#indiewebcamp 2014-08-27

2014-08-27 UTC
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@ScottWNesbitt Want to get on the IndieWeb? Here's your guide - http://indiewebify.me/?utm_content=buffer14078&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer (twitter.com/_/status/504418798146166784)
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tantek !tell snarfed any idea why Bridgy Publish POSSE posts to FB lack a /link-preview while Twitter to FB posts get a link-preview (i.e. the image)? E.g. https://www.facebook.com/tantek.celik/posts/10101245414331493 vs. https://www.facebook.com/tantek.celik/posts/10101245413498163
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek KartikPrabhu: looks like @luxagraf was owning his own notes here https://luxagraf.net/field-notes/ til June 28, then subsequent tweets are @luxagraf Twitter only. Note also the web actions on his notes.
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KartikPrabhu tantek: I wonder why he stopped posting on his own domain
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KartikPrabhu given that he had so much working on it
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tantek KartikPrabhu: I'm wondering the same thing, especially since he did keep working on his own domain and got https A+ rating fully working just recently: http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?title=User:Luxagraf.net&action=history
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tantek (which is pretty awesome)
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tantek !tell luxagraf welcome back! noticed your tweet https://twitter.com/LongHandPixels/status/504413501368987648 Congrats also on https A+ (per your /UserLuxagraf.net page). Can you make it to IndieWebCamp Cambridge? http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/Cambridge
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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@iamaegibson : Gonna try to #indieweb this blog. Got a ways to go. http://aeg.pw (twitter.com/_/status/504458357852213249)
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bret tantek_com: where do you take bug reports for falcon?
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tantek_com1 Strange, I wonder who tantek_com is.
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tantek_com1 bret, good q. Perhaps in a new section on /Falcon ?
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (+123) "/* Working On */ bug reports" (view diff)
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tantek_ good evening snarfed!
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@iamaegibson : Let' the great #indieweb experiment begin! http://aeg.pw/t/R (twitter.com/_/status/504476942754537472)
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kylewm !tell tantek: to your question about Bridgy publish to FB, it doesn't have a link-preview because that has to be provided explicitly to the facebook posting API (which bridgy doesn't do)
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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snarfed hey tantek!
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Loqi snarfed: tantek left you a message 2 hours, 34 minutes ago: any idea why Bridgy Publish POSSE posts to FB lack a /link-preview while Twitter to FB posts get a link-preview (i.e. the image)? E.g. https://www.facebook.com/tantek.celik/posts/10101245414331493 vs. https://www.facebook.com/tantek.celik/posts/10101245413498163
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tantek_ Swarm app has 140 character limit on check-in notes (what they call "shouts") = use-case for short domains and permashortlinks
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Loqi tantek_: kylewm left you a message 19 seconds ago: to your question about Bridgy publish to FB, it doesn't have a link-preview because that has to be provided explicitly to the facebook posting API (which bridgy doesn't do)
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snarfed tantek_: wow, and swarm doesn't shorten links?
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snarfed sigh
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snarfed kylewm: maybe. i suspect tantek's twitter-to-fb service doesn't do that either, and yet fb does promote one of the text links to preview
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GWG Hello, all
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snarfed both fb's and g+'s link preview logic is somewhat opaque
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kylewm I don't agree that it's opaque :) there is a parameter "picture" that you pass to the /feed/me edge
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kylewm see, https://github.com/kylewm/redwind/blob/master/redwind/plugins/facebook.py#L167
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tantek_ snarfed, yeah no Swarm linkwrapping (yet) and I expect new services/silos to have similar note/comment limits
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snarfed kylewm: oh, agreed, if you explicitly set the link attachment via the api, you can get deterministic results
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kylewm does it use opengraph stuff otherwise?
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snarfed text links are the example here, they can be a bit unpredictable
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kylewm for that I would think you'd at least need to pass the "link" param
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tantek_ kylewm, what do you think of Bridgy Publish grabbing the u-photo inside the h-entry to set the picture parameter explicitly?
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kylewm snarfed: ah I see what you meant. you're right, the twitter post didn't have a picture, so it wouldn't have passed that to facebook.
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tantek_ The first u-photo (if any) inside the h-entry
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kylewm bridgy treats an h-entry with a u-photo as a photo post, so it would be attached as a 'native' photo, not a link preview
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kylewm snarfed: please correct me if i'm wrong!
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snarfed nope that's right, as of a few days ago :P
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kylewm tantek_: this is all emmak and snarfed's work
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kylewm emmak++
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Loqi emmak has 5 karma
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kylewm snarfed++
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Loqi snarfed has 40 karma
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snarfed tantek_ is right though, we could explicitly set the link attachment in fb, we just don't yet
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kylewm posee to facebook is weird
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tantek_ Hmm I'm not sure that's how aaronpk and others have been using u-photo
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tantek_ It started as a way to indicate a representative image for a post, not saying a post is a photo post
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snarfed tantek_: hrm. we had lots of discussion on this, i think including aaronpk. finding. open to reconsidering it more though!
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tantek_ Pretty sure aaronpk's articles use u-photo for a representative image to with the blog post.
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snarfed looks like aaronpk wasn't involved after all. https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/85
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snarfed tantek_com: ok, understood. is there mf2 to identify a photo post? as opposed to just a post with a representative picture?
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kylewm I asked tantek about it at 21st amendment after HWC that night too, but we got sidetracked talking about microformats implied properties :(
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kylewm oh dang, that was the "lunatics running the asylum" day on IRC
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kylewm when we discussed "photo" vs. "note with a photo"
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tantek_ oh dear
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KartikPrabhu someone say lunatics!
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GWG The line between genius and insanity is often blurred
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tantek_ GWG++
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Loqi GWG has 15 karma
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kylewm http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-07-15/line/1405451659000
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KartikPrabhu iirc I brought up the conflict with the accepted definition of u-photo
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tantek_ wow that's a long log day
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kylewm tantek_: tried to distill some of it here http://indiewebcamp.com/photos#Distinguishing_Photos_from_Notes
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GWG tantek_: Is your preferred method of contact really AIM?
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tantek GWG - yeah, on my public home page right now until I get the People Focused Comms prototype hooked up
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GWG tantek_: How's that going?
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GWG And does anyone actually contact you on AIM?
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tantek sometimes yes!
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GWG tantek_: If you said no, I'd be firing up AIM
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tantek though I do get about 1 spam/phish a month
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tantek which isn't too bad
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tantek I think I got 2 in the past month after a month of nothing
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GWG I have AIM hooked into IRC
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tantek nice
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tantek kylewm: that's a good capture of the issue
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tantek so for once we actually have a more concrete use-case of need to distinguish type of post
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GWG tantek: Things like Bitlbee are very useful in me not caring what platform I'm communicating on by unifying them all
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tantek beyond in-reply-to, u-like-of, u-repost-of
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tantek what is Bitlbee?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Bitlbee" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=Bitlbee
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GWG Which seems like a very Indieweb-type concept.
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GWG http://www.bitlbee.org/main.php/news.r.html
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kylewm.com edited /photos (+7) "/* Distinguishing Photos from Notes */ add link to /link-preview wiki page" (view diff)
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GWG Of course, Facebook is deprecating its XMPP Gateway on April 30, 2015. Google could do so any day, as they've sort of discontinued XMPP support with Hangouts...
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tantek kylewm - the last time we had the larger conversation about post types (and distinguishing) we came up with some of this: http://indiewebcamp.com/posts#Kinds_of_Posts
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GWG Thank you every platform for enticing the people I want to speak to in and then bricking up the wall behind them like the Cask of Amontillado.
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tantek specifically http://indiewebcamp.com/posts#Inferring_post_kinds_from_properties
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tantek "photo" is a good test case that's clearly forcing this issue
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GWG Okay, rant over there
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tantek what is the Cask of Amontillado?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "the Cask of Amontillado" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=the+Cask+of+Amontillado
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GWG tantek, do you actually want to know, or just testing if Loqi knows?
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Loqi yeah!
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kylewm tantek: "with an embedded image (via h-media?) -> photo", does that mean an h-media inside an h-entry?
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tantek kylewm - great question
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GWG Bitlbee is an IRC to chat network gateway
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tantek we got no further than that (?) comment
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GWG The Cask of Amontillado is a story by Edgar Allan Poe.
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tantek I don't think anyone is doing h-media embedding
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snarfed i kind of like GWG's proposal of h-as-image
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snarfed (or h-as-whatever)
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tantek snarfed - I'm not sure I do, and I came up with the h-as-* convention (by just using it in my posts as part of internal markup for /Falcon)
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tantek see: http://indiewebcamp.com/ActivityStreams#Use_with_microformats2
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snarfed tantek: sure. as usual w/markup, i don't really care, i'll implement whatever.
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GWG tantek: I liberated it.
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tantek GWG - hah - I put it on the wiki and thus CC0'd it ;)
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KartikPrabhu I agree with tantek about not upgrading h-as-* to actual mf2 markup
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GWG I liberated it from obscurity.
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david.shanske.com created /the_Cask_of_Amontillado (+560) "Created page with "The Cask of Amontillado is an 1846 short story written by Edgar Allan Poe. In the story, one of the characters is, while inebriated, chained to a wall and bricked up alive. Th..."" (view diff)
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david.shanske.com created /Bitlbee (+315) "Created page with "BitlBee is an IRC to other chat networks gateway. BitlBee currently supports the following IM networks/protocols: XMPP/Jabber (including Google Talk), MSN Messenger, Yahoo! Mess..."" (view diff)
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tantek ok aaronpk, we're going to need you on this u-photo discussion
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kylewm an additional wrinkle for the bridgy case, i'm not sure it's ever clear that you want to include a "link" at all?
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tantek you mean the permalink back to the original?
