#indiewebcamp 2013-06-30

2013-06-30 UTC
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sandeepshetty tantek: it's tricky to balance the need for reducing barriers to collaboration while also increasing it to avoid spam. On the IWC wiki, I got in easily with Openid but when it switched to indieauth it took me a couple of months to get around to using the wiki
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pdurbin sandeepshetty: sure. certainly on topic for #swig as well, where sivoais hangs out. if you guy have a conversation, please link to the logs. (i.e. http://chatlogs.planetrdf.com/swig/2013-06-29.html )
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tantek.com edited /2013/UK (+5) "sort RSVPs" (view diff)
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sandeepshetty is there going to be remote participating allowed to IWC 2013/UK?
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sandeepshetty *participation
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tantek create a section on Remote Participation on the wiki page like the one for /2013 and let's make it happen!
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christopheducamp.com created /foursquare-fr (+27) "[fr: redirection]" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /2013/UK (+117) "/* IndieWebCampUK */ put consider dConstruct up at the top" (view diff)
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www.sandeep.io edited /2013/UK (+1077) "Added Remote Participation section and added myself to it." (view diff)
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@xtof_fr @lentremetteur prête pour partir sur @MyDataLabs #indieweb ?
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sandeepshetty tantek: dt-published might be required when you're paginating feeds.
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sandeepshetty (http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5005)
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tantek I don't think pagination makes sense for feeds. instead, have crawlable date-time indexed archives.
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tantek e.g. by year, month, maybe even day
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tantek pagination is bad because the links to pagination pages don't mean anything - they change all the time
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sandeepshetty pagination solves on problem with pull based feeds..
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sandeepshetty if you are polling at some interval and the feed has updates within that period that are pushed to the next page.. they will be missed by the poller
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sandeepshetty pagination help get all updates till the last one present locally
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aaronpk sandeepshetty: check out the way I do pagination, theyre all permalinks that don't change, so tantek's concerns are covered
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josephboyle What do you guys like to use for delivery of mail to your domains and spam filtering?
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aaronpk josephboyle: I use gmail for spam filtering, but all my domain names run through my own postfix server which I forward then to gmail
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josephboyle Do you only send mails that fail your personal whitelist to gmail for filtering?
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sandeepshetty aaronpk: converspace also does pagination that are permalinks (give me posts older/newer than this post_id )
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@sandeepshetty A valid Atom 1.0 feed generated from the h-feed on sandeep.io... http://www.sandeep.io/98 #indieweb /cc @t
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sandeepshetty aaronpk: first pass at h-feed to atom proxy is live! :)
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sandeepshetty only works with a proper h-feed and has no fallback yet
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sandeepshetty will clean it up later to pick up top level h-entry like on your site
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aaronpk sandeepshetty: nice!
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sandeepshetty aaronpk: A mention showed up a little weirdly on your site: http://aaronparecki.com/replies/2013/06/28/1/indieweb
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aaronpk !tell sandeepshetty yea bret was missing a space between the <a> amd <p> tags
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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aaronpk bret: looks like you've updated the code since then, if you re-send the webmention it will apparently update
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bret are people treating likes and reposts differently?
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bret also, aaronpk, does pin13 parse h-cards that are on another page as described on http://indiewebcamp.com/authorship ?
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bret linked from within an h-entry
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aaronpk bret: yes sandeep treats likes and reposes differently
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aaronpk and pin13 is just the php-mf2 parser
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aaronpk it checs out the master branch every hour or so
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bret oh ok
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tantek good evening indiewebcampers
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bret hi tantek
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aaronpk good evening
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Loqi sandeepshetty: aaronpk left you a message 18 minutes ago: yea bret was missing a space between the <a> amd <p> tags
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bret ill resend that webmention
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bret got an already registered error but it updated alright
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sandeepshetty bret: (re /authorship) the mf2-cleaner that barnabywalters is working on has a getAuthor that should do it eventually.
