#indiewebcamp 2014-11-20

2014-11-20 UTC
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tantek aaronpk - to parse it, and *show it* as a <map> with <area> inside
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aaronpk unfortunately the mf2 parser doesn't recognize anything in the <area> html you gave
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aaronpk it just shows up as an empty h-card
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tantek wonders about the fallback text for his person-tag reply post on his own site: "tagged himself in a photo on aaronparecki.com"
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tantek goes to check the uf2 spec
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aaronpk and the fallback text that will display if I don't parse out the rect and such
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tantek right
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tantek better yet I should be person-tagging someone else
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tantek like benwerd
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benwerd wakes up again
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benwerd tagging works
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benwerd (but fatberg is back)
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aaronpk glad to know where your priorities are :)
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tantek <span class="e-content"><span class="p-summary">tagged benwerd</span> in a <a class="u-in-reply-to" href="https://aaronparecki.com/notes/2014/10/13/1/indieweb-latergram">a photo on aaronparecki.com</a></span>
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tantek aaronpk - that <area> itself needs to be inside an h-entry
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aaronpk http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgist.githubusercontent.com%2Faaronpk%2Fde26b1cc6a38e02d0cb8%2Fraw%2F7cb8877287a8746ec52e4a334a5caa969e2a2617%2Ftag.html
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aaronpk from https://gist.github.com/aaronpk/de26b1cc6a38e02d0cb8
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tantek yup I need to add <area> to the microformats2 parsing algorithm - now that we have a concrete use-case. wow.
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aaronpk aha
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tantek well, that's good - no feature before there's a concrete use-case.
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tantek but here's where it gets tricky, the implication is that the uf2 parser will also extract the coords and shape attributes from the <area> tag
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tantek ok that's good to think about
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tantek aaronpk - from a publisher perspective, does that area example make sense?
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tantek <area class="p-category h-card" href="http://personB.example.com" alt="Person Bee" shape="rect" coords="100,100,120,120">
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aaronpk I think so yeah
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tantek good, then I think I've figured out how to update the microformats2 parsing spec
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tantek oh - the parser MUST already be returning SOMETHING for the area element
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tantek per http://microformats.org/wiki/microformats2-parsing#parsing_a_p-_property : "else if img.p-x[alt] or area.p-x[alt], then return the alt attribute"
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tantek so this should give you something:
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tantek <span class="h-entry"><area class="p-category h-card" href="http://personB.example.com" alt="Person Bee" shape="rect" coords="100,100,120,120"></span>
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tantek yeah that works to produce an h-entry with p-category of "Person Bee" at least
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tantek good. that's decent fallback.
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tantek now we just need to fix object-level parsing of <area> and implying properties from <area>
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tantek and add details of shape and coords
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/rsvp/facebook/12802152/714336951990549/871610248 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-11-19-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
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tantek http://microformats.org/wiki/index.php?title=microformats2-parsing&diff=64684&oldid=64589&rcid=101047 is the edit that adds support for <area> microformats to microformats2 parsing - please review aaronpk and anyone else interested in consuming these
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tantek and now to work on a sample person-area-tag reply post to https://aaronparecki.com/notes/2014/10/13/1/indieweb-latergram
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tantek so we can have a concrete real world markup example to test microformats2 parser improvements on
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (+421) "/* Working On */ one-off person-area-tag reply to aaronpk's photo post, to person-area-tag benwerd, as part of pushing forward building blocks for SWAT0" (view diff)
fmarier, michielbdejong and indie-visitor joined the channel
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indie-visitor testing
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GWG Hello
AustinPrior joined the channel
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AustinPrior testing again
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AustinPrior Now I have a name.
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AustinPrior I am a noob and I'm eager to set myself up as a citizen of the IndieWeb
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GWG Good evening.
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AustinPrior Good evening GWG
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GWG AustinPrior: Do you have a website?
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AustinPrior Yes. I've got a domain, hosting, and a wordpress instance.
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GWG Well, WordPress is reasonably easy to adapt
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GWG There are some good plugins
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AustinPrior I thought I was almost there but the h-card and rel-me bits have me stumped
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GWG AustinPrior: What's the domain?
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AustinPrior ShkintyBoda.org
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/rsvp/facebook/12802152/714336951990549/563260902 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-11-19-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
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AustinPrior ShkintyBoda.org/braindump/ for the WordPress
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GWG In Dublin no less.
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AustinPrior yup. Where you based?
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GWG New York. But I was in Dublin last month
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bnvk as
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bnvk dsdadklfjgfsf
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GWG AustinPrior: So, you want an h-card in a hurry?
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GWG https://github.com/dshanske/hcardtools
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GWG It's a bit rough
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GWG But it'll do the trick
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AustinPrior yeah. I've got one but it doesn't quite pass the test...
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GWG Well, editing a theme to be mf2 compliant can be annoying sometimes.
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GWG AustinPrior: You redid the entire theme with mf2?
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AustinPrior ???
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AustinPrior Me no understand
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GWG AustinPrior: It's markup for the theme. It allows external sites to read information from your site.
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GWG How did you try to do the h-card?
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@kevinmarks Barbie joins the #indieweb (via https://computer-engineer-barbie.herokuapp.com/view/64622 ) https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/535236246709497856/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/535236246709497856)
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AustinPrior I just copied and pasted from a couple of different sources
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AustinPrior (noobie shit)
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AustinPrior Just to clarify:the basic little page at the root domain is just html...