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kylewm sorry, link is the name of the facebook API parameter that makes it a different style of facebook post, with the link-preview at the bottom
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tantek oh bookmarks
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snarfed kylewm: we could make it explicitly opt in. if you leave the checkbox checked in the preview UI, or if you explicitly include a bridgy_omit_link=false in the webmention request (non standard, i know)
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snarfed https://www.brid.gy/about#omit-link
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tantek kylewm, snarfed, I have a dumb suggestion to solve this problem. out of band.
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tantek (at least for Bridgy Publish, for now)
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kylewm just to be clear, I'm talking about these options http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE_to_Facebook#How_we_got_here
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tantek (either at post-type as an explicit parameter to Bridgy Publish, or make a different Bridgy Publish API call for each post type)
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kylewm right now Bridgy includes a "note with inline citation link", adding a link-preview would make it "Note with text and link parameter"
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ScriptCodess Say, what is "Ae"?
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ScriptCodess related to gifs, it seems
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snarfed tantek: sure! sounds like an expansion of u-bridgy-omit-link in https://www.brid.gy/about#omit-link
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snarfed ok with me as long as we're actively figuring out the real mf2 solution
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tantek hello ScriptCodess what is the context of your question?
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tantek snarfed - we lack the publishing data/experience to come up with a good explicit markup solution
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kylewm ScriptCodess: After Effects icon perhaps?
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tantek hence the resistance to adopting the low-experience h-as-* class names
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ScriptCodess kylewm: thank you. That's it.
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tantek looks at some of the markup in IndieWeb Examples of /photos
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tantek kylewm - you provided this example of a note with a photo that is not a photo post, but I don't see any photo at all https://kylewm.com/note/2014/05/05/1
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kylewm !!
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kylewm tantek: thanks for pointing that out, please try again
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kylewm side note: autolinking is hard
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tantek oh hey there it is
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tantek and yes it is
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tantek kylewm - if you have autolinking test cases I'd be interested in seeing how well CASSIS.js auto_link did with them
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kylewm tantek: it's more of an anti-test case... most naive attempts of mine have tried to incorrecly link something in this post https://kylewm.com/note/2014/03/13/2
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tantek lol
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kylewm so i resorted to using BeautifulSoup to exclude <a>'s and <pre>'s altogether, and only try to link in regular textContent
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tantek interesting. I have code in my auto_link() to specifically *not* double link <a>s.
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tantek so you can literally run the output of my auto_link() on itself and it's idempotent
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KartikPrabhu kylewm: have you looked at Bleach for auto-linking? It does those smart thing afaik
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KartikPrabhu looks into Bundle code
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tantek snarfed, ironically your example of a "photo(s)" post lacks any u-photo markup
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tantek https://snarfed.org/draw_group
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snarfed tantek: true!
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snarfed i'm usually a very lagging indicator of markup
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tantek so a hypothetical h-entry reader would interpret that as an *article* based the fact that it has a *name*
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snarfed whereas a real human reader would interpret it as a collection of photos, because that's what it is :P
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tantek snarfed, right, it's a *collection* post, not a photo post ;)
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tantek a /collection as it were
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snarfed ah, i see what you mean. true
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tantek now explicit since aaronpk started posting /collection posts
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kylewm laughs at calling snarfed out on missing microformats on a post from 2003
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snarfed to his credit, sounds like i did add it as an example of something somewhere in the wiki :P
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tantek kylewm - the pages are fresh fried, not statically baked, hence it's reasonable
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snarfed the top two posts on my h-feed right now (https://snarfed.org/ ) are actually good examples of post-with-representative-photo vs photo-post
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snarfed not markup wise, but content wise
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kylewm KartikPrabhu: I did look at bleach but ... a) it is slooow (bc hard dependency on html5lib) and b) i wanted to handle special parsing for @usernames and stuff too
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KartikPrabhu kylewm: oh did not know about slowness... never testes
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KartikPrabhu err tested*
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KartikPrabhu 's language neurons are filled with math
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kylewm i can't say with any conviction, but it did come out near the top on the little bit of profiling i've done (i run comments through it)
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kylewm.com created /Bleach (+237) "added stub before anyone asks "What is Bleach"" (view diff)
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kylewm.com edited /Python (-39) "/* Third-party Libraries */ change to local reference" (view diff)
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kylewm.com edited /Bleach (+78) "add link to documentation" (view diff)
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KartikPrabhu kylewm: I'm sure there are many pieces of code that I've added without speed testing that slow my site down at the moment :(
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kylewm bah that's nothing to feel bad for. micro-benchmarks, premature optimization, all that
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KartikPrabhu kylewm: how do you speed test your code?
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tantek I run it on a sample JS page. If it's not instant, it gets rewritten
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tantek I can do this because it's CASSIS which runs in both JS and PHP. And I figure the server is running PHP faster than my browser is running JS.
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kylewm werkzeug (the server under Flask) has a built in Profiler middleware that just prints out how long a request spends in each method
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KartikPrabhu aah I see
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tantek on today's CPUs, unless you're doing 3D modeling or protein folding or megabytes of IO or something, your code to do pretty much anything should be instant. Zero human noticeable lag.
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KartikPrabhu ultimately I am just thinking of pre-processing everything into HTML that the templates can just grab and insert
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kylewm yeah... my site is not there yet :(
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tantek then again I don't use any of that OO crap
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KartikPrabhu tantek: yeah agreed
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KartikPrabhu tantek: hey don't hate on OO
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tantek OO is how you get massively nested call depths of impossible to debug code that all of a sudden gets mysteriously slow.
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KartikPrabhu :P
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kylewm hey you can write Java in any language
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kylewm I'm still coming to terms with Python "modules" that are basically just singletons
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KartikPrabhu Java-- wasted a couple of months learning that hell-crap
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Loqi Java has -12 karma
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tantek snarfed, your most recent "photo" post lacks u-photo as well: https://snarfed.org/2014-08-23_10387
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snarfed tantek: yes. i don't use u-photo markup yet.
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tantek snarfed, also FYI I am seeing the "mixed content blocked" shield on https://snarfed.org/draw_group - explained here: https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/how-does-content-isnt-secure-affect-my-safety
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snarfed tantek: yes, i know. my site isn't perfect wrt that yet. hard to do on a site with lots of old content; you'll see the same thing on lots of sites that convert to https. not a high priority for me right now.
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snarfed most more recent pages are ok though
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tantek ok good to know. thanks for being a trailblazer :)
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tantek well it appears that nearly all "photo" posts are using u-photo
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tantek from /photo#IndieWeb_Examples
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tantek and none of the "notes with photo" are
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tantek and even Aaronpk's recent articles with representative images are NOT using u-photo
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tantek so it appears folks have converged, whether organically or as a result of the "inmates" discussion earlier, on "u-photo" indicating a photo-post (or subtype thereof)
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tantek one fascinating exception: http://aaronparecki.com/notes/2014/05/06/3/iiw-indieweb
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tantek has both u-photo and a p-location h-card *venue* which we had previously decided mean it was a *checkin*
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tantek s/mean/meant
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Loqi tantek meant to say: has both u-photo and a p-location h-card *venue* which we had previously decided meant it was a *checkin*
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tantek since the p-location is a property of the h-entry itself, rather than say being a property of an h-photo (on u-photo) inside the h-entry, I think it makes sense to stick with p-location h-card = checkin
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tantek whereas if you wanted to "tag" the location of the photo itself, there must be some other object nested inside the u-photo which would have such information. E.g. especially if you have multiple u-photo values, it would/could make sense for them each to have a different physical venue, even if they were part of the same post.
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KartikPrabhu tantek: I would attribute the convergence to the inmates discussion. If there is a better/simpler markup I am all for it
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tantek KartikPrabhu: it's unlikely that that many different people with such different sites and methods/styles of posting and implementations would converge on something unless it worked particularly well
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tantek as inmates or not ;)
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kylewm so tantek: how would you describe the difference between a photo post and a note with a representative photo post?
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tantek a photo post has one or more u-photo properties of the h-entry
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tantek according to discussion here and very consistent usage in examples
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tantek there is no current method of inferring a representative photo of a note or other type of post
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KartikPrabhu tantek: first u-photo = representative photo?
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tantek KartikPrabhu: unlikely. In a photo(s) post, typically if there is more than one photo in the post, the "representative photo" is a thumbnail generated from a grid of all the photos.
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kylewm tantek: disregarding markup, what's the difference between the two post types though? like if "a note is a short plain-text article without a title", is a photo "a note with a photo" or...?
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tantek kylewm hard to argue/discuss that in theory (or rather you quickly get into architecture astronomy)
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tantek better to discuss using actual examples of a note with a photo vs. a photo post
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tantek.com edited /posts (+913) "/* Inferring post kinds from properties */ u-photo -> photo post. but p-location with venue makes it a checkin regardless. also note p-rsvp, u-like-of, u-repost-of implying post types." (view diff)
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kylewm just wondering if there is a difference at all, i'm not convinced there is
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tantek in terms of how people actually publish? there definitely is - see the existing /photo#IndieWeb_Examples
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tantek and the notes with photos below them
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tantek kylewm you yourself posted a note with photo!
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tantek the one you fixed!
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kylewm the only distinction i can think of is if the caption serves the picture (--> photo) or picture serves the text (--> note)
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tantek right, what's the primary subject of the post? the photo? or the text?
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kylewm I did, I argued that side in the inmates debate :)
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KartikPrabhu thinks that is sort of arbitrary
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tantek kylewm a-ha that makes sense then
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tantek KartikPrabhu: I have notes with auto-embedded images all the time, often not from my site. They are all notes with images/photos. None of them are "photo posts"
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KartikPrabhu tantek: is there a difference in how I post them? or when someone views them?
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tantek KartikPrabhu: in practice both
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KartikPrabhu hmmm examples?
