view diff)
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs (+36) "update from events.indieweb.org" (view diff)
jeremycherfas, [jeremycherfas] and [LewisCowles] joined the channel
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www.ohhelloana.blog edited /IndieWebCamp_Organizing (+177) "/* After */ Link to instructions of how to upload videos" (view diff)
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aaronpk [Ana_Rodrigues]++ thanks
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Loqi [Ana_Rodrigues] has 2 karma over the last year
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cheuk.dev uploaded /File:indiewebcamp-london-20200314.png "Group photo of IndieWebCamp London 2020 03 14 https://indieweb.org/File:indiewebcamp-london-20200314.png"
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cheuk.dev edited /2020/London (+43) "/* Day 1 */" (view diff)
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cheuk.dev uploaded /File:indiewebcamp-london-20200315.png "Group Photo of IndieWebCamp London 2020 03 15 https://indieweb.org/File:indiewebcamp-london-20200315.png"
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cheuk.dev edited /2020/London (+42) "/* Day 2 */" (view diff)
[tantek], [jeremycherfas], DioBrandonDiscor, NetherwolfDiscor, gmelodieDiscord[, dy5es41Discord[m, UsDiscord[m], hvergaraDiscord[, aaronpk[m], Senshi[m], l^discordDiscord, cardDiscord[m], blzDiscord[m]1, poofDiscord[m], XierumengDiscord, kevinkDiscord[m], [grantcodes], gRegorLove and [chrisaldrich] joined the channel
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[chrisaldrich] aaronpk++ for the pleasant subtlety of timezone conversions in events: https://events.indieweb.org/local-time?date=20200318T1800&tz=America%2FNew_York
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Loqi aaronpk has 62 karma in this channel over the last year (201 in all channels)
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@ChrisAldrich I'm joining remotely. How about you? Have questions about improving your website or want to show off something you've gotten working on it? #DoOO #EdTech Come join us: https://boffosocko.com/2020/03/16/online-indieweb-meetup-nyc-march-18-2020/ (twitter.com/_/status/1239959360840687617)
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[tantek] FYI while IndieWeb wiki content and uploads are CC0, videos are being uploaded to the Internet Archive with a SA-BY-NC license
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[tantek] Typically this is because they have people in them, and we'd rather err on the side of caution with re-use of videos of people.
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[jgmac1106] that is smart, we should never assume how people's likeness should or could be used commercialy
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[jgmac1106] apologies I gave Ana wrong advice this morning
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aaronpk technically if someone did want to republish a CC0 video that includes a person, they still need that person's permission, but i suspect most people don't know that and it's not worth the risk, so the more restrictive SA-BY-NC license makes more sense
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[jgmac1106] ...I didn't know that...and I been doing CC for awhile...thx
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aaronpk model release is not part of copyright
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[jgmac1106] ahh okay I usually record a thumbs up folks are okay with the license I choose, but the restriction makes sense
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aaronpk no that's fine, i mean if someone took your video and wanted to republish it or edit it, they need to get their own permission release from the people in it, regardless of what copyright license it's under
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[jgmac1106] instead of having to note that on each wiki page with embedded videos we might want to put the video license in the footer
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[jgmac1106] ...oooh I didn't know that, thanks
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aaronpk but anyway the point is this kind of stuff is too in the weeds so it makes sense to put clearer restrictions on the videos in the first place
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[jgmac1106] I thought the "thumbs up" was a model release writ large
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aaronpk it is for *you*
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[jgmac1106] thx
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aaronpk but unless you explicitly say something like "and this will also let other people publish this video" then it doesn't include that
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aaronpk it's also the kind of thing that isn't a problem until it is
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aaronpk but i don't want to empahsize the legal aspect of this too much anyway, because it's more about tantek's original point of we want to err on the side of caution
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@Purelyrighteous @wencesg says: "we're facing the unethical evolution of many social platforms, but there is a movement called the #IndieWeb that understands you're done with others owning your content and your identity!" https://buff.ly/2pTyo6E #startup (twitter.com/_/status/1239972290625826816)
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[jgmac1106] yeah its a good idea, I liked his idea of doing the same for photos as well
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[tantek] I think we should consider doing the same for HWC/IWC group photos (switching to a SA-BY-NC license). WDYT folks?