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aaronpk bret: sweet
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bret sandeepshetty good to know
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bret i kind of like the idea of having a link to a single h-card rather than a card per post item
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sandeepshetty yeah I switched to a single h-card as well with my redesign
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tantek sandeepshetty yesterday you said you couldn't find dt-published for my h-entry
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tantek I didn't ask which URL - but now I'm seeing no problem
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tantek e.g. http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=http://tantek.com/2013/178/t1/surreal-meeting-dpdpdp-trondisc
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tantek I see the dt-published there no problem
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tantek I haven't changed my markup
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sandeepshetty it was the home page I was looking at
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tantek oh
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sandeepshetty (for the h-feed)
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tantek you mean inside the h-entry(s) there?
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tantek yeah the only difference is that the dt-published is on an a tag rather than a span like on the permalink pages
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sandeepshetty yes
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sandeepshetty tantek: did you see http://www.sandeep.io/98 ?
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tantek nicely done!
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sandeepshetty it's very basic right now and will probably only work with my site but I'm hoping to make it more robust
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sandeepshetty and provide it as a service so indiewebers don't have to worry about atom
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tantek beautiful
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tantek perhaps add it to http://indiewebcamp.com/Atom ?
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sandeepshetty sure thing. Will do it on the other side of some shut eye.
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tantek sounds good. sleep well!
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tantek !tell barnabywalters it appears php-mf2 doesn't support the value-class-pattern for dt-* properties when they're set on an <a href> (e.g. tantek.com) rather than a <span> (on all my permalink pages)
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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tantek !tell barnabywalters compare http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=http://tantek.com/2013/178/t1/surreal-meeting-dpdpdp-trondisc which was dt-published to http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=http://tantek.com/ which lacks dt-published.
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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sandeepshetty tantek I filed a bug for it yesterday on github
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tantek URL?
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sandeepshetty good night.
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tantek good night!
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Loqi sweet dreams
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Loqi goodnight!
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sandeepshetty sorry on my phone. it should be the top one on his project
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tantek np - checking
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tantek got it https://github.com/indieweb/php-mf2/issues/25
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tantek added info there.
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tantek !tell barnabywalters I've added that info the github issue 25. https://github.com/indieweb/php-mf2/issues/25
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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tantek aaronpk - I made good brainstorming progress with benwerd on IndieMark yesterday
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tantek I have a few more mods to make today
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tantek tonight
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tantek feeling like I've got a pretty solid proposals for levels 0-2.
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tantek and portions thereof
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aaronpk OH great!!
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aaronpk i'm super into the idea of indiemark but having trouble actually articulating it
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melvster IndieMark?
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tantek aaronpk - it's ok, it's taking some iterations to clear up make it sensible / useful
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tantek melvster - how indieweb is your personal site?
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tantek measured by real practical things that we're building, each with use-cases.
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melvster tantek: not done webmention yet, but pretty advanced id say
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tantek none of the theoretical/hypothetical checkmark items. every indiemark item bring utility.
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tantek melvster, not sending or not receiving webmentions?
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aaronpk melvster: that was a rhetorical question meant to describe IndieMark :)
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melvster ahhhh
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melvster thx :)
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tantek needs to include </rhetorical>
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tantek you're going to need replies and sending of webmentions to achieve Level 2.
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tantek Level 3 will require *receiving* webmentions and showing comments from others.
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melvster oh cool, like badges?
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tantek more like ringmark
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tantek http://rng.io/
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melvster ah i see, like a test suite, good idea
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melvster so what if there's more than one way to solve a particular use case?
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aaronpk there's a zillion ways to solve the use case :) everybody so far has implemented it differnetly
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melvster lol, and they all work together?
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melvster if so that would be awesome
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aaronpk yes: http://eschnou.com/entry/testing-indieweb-federation-with-waterpigscouk-aaronpareckicom-and--62-24908.html
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melvster cool!
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melvster so how do i add a comment, I assume it's more than just filling in the comment form?
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bret make a post on your website
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bret make sure the html is marked up with h-entry
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bret send a webmention (or pingback for eschnou.com),
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bret let me give you some links
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bret melvster http://indiewebcamp.com/reply#How_To
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melvster bret: thanks!
