2014-08-12 UTC
# 00:07 Arnaud you did just fine, there is no problem with your chairing skills # 00:07 Arnaud I'm honestly concerned that if we have too many of these informal calls people will turn us off # 00:08 Arnaud people will feel compelled to call in because they don't want to miss out on anything but then if there is no real substance they'll be disappointed # 00:09 Arnaud even though we clearly say this is informal and that should the expectation right it's hard to avoid having people feel let down # 00:09 tantek Arnaud, I feel the agenda should expectations for any particular call # 00:09 Arnaud I'd rather we start having calls when we can start work in earnest # 00:10 tantek Arnaud - I'm ok leaving that "rather … have" up to each individual decidee for themselves # 00:10 Arnaud but I won't stand in the way and will attend if you guys want to have a call # 00:10 tantek I'm also ok with having the calls about all this chair/meta/admin-fu be public/open to comments/commentary tantek, bblfish, KevinMarks, nicolagreco, ShaneHudson, barnabywalters, jasnell, AdamB, jasnell_, KevinMarks_, nicolagreco_, jtauber, caseorganic and deiu joined the channel
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# 19:41 tommorris apparently, if I type in here, a picture of me appears on the interwebs. # 19:41 tommorris (wow, our IRC logs are like Grindr but you don't have to cook anyone breakfast.) # 19:44 tantek tommorris: Now now don't be spreading rumors about unannounced things ;) # 19:46 evanpro I thought I received an email about it late last night from Harry but when I checked this morning I couldn't find it. jasnell joined the channel
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# 19:51 tantek Any last minute agenda requests? Or feel free to add to "new business" # 19:52 hhalpin Zakim, space for 30? # 19:52 Zakim ok, hhalpin; conference Team_(social)19:52Z scheduled with code 7625 (SOCL) for 60 minutes until 2052Z # 19:53 hhalpin guys i am on a mobile phone will be back at office abiut 10 min late for meeting RRSAgent joined the channel
# 19:55 hhalpin RRSagent, this is social # 19:55 RRSAgent I'm logging. I don't understand 'this is social', hhalpin. Try /msg RRSAgent help tantek joined the channel
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# 19:57 hhalpin tantek note I will be 10 min late # 19:57 hhalpin any scribe volunteers? # 19:57 hhalpin just start wo me caseorganic joined the channel
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# 19:59 Zakim I don't understand 'chair: tantek', tantek # 20:00 tantek hhalpin can you help us with some bot commands? # 20:01 evanpro I'm on, but I came in via skype so I have no idea what my number is going to look like # 20:01 Zakim On the phone I see [Mozilla], deiu (muted), Sandro, jasnell, aaronpk, [IPcaller], AdamB, Arnaud # 20:02 evanpro [16:01] <evanpro> I'm on, but I came in via skype so I have no idea what my number is going to look like # 20:04 deiu tantek: aaronpk volunteered last week to set up the 24h irc logs # 20:04 deiu ... this URL will always redir to today's log # 20:04 deiu tantek: can you document that on the wiki please? # 20:05 deiu aaronpk: under IRC on the social WG page # 20:05 deiu tantek: logs look pretty good for now, maybe you want to provide a quick explanation for how they work? AnnBassetti joined the channel
# 20:06 deiu AnnBassetti: could you clarify what the end result is? # 20:06 deiu tantek: the current result is that the social WG is using #social on irc.w3.org # 20:06 deiu ... the social IG might be using a different name, #socialIG maybe # 20:06 deiu aaronpk: should Loqi also log that channel? # 20:07 deiu aaronpk: I'll log that one too (after the call) # 20:08 Zakim On the phone I see [Mozilla], deiu (muted), Sandro, jasnell, aaronpk, [IPcaller], AdamB, Arnaud, MarkC, Ann, Doug_Schepers, [IPcaller.a], ??P12 # 20:08 hhalpin given closely related nature of work sharing channels makes sense MarkC joined the channel
# 20:08 tommorris I'm using Skype, not sure how to identify myself to Zakim # 20:08 deiu aaronpk: there's a wiki page called irc-people; you put your name there and photo # 20:09 deiu ... just copy/paste the template from other people # 20:09 deiu tantek: are the logs live as of today or do they reflect any history? # 20:10 deiu tantek: do we have any more questions/issues while at this topic? # 20:10 jasnell will the logs archive after they roll over pass the 3-4 day period? # 20:11 deiu evanpro: can we move the wiki page to the social WG wiki? it seems we're sharing the page with the IG # 20:11 deiu tantek: names should be unique/irc server so we're ok # 20:12 deiu AnnBassetti: for people on the phone, if you're not on IRC and/or have not used IRC, please check the wiki page pasted above for info # 20:13 deiu Please use the nick, not the name when speaking ;) # 20:13 deiu Topic: follow up on Activity Streams 2.0 # 20:14 deiu tantek: from last week we had an action to find out contributors to AS2.0 that are not W3C members # 20:14 deiu jasnell: all the ones I could find have already signed the agreement # 20:15 deiu ... for the 2.0 contributions, I believe only 1 contributor has submitted anything substantial and I'm tracking him down # 20:15 deiu ... he is contributing as an individual, not