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KartikPrabhu i don't think there is a diff when viewing at least
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tantek photo posts today are typically actual photographs you've taken, often quite recently (like even as part of the posting process)
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tantek viewing is the easiest difference
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tantek look at how silos present photo posts vs. notes/links with little link-preview images.
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KartikPrabhu again seems like an arbitrary choice
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tantek KartikPrabhu: the examples look *very* different
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KartikPrabhu well I am fine with calling it whatever
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tantek actual publishing examples
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tantek e.g. note with representative photo: https://www.facebook.com/tantek.celik/posts/10101245413498163
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KartikPrabhu my problem is I have never been able to decide "this will be a photo post" and "this will be a note with photos" while I am posting
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tantek as well as the original post that was POSSEd from http://tantek.com/2014/238/t3/tough-trackattack-relay-did-all - also a note with an embedded photo
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KartikPrabhu if others can do that then well...
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tantek KartikPrabhu: sounds lik you only have a UI that's conducive to notes then
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tantek photo posting UIs are typically centered around taking a photo
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KartikPrabhu tantek: not about UIs
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tantek in practice it is
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tantek here's another test you can apply
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tantek if you only have time to post half of it
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tantek do you care more that the photo gets posted
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tantek or the text note gets posted
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tantek first
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tantek and then eventually you can add the other half
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tantek as a thought experiment
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KartikPrabhu that is my point... I don't see them as more important or not
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KartikPrabhu I don't consider these as different "types" : https://kartikprabhu.com/notes/owen-engine https://kartikprabhu.com/article/lights-nyc https://kartikprabhu.com/article/mahabaleshwar-panchgani for instance
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tantek I bet in actual situations you will feel strongly about one or the other being more important to publish
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tantek this is clearly an article, has more structure etc.: https://kartikprabhu.com/article/mahabaleshwar-panchgani
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tantek including name
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KartikPrabhu I could add or skip name on any of them
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tantek but you didn't
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tantek the point is not what you could have done
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tantek the point is what you *did* do
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tantek this is a collection: https://kartikprabhu.com/article/lights-nyc
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KartikPrabhu because I am testing out this note/article with photo distinction
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KartikPrabhu I should start posting notes with titles :P
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Loqi it is probable
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KartikPrabhu lol
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tantek this is a photo that could be a check-in if you linked/marked up "At @owenandengine.com" accordingly but it is only a photo for now. https://kartikprabhu.com/notes/owen-engine
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tantek KartikPrabhu: a note with an explicit name would likely be interpreted as the name (title) merely being the first part of the note.
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KartikPrabhu hmmm
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KartikPrabhu is still confused
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tantek KartikPrabhu: the point is not to try to test things out just to see if you can cause confusion (even in yourself)
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KartikPrabhu tantek: not to cause confusion but to see what people mean by this distinction...
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tantek the point is to document existing behaviors (i.e. how / what people post on silos and how they are presented differently) and make sure we can do the same
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tantek on our own sites
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KartikPrabhu possibly...
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KevinMarks Hm, I wonder if I can make a "save to homepage" app of irc today before it redirects
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tantek no definitely, if your goal is to "see what people mean by this distinction"
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tantek KevinMarks http://indiewebcamp.com/irc#Logs_on_Your_iPhone_Home_Screen
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KartikPrabhu tantek: which is why I have been following the convention on this mostly... but not sure I like it
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tantek KartikPrabhu: if you want to better understand "what people mean by this distinction", document more silo examples of different post types, with screenshots and permalinks
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KevinMarks IPhone?
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tantek should work anywhere KevinMarks
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KartikPrabhu .me is on less silos that most people here :P
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tantek KartikPrabhu: you can document other people's silo posts too
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tantek and plenty of /silos to choose from to do your research
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kylewm so practically is the main use case for finding "representative photo" the posse-to-facebook one?
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tantek kylewm /link-preview is the use-case
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tantek which is something LOTS of sites do
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tantek Facebook (via OGP or algorithms), Twitter (via Twitter Cards, OGP), Google Rich Snippets (via microformats etc.), Pinterest (via their own algorithms)
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kylewm OK, so I think the field is wide open if someone wants to start publishing u-representative-photo or something
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tantek I wonder if newspapers have a term for the representative photo that accompanies an article.
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kylewm I would be into displaying them in bookmarks posts, and maybe in reply-contxts
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tantek we're not the first to think of this concept
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tantek so let's see what existing usage calls it
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tantek kylewm - precisely!
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tantek plenty of uses of /link-preview s like that
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KevinMarks That worked. Facebook makes a distinction between photo post and with photo
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KevinMarks Also between an explicitly shared link and an incidental link
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tantek yes of course it does
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KevinMarks Let me find their page, was reading this yesterday
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tantek that's my point. now document screenshots of those for side-by-side comparison
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tantek the AS community made this same analysis, but failed to actually document their work
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KevinMarks Will do, when I'm on computer not phone
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tantek no lab notebook, no credit for science :P
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KevinMarks Which is now painful as it's being randomly rebikeshedded
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KevinMarks "let's abolish url" this week
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tantek that's the penalty of not documenting your work
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tantek it means others who also have not documented their work can play pseudo-science politics with you
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tantek ok kylewm, snarfed, KartikPrabhu, aaronpk and whoever else "conspired" ;) to make u-photo mean "photo post", your real world publishing efforts have not gone unnoticed.
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kylewm lol
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tantek h-entry spec updated accordingly http://microformats.org/wiki/h-entry - u-photo promoted from "proposed" to "experimental properties in use in the wild", along with the change in meaning from representative photo of the post to this is a photo post.
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KartikPrabhu crap! that messes up my thumbnails for articles!
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KevinMarks Activity Streams wiki was not well gardened
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KartikPrabhu thanks to myself and others, my articles feed is now a feed of photo posts!
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KevinMarks Partly my fault as I was trying not to visibly contribute as getting OWFa through BT legal didn't go well with
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tantek KevinMarks not your fault in the least. It's because they had/used a mailing list and thus got distracted by having ephemeral arguments on it
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tantek instead of actually spending their time documenting ideas, iterations, consensus on the wiki
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tantek this is the natural consequence of nearly every community with a mailing list
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tantek since in the short term, posting quick things on a mailing list is "easier" because you don't have to try to integrate productively with others' work
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KevinMarks And lots of face to face meetings that didn't necessarily feed into the wiki
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tantek all you have to do is post your own screen
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tantek s/screen/screed
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Loqi tantek meant to say: all you have to do is post your own screed
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tantek or worse, go into confrontation by default mode with email replies
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KevinMarks So should we redo that work?
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KevinMarks Given site deaths it should be easier now
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tantek KevinMarks: we both have no choice, as any scientists who have to redo the work of alchemists who didn't document their work, and we *ARE* redoing this work with a document-it-as-you-implement it practical self-dog-food culture
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tantek it's also why we've come up with far simpler methods/approaches - that happens when you're forced to implement it if you want it
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tantek as opposed to being forced to come to some political consensus with non-implementers
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tantek KartikPrabhu: your homework assignment/mission, should you choose to accept it, is to research what do newspapers call the photo they sometimes post with an article - do they have a special name for it like "representative photo"
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tantek you may use any means at your disposal, including directly contacting Jeremy Zilar at the New York Times who has done research into the different names for the different sizes of headings for example
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tantek (a shortcut would be to hack/reuse "icon" or "logo" as a property, e.g. u-icon or u-logo, but those don't exactly mean "representative photo" so we may be doing ourselves a disservice there)
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KevinMarks Thumbnail?
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KevinMarks Icon isn't bad
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tantek KevinMarks: guessing at bikeshedding before researching existing use is bad form/methodology, hence why I explicitly warned against that shortcut.
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tantek !tell snarfed,kylewm one more (hopefully minor this time) Bridgy Publish to FB request. Could I have it say "Originally published at: PostPermalinkURL" instead of "(PostPermalinkURL)" at end of FB POSSE copy? Trying for more human-friendly (paren syntax was intended for Twitter where chars are tight).
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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KartikPrabhu tantek_ extensive searching found nothing :(
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KartikPrabhu hero image :P
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KartikPrabhu The Guardian calls it photograph/graphic: http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-files/Guardian/documents/2011/08/26/EducCentNewsterminology.pdf
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KevinMarks Google+ calls it full bleed image for a photo post and thumbnail image for what Tantek calls representative photo https://developers.google.com/+/web/snippet/article-rendering
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@kaffeeringe Do it! Meine To-Do-Liste fürs Indie-Netz #indieweb #posse http://www.konradlischka.info/2014/08/blog/do-it-meine-to-do-liste-fuers-indie-netz/ (twitter.com/_/status/504549816433512448)
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@wolfwitte RT @kaffeeringe: Do it! Meine To-Do-Liste fürs Indie-Netz #indieweb #posse http://www.konradlischka.info/2014/08/blog/do-it-meine-to-do-liste-fuers-indie-netz/ (twitter.com/_/status/504551267491139584)
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@coldheat RT @kopfzeiler: Bemerkenswerte Entwicklung, auch semantisch: Self-hosting heißt jetzt #IndieWeb. http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2014/04/25/indiewebcamps_create_tools_for_a_new_internet.html (twitter.com/_/status/504553531186360320)
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KevinMarks_ Check out @0x0acebabe's Tweet: https://twitter.com/0x0acebabe/status/504562917874728960
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@0x0acebabe @kevinmarks "every social network will eventually contain a slow, informally specified, bug-ridden implementation of LJ friend permissions" (twitter.com/_/status/504562917874728960)
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channy.creation.net created /ko (+2593) "/* main page for Korean */" (view diff)
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channy.creation.net edited /ko (+67) "/* add events for Korean */" (view diff)
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channy.creation.net created /ko/Getting_Started (+7655) "/* Add the first translation */" (view diff)
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@LongHandPixels @rubenlightfoot @aral no offense, but that analogy makes no sense. The #indieweb predates @Medium by what? 25 years? Silos are new. (twitter.com/_/status/504607454463033344)
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@LongHandPixels @rubenlightfoot @aral I think the #indieweb is more like emacs to the silos' sublime text. In ten years i'd bet emacs will still be around. (twitter.com/_/status/504607781018943488)
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@rubenlightfoot @LongHandPixels @aral not sure mass-accessibility has yet been achieved by #indieweb and that's the real problem. (twitter.com/_/status/504613447171309571)
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@LongHandPixels @rubenlightfoot be sure to check out http://indiewebcamp.com/ and if you use IRC: #indiewebcamp lots of smart people talking about this stuff. (twitter.com/_/status/504620622685564928)
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Loqi [mention] https://github.com/sebsauvage/Shaarli/pull/201 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/ (webmention)
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barnabywalters wow, the start of a korean translation! awesome!