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bret melvster http://pin13.net/ is useful for checking your microformats
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bret webmentions are far easier to send, espcially from the command line
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bret there is an example of pingback somewhere
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bret but I'll redo that on the actual pingback page
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bret The idea is that eventually, whatever solution you implement will make it trivial to send a webmention
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bret melvster, if you want to reply to eschnou.com manually use this https://gist.github.com/aaronpk/5744879
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bret otherwise just use this http://indiewebcamp.com/webmention#Manually_sending_webmentions
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melvster thanks, was just reading ... :)
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bret aaronpk, what are your thoughts on upvotes now? would we syndicate a like to indieweb?
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bret err indienews I mean
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aaronpk i like that idea yea
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aaronpk probably isn't the highest priority in my implementation queue
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bret i understand, I was thinking about it
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bret i have so much other stuff to do
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bret im trying to decide how I want to represent these actions and verbs
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bret I should probrably just focus on getting some simple things done really well
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Loqi fo sho
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bret refactoring is tedious, imagination keeps wandering
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aaronpk yep
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aaronpk make a list of all the things you want to do
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aaronpk then prioritize it
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aaronpk then just do one of them
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bret i started doing that after the IRC meeting
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bret on paper
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aaronpk put it on the wiki!
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aaronpk public all the things!
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Loqi PUBLIC ALL THE THINGS http://loqi.me/7ZQ
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aaronpk thanks loqi
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Loqi you're welcome
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melvster is anyone going to register rel="webmention" ?
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melvster or is that a bad idea?
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melvster there may be some confusion with comparing http://webmention.org and http://webmention.org/ with the trailing slash
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melvster im not sure which is more normal...
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tantek.com edited /IndieMark (+993) "/* areas */" (view diff)
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tantek yes, registering rel=webmention is probably a good idea
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tantek want to write something up on the /webmention page?
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melvster tantek: do you know what's more normal as a URL, http://webmention.org or http://webmention.org/ ... I wasnt sure on that one ...
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tantek with trailing slash
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melvster ah thanks
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tantek you need that to for it to be a proper URL
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melvster really?
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tantek yes, "/" is the minimum path component
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melvster is one of those things that always confused me :)
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melvster i know a domain redirects to the /
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tantek the browser does that
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melvincarvalho.com edited /webmention (+89) "/* Brainstorming */" (view diff)
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tantek melvster, I'll refer to http://tantek.com/2011/238/b1/many-ways-slice-url-name-pieces
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tantek and with that - I'm off to bed :)
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melvster cu! :)
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melvster that's an awesome post! lol
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tantek.com edited /webmention (+141) "/* Brainstorming */ HTML5 rel registry" (view diff)
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bret what do folks think about linklogs?
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bret.io created /linklog (+356) "Started linklog stub." (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /IndieMark (+1120) "/* areas */ expand on posting UI, web actions levels of achievement" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /IndieMark (+723) "/* areas */ resort a bit by more developed areas first, staging for inclusion into actual level definitions" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /linklog (+165) "add a few more resources" (view diff)
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@AxelNennker I am wondering why #indieweb does not use Persona. #browserid
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waterpigs.co.uk uploaded /File:twitter-email-reply-context.png "[[Twitter]] is using their ellipse [[reply-context]] UI within emails."
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waterpigs.co.uk edited /reply-context (+143) "/* Twitter home page */ added twitter email usage" (view diff)
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Loqi barnabywalters: pfefferle left you a message on 6/28 at 5:25am: the parser works totally fine, i had a little blackout and haven't mentioned that <url> uses &lt
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Loqi barnabywalters: pfefferle left you a message on 6/28 at 5:38am: sandeepshetty I take everything back! I am right though!! you use a not <http://example.com> encoded instead &lt;http://example.com&gt
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Loqi barnabywalters: pfefferle left you a message on 6/28 at 6:13am: I like the new rel-parser a lot, thanks!
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Loqi barnabywalters: erikmaarten left you a message 1 day, 6 hours ago: there seems to be a problem installing mf-cleaner with Composer. mf-cleaner requires tantek/cassis, but "no matching package found". Perhaps a minimum-stability issue?