a company # 20:15 deiu tantek: beause he's not a W3C member, there's a form he can fill out # 20:16 deiu tantek: we don't have to worry about it too much for now, at least until we publish a working draaft harry joined the channel
# 20:17 deiu Topic: regular telcon time preference # 20:17 Zakim the conference code is 7625 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), harry # 20:18 deiu ... so far it's not very friendly to people in US # 20:18 deiu ... we're trying to gather data for deciding which time will be the least inconvenient # 20:19 deiu ... that's an action to everyone to please go ahead and fill in the doodle # 20:19 deiu ... please try to do that by next Tuesday # 20:19 deiu harry: we are going to prioritize the chairs and editors (re. timezone) # 20:20 deiu ... but we do want to get as many people to participate, so it's probably easier for people in EU to attend a bit later, rather to have US people wake up very early # 20:20 deiu sandro: if I recall, W3C requires 7 days notice...so maybe we can have the deadline be Sunday jasnell_ joined the channel
# 20:21 deiu ... maybe the chair can make a decision on that # 20:21 deiu tantek: objections to making the deadline Friday? # 20:21 harry notes that I'm on vacation next week, but deadline friday makes sense # 20:21 harry but we have a much wider selection of time! # 20:21 tommorris as a Europe/London resident, participating in the evening is preferable to during the day. # 20:21 harry you can start without me, but we do need 7 day notice # 20:21 deiu tantek: we've been thinking about starting telcons sometime in September # 20:22 deiu ... are there any objections/suggestions for a week in Sept? # 20:22 deiu evanpro: if we pick a day, can we start the week of the 24th Aug? # 20:22 deiu harry: that would work for me, with a 7 day notice # 20:22 Arnaud for non US people that's the week of the 25th # 20:22 harry Is anyone still stuck in legal review of charter? # 20:23 harry RESOLUTION: Will start official telecons 24th of August # 20:23 AnnBassetti Harry, yes .. the Boeing folks still await word from our lawyers # 20:24 harry Ann - you don't mind if we start on the 24th, right? # 20:24 AnnBassetti start when you start; I will ping our lawyer now # 20:24 bret had trouble connecting sorry to be late # 20:24 AdamB no, we don't mind # 20:24 Zakim I don't understand '??P15 might be me', rhiaro # 20:24 deiu tantek: that brings us to the open questions about the WG charter # 20:24 AnnBassetti there's no real way I can speed him up # 20:24 deiu ... do we have any new invited experts this week? # 20:24 deiu harry: I haven't invited anyone new this week # 20:25 deiu evanpro: if we're aiming for the week of 24th, we do need to extend the invitations sooner rather than later # 20:25 deiu ... I started a wiki page for organizations # 20:25 deiu ... I'm in the process of reaching out to people I know at those orgs # 20:25 Zakim sorry, tantek, I do not know which phone connection belongs to tantek # 20:25 Zakim tantek was already listed in [Mozilla], tantek # 20:25 Zakim sorry, tantek, I do not know which phone connection belongs to tantek # 20:26 deiu ... harry: is there a formal process to extend an invitation to a W3C member org? # 20:26 deiu ... if there is, then we should reach to people # 20:26 deiu harry: the launch of the WG may not have reached the employees of all the member companies # 20:27 deiu ... if you do have any friends working for member companies, just invite them yourself and CC me so I can put them in touch with their AC rep # 20:27 AnnBassetti yes, helpful Harry # 20:28 deiu evanpro: I will go through a list and try to contact people # 20:28 deiu tantek: can you split that list in two, members and orgs that might have invited experts # 20:29 deiu evanpro: yes, I will look for orgs that have social products or contribute to social software # 20:29 deiu tantek: the last question I wanted to raise is about the schedule # 20:30 deiu ... I want to raise the issue that if we're going to put up a schedule, we should at least start having official discussions... # 20:30 deiu ... so that people can commit to dates # 20:30 deiu ... a week out from when we start the official telcons maybe # 20:32 deiu tantek: I suggest we have another telcon next week (same time) to follow up on open actions # 20:32 aaronpk ACTION for aaronpk: log the #socialig IRC channel # 20:32 trackbot Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel. # 20:33 aaronpk ACTION for aaronpk: backfill #social logs from before Loqi was in the channel # 20:33 trackbot Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel. # 20:33 deiu Arnaud: aren't you going to Semtech next week? # 20:33 deiu s/Arnaud: aren't you going to Semtech next week?