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ben_thatmustbeme good morning
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waterpigs.co.uk created /Livejournal (+24) "Redirected page to [[LiveJournal]]" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme very cool. korean translation, very cool
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@aral @LongHandPixels I can’t speak for #indieweb as ind.ie is not affiliated, however http:///manifesto/ is all about UX. +@rubenlightfoot (twitter.com/_/status/504631410205134848)
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@LongHandPixels @aral @rubenlightfoot no one can speak for #indieweb, that’s the point :). But yes, without good UX nothing indie has a chance against silos (twitter.com/_/status/504634218278682626)
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@fdevillamil @fredwilson True. Keeping your personal #indieweb space of expression is one of the most important thing to remember on the Web. (twitter.com/_/status/504636160367681537)
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snarfed is anyone using microformats to represent a push notification yet?
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Loqi snarfed: tantek left you a message 7 hours, 31 minutes ago: one more (hopefully minor this time) Bridgy Publish to FB request. Could I have it say "Originally published at: PostPermalinkURL" instead of "(PostPermalinkURL)" at end of FB POSSE copy? Trying for more human-friendly (paren syntax was intended for Twitter where chars are tight).
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snarfed i'm currently generating facebook notifications via this api: https://developers.facebook.com/docs/games/notifications/#impl
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snarfed (code here: https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/tree/master/facebook.py#L171 )
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snarfed and i'm wondering if there's any existing mf2 i could translate to that
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snarfed tantek_: sure! will do
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Loqi [mention] http://werd.io/2014/reflecting-on-fredwilsons-swing-back-to-personal-sites-which-is linked to http://indiewebcamp.com (webmention)
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aaronpk goooood morning lots of catching up here
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barnabywalters snarfed: h-feed would be the place to start — some of us use h-feeds for our mentions, which is close to a notification list e.g. http://aaronparecki.com/mentions
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aaronpk snarfed: closest thing I've done is described how this app would work http://indiewebcamp.com/mention-app
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snarfed thanks guys
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gRegor` KartikPrabhu: Still on for tonight?
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neuro` Good morning.
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@calum_ryan @onishiweb good spot. I can't be @dconstruct this year :( but hope it's good. Will be in Brighton for @IndieWebCampUK the following day (twitter.com/_/status/504661513828061184)
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ben_thatmustbeme good morning, all.. seems rather quiet thus far
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@onishiweb @calum_ryan @dconstruct I have high hopes, and expect they’ll be blown away too :) Enjoy @IndieWebCampUK (twitter.com/_/status/504662068352786433)
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tantek.com moved /ko to /Main_Page-ko "please see [[how-to-start-new-translation]]. And thanks for starting this!"
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tantek.com moved /ko/Getting_Started to /Getting_Started-ko "please see [[how-to-start-new-translation]]. And thanks for starting this!"
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@merlinrebrovic Very interesting talk about escaping web silos "Tantek Çelik - The once and future IndieWeb" https://www.youtube.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/504662661699608576)
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gRegor` Morning, neuro`, ben_thatmustbeme
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gRegor` and the rest of indiewebcamp that's awake
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tantek.com edited /Main_Page (+61) "/* Translations */ +Korean!" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /other-languages (+62) "/* translations ordered by number of articles */ +Korean!" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Bitlbee (+94) "stub, dfn, lists" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Bitlbee (+22) "link to home page" (view diff)
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tantek.com moved /Bitlbee to /BitlBee "canonical capitalization"
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tantek.com created /bitlbee (+21) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /the_Cask_of_Amontillado (+325) "dfn, linky linky, hotlink wikipedia image" (view diff)
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tantek.com moved /the_Cask_of_Amontillado to /The_Cask_of_Amontillado "capitalize The"
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@ShaneHudson @onishiweb Are you staying for @IndieWebCampUK too Adam? I am :) Should be good! cc @calum_ryan (twitter.com/_/status/504665812276613120)
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gRegor` what is the Cask of Amontillado?
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Loqi The Cask of Amontillado is an 1846 short story written by Edgar Allan Poe http://indiewebcamp.com/The_Cask_of_Amontillado
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gRegor` Hah
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gRegor` what is Bitlbee
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Loqi BitlBee is a communication gateway from IRC to other chat http://indiewebcamp.com/BitlBee
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gRegor` I had not dug far enough into Bitlbee to realize it did Twitter API. Might have to try that out.
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gRegor` Bitlbee => indieweb post could be cool.
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gRegor` Post notes directly from IRC.
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bret gRegor` bitlbee to micropub
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bret ha
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gRegor` Yep
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bret i should do that
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Loqi I agree
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gregorlove.com edited /BitlBee (+117) "Bitlbee to micropub idea" (view diff)
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gRegor` wikified
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aaronpk whoa someone made a korean version of the home page? http://indiewebcamp.com/Main_Page-ko
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gRegor` Yep. And /Getting_Started
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aaronpk wow, awesome
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@onishiweb @ShaneHudson @IndieWebCampUK @calum_ryan no plans to at the moment, not really my scene, probably stay and catch up with friends :) (twitter.com/_/status/504668881320181760)
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bret.io edited /BitlBee (+106) "/* Ideas */ Webmention notifications" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /The_Cask_of_Amontillado (+94) "expand dfn to include context of why it is documented here on IWC" (view diff)
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bret that was the most screwed up poe story
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tantek.com created /the_cask_of_amontillado (+37) "r lowercase" (view diff)
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bret haha
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aaronpk just noticed that all the links on the ko page are ko/* vs the fr pages which are *-fr
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Loqi awesome
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tantek what is the cask of amontillado?
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Loqi The Cask of Amontillado is an 1846 short story written by Edgar Allan Poe in which a character is chained to a wall and walled up, analogous to many silo practices http://indiewebcamp.com/The_Cask_of_Amontillado
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tantek aaronpk will fix
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aaronpk I think the what is search is not case sensitive
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tantek WHAT IS THE CASK OF AMONTILLADO?
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Loqi The Cask of Amontillado is an 1846 short story written by Edgar Allan Poe in which a character is chained to a wall and walled up, analogous to many silo practices http://indiewebcamp.com/The_Cask_of_Amontillado
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aaronpk hahahaha
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tantek nice
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tantek.com edited /Main_Page-ko (+0) "use *-ko instead of ko/* per [[how-to-start-new-translation#Page_naming_convention]]" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Getting_Started-ko (+0) "use *-ko instead of ko/* per [[how-to-start-new-translation#Page_naming_convention]]" (view diff)
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aaronpk I do like having the /ko URL as the main page for that language
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aaronpk nicer URL to share
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aaronparecki.com created /fr (+25) "add /fr redirect to french main page" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk, agreed
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bret aaronpk whats a good time to get to esri?
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aaronpk bret: 6ish?
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bret k
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@kevinmarks “the personal blog, yourname•com, where you control everything and get to do whatever the hell pleases you” http://avc.com/2014/08/the-personal-blog/ #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/504674367565869056)
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aaronpk KevinMarks_: nice
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aaronpk my favorite quote
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aaronpk "I wanted to reply to that comment, but could not for the life of me, log into WordPress to leave it. So I’ll blog about it instead."
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tantek THIS: "I wanted to reply to that comment, but could not for the life of me, log into WordPress to leave it. So I’ll blog about it instead."
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tantek haha yeah aaronpk
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aaronpk so good
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aaronpk need a good blockquote style for p3k
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tantek !tell snarfed can you reach out to Elizabeth http://elizabethspiers.com/2014/08/25/here-i-go-again-on-my-own/ and get her setup with IndieWeb WordPress plugins so we can bring her up to speed on what blogs are like in 2014?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek aaronpk - see Tumblr's "quote" post type for good blockquote styling examples
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aaronpk yes!