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Loqi barnabywalters: erikmaarten left you a message 1 day, 5 hours ago: sorry, mf-cleaner requires helpers, which require tantek/cassis.
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Loqi barnabywalters: tantek left you a message 6 hours, 52 minutes ago: it appears php-mf2 doesn't support the value-class-pattern for dt-* properties when they're set on an <a href> (e.g. tantek.com) rather than a <span> (on all my permalink pages)
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Loqi barnabywalters: tantek left you a message 6 hours, 52 minutes ago: compare http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=http://tantek.com/2013/178/t1/surreal-meeting-dpdpdp-trondisc which was dt-published to http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=http://tantek.com/ which lacks dt-published.
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Loqi barnabywalters: tantek left you a message 6 hours, 47 minutes ago: I've added that info the github issue 25. https://github.com/indieweb/php-mf2/issues/25
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barnabywalters okay, thanks Loqi
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Loqi you're welcome
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erikmaarten nice slew of messages you got there, barnabywalters :)
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tommorris msgspam
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barnabywalters erikmaarten: working on yours first — it occurs to me I haven’t actually tried a clean composer install of mf-cleaner
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barnabywalters wait, does the second message imply it was resolved?
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erikmaarten no, I just realized I mistyped the first message a little bit
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barnabywalters ah, apparently not — okay, fixing
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erikmaarten the error message was something like that, mf-cleaner requires helpers, helpers require tantek/cassis
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barnabywalters ah, okay, I just tried installing cassis and I know why this is
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erikmaarten so I guess there's only some minor problem getting the tantek/cassis package
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erikmaarten nice!
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erikmaarten what was it?
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barnabywalters either you need to set minimum_stability: dev in your composer.json, or tantek needs to tag a release of cassis, or both
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erikmaarten right, easy to get around then
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erikmaarten thanks!
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barnabywalters might actually be a hyphen instead of an underscore
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erikmaarten so, "minimum-stability": "dev", before the requires in my composer.json, right?
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barnabywalters erikmaarten: yep, or if you don’t want that setting to apply to all your other packages then "tantek/cassis": "dev-master" might work http://getcomposer.org/doc/04-schema.md#minimum-stability
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barnabywalters prefer-stable might also be useful, I’ve never actually come across it before
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erikmaarten barnabywalters: I set minimum-stability to dev and it worked fine.
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barnabywalters erikmaarten: yay! I’ll ask tantek about tagging his releases so people don’t have to go through this little dance — I think this has happened a few times
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Loqi giggles
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erikmaarten How would I use prefer-stable? I'm looking at the documentation but it doesn't make very clear how to enable prefer-stable. Would it possibly be something like "prefer-stable": "true", do you think?
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barnabywalters erikmaarten: I think so, yes. try it, we can make the docs clearer if it works
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erikmaarten oops, it wasn't :)
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erikmaarten right, so it seems a boolean value enables/disables it
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erikmaarten "prefer-stable": true, seems to work
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erikmaarten It's a bit confusing that the docs use "true" for some options
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erikmaarten (as a string)
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erikmaarten I added the usage to the docs and sent a pull request
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erikmaarten my first ever pull request!
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barnabywalters erikmaarten: oh brilliant! thanks for that
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erikmaarten no problem!
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waterpigs.co.uk edited /Taproot (+96) "/* Roadmap */ pirates, updated roadmap" (view diff)
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waterpigs.co.uk edited /Taproot (+99) "/* Roadmap */ twitter shimming" (view diff)
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www.sandeep.io edited /webmention (+154) "/* Brainstorming */ I'll take up registering the webmention rel if there is enough consensus that we need it..." (view diff)
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www.sandeep.io edited /webmention (+65) "/* Brainstorming */ Forgot to sign the last commit." (view diff)
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@sandeepshetty DRY: h-feed enabled = Atom enabled http://www.sandeep.io/98 #indieweb #microformats
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aaronpk i'm awake, but i really shouldn't be
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barnabywalters sandeepshetty: nice work getting h-entry to ATOM going!