/-- # 20:34 deiu tantek: evanpro, can you chair next week? # 20:34 Arnaud thank you deiu for knowing my schedule better than I do! :) # 20:35 deiu tantek: ok, next week's chair will have to handle the scribe management next week # 20:36 evanpro One thing I wanted to bring up, which is one of our first tasks in the schedule # 20:36 evanpro is determining what we want out of a social syntax jasnell joined the channel
# 20:36 tantek harry, do you know if Zakim has an avatar/icon/logo? # 20:39 aaronpk evanpro: "not logged in"... is the JSON version not public? # 20:39 aaronpk and that URL is not discoverable from the HTML version? # 20:41 aaronpk if the HTML version is public, why not the AS version? # 20:41 evanpro You have to authenticate remotely; it's a funny system, probably too paranoid on this point. # 20:42 aaronpk really I was just looking for a quick example of AS JSON, and thought your site would be the easiest place to copy/paste an example :) # 20:43 jasnell aaronpk: there are a couple quick examples in the AS JSON spec. # 20:44 jasnell but examples in the wild are much more.... diverse # 20:45 aaronpk jasnell: was hoping for an exmaple in the wild because they tend to be more reflective of what things will actually look like # 20:46 jasnell examples in the wild tend to reflect (a) lack of focus on interop, (b) domain specific "extensions", (c) intentional divergence to address specific issues, or (d) differences of opinion # 20:47 jasnell basically, people have the same basic ideas but they're doing it lots of different ways # 20:51 jasnell In most cases that I've seen, there's been an absolute lack of focus on interop in the activity space. Generally, implementers will focus on enabling functionality for their own API only. This results in developers have to write to the fb api, or the google api, or the apigee api, etc... rather than writing to any particular standard # 20:52 tantek jasnell - strange about lack of focus on interop in activity space. in the indieweb space, there's been a lot of focus on interop, because we have to # 20:53 aaronpk frankly that's the same lack of interop focus that happened with OAuth 2 # 20:54 tantek jasnell's examples of fb, google, apigee etc. demonstrate why I'm skeptical about big orgs/sites actually working in good faith on contributing to / implementing any standards # 20:54 jasnell if you look at specific areas, like the ADL/xAPI stuff, interop is a focus because it's a multi-vendor ecosystem. Problem is, they started with AS and diverged. # 20:54 tantek that's even worse, where another subconsortium or oligopoly decides to go its own way # 20:54 tantek that happened with schema too - and now we have volcanoes with fax numberes. # 20:55 jasnell for IBM, the lack of interop is a big deal.. we don't want 100 different ways of doing the same basic things. It's annoying as hell # 20:57 Zakim disconnecting the lone participant, Ann, in Team_(social)19:52Z # 20:57 Zakim Attendees were [Mozilla], deiu, Sandro, tantek, jasnell, aaronpk, [IPcaller], Arnaud, AdamB, MarkC, Ann, Doug_Schepers, rhiaro, barnabywalters, bret # 20:59 jasnell for most systems.. the focus tends to be "hey, come use our social tool only. it's everything you need. here's our REST API. isn't it awesome?" .... it's not "Our social tool works with other social tools. If another system publishes profile and activity data, we're capable of using that data also"... way too many social silos being built # 21:03 bret aaronpk how do i set an avatar? irc-people? # 21:07 bret hrmm cant log into the wiki even with my w3c profile info # 21:08 aaronpk did you recently change your password? there's a lag # 21:10 bret it didnt work the other day, and it didnt work today. maybe a reset will get it # 21:10 RRSAgent I'm logging. I don't understand 'make minutes public', tantek. Try /msg RRSAgent help jasnell joined the channel
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# 21:43 tantek thanks Arnaud, I've noted it in the agenda for today so hopefully it copy/pastes to the future. # 21:44 Arnaud but once we get a Tracker set up with a regular conference we can get trackbot to do some of that work for us jasnell joined the channel
# 21:44 Arnaud then you just have to say "trackbot, start meeting" and possibly "trackbot, end meeting" and it does all that stuff for you # 21:45 Arnaud I said "possibly" because actually it will even detect the lack of activity and do that automaticcally if you don't jasnell_ and bblfish joined the channel
# 21:57 Arnaud tantek: I actually don't see the icons on the IRC-people, what am I missing? jasnell and jasnell_ joined the channel
# 22:23 Arnaud tantek, so what about my question regarding the images? # 22:27 Arnaud are you saying the answer to my question is in the logs? # 22:40 tantek Arnaud: gadget, like "card", or "web intent", or "annotation" I find has expanded to mean anything and thus nothing. If I'm incorrect and you mean something specific and limited for "gadget", perhaps you can provide a URL to it (or create /gadget :) ) jasnell, tantek, nicolagreco, ShaneHudson, jasnell_, tantek_ and bblfish joined the channel
caseorganic Hello!
tantek tommorris: Really? /wiki/socialwg#Telecons (he types from memory)
KevinMarks so the call is at 1?
barnabywalters I’ll be missing the first half and dailing in later
RRSAgent logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/08/12-social-irc
jasnell I am collecting a list of AS 1.x / 2.0 impls here: https://www.w3.org/wiki/Activity_Streams#Implementations
evanpro I started a page on the wiki, here: https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/Social_syntax_requirements
aaronpk evanpro: how do I find a JSON version of your activity stream here? https://e14n.com/evan
bret http://www.w3.org/accounts/ is the same account as the wiki right?