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aaronpk this is why I have a tumblr account, for testing stuff like this
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aaronpk http://miniblog.aaron.pk/post/95923053596/i-wanted-to-reply-to-that-comment-but-could-not
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@kevinmarks “I miss being able to engage other people online in discussions that are actually productive.” @espiers http://elizabethspiers.com/2014/08/25/here-i-go-again-on-my-own/ #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/504675650943582208)
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gRegor` !tell snarfed Getting 401 Unauthorized on bridgy publish: https://www.brid.gy/log?start_time=1409159114&key=aglzfmJyaWQtZ3lyUAsSDVB1Ymxpc2hlZFBhZ2UiKWh0dHA6Ly9ncmVnb3Jsb3ZlLmNvbS9ub3Rlcy8yMDE0LzA4LzI3LzQvDAsSB1B1Ymxpc2gYgICAgICumQoM
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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aaronpk it would be great if indienews also presented quotes like kevin posts better
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aaronpk http://news.indiewebcamp.com/post/aaronparecki.com/notes/2014/08/27/1/
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aaronpk I really like KevinMarks_'s plaintext format for quotes. I wonder if that could be parsed out automatically and styled better on my ow nsite
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tantek aaronpk, you could add it as a microformats.org/wiki/picoformat
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aaronpk yes that's the word I was looking for
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aaronpk http://microformats.org/wiki/picoformats
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tantek aaronpk I tumblr reblogged your quote post just to see what that would look like
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aaronpk interesting
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aaronpk http://tantek.tumblr.com/post/95923505660/i-wanted-to-reply-to-that-comment-but-could-not
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tantek I don't like the way it shows up - it doesn't credit you as a /repost should IMO
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tantek via is insufficient
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aaronpk and it looks different still in my tumblr dashboard http://aaronparecki.com/uploads/tumblr-20140827-101259.png
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aaronpk agreed, "via" makes it look hand-typed
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tantek yeah - follow my Tumblr and see how it looks even worse when I reblog it
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aaronpk and often "via" posts have original content by the poster, not strictly a repost
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tantek in your dashboard view of my reblog of your quote post
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aaronpk http://aaronparecki.com/uploads/tumblr-reblog-20140827-101414.png
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tantek right - it makes it look like I'm saying it which I'm not
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tantek doubly indirectly so even
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tantek ok since you've made both those screenshots, that's worthy of adding to http://indiewebcamp.com/Tumblr#Criticisms
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aaronpk needs to get to work on his repost post types
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aaronpk I have a pretty good idea of how I want to show things now, and I have a feeling it will stir up a lot of discussion
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tantek Poor Repost Presentation
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tantek and Poor Quote Post Presentation
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KevinMarks Twitter had that problem too
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tantek Tumblr gets so many other UX things right that it's worth documenting when they screw up UX/Presentation
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tantek KevinMarks: Twitter retweets are much less problematic
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tantek native retweets that is - that preserve the original poster's icon
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KevinMarks I should make a tool for doing this that generates an image too
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aaronpk an image?
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tantek.com created /respot (+20) "typo" (view diff)
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Loqi yea
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gRegor` aaronpk: Does your setup allow you to post quotes like that in a <blockquote>?
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aaronpk not yet
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aaronpk Now i'm considering a picoformat match for quotes and doing that automatically
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aaronpk kind of like the autolinker for plaintext notes
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tantek.com edited /Tumblr (+422) "/* Criticisms */ bad presentation in Tumblr, who knew? quote posts are hard, reposts are hard" (view diff)
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gRegor` Nice
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gRegor` The tumblr cross-post is a "quote" format, thought, right? Or is that just a text note?
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aaronpk I posted a "quote" post on tumblr
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aaronparecki.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:tumblr-quote-post-aaronpk.png]]""
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gRegor` Makes sense.
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aaronparecki.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:tumblr-quote-reblog.png]]""
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tantek.com edited /Tumblr (+3) "move Downtime inside criticisms, move TOC out of the way of images" (view diff)
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tantek awesome aaronpk. http://indiewebcamp.com/Tumblr#Poor_Quote_Post_Presentation is all yours. edit token reliquished. :)
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gRegor` An auto-quoter that extracts the author name from the cited URL's author would be cool.
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aaronparecki.com edited /Tumblr (-53) "use local images" (view diff)
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aaronpk :)
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tantek gRegor`: and automatically links the <blockquote cite> to the fragmention of the quote
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aaronpk gRegor`: yeah totally. was thinking about doing that for page title as well for my bookmarks
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gRegor` s/author/h-card/
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Loqi gRegor` meant to say: An auto-quoter that extracts the h-card name from the cited URL's h-card would be cool.
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aaronpk tho now i'm reconsidering what exactly a bookmark means on my site, since a lot of them would look like blockquote posts
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gRegor` Ooh, yeah tantek.
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tantek ah I'd called it /quotation when I documented this before
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aaronpk example post: http://aaron.pk/bookmarks/?bookmark=protocols-dont-mean-much
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tantek.com edited /quotation (+88) "/* How to markup */ ideally using a fragmention" (view diff)
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snarfed gRegor`: looks like the 401 is because you're replying to someone whose account is protected, which bridgy can't do (unless that person signs up for bridgy too)
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Loqi snarfed: tantek left you a message 22 minutes ago: can you reach out to Elizabeth http://elizabethspiers.com/2014/08/25/here-i-go-again-on-my-own/ and get her setup with IndieWeb WordPress plugins so we can bring her up to speed on what blogs are like in 2014?
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aaronpk oh hey that page links to a bunch of my bookmark posts already
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tantek aaronpk - already http://indiewebcamp.com/quotation#IndieWeb_Examples :)
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Loqi snarfed: gRegor` left you a message 18 minutes ago: Getting 401 Unauthorized on bridgy publish: https://www.brid.gy/log?start_time=1409159114&key=aglzfmJyaWQtZ3lyUAsSDVB1Ymxpc2hlZFBhZ2UiKWh0dHA6Ly9ncmVnb3Jsb3ZlLmNvbS9ub3Rlcy8yMDE0LzA4LzI3LzQvDAsSB1B1Ymxpc2gYgICAgICumQoM
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snarfed gRegor`: the error message could be better though. mind filing an issue? https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues
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snarfed tantek: sure! i'd just make happy noises and link her to /WordPress#Adding_Indieweb_Support.2FElements_to_a_Wordpress_Site, but i'm happy to do that
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tantek snarfed - that would be GREAT
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eliemichel aaronpk: I see that you use a wordpress blog to store your bookmarks. Do you know about Shaarli?
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tantek regardless of the outcome, we will learn from the engagement
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aaronpk eliemichel: yes I think I tried out shaarli at one point!
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tantek waits to see /bookmark posts get higher up on aaronpk's Itches list ;)
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eliemichel I added a pull request for Shaarli to send webmention 3h ago ;)
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tantek.com created /quote (+23) "r" (view diff)
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aaronpk eliemichel: NICE!
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aaronpk eliemichel++
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Loqi eliemichel has 2 karma
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tantek eliemichel awesome!
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tantek what is Shaarli?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Shaarli" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=Shaarli
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@gasull WordPress ported to Sandstorm.io https://blog.sandstorm.io/news/2014-08-18-wordpress.html https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/sandstorm-io-personal-cloud-platform https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/sandstorm-io-personal-cloud-platform/x/5184124 #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/504681513771073536)
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eliemichel tantek: it's little web-program you can install to store & share your bookmarks
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eliemichel http://sebsauvage.net/wiki/doku.php?id=php:shaarli
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tantek.com edited /Tumblr (+29) "/* Mapping of Tumblr post types to ActivityStreams */ linky linky" (view diff)
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aaronpk heh my bookmarks issue already has a comment about making sure quotations are handled referencing that page https://github.com/aaronpk/p3k/issues/19#issuecomment-46062652
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aaronpk clearly I have gone down this train of thought before
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tantek eliemichel: great! could you create /Sharli accordingly by clicking that link that Loqi posted above?
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Loqi grins profusely
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eliemichel the last one?
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aaronpk the "it looks like..." line
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tantek.com edited /Tumblr (+12) "/* Criticisms */ morelinky" (view diff)
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tantek eliemichel: yes that one
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tantek.com created /reblogs (+20) "r" (view diff)
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bret listening to http://web.archive.org/web/20130729205352id_/http://itc.conversationsnetwork.org/shows/detail1155.html
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eliemichel tantek: what exactly do you intend me to do actually?
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eliemichel sry…
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tantek eliemichel: click the link to create the page and then copy paste the description of Shaarli that you typed here in IRC - that's fine to start a stub with
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tantek see http://indiewebcamp.com/start_a_page for more on how to start a page
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eliemichel okey =)
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tantek aaronpk see also http://indiewebcamp.com/microsyntax
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tantek.com edited /microsyntax (+12) "/* See Also */ posse" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /POSSE (+58) "/* Related */ microsyntax" (view diff)
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gRegor` snarfed: Done. https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/268
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snarfed gRegor`++
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snarfed gRegornobacktick++
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Loqi gRegornobacktick has 12 karma
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gRegor` Hehe
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Loqi [mention] https://snarfed.org/2014-08-27_here-i-go-again-on-my-own-elizabeth-spiers linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/ (webmention)
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tantek.com edited /microsyntax (+89) "subheads on brainstorming" (view diff)
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aaronparecki.com created /quotations (+22) "r" (view diff)
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aaronpk tantek: lol I was just adding those subheads
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gRegor` snarfed: Is that a privacy concern issue, or does the Twitter API not allow retrieving the tweet ID since it's private?
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aaronpk yours are better tho
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snarfed gRegor`: i believe the latter
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gRegor` I guess it's the latter. That would make sense.
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snarfed gRegor`: i don't even try to retrieve it, just create a reply to it, but still
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gRegor` Otheriwse you could harass private accounts
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gRegor` given their tweet URLs
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exppad.com created /Shaarli (+486) "Add Shaarli page" (view diff)
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snarfed gRegor`: eh you can harass private accounts anyway, just @ mention them
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snarfed but yeah
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aaronparecki.com edited /microsyntax (+1088) "/* Brainstorming */ add quotations section with examples and list of plaintext components of a quotation" (view diff)
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gRegor` True. "blocked" and "private" got crossed in my mind.
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gRegor` coffee++
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Loqi coffee has 20 karma
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tantek.com edited /note (+252) "/* Picoformats */ microsyntax for local thoughts" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com edited /projects (-159) "/* Shaarli */ Removed my 'interest' note; not likely to happen anytime soon. :) Linked to new wiki page." (view diff)
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gRegor` Shaarli is also at http://indiewebcamp.com/projects#Shaarli Feel free to merge this into the new page as necessary
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tantek.com edited /exercise (+131) "POSSE" (view diff)
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eliemichel gRegor`: thx
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tantek oh this is interesting it looks like http://elizabethspiers.com/ is on Tumblr
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gRegor` And also can list yourself there if you're running Shaarli, eliemichel :)
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aaronpk tantek: looks like wordpress to me, I have the wordpress header there when I click it
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tantek no I am mistaken. I was confused by a very Tumblr looking (+) Follow button in the lower right corner
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gregorlove.com created /del.icio.us (+23) "r" (view diff)
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KartikPrabhu gRegor`: yup!