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barnabywalters morning aaronpk :)
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aaronpk morning :)
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sandeepshetty barnabywalters: thanks.
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sandeepshetty aaronpk: the Twitter msg formatting is nice... any way to link to original tweet permalink as well?
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sandeepshetty (context: IRC/loqi)
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Loqi is done
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pdurbin sandeepshetty: last time I'm playing messenger: http://irclog.greptilian.com/sourcefu/2013-06-30#i_9817 :)
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aaronpk sandeepshetty: unfortunately not unless I include the permalink in the line that goes to IRC
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aaronpk which I should probably do
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tantek good morning indiewebcamp
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tantek barnabywalters how can I help with tagging cassis?
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barnabywalters morning tantek
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barnabywalters easiest thing to do is, every time you push changes, tag the commit with a version number like v0.1.1
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barnabywalters so, whenever I want to push a new stable version of php-mf2 I check all the tests pass, then:
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Loqi CHECK ALL THE TESTS http://loqi.me/7ZU
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barnabywalters 1. git tag (to see what the current highest version is)
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barnabywalters 2. git tag v0.1.x (where X is one more than the current highest)
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barnabywalters 3. git push && git push --tags
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tantek huh so if I do this once then I'm done right? until someone wants to depend on a new function?
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Loqi 5 files modified in aaronpk/IndieAuth/master by aaronpk https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth/compare/829297bf2b44...b9dd2c367b4b
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Loqi aaronpk: show email address under the persona button for when there are multiple addresses on the page
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Loqi aaronpk: Don't make an HTTP request to verify the provider status unless it's actually a known provider. SMS and email no longer require an HTTP request either.
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Loqi aaronpk: adds more providers to the rakefile
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tantek hates command line UIs
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aaronpk tantek: you should check out Gitbox, it's a pretty decent Git GUI
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aaronpk way easier to tag stuff and push code around
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barnabywalters tantek: well, either that or we tell everyone explicitly to require the dev version of cassis
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barnabywalters hm, should be pretty easy to create a single command which does the whole thing for you
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tantek git tag does nothing - what does that mean?
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tantek then I have to remember/maintain that one-off single command
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aaronpk use gitbox!
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tantek opens the github mac app
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barnabywalters tantek: or alternatively add it to a git hook and then forget about it — it just runs automatically whenever you push
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aaronpk i don't like the github app as much actually
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tantek I guess it's good to require an explicit versioning action
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tantek for dependencies
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aaronpk ahhh much better. just pushed up a change to indieauth which speeds up the first step a bunch. now if you want to do SMS or email auth it doens't take nearly as long
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barnabywalters aaronpk++
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Loqi aaronpk has 171 karma
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aaronpk more coming soon
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tantek barnabywalters , in the command git tag v0.1.x - does x have to be a number 0-9? or are letters ok?
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barnabywalters aaronpk: localstorage caching of previously found providers?
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barnabywalters tantek: number, not 1-9 though, just incrementing
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barnabywalters e.g. php-mf2 is on v0.1.17 at the moment
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aaronpk barnabywalters: even better
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aaronpk client-side would not be secure
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barnabywalters and v0.2.0 will include some breaking changes like encoding non e-* properties by default
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tantek_ barnabywalters, I mean like is v0.1.1a ok
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barnabywalters tantek_: I don’t think packagist supports that, why do you want to use it?
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tantek_ sexagesimal epoch days of course
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barnabywalters well you could raise it as an issue but I think people are likely to want to stick to the simpler solution
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barnabywalters see: http://getcomposer.org/doc/02-libraries.md#specifying-the-version
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barnabywalters ah yeah I forgot that you can actually specify the version on composer.json too, which might be easier
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aaronpk heh, I tried versioning things with sexagesimal epoch days. everybody hated it
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barnabywalters aaronpk: at geoloqi?
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aaronpk yea
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tantek_ barnabywalters, then decimal epoch days it will be
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aaronpk here's an interesting question
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aaronpk I want IndieAuth to give an indication of what site you're trying to log in to when looking at the list of buttons
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tantek found a major problem in JS handling of ordinal dates in CASSIS related to DST.
