#social 2019-10-04

2019-10-04 UTC
lanodan, xmpp-social, BitBot and KjetilK joined the channel
#
lain_soykaf Two additions we're doing that might be intersteing for others:
#
lain_soykaf 1. Emoji Reactions: https://git.pleroma.social/pleroma/pleroma-meta/issues/4
#
lain_soykaf This is nearly done
#
lain_soykaf 2. Stories: https://git.pleroma.social/pleroma/pleroma-meta/issues/5
#
lain_soykaf This is still in early planning
#
nightpool[m] "with a single character unicode emoji"
#
nightpool[m] does this mean zwj sequences like 🏳️‍🌈 and 👩‍👩‍👧‍👦 are out?
#
aaronpk hehe good luck with that! it's surprisingly hard to tell whether a series of bytes represents a single emoji
#
aaronpk ideally emojis with ZWJ sequences should count as a single emoji still
#
lain_soykaf yeah, it's not easy
#
lain_soykaf check the implementation, the valid characters there are the unicode codepoints listed in the unicode docs for emojis
#
aaronpk some of you might find this helpful though https://github.com/aaronpk/emoji-detector-php
#
lain_soykaf so no sequences
#
aaronpk ironically even my computer doesn't recognize your first one nightpool[m]! I'm a few OS versions out of date https://media.aaronpk.com/Screen-Shot-2019-10-04-06-33-14-EO8IJ58k3w.jpg
#
lain_soykaf btw, i agree that conceptually, the sequences should be valid as well, so this would be a bug in the current implementation
#
nightpool[m] right just trying to hammer out the normative definition of "single character"
#
lain_soykaf i'll add some text about that in the issue
#
aaronpk check the unicode spec they probably have specific language
#
nightpool[m] my other piece of feedback is that people are really really going to want to be able to react with custom emoji, so we should make sure that we at least consider that issue in the federation format
#
lain_soykaf The problem with custom emoji reactions is that they don't stack
#
aaronpk slack managed to do it just fine
#
lain_soykaf because it's not trivial to figure out if two custom emojis are the same\
#
lain_soykaf slack controls the whole network
#
aaronpk just stack them only if they share the same image URL?
#
aaronpk close enough
#
nightpool[m] I feel like people will care less about that then they will about actually being able to do it
#
aaronpk agreed
#
lain_soykaf i don't think that's close enough at all
#
lain_soykaf if people from 10 different servers react with the same custom emoji, they'll all have different urls
#
nightpool[m] I think one worse is better option is (on the front end) to allow people to react with other instances custom emoji if they're already on the post
#
nightpool[m] so emergantly people will just standardize on whoever gets there first
#
nightpool[m] this mirrors how, e.g., discord nitro works, which has a similar problem with server specific emoji
#
lain_soykaf I'd rather have proper identifyable emojo
#
aaronpk good idea nightpool[m]
#
lain_soykaf with something like LET'S SAY datashards(tm)
#
nightpool[m] Unicode is working on that, actually
#
nightpool[m] Unicode has a cool custom emoji proposal up for public comment
#
lain_soykaf huh, i haven't seen that
#
aaronpk https://unicode.org/L2/L2016/16009-custom-emoji-framewk.pdf
#
nightpool[m] > <@irc_aaronpk:cybre.space> https://unicode.org/L2/L2016/16009-custom-emoji-framewk.pdf
#
nightpool[m] not that one
#
nightpool[m] whoops, sorry
#
nightpool[m] not that one
#
aaronpk oh?
#
nightpool[m] let me find the link, there's a much better proposal that's currently in the public comment phase
#
aaronpk aewsome
#
nightpool[m] https://www.unicode.org/L2/L2019/19082-qid-emoji.pdf
#
nightpool[m] anyway I don't think the stacking issue is a problem in practice—people aren't going to dig into the emoji picker if they already see the emoji they're looking for displayed as a possible reaction
#
nightpool[m] discord nitro has this exact same problem and they don't do any deduplication, to my knowledge
#
nightpool[m] I've never heard someone notice it as an issue in practice
#
lain_soykaf sure, but people don't necessarily see the reactions of others unless they follow them
#
nightpool[m] that's fixed by inbox forwarding though?
#
lain_soykaf what's that supposed to be
#
lain_soykaf Either way, i'm sure custom emoji reactions can be done and should be done, but they are a lot more involved than basic unicode ones, that's why this issue refers only to unicode
#
nightpool[m] yeah I just don't want to settle on a federation format that precludes them
#
lain_soykaf I think one with more functionality should just be another type like CustomEmojiReaction
#
jaywink[m] likes the `litepub:EmojiReaction` and would definitely implement in Socialhome
#
jesopo ooh activity
#
aaronpk I haven't been following changes much lately, but have any of you all figured out the "tootstorm" problem yet? like if I want to post a series of posts in reply to each other, but also have them all delivered to my followers, is that possible?
#
aaronpk I remember people were boosting their own posts to effectively do this, but that seems like an ugly hack
#
lain_soykaf why would they not be delivered?
#
aaronpk well maybe they're delivered but they aren't shown in the main timeline because they're a reply
#
aaronpk or at least that used to be the case. like I said it's been a while since i've checked
#
lain_soykaf i think that might be a mastodon specific issue
#
aaronpk ah hmm
#
nightpool[m] I'm not sure I understand the problem either. mastodon always shows self replies in the main timeline
#
aaronpk always always? is it possible that like over a year ago it did not?
#
nightpool[m] maybe 2 years ago? maybe we had a bug for a while? not exactly sure.
#
aaronpk I just remember it not working, and then also remember seeing people boost their own replies to create a kind of tweetstorm
#
nightpool[m] I do remember the thing you're talking about but I don't remember what the actual problem was, I think I sorted it into my head into some kind of misunderstanding
#
jaywink[m] doesn't sound like a protocol issue tho ;)
#
lain_soykaf Will we see some mastodon presence at fosdem?
#
nightpool[m] I'm not planning on going, I can't speak for anyone else
#
jaywink[m] btw, there is going to be a decentralized internet room this year as well
#
jaywink[m] s/this/2020/