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tantek hahahaha http://avc.com/2014/08/the-personal-blog/#disqus_thread "So why aren't they on Disqus? If they want a community to flourish, Disqus is a better lubricator than Wordpress comments. " ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?
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gRegor` what is folksonomy?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "folksonomy" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=folksonomy
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aaronpk just noticed the old delicious is still up at http://icio.us/ even though it says it will be shutdown(sic) by April 2014
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gRegor` Ha!
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gRegor` Wait, which old delicious? old-old delicious? or old-old-old**short circuits**
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tantek better: "what's the difference between Facebook which has a business of using your data to drive ads and Disqus which is in the exact business?"
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tantek http://avc.com/2014/08/the-personal-blog/#comment-1561544970
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snarfed (tantek: aaronpk: she's actually on wp.com, which is why i only linked her to bridgy, not plugins or anything else)
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gRegor` betterer: "When I send my URL (www.arnoldwaldstein.com) to new clients and and say--this is me--it feels just great each and every time." http://avc.com/2014/08/the-personal-blog/#comment-1561441162
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tantek I'm waiting for KevinMarks to take these quotes we're finding and tweet them as nicely as he does
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exppad.com edited /projects (+124) "/* Diaspora */" (view diff)
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bret What is WebDAV?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "WebDAV" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=WebDAV
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ben_thatmustbeme what is shaarli
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Loqi Shaarli is a simple web program you can install to store and share your bookmarks http://indiewebcamp.com/Shaarli
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aaronparecki.com edited /p3k (+12) "/* Backwards-Compatible Support */ linky" (view diff)
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exppad.com edited /Shaarli (+422) (view diff)
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bret does anyone here use / have used webDAV for anything?
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aaronpk bret: yes, see http://indiewebcamp.com/p3k##WebDAV
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bret which apps that you use have webdav?
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aaronpk Skitch
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aaronpk (old version)
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bret heh cool
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aaronpk and Finder
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aaronpk but I don't use it from Finder often
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exppad.com edited /projects (+65) "/* Shaarli */" (view diff)
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tantek snarfed - is there a missing reply context on https://snarfed.org/2014-08-27_here-i-go-again-on-my-own-elizabeth-spiers ?
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KevinMarks http://www.savepublishing.com is good too
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aaronpk tantek: his site doesn't show the in-reply-to URL or reply context because of a wordpress issue
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tantek the "welcome back!" at the start seems out of context - to whom?
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tantek aaronpk, is there a plugin for that?
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tantek ;)
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tantek oops
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KevinMarks Switch site-deathed my images :(
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tantek !tell snarfed snarfed - is there a missing reply context on https://snarfed.org/2014-08-27_here-i-go-again-on-my-own-elizabeth-spiers ? the "welcome back!" at the start seems out of context - to whom?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek what is Switch?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Switch" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=Switch
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aaronpk i think that's the problem... plugins can't add things to the theme or something
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snarfed tantek: we've had this conversation two or three times before :P
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Loqi snarfed: tantek left you a message 18 seconds ago: snarfed - is there a missing reply context on https://snarfed.org/2014-08-27_here-i-go-again-on-my-own-elizabeth-spiers ? the "welcome back!" at the start seems out of context - to whom?
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KevinMarks s/Switch/Skitch/
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Loqi KevinMarks meant to say: Skitch site-deathed my images :(
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aaronpk snarfed: can you document on /Wordpress so we don't keep asking?
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aaronpk :)
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tantek what is Skitch?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Skitch" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=Skitch
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snarfed aaronpk: it's more an issue with my site than wordpress
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aaronpk hm
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tantek looks for http://indiewebcamp.com/User:Snarfed.org#FAQ ;)
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snarfed or maybe with me personally :P proper reply contexts just aren't a big itch for me
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snarfed hah. tantek, if i documented that kind of thing anywhere, it'd be on my site, not on the wiki :P
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tantek looks for https://snarfed.org/faq
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snarfed it's a good nudge! worth writing up
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snarfed this is definitely a big reason my replies aren't easy for visitors to stumble across: they're not particularly good
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tantek snarfed, how did you do this? http://elizabethspiers.com/2014/08/25/here-i-go-again-on-my-own/#comment-5350
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snarfed er, make that, why i intentionally don't make them easy to stumble across
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snarfed tantek: how did i do what?
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tantek without her changing her blog to support webmentions + microformats?
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snarfed manual
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tantek oh man, I thought maybe you had added a Bridgy Publish Reply to Wordpress blog feature
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tantek just as you have a Bridgy Publish Reply to Facebook post feature
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snarfed good feature request!
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snarfed assuming the api lets you do that without the site owner approving the app. not sure.
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exppad.com created /User:Exppad.com (+410) "Created page with "When I discoverd the word of blogging, you though it would be nice to have it a little more "social". For example, being aware of who quote us, or being able to react to other pe..."" (view diff)
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tantek snarfed - curious why your manual comment on her post didn't link to the permalink of your reply on snarfed.org
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snarfed tantek: partly because i usually omit them when they don't have anything extra, and partly because i'm lazy :P
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tantek seemed like a teachable moment, that's all
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tantek whoa the post she links to has a screenshot of IE5/Mac! http://lockhartsteele.com/blog/2014/08/back-to-the-blog/
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snarfed sure, understood
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KevinMarks In the context of avc, disqus is a good community because Fred tummels it
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KevinMarks Also, he's an investor in it so they may be sucking up
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tantek ah there's the missing context.
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tantek is reading /irc/2014-07-15 in an attempt to better understand the lunatics. ;)
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tantek GWG, you mentioned "thumbnail/featured image idea in WordPress" - could you link to a more detailed description of this "idea"?
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tantek_1 ok so I'm guessing it takes a while for nicknames to timeout, hence why there is a tantek_ and tantek_com in the channel already, from my previous use of the ?beta IRC UI
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snarfed tantek: tantek_1: aaronpk: ask and ye shall receive! https://snarfed.org/why-i-dont-have-reply-contexts
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tantek_1 !tell KartikPrabhu re: http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-07-15/line/1405446385000 "sometimes feels we are trying to fit square pegs in round holes..." which is why we document real world examples/URLs of square pegs *before* making the mistake of designing round holes for them.
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek_1 snarfed - it's fine to not use post types at all. And a funny admission for an ActivityStreams advocate. ;)
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tantek_1 re: http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-07-15/line/1405446472000
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snarfed tantek_1: heh, sure. i don't actually feel that strongly about activitystreams, it's just the only hammer i had at the time
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tantek_1 reuse++
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Loqi reuse has 1 karma
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tantek_1 reinvention--
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Loqi reinvention has -1 karma
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ben_thatmustbeme tantek_1, when i was trying on mobile as soon as i lost signal it had booted the user
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ben_thatmustbeme i think you can only use nickserv to kick dead connections of registered users
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tantek_1 really appreciate mko arguing / pointing out the UX perspective over and over in the /irc/2014-07-15 discussion
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tantek_1 thanks gRegor` for kicking off and encouraging http://indiewebcamp.com/photo#Discussion
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tantek_1 welcome back KartikPrabhu
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KartikPrabhu hi :P
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@johakuhn Love that the #IndieWeb-Debate (from which I heard the first time yesterday) is getting ahead. http://avc.com/2014/08/the-personal-blog/ (twitter.com/_/status/504701593892040704)
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Loqi KartikPrabhu: tantek_1 left you a message 6 minutes ago: re: http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-07-15/line/1405446385000 "sometimes feels we are trying to fit square pegs in round holes..." which is why we document real world examples/URLs of square pegs *before* making the mistake of designing round holes for them.
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aaronpk tantek: the web clients should leave IRC when the window is closed or the websockets connection is lost.
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tantek_1 aaronpk, in that case it seems that Firefox is holding on tight ;)
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tantek_1 across sleeping/waking etc.
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aaronpk interesting
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bret aaronpk are you running an irc client for the web client basically?
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aaronpk basically yeah. it's in node
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bret heh neato!
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aaronpk https://github.com/aaronpk/indiewebcamp-irc-logs/blob/master/streaming/irc-client.js
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bret something I can read! :)
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tantek_1 heh: https://kylewm.com/share/2014/07/15/1
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tantek_1 I like this too https://twitter.com/gRegorLove/status/489276808458547200 and fits the "build and use your own site" vibe of IndieWeb.
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@gRegorLove @anomalily @veganstraightedge My latest favorite alternative is "build your own light saber." (twitter.com/_/status/489276808458547200)
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tantek_1 yet wondering if analogy to "Jedi" may be perceived to be too elitist.
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ben_thatmustbeme i think it very much would be
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tantek_1 plus those robes never seemed very functional
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ben_thatmustbeme agreed
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benwerd does, however, want to build his own lightsaber.
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Loqi benwerd: KevinMarks_ left you a message on 8/22 at 4:41pm: the POSSEd HWC has today's date
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Loqi benwerd: barnabywalters left you a message 2 days, 8 hours ago: noticed duplicates of http://known.kevinmarks.com/2014/kevin-marks-posted-i-frequently-retweet-old-style-to-add in shrewdness, same content is served from both that URL and http://known.kevinmarks.com/2014/i-frequently-retweet-old-style-to-add-extra-info-usually — what happened here? content edit? URL structure edit? the one starting “kevin-marks-posted-” appears to be the canonical one (linked from
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tantek_1 lol
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Loqi benwerd: aaronpk left you a message on 8/25 at 1:05pm: is there an open issue on Known to support Micropub? If not, I will gladly create one!
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benwerd waits ..