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aaronpk like this scree http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l7bfnbuDoJ1qzt3x8o1_500.png
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tantek aaronpk, so in our case, IndieWebCamp.com?
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aaronpk yep, or if you're logging in to my site, aaronparecki.com
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aaronpk so the question is... how to use microformats to pull out that data
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tantek icon + URL?
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aaronpk icon, url and possibly name
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tantek do you have the requesting site's URL?
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aaronpk maybe just url
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aaronpk I have a redirect URI
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tantek so you could go get the name of the site from the home page <title>
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tantek and icon of the site is … a mess
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tantek (thank you apple thumnbails, favicons and all the other non-standard crap)
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aaronpk so the crazy thing is the redireect URI for the wiki may be something like this: http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?title=Special:IndieAuth&returnto=projects
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aaronpk it'll be different depending on what page you hit the login form from
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aaronpk so... should I just use "/" for the path on that domain and fetch info from there?
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aaronpk that means one domain can only be one "app"
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aaronpk and I could also just require a microformats-2 h-card on the home page for all the info
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tantek one domain one app seems good enough for now :)
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aaronpk probably yea, especially since we require root-level domains for logins
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tantek aaronpk - sounds like the minimal h-item is all you need. name, photo, url
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tantek http://microformats.org/wiki/h-item
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aaronpk whoa, didn't know about h-item
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tantek yeah, it fell out of hReview
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tantek when we converted it to h-review
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aaronpk is that better than an h-card? aren't people already going to be publishing h-cards on their home page?
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tantek h-card is for a person or organization
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aaronpk so far the use cases only include people and orgs :)
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tantek interesting
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aaronpk e.g. logging in to aaronparecki.com to see private posts, and logging in to the wiki for the org, IndieWebCamp
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tantek sure, let's go with that then, perhaps representative h-card in case it's not just the first one on the page?
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aaronpk should it follow similar rules as the authorship rule?
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tantek authorship does more
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tantek because it's for permalink pages
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aaronpk right
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tantek but essentially, yeah, the subset that applies to rel-author destinations (which is representative h-card)
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aaronpk oh this is gonna be good
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Loqi 2 files modified in aaronpk/IndieAuth/master by aaronpk https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth/compare/b9dd2c367b4b...5cb8670bcc9a
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Loqi aaronpk: Pre-loads the list of profiles for returning users, speeds up logins by a ton!
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aaronpk ok this is going live ^^
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aaronpk wanna give it a shot? :)
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Loqi [mention] http://www.w3.org/community/rww/2013/06/30/read-write-web-monthly-open-thread-june-2013/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/Main_Page (pingback)
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Loqi [mention] http://www.w3.org/community/rww/2013/06/30/read-write-web-monthly-open-thread-june-2013/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/2013 (pingback)
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tantek well how about that
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tommorris W3C love us. ;)
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aaronpk https://twitter.com/Indie_Auth/status/351392488960950275
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@Indie_Auth Just launched a change to speed up logins a *ton* by using the last known list of providers instead of scanning each time!
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tantek tommorris - at least the random rww community group (never heard of them)
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tommorris tantek: melvster runs it. he lurks in here. I'm on the mailing list (which is fairly bad signal:noise, alas)
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tommorris I think barnaby is on the mailing list too
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tommorris in as much as I've seen him grumbling about the signal:noise ratio
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tommorris there's some webfingery people in there, some semweb people and various other interesting people
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tommorris some of the discussions are pretty far-out there in terms of grand architecture and philosophy rather than practical implementation. (moar self-dogfooding!)
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tommorris but it's good there are conversations going on in W3C world
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tantek bad signal:noise on a mailing list? imagine my surprise.
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tommorris I know. Next we'll find out that there's trolling, drama and strife... ;)
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tantek tommorris - for a grand architecture and philosophy good time, see the FSW mailing list.
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tommorris ah, that may be the one
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tommorris may have gotten FSW and RWW mixed up
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tantek and just committed perhaps my biggest fix to CASSIS in a year+
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tantek ouch that one was hard to find/track down.
