#meta 2026-08-30
2026-08-30 UTC
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tantek.com edited /principles (+14) "expand principle 1 to own your domain & data because that was always the key part of being in/on/part of the IndieWeb, making change as proposed yesterday (no objections), https://chat.indieweb.org/meta/2026-08-29#t1788020325430500, "Own your identity" was previously proposed since 2024 ([[principles#Own_your_identity]]) but isn't really direct enough (could still consider it as an alternative)" (view diff)
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osteophage I disagree with that change for the reasons I've written about in the newsletter previously.
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[capjamesg] I’m not sure I fully agree with this either. There are plenty of sites on Neocities where people are actively making things and publishing but aren’t doing so on their own domain that they have purchased.
# [capjamesg] The same is true of Bear Blog. There are plenty of people writing and publishing there who are also embracing the ideals of publishing on your own site first, and using your site as a means of expression on the web.
# [capjamesg] If anything, I’d say the most important thing about being on the IndieWeb is using a personal website as a means of expression, whatever that means for you, ideally using software or a system that gives you control over your data (good import/export functionality, uses open formats, etc.).
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[artlung] If we can articulate the distinction between http://example.neocities.org versus http://example.substack.com that would be helpful
# [capjamesg] I think the difference is Neocities allows for full customisation (you’re writing HTML!) and easy data export (copy your HTML/assets, etc.). There is no lock in.
# [capjamesg] Similarly, Bear Blog allows a lot of customisation, and has data export (even if some coding may need to be done to convert it into a more standard format).
# [capjamesg] I’m not sure I am coalescing toward a good definition here, rather to say that there are sites that use those tools that I firmly consider to be in alignment with the IndieWeb ethos and that also do not have their own domains.
# osteophage Thanks for chiming in, James. This chatroom is not a good medium of communication for me but I'm interested in hearing any other thoughts on the subject that folks may have, so I'd appreciate if anyone wanted to submit something about it to IndieNews.
# [capjamesg] I think part of it is having some kind of commitment to being open. Neocities’ backbone is HTML. Bear Blog’s backbone is plain text. Both position themselves toward people who want a place on the web, the former for people who want to write HTML, the latter for people who want to blog. I’m sure there are other equivalents too (omg.lol for people who want more of a profile on the web).
# [capjamesg] osteophage I might write this up, but I’ll wait for some discussion here first. I’m keen to hear others’ perspectives!
# osteophage For reference, my previous post: https://osteophage.neocities.org/essays/indie-web-priorities
# thamara_k As for the distinction, is there a case to be made about ownership? Substack being owned and financed by corporate interests/private equity while a platform like Bear Blog isn't? (I don't know anything about Neocities)
# osteophage That's some of what I discussed in my post.
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[jeremycherfas] I think capjamesg is onto something. It isn't the domain as such, but the potential to move to a domain you own if you choose to. Lock-in and proprietary formats are the antithesis of indiewebness. I don't want to be negative, but it may be that if your site, regardless of domain and who owns the platform, does not allow easy export, it is by definition not indieweb.
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