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tantek_1 benwerd, I fixed the HWC POSSE copy issue.
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ben_thatmustbeme if they could build lightsabers why didn't they just build a bunch of them together and build a lightshield too?
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benwerd tantek_1: I saw that; thanks!
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tantek_1 different power requirements? besides, the Gungans already built lightshields.
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benwerd nonetheless, a jedi assembly line might have been a shrewd move.
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bret_web /exit
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benwerd aaronpk: Known supports micropub via a plugin! *AND* I solved the crazy issue that prevented werd.io from supporting it.
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ben_thatmustbeme actually probably just the kurosawa influence
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tantek_1 I don't the Jedi wanted to arm everyone with lightsabres - too much likelihood for people cutting off their own body parts.
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benwerd (aaronpk: combined indieauth + micropub plugin)
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benwerd tantek_1: agree, was surprisingly unenlightened legislation
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tantek_1 finished reading /irc/2014-07-15
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tantek hey KevinMarks - can you invite all the Tummlr and other techie types you usually do to tonight's HWC? http://indiewebcamp.com/events/next-hwc
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tantek !tell gRegor`, KartikPrabhu were you able to reach out to the usual Chicago hopefuls? Mari and I forget the other person's name that has @-replied a bunch on Twitter about Chicago HWC
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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gRegor` I sent the standard invite tweet with links to the event and FB copy. Margot RSVPed on FB and has really wanted to make it before, so hopefully she will.
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Loqi gRegor`: tantek left you a message 52 seconds ago: were you able to reach out to the usual Chicago hopefuls? Mari and I forget the other person's name that has @-replied a bunch on Twitter about Chicago HWC
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gRegor` I have not heard back from Denton or Mari this week.
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gRegor` Invited adactio since he's here for a conference, but he's flying back this evening unfortunately.
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tantek_1 !tell GWG you mentioned "thumbnail/featured image idea in WordPress" - could you link to a more detailed description of this "idea"? http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-07-15/line/1405446335000
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek gRegor`: yeah I saw that
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gRegor` Twitter shows tantek's favorite of this tweet in my notifications, but not on the tweet permalink itself. Interesting. https://twitter.com/gRegorLove/status/489276808458547200
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@gRegorLove @anomalily @veganstraightedge My latest favorite alternative is "build your own light saber." (twitter.com/_/status/489276808458547200)
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gRegor` Even after hard refresh.
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gRegor` I feel like similar discrepancy was noted before
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snarfed gRegor`: twitter fave and rt indicator icons are often flaky :/
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tantek gRegor`: shall I try unfave and refave?
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tantek it shows it as favorited to me, but no icon of me
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tantek in the facepile
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gRegor` Also interesting, @t profile does not show the link to your favorites. Perhaps because you're not following me back.
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gRegor` Oh, let me check the facepile.
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gRegor` @aaronpk shows a link to his favorites, but he's following me
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tantek gRegor`: try making your window wider ;)
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tantek (or check the More v menu)
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gRegor` Not under "More"
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tantek weird. it is just twitter.com/t/favorites
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gRegor` Full width on 1080p :)
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gRegor` Yeah, just noting the oddity of the link missing.
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tantek weird. well direct URL then.
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tantek also, when did Twitter favorites (as in your own username/favorites page) display order switch from ordered by date-when-favorited-most-recent-first to date-when-original-tweet-published-most-recent-first ?
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tantek gRegor`: ok I will unfave and refave, watch this
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tantek boom, now in the facepile
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gRegor` tantek: It's been original-tweet-publish order for quite some time. I don't remember it being different, actually.
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tantek it used to be the other way, based on when you favorite it
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tantek which is how Flickr favorites works for example
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tantek it was better, because you could be like what was that thing I just favorited and then go check your favorites and see it - regardless of how old the original post was
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gRegor` Lulz. Now Lilly's dropped off the facepile and it still lists "2 favorites". When I click 2, though, it pops over and lists all 3.
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tantek gRegor`: silo scaling problems
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gRegor` Agreed. I would prefer most recent first list of favorites.
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gRegor` And maybe an option to sort by original published date.
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tantek do you have a gregorlove.com/likes page?
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gRegor` No, I'm not publishing likes yet.
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tantek is it on your itches?
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tantek along with that ordering preference?
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gRegor` Adding it now. Likes are a pretty low priority, though.
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tantek fair. it's worth documenting even low priority itches just to get them out of your head so you can focus on the higher priority ones :)
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gRegor` Yep. Building quite a list. :)
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tantek tell me about it ;) /Falcon#Working_On
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aaronpk tantek: should we add /page-name to the microsyntax list? ;)
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tantek or just domain relative /path in general?
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gregorlove.com edited /User:Gregorlove.com (+229) "/* Interests */ Stars" (view diff)
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tantek (probably)
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gRegor` On that same tweet above, when I click the number of favorites, at the bottom it says "-1 users have asked not to be shown in this view."
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gRegor` "Learn More" links to https://support.twitter.com/groups/51-me/topics/267-security-privacy/articles/20169886-protecting-and-unprotecting-your-tweets
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tantek that is so weird
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gRegor` I think that means Twitter owes me a favorite? :)
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gRegor` Anyway, enough tinkering with this oddity.
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@npdoty @aaronpk is the Portland branch of Indiewebcamp meeting tonight? I happen to be passing through town. (twitter.com/_/status/504715470721662976)
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@aaronpk @npdoty Yes! Come on by! 6:30pm http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-08-27-homebrew-website-club (http://aaronparecki.com/replies/2014/08/27/2/indiewebcamp) (twitter.com/_/status/504715842265677824)
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Loqi [mention] http://aaronparecki.com/replies/2014/08/27/2/indiewebcamp linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-08-27-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
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@attamoves Interview with Indie Author Today http://www.attamoves.com/blog/indieauthortoday (twitter.com/_/status/504719519123001344)
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neuro` KevinMarks: speaking of avc, he published an interesting post today about personal blogging, http://avc.com/2014/08/the-personal-blog/
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tantek neuro`: indeed, that post and the ones he linked to have been all the buzz this morning in the channel. see indiewebcamp.com/irc/today :)
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neuro` tantek: and I'm blogging about it too :)
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neuro` just finished my post.
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tantek woot!
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Loqi :D
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tommorris.org edited /The_Cask_of_Amontillado (+20) "wikipedia link fix" (view diff)
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tommorris so, Twitter opened up analytics today. you can now see how many people saw your tweets
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tommorris https://analytics.twitter.com/
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aaronpk is it open to the public now? it's been open to "ad partners" for a while
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aaronpk oh wait no this is different
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aaronpk holy crap "Number of times users clicked on the Tweet to view more details"
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tommorris I'm going to see if I can have a sneak peek at the ad partner dashboard and compare tomorrow.
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aaronpk can't help but notice the giant "export data" button in the corner!
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tantek lol "A problem occurred while loading the page. To use this site, you need to disable AdBlock or any other ads-blocking extension you are using, or customize it to show ads on this site."
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aaronpk tantek: I got that too :)
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aaronpk holy crap you can get all the data as a csv
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tantek KevinMarks: will ask if it is TSV ;)
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aaronpk i dunno but it opens fine in excel
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tommorris no, CSV
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tommorris and the data goes back to 2013-10
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aaronpk seems the stats only go back to 2014-08-22
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tommorris ah, perhaps it's just the last N tweets
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aaronpk the "impressions" do anyway, I have "engagement" data farther back
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tantek.com edited /Posts_about_the_IndieWeb (+91) "emojicon" (view diff)
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snarfed interesting. i wonder how much of the twitter analytics thing is just messaging. you could sign up for twitter ads before, with zero budget, and see basically the same data
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snarfed i did that a long time ago
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aaronpk snarfed: they didn't show impressions before
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snarfed aaronpk: aha
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aaronpk nor the detail of things like "Number of times users clicked on the Tweet to view more details"
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aaronpk is the other ad dashboard still up somewhere? (you got access to that by signing up for twitter cards)
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tommorris aaronpk: yeah, impressions for me only goes back to 2014-06-10. but metrics total has 2271 entries for me
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tommorris just did a quick sum of the impressions column - 208,871. Twitter ought to be paying me a CPM rate.
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tommorris has the nasty sinking feeling that he will soon be asked to write a parser for the Twitter engagement data CSV
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tantek.com edited /Events (+83) "emojicon" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /videos_about_the_indieweb (+85) "emojicon, no longer a stub, active voice" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /events/2014-08-27-homebrew-website-club (+97) "emojicons" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /2014/UK (+83) "emojicon" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /2014/UK (+4) "shift emojicon down" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /IRC (-12) "shorten the longest heading so that it shrinks to the TOC" (view diff)
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tommorris watches KevinMarks' Ignite talk and applauds on behalf of his genderqueer and non-binary friends. KevinMarks++
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tommorris oh, that can't be in a /me
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tommorris KevinMarks++ then
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Loqi KevinMarks has 48 karma
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tommorris If programmers were building databases 50 years ago, they'd be encoding racial segregation. Today, they are unwittingly encoding cisnormativity. (And if you don't know what that is, check your favourite search engine.)
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KevinMarks_ Thanks Tom. We had exactly that with vcard 4
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tantek KevinMarks_: you mean we *fixed* that in vCard4
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tantek (and had to fight non-trivially for it)
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tantek.com edited /IRC (+99) "emojicon, move TOC below logs grid" (view diff)
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KevinMarks_ We did, yes. I meant we had programmers advocating a "simple obvious" sex field
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tantek !tell aaronpk seems like the months=6 param on showing only 6 months of logs has broken here and it is showing *all* months: http://indiewebcamp.com/IRC#Logs
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek KevinMarks_: unfortunately that won't stop the problem tommorris is pointing out, because programmers love to makeup their own database schemas from scratch over and over and over
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tommorris tantek: does microformats.org wiki count my hazy recollections as a source for the history of gender representation. because I distinctly remember that there was a protest on MySpace where people would just put "GENDERQUEER" in various fields to fuck with their metadata. alas, the URLs probably do not resolve
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tantek is looking for an emoji for /principles
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KevinMarks_ 👸 🎨 -ess -ette
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tommorris tantek: I have my own emjoi: ™
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tommorris (And the trade mark symbol is a valid emoji according to the Unicode standard. I checked.)