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tommorris also, on the mailing lists front, I did see a talk given at State of the Map US where a guy had done some kind of small scale study and found that the perception of how welcoming and trollish the community seems depends heavily on membership of the mailing list...
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tantek yay for timezones, DST, and off by one errors!
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tommorris ;)
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tantek of course I tested the changes on my own site before committing to github
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tommorris he said that if your primary interaction with the OSM community was through IRC, you had the best perceptions of the community. second was the wiki. third was mailing lists.
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tantek ah, so just cut out the 3rd and we're good :)
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aaronpk we should start an indiewebcamp mailing list, and any time anybody sends an email to it, it just auto-responds with a bunch of info about why email lists are bad and tells them how to get on IRC
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tantek LOL!!
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pdurbin +1
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neuro` I like this ©
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tantek aaronpk - how about an email list that requires fax confirmation to sign-up?
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tantek !tell barnabywalters ok I did the git tag / push things you said to do for cassis - did that work?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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tantek !tell barnabywalters v0.1.15886
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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www.sandeep.io edited /responses (+291) "/* object of action */" (view diff)
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bret aaronpk, have you tried http://rowanj.github.io/gitx/ yet? Its kind of like gitbox but free software
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bret it is a fork of the original gitx, and far better and activly maintained
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tommorris ooh that's handy
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bret far betterr than the original gitx.*
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pdurbin I usually just use gitk
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bret gitk is nice to have
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bret since it follows you everywhere
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pdurbin I'm all about the lowest common denominator :)
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bret aaaaand, blue screen of death, and were back
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bret pdurbin, yeah Im starting to understand why that can be important
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bret also, wow, indieauth is fast now!
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sandeepshetty pdurbin: thanks.
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sandeepshetty +1 for gitk, git-gui & lowest common denominator
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bret How close do people thing google picasa is to the chopping block?
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bret It still has the old google reader "like" button :/
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pdurbin there's also some git command line visualization built in. I forget the flag
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bret git show graph or something right?
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pdurbin bret: yeah. git log --graph
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bret there are a bunch of aliass that give you fancy git tree representations too if you just google for them
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bret <3 git
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bret nobody in my field uses it
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www.sandeep.io edited /Atom (+256) "Noted that I generate atom from h-feed." (view diff)
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@domenicoperri I liked a @YouTube video http://www.youtube.com/ IndieWeb comments, likes and events
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bret Very cool sandeepshetty !
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sandeepshetty bret: the atom from h-feed?
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bret yeah!
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sandeepshetty thanks. how does Jekyll do atom? (IIRC you have a static site?)
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bret I know tantek isn't a fan of atom/rss, but a gajillion number of sites are still publish atom/rss and all the tools for personal aggregation only consume those data types. We need good transitional tools available and it sounds like a good start
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bret sandeepshetty: you generate an atom or rss feed the same way you generate every other page on your site. You make a template and process it at the time of publication
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sandeepshetty still a lot to do in h-reader.com before others can use it.
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bret you can even have a post commit hook to hit a pubsubhubub hub to update PuSH enabled subscribers
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sandeepshetty ah, should have known.
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sandeepshetty nice!
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bret still, Im glad to someone is working on it :)
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bret sandeepshetty: here is my atom template. it has some issues but works for the most part. https://github.com/bcomnes/bcomnes.github.io/blob/master/atom.xml
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sandeepshetty I can see it's very easy to do. I would have
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bret sandeepshetty: did you come up with web mentions?
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sandeepshetty I think of it as more: just tried to make pingback simpler because I didn't want to do xmlrpc :)
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bret they are great!
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bret should we add it to here? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trackback
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@hober The feed reader v. social network news feeds: "An elegant weapon for a more civilized age." #indieweb #googlereader #googleplus
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sandeepshetty Yeah. Want sure what the criteria was to be included there
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sandeepshetty *not
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bret There are a list of ping types near the bottom
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bret I'll add it to the list
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sandeepshetty (y)
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bret "A trackback is one of three types of linkback methods for website authors to request notification when somebody links to one of their documents."
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bret should I also change that to 4?
