#meta 2020-03-25

2020-03-25 UTC
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gRegorLove I was wondering about the format for the online HWCs. Most of the ones I've been to previously were only regulars, so we did the normal quiet writing hour first and it wasn't awkward.
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gRegorLove With the last one I hosted, we did intros, then photo, then just kind of open for discussion.
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gRegorLove Which I think went ok, but should there be more structure to that "open for discussion"? set topics?
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[chrisaldrich] or even small mini-topics for brainstorming?
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[chrisaldrich] That question is more important when there are a number of newer people, particularly when there is a preponderance of "regulars" who may forget to be as welcoming or could possibly seem cold as everyone else seems to know everyone else.
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@jgmac1106 ↩️ Exactly do not let Facebook profit from the exploitation of iour dentity work, we need to root the webs and the urls in the youth and our communities. #IndieWeb is critical #literacies (twitter.com/_/status/1242613074537873418)
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[tantek] gRegorLove re: format for online HWCs, I think we need to borrow / go back to some of the original structure of HWCs
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[tantek] one thing we did deliberately originally, following from the Homebrew Computer Club, was to timebox specific/individual questions and answers, and then encourage folks interested in following-up further to have a side discussion about it
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[tantek] that way we prevented any one person from (unintentionally) monopolizing the discussion
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gRegorLove agreed, one person last time was new (to me?) and didn't hang out long after intros, so I was concerned about being welcoming
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[tantek] this requires deliberate active work on the part of the organizer as a moderator
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gRegorLove pretty sure it was before the griefing we got too
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[tantek] and *especially* at the start
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[tantek] like literally limiting people to 1min
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[tantek] right, when one person goes on and on, if it's not of interest to others, especially new people, especially new quieter people, they'll just leave rather than raising a fuss
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gRegorLove we did get kind of in the weeds on CSS
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[tantek] so it is absolutely necessary for strong moderation
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[tantek] yeah that's the other thing I was going to bring up
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[tantek] I thought about that afterwards
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[tantek] and I think I'd rather keep discussions on topic specifically for *indieweb*
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[tantek] rather than descend into anything general webdev/webdesign
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[tantek] like I appreciate that people find this community helpful, and that people here are helpful
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[tantek] however, for any future generic webdev conversation, I think we as organizers / moderators should quickly (like not even allowing for 1min of let me describe my problem) redirect that to the online #dev channel
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gRegorLove I think that sounds good
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[tantek] and deliberately instead create space for *indieweb*-specific conversation, indieweb features/UI/protocols etc.
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[tantek] like if someone else wants to organize a generic web dev meetup/zoom, great, they should do that!
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[tantek] but that's not why people come to indieweb in general, so I'd rather not let that happen by default
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aaronpk i joined late and was pretty confused about what was going on with that css discussion
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[tantek] yeah I think in general we're going to redirect any general webdev questions back to the dev channel where people can answer/ignore as they wish, or discuss other topics in parallel
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gRegorLove Hangouts calls are easy to start too if people need to screen share for those webdev convos
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aaronpk I haven't tried it yet, but zoom also has a way to do breakout sessions where people can split off into smaller groups from a main call
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Salt[m] I can play with the format for HWC? How much...? Like I am happy to do some work to get it to be more online comfortable (doing this for a lot of things right now...)
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aaronpk I'd say go for it!
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[tantek] I've experienced the breakout sessions from a participant perspective and it was quite fun!
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Ruxton zoom is super good at that stuff
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Ruxton breakuot sessions are handy
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[jeremycherfas] So, people of GMT + or -2, should we be thinking of a virtual HWC or just pile in on one of the UK ones?
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@_SuzanneNoble @wencesg says: "we're facing the unethical evolution of many social platforms, but there is a movement called the #IndieWeb that understands you're done with others owning your content and your identity!" https://buff.ly/2pTyo6E #startup (twitter.com/_/status/1242724660191641600)
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@craigburgess Who’s in for #HomebrewWebsiteClub Barnsley tonight at 6-8pm? Virtual one on Zoom. I think we all just need a chat! @_richKeys @shrff @Cr8tveBarnsley @mattwatsoncodes @mattbrailsford @mkjones @assistpoint @ceribatchelder Anybody else is welcome too! (twitter.com/_/status/1242771429738852357)
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@craigburgess ↩️ Would be cool to see @JamieTanna Also updated https://events.indieweb.org/2020/03/homebrew-website-club-barnsley-hGOqaDqcyIPP (twitter.com/_/status/1242772472883224576)
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[tantek] Jamietanna and craigburgess, heads up for anyone hosting a Zoom for the first/second time, https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/20/style/zoombombing-zoom-trolling.html
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[tantek] Lock down screen sharing, and familiarize yourself with the UI for kicking people off
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[Michael_Beckwi] also encourage audio/video pausing if someone needs to do something they don’t want everyone to see
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[Michael_Beckwi] i am also a believer in staying muted unless intending to talk, but that’s more me than anything
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[tantek] That’s elective though and not the problem I’m talking about which is trolls
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[Michael_Beckwi] yeah, just some general zoom tips from my experiences. i know what you’re talking about though
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Zegnat When we were using Mumble for vHWC we would always recommend people to use push-to-talk. I don’t remember if that is available in Zoom.
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Zegnat It isn’t in Slack, which annoys me now that I constantly have to use Slack for meetings at work.
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aaronpk it is! if you're muted, spacebar becomes push-to-talk
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aaronpk in zoom
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Zegnat Good!
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Zegnat I just cannot believe this isn’t in Slack :(
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[tantek] these are all good tips for "civil" people, again, that's not the primary concern IMO, until we have this troll problem solved in practice
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[tantek] hoping the UK HWC meetups go well
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aaronpk that should be happening around now, yea?