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KevinMarks_ 📜or
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tantek parchment?
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KevinMarks_ 📃
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KevinMarks_ Maybe
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tantek how about 💞 ?
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tommorris and on emoj.li, I have registered the username "™ðŸ‘¬"
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tantek tommorris: amaze
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tommorris Unicode also contains a symbol for aubergine (eggplant): 🍆
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tommorris I once posted the aubergine symbol into #wikipedia-en and got sternly told off because it is part of a range of Unicode characters that cause certain unpatched versions of Xchat for Windows to crash.
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tommorris Apparently, Xchat for Windows took the XML approach to error handling: catastrophic failure.
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KevinMarks_ 🗽 could be principles
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eliemichel ='( my IRC client can't see any of your emojies
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tommorris KevinMarks_: you know http://enwp.org/🗽 is a redirect to the Statue of Liberty article, right?
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eliemichel (except for ™)
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tommorris my emoji is the best.
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tantek what is 🗽?
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Loqi http://indiewebcamp.com/%F0%9F%97%BD
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rascul those weird emoji things look like black question marks inside a white circle to me
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KevinMarks_ 🚷 is the emoji for schema
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KevinMarks_ As well as 🌋 📠
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tantek note 👹?
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tantek s/note/not
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Loqi tantek meant to say: not 👹?
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tantek KevinMarks_: if someone hasn't registered volcano fax on emojli you should go get it just for scheama
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KevinMarks_ 💒 is odd, what's that called?
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tantek wedding chapel (guessing)
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ben_thatmustbeme this is the weirdest conversation for me since none of those render at all
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tantek how about 🗿 for long web?
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KevinMarks_ ™ is a different code point than ™?
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eliemichel rascul: that means that your client can't show it
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rascul i agree
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eliemichel I see all of the emojies like so
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rascul i wonder if maybe it's a font thing
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tantek try https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/today
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eliemichel good idea
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eliemichel well, the result is not so better
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rascul what are the numbers in the boxes?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "the numbers in the boxes" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=the+numbers+in+the+boxes
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KevinMarks_ Is there an emoji for shed?
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eliemichel I soo utf codes inside a square…
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rascul utf? ok thought so
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eliemichel rascul: this is another way of saying "hey, can't render that symbol"
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rascul yeah, i didn't know what the numbers inside the boxes were though
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neuro` tantek, KevinMarks_ which fonts are you using?
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eliemichel I believe this is utf, but I did not check
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eliemichel rascul: What language is your system configured to use?
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tommorris Damn you Twitter. http://enwp.org/🗽 isn't considered a valid link
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rascul english
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eliemichel it may be a local problem
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eliemichel erf
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eliemichel it may not be
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eliemichel I wondered since mine is French
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rascul i'm trying different fonts but none of them show any different for me
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eliemichel I don't use the same font in my browser and my IRC client
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tommorris zomg wikipedia emoji redirects is my new favourite thing.
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eliemichel The only common point is that both of them use gtk
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KevinMarks_ Chrome doesn't show them (except on android)
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eliemichel but anyway, this is not interesting on that chat
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tantek tommorris: what do you think inspired all the redirects I added to the iwc wiki?
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tommorris I wonder if compound emoji redirects will get me into trouble
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tantek tommorris: http://indiewebcamp.com/💀
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tommorris so, what you are saying is we need stubs on IWC for all emojis. CHALLENGE ACCEPTED.
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tantek or at least redirects where they make sense
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tantek note you may find the easy ones already done :)
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KevinMarks_ 💒 is wedding officially
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tommorris 📟 already done
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tantek KevinMarks_: what was that tommorris was saying about normatism?
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tantek wedding implies church?
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KevinMarks_ 🏩 is love hotel
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tantek tommorris: if you refer to them with a leading / then they'll hyperlink in the logs too
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ben_thatmustbeme heh... ew
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tantek e.g. /📟
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tommorris.org created /📠 (+23) "the fax machine lives" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /principles (+139) "emojicons" (view diff)
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tantek ok I'm pretty pleased with http://indiewebcamp.com/principles
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tommorris 👯 may be against the code of conduct
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tantek what is http://enwp.org/👯 ?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "http://enwp.org/👯 " yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=http%3A%2F%2Fenwp.org%2F%F0%9F%91%AF+
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tommorris tantek: 'Cosplay'
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tantek !tell aaronpk if someone asks what is http://example.com/ a URL then Loqi could retrieve the title of the page instead of looking for /
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tommorris tantek: if you try and create a Wikipedia page with emoji in, you get this warning - http://cl.ly/image/3r1x3k423f0Y
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@gasull I'd love to see Cjdns (with Hyperboria configured as default) on @SandstormIO! https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/sandstorm-io-personal-cloud-platform/x/5184124 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cjdns #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/504739142644011011)
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ben_thatmustbeme yay, i see them now
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Loqi does a happy dance!
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tantek.com edited /principles (+44) "linky" (view diff)
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tommorris http://enwp.org/WP:👑
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tantek.com edited /Getting_Started (+93) "emojicon" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Getting_Started (+0) "f" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /projects (+94) "emojicon, move TOC below under construction" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /📑 (+22) "r" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme and what should /💩 be?
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tantek I got it
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tantek.com created /💩 (+22) "r" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme hah, nice
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tantek.com created /ℹ (+29) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /🗽 (+1) "better" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme #⃣ to fragmention?
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JonathanNeal responds to the bat signal
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tantek.com edited /principles (+8) "/* Plurality */ projects emoji" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /✊ (+27) "r" (view diff)
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KevinMarks_ Wow, the Mac OS ones are ugly compared to the android ones
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tantek.com created /😋 (+25) "r" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme i want to sit down some day and just write a story using only emoji
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tantek.com edited /selfdogfood (+87) "emojicon" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /📓 (+26) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /📓 (+0) "r" (view diff)
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snarfed ben_thatmustbeme: we had an (internal) postmortem at google that was entirely in meme
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snarfed it was pretty epic
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ben_thatmustbeme haha, nice
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tantek.com edited /own_your_data (+86) "emojicon" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme okay, train ride home time
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ben_thatmustbeme hopefully its not delayed too much
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tantek.com edited /start_a_page (+87) "emojicon" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /📐 (+20) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /design (+94) "emojicon" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /✂ (+17) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /🌐 (+29) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /🎉 (+17) "r" (view diff)
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snarfed can i send Loqi and the emoji edits to #indiechat? :P
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tantek.com edited /lulz (+87) "emojicon" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /😂 (+18) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /🌈 (+29) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /code-of-conduct (+95) "emojicon" (view diff)
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tantek tommorris: you figured out the answer for that emoji that wp thinks is cosplay
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tantek.com created /👫 (+29) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /👬 (+29) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /👭 (+29) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /👪 (+29) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /💏 (+11) "better" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /💑 (+11) "better" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /🎭 (+29) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /👯 (+29) "r" (view diff)
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tantek what is love?
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Loqi "baby don't hurt me . . . " ♫ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhrBDcQq2DM http://indiewebcamp.com/love
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tantek.com created /📺 (+39) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /IndieWebCamp:Copyrights (+134) "CC0 icon" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /🇫🇷 (+26) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /🇩🇪 (+26) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /Main_Page-de (+27) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Main_Page-de (-8) "stub with link to only German translated page so far" (view diff)
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ShaneHudson Wow, Tantek has been busy
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tantek welcome RichardLitt!
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RichardLitt Thanks tantek
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eliemichel tantek: <3 /love ^^
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/comment/twitter/gRegorLove/503288976665366528/504766407629111296 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-08-27-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
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gRegor` Hello from Chicago HWC
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aaronpk oh my god you guys... so emoji
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Loqi aaronpk: tantek left you a message 2 hours, 41 minutes ago: seems like the months=6 param on showing only 6 months of logs has broken here and it is showing *all* months: http://indiewebcamp.com/IRC#Logs
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Loqi aaronpk: tantek left you a message 2 hours, 14 minutes ago: if someone asks what is http://example.com/ a URL then Loqi could retrieve the title of the page instead of looking for /
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aaronpk why doesn't this page actually show the page contents? http://indiewebcamp.com/%E2%9C%8A
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aaronpk oh it's a double redirect issue
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gRegor` OMG, what does it mean?
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aaronpk lol
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rascul it means party time
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gRegor` !tell snarfed Hmm, getting 401 again and verified the account is public. https://www.brid.gy/log?start_time=1409182429&key=aglzfmJyaWQtZ3lyUAsSDVB1Ymxpc2hlZFBhZ2UiKWh0dHA6Ly9ncmVnb3Jsb3ZlLmNvbS9ub3Rlcy8yMDE0LzA4LzI3LzUvDAsSB1B1Ymxpc2gYgICAgICAgAoM
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/comment/twitter/gRegorLove/503288976665366528/504775420915359744 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-08-27-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] http://tools.exppad.com/shaarli/?6qMX7w linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/ (webmention)
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gRegor` Margot is here at Chicago HWC for the first time, http://pitchdesignunion.com/
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gRegor` Helping her get set up with indieauth and sign in to the wiki
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gRegor` She does mostly graphic design, history in print design, some code (Ruby, PHP)
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gRegor` And then there's Kartik and me.
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gRegor` Nobody wants to know more about those two. ;)
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gRegor` She's heard good things from multiple people about http://macaw.co/