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sandeepshetty like I said, I don't know at what point (adoption level) something qualifies to be added there
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sandeepshetty but I guess we can always edit and see what the maintainer does
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bret sandeepshetty: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WebMention there you go!
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bret.io edited /webmention (+149) "/* See Also */ Added wikipedia link to our wiki" (view diff)
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sandeepshetty bret: awesome. thanks.
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bret ok see ya later
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bret laptop is going to die
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@schneitj RT @hober: The feed reader v. social network news feeds: "An elegant weapon for a more civilized age." #indieweb #googlereader #googleplus
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bret I'm thinking about archiving metadata about media I want in my posts rather than raw URLs
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bret then use a template to generate the embeded objects
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aaronpk tantek: I fully support this idea of fax-based subscription to mailing lists
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aaronpk I should add fax support to IndieAuth first
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bret i went to a meeting about portland fiber and asked why their IRC was so poorly attended. they told me they prefer mailing lists
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Loqi yea
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sandeepshetty bret: re metadata, it sounds similar to what I'm doing with machine tags.
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aaronpk add <a href="fax:+15035551212" rel="me">fax</a> to your domain, then you'd get a fax with a 4-digit code that you'd enter when logging in via indieauth
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aaronpk would totally work
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sandeepshetty though I don't have media support yet, that is what I'll be using when I introduce them.
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bret aaronpk, that might appeal the wizzards who fear cell phones and google voice
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bret fax or computer dicated codes
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bret :)
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aaronpk I wish I had a phone line so I could actually record a demo of this
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aaronpk I might have to test it out at my office, I think we have a fax line there
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bret sandeepshetty, I was thinking if I post a video of a song or something, if that video disapears, the embed could revert back to just the name of the media or something
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bret and then its just a matter of updating to a replacement file
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sandeepshetty aaronpk: what do they use the fax line for?
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bret lawers most likely
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aaronpk i don't even know, most of the stuff we sign gets scanned electronically anyway
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aaronpk i haven't seen anybody actually use it yet
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bret tantek, another alternative to the git CLI incase you missed it: http://rowanj.github.io/gitx/
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tantek scrolls up a bit
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tantek hey webmention on wikipedia - awesome
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tantek is going to Blue Front Cafe for a late post-run brunch and some indieweb hacking in case anyone wants to meet up.
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sandeepshetty checked out how his feed looks in a feed reader and realized it looks like sh** :( and needs fixing.
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bret I really dig the http://fed.wiki.org/ interface! But I have no idea what is going on
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aaronpk SMS + fax auth brings up an interesting question of where does the $$ come from to send the verification messages
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bret its like walking through a maze with all sorts of interesting things to see along the way
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bret aaronpk does it cost $$$ to send SMS?
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aaronpk yea, 1¢ / message http://www.twilio.com/sms/pricing
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aaronpk faxes are more, like 7¢ / page
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bret yikes
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aaronpk i still have $45 credit with a fax provider from 2006 when I signed up, so that'll go a long way, but it's an interesting question
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sandeepshetty aaronpk: I was wondering about that when you added SMS support... because sending a msg to me would have been expensive
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bret Part of me would love to be able to ditch phone numbers and SMS
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aaronpk sandeepshetty: looks like they charge 1¢/message to india too
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aaronpk airtel is 1.7¢, but the rest of 1
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aaronpk are*
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aaronpk ok... maybe there is a way to use the google authenticator algorithm with indieauth
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aaronpk that would be more useful than fax probably
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bret not as funny though
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aaronpk true
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bret aaronpk in addition to google authenticator, there is also https://www.authy.com/ ... but the fact they wanto have give me two factor authentication so badly makes me raise an eyebrow
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bret delete have
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aaronpk oh sweet https://github.com/nricciar/google_authenticator_auth
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bret does anyone recoemend a good openID provider that I could add to my domain?
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bret google requries G+
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bret and I want to avoid that
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aaronpk http://indiewebcamp.com/How_to_set_up_OpenID_on_your_own_domain
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bret ahh ty
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aaronpk i think myopenid.com is the one everybody was using before
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