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aaronpk did London and Barnsley decide to combine meetups? they're still listed separately
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[tantek] good question
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Zegnat What is Zoom?
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Loqi Zoom is a video conferencing service used during some IndieWebCamp and Homebrew Website Club events https://indieweb.org/Zoom
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Zegnat Zoom << [https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KLRrnm6g5YvD8QRSPwwNWq6NPk9FYvMpZPy_XEyOmMM/preview Hosting troll-free/playful/interactive virtual events with Zoom]
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Loqi ok, I added "[https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KLRrnm6g5YvD8QRSPwwNWq6NPk9FYvMpZPy_XEyOmMM/preview Hosting troll-free/playful/interactive virtual events with Zoom]" to the "See Also" section of /Zoom https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=69235&oldid=69234
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Zegnat h/t Tina @ https://www.swiss-miss.com/2020/03/how-to-run-meetings-on-zoom.html
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[tantek] Google doc instead of a blog post? Really?
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs (+15) "update from events.indieweb.org" (view diff)
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[jeremycherfas] That’s good to know.
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[jgmac1106] Every single k12 school in the USA just went online with gDocs...this will just further cement Google's position as tools for teaching and the "open" web...which in terms of access it all does just work...for the priviledged....buy two chromebooks, just sign in, and everythign just works
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[jgmac1106] people kinda giggle when I say join my wiki...be alll like nah...wikispaces....Google is easier
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[tantek] Google is benefitting in "productivity" from the same "but you're signed in already" that FB benefits from in "social"
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@ohhelloana We're starting now and the link to the zoom room is available on the event page: https://events.indieweb.org/2020/03/online-homebrew-website-club-london-DNdVXaId2jig (twitter.com/_/status/1242871828747620362)
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[tantek] I like that approach [Ana_Rodrigues] of asking people to find the zoom room on the event page. Perhaps that's just enough (one level removed, takes an extra step) that fewer griefers will show up
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[tantek] [calumryan] it's good to keep screensharing disabled
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[tantek] people can share their blog URLs in #indieweb
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[tantek] and you can screenshare it
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[Ana_Rodrigues] that’s a good point about the screen sharing!
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[tantek] it's a good way to moderate it, and let the organizer keep discussions moving to keep involving different people in the meetup
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doubleloop Did I drop out of the Zoom room? Before I saw everyone's screen (though their video was off), now I just see info about the room
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[calumryan] doubleloop: still there just everyone's muted or left
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doubleloop [calumryan]: ah cool, thanks.
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[calumryan] doubleloop: joining for group photo?
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doubleloop [calumryan]: ah yup! one sec, I've lost the zoom window
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@swentel Just pushed a release of Indigenous which now comes with a built-in anonymous account. The reader has some default channels and you can even change the endpoints without having the need of an IndieAuth enabled site! #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/1242890812884688897)
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swentel [tantek], remember the offline/anonymous/onboarding conversation from a while ago? You're going to love that one ^
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[tantek] ooooh
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aaronpk nice
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swentel The Drupal indieweb has support now for optional anonymous channels, indigenous is connected with one of those now
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swentel *module
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aaronpk wait was there another griefer on the zoom today?
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@drupal8modules Minor update available for #drupal8 #module indieweb (8.x-1.9). More info: https://www.drupal.org/project/indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/1242894154436349953)
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[tantek] aaronpk, not AFAIK
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aaronpk oh good okay
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@worldology2 Nikola Gitlab Pages No-Brainer IndieWeb Guide: https://dem.cx/2020/02/02_nikola-gitlab-pages-no-brainer-indieweb-guide/ (twitter.com/_/status/1242907684636164099)
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sknebel I've seen right that only west-coast has a meeting today?
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GWG Yes, no East Coast.
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GWG I'm not against it though. I'll show up any time
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GWG I need contact
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sknebel GWG today is a bit short notice then, but I'd be up for one most days right now, so we could look at having one e.g. friday?
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aaronpk there are no rules anymore! HWCs every day!
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jacky lmfao
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GWG aaronpk++
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Loqi aaronpk has 64 karma in this channel over the last year (206 in all channels)
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GWG Why do we need rules?
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GWG I'm just saying that I'm willing to do more than once every other week while in quarantine
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@gRegorLove We're having another online IndieWeb meetup tonight at 6pm Pacific, hosted by @altsalt. Join us! https://events.indieweb.org/2020/03/online-homebrew-website-club-west-coast-5CZGhYbdcga1 (twitter.com/_/status/1242924510363320320)
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GWG What the world needs now is more Indieweb
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@gRegorLove ↩️ We'll probably start doing these weekly on Wednesday nights. Stay tuned to https://events.indieweb.org for more events. (twitter.com/_/status/1242925084076990464)
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sknebel our vHWCs were mondays most of the time
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[chrisaldrich] What is Nikola?
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Loqi Nikola is an open source static site generator written in Python https://indieweb.org/Nikola
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[chrisaldrich] Nikola << https://dem.cx/2020/02/02_nikola-gitlab-pages-no-brainer-indieweb-guide/
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Loqi ok, I added "https://dem.cx/2020/02/02_nikola-gitlab-pages-no-brainer-indieweb-guide/" to a brand new "See Also" section of /Nikola https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=69238&oldid=66307
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loqi.me edited /Nikola (+141) "[chrisaldrich] added "https://dem.cx/2020/02/02_nikola-gitlab-pages-no-brainer-indieweb-guide/" to "See Also"" (view diff)
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boffosocko.com edited /time (+332) "/* See Also */ Template:timee-link; timezone, and other miscellaneous time related pages" (view diff)
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