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[tantek] (just realized that was sitting in a "Slack failed to send" state)
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[jgmac1106] +1
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[jgmac1106] especially now that mine will involve minors
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[tantek] aaronpk, what would it take for:
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[tantek] 1. File upload on mediawiki to have the SA-BY-NC license as a option along with CC0
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[tantek] 2. if file type (name) is .jpg / .jpeg, the default to SA-BY-NC license, else CC0 (presumably PNG screenshot or SVG/GIF diagram)
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aaronpk for #1, probably editing one of the system messages here https://indieweb.org/Special:AllMessages
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artlung.com edited /San_Diego (+37) "/* San Diego IndieWeb Members */" (view diff)
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aaronpk i doubt we can do #2 easily
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www.ohhelloana.blog edited /2020/London (+82) "/* Blog posts */ Add pre-event blog post link" (view diff)
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[tantek] aaropnk, I feel like a little bit of JS monitoring onchange for the input type=file could pull that off
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[tantek] aaronpk 🙂
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aaronpk maybe, but I am wary of doing anything too custom in mediawiki because it makes upgrading it harder later
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[tantek] true, we'd have to add it to the list
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[tantek] what are mediawiki customizations
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Loqi https://indieweb.org/mediawiki_customizations
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[jgmac1106] impossible to mortals...that's what they are
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cheuk.dev edited /2020/London (+112) "/* Blog posts */" (view diff)
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[tantek] XOXO is cancelled however dConstruct is still a go AFAIK: https://2020.dconstruct.org/
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[tantek] (e.g. for any IWC Brighton planning)
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tantek.com edited /Events () "(-530) clean-up a bit more, see also IWC Organizing for more discoverability" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Planning (+169) "/* Dusseldorf */ BT postponed, del current dates, wait for new BT date" (view diff)
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[fluffy] Regarding video licenses should that also have a ND if we’re concerned about usage of people?
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[fluffy] Like BY-SA-NC doesn’t prohibit re-editing something for trolling purposes
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sknebel [fluffy]++
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Loqi [fluffy] has 14 karma in this channel over the last year (63 in all channels)
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[tantek] I think CC has veered away from ND because it had too many unintended negative consequences. I don't recall the details though.
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[tantek] Might still be worth it though. Worth considering ND
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sknebel I thought NC was the more difficult one?
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[tantek] I think it may block things like playlists or making a combined video of appending multiple IWC videos.
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[tantek] NC has not been problematic AFAIK
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sknebel NC had a few questions about what exactly is "commercial" (Although I think one of the bigger legal cases got resolved supporting the CC position)
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[fluffy] yeah NC’s got a lot of open questions when it comes to, for example, advertising-supported sites or whatever
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sknebel right, I think the one that was resolved was about paying someone to reproduce NC material, which was found fine
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[fluffy] ND does mean that the video file can’t be modified, which implies you can’t do things like transcoding it for bandwidth/quality purposes (or chunking it into an HLS stream) but otherwise I don’t think that prevents any usage in a playlist.
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sknebel right, transcoding counts too
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sknebel licensing is tricky, who would have thought :D
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jacky lol
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs (+177) "update from events.indieweb.org" (view diff)
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sknebel hm, should I have Kaja exclude cancelled events there? ^^^
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[tantek] yeah. I posted some ideas about canceled events as a feature in github issues on Meetable
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[tantek] didn't know where to post anything like that for Kaja 🙂
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aaronpk good consuming case for a cancellation microformats property
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sknebel just say stuff here and mention me, the only real issue tracking kaja has is my brain right now
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sknebel heh, never noticed it's cance*l*ed in US english
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sknebel goes patch Kaja again
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aaronpk i can never keep track of which one it is
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aaronpk i think i use double-l more often
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs (-189) "update from events.indieweb.org" (view diff)
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sknebel so, too lazy for regex, so this will hit "CANCELCON Meetup" too but I worry about that if something with that name happens...
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aaronpk haha
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[tantek] it's ok to cancel CANCELCON IMO
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gRegorLove Online: SocialDistancingCon is still on, though.
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs (-176) "update from events.indieweb.org" (view diff)
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sknebel limited to next 60 days too
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aaronpk good call
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sknebel we're probably not going to do as extreme pre-creating now it's easier, but still seemed sensible to have
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[tantek] yes
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[fluffy] So speaking of all this, when are we going to start worrying about whether to cancel indieweb summit?
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[fluffy] I know it’s really early right now but is there anything ruminating about that?
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aaronpk Yes
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