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@infinite_ammo RT @kevinmarks: Barbie joins the #indieweb (via https://computer-engineer-barbie.herokuapp.com/view/64622 ) https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/535236246709497856/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/535236426166968322)
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AustinPrior The WordPress is at ShkintyBoda.org/braindump/
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@Ivesaguiar RT @kevinmarks: Barbie joins the #indieweb (via https://computer-engineer-barbie.herokuapp.com/view/64622 ) https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/535236246709497856/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/535236499814752258)
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GWG I'm looking at the WordPress site
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AustinPrior OK. My understanding was that the h-card had to be in index.html in the root
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GWG http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fshkintyboda.org%2F
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GWG Doesn't have to be, but it is a good practice.
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GWG It is reading the h-card.
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AustinPrior just a sec
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AustinPrior http://indiewebify.me/validate-h-card/?url=shkintyboda.org
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AustinPrior having connection troubles as well
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GWG <a rel="me" class="u-url">…</a> - Wrap the image in this anchor link.
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@alexwilliams RT @kevinmarks: Barbie joins the #indieweb (via https://computer-engineer-barbie.herokuapp.com/view/64622 ) https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/535236246709497856/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/535238134607663104)
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AustinPrior like this?...
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AustinPrior <a rel="me" class="u-url"> <img src="/avatar.png" alt="" /> Austin Prior</a> </a>
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@Uebyn RT @kevinmarks: Barbie joins the #indieweb (via https://computer-engineer-barbie.herokuapp.com/view/64622 ) https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/535236246709497856/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/535239386510946305)
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GWG You have two </a>
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AustinPrior oops, yeah. deleted that but I'm still getting odd output
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gRegor-hwc Hello from Chicago HWC
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gRegor-hwc Margot, Kartik, and myself are here
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AustinPrior can i send you the text file? Thanks for your help by the way! :)
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GWG Hello, gRegor-hwc
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GWG AustinPrior: Take the / out of the <a rel="me"
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GWG You can send me the text if you want.
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GWG Oops, lost him
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GWG You can send me the text if you want.
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GWG AustinPrior: Doesn't seem to be working.
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AustinPrior my IRC client says: Waiting for the transfer to begin
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GWG AustinPrior: My client crashed
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GWG AustinPrior: But I'm working on it from your site. Stand by
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AustinPrior cheers
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GWG Pasted it
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GWG AustinPrior: You should have it in a private window
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AustinPrior cool. Got it.
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AustinPrior Thanks. I'm going to go and take a look...
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AustinPrior updated! Thanks.
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AustinPrior woohoo! My h-card is now "representative"
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GWG There you are.
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AustinPrior1 GWG, You have been really helpful so please don't feel obliged to take on my next problem...
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GWG AustinPrior1: We're here to help.
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AustinPrior1 Yay
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AustinPrior1 http://indiewebify.me/validate-rel-me/?url=shkintyboda.org
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GWG https://twitter.com/SeveralPigeons - Get rid of the index.html
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GWG Then test Indieauth
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AustinPrior1 how embarrassing! I thought I had gotten rid of that. I only put it there when I was having problems removing a former redirect
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AustinPrior1 Aha! Now I get it. indieauth does the linking. This is cool.
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@NateKandler RT @kevinmarks: Barbie joins the #indieweb (via https://computer-engineer-barbie.herokuapp.com/view/64622 ) https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/535236246709497856/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/535246294038900738)
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GWG AustinPrior1: What's next?
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AustinPrior1 I authorised both Twitter and my email but they still show as not linking on indiewebify.me
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gRegor-hwc aaronpk: Question from Kartik. How are you associating external content with your notes. Looked on /p3k and couldn't figure it out.
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GWG Hmm...When did they start doing this?
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GWG <span class="ProfileHeaderCard-urlText u-dir" dir="ltr"><a class="u-textUserColor" target="_blank" rel="me nofollow" href="http://t.co/s4pwvNGLQK" title="http://ShkintyBoda.org">
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gRegor-hwc Saw the folder structure of how you save the content mapped to the external URL
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gRegor-hwc Kartik is planning out moving entirely to file-based storage
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GWG gRegor-hwc: Is there another conversation going on I'm missing?
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gRegor-hwc (and tantek rejoiced)
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gRegor-hwc GWG: We're at HWC
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GWG AustinPrior1: It looks like Twitter is obscuring the URL behind a t.co redirect.
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GWG gRegor-hwc: I wanted to be at HWC. Where is it?
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gRegor-hwc Chicago, The Wormhole Coffee
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GWG gRegor-hwc: I can't get there in time
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AustinPrior1 I see. And you're thinking this might be a recent change that we now need to adapt to?
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GWG AustinPrior1: Is it your only link other than email?
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AustinPrior1 yeah. I'm not on any other compatible social networks
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AustinPrior1 The email one should be working too though, right?
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GWG Not sure. Mine does it. But I don't know if it is a recent change.
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GWG How can email link back?
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gRegor-hwc Are you talking about logging in to the wiki or indieauth.com?
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AustinPrior1 cos I authorised it on indieauth.com
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AustinPrior1 maybe I'm misunderstanding...
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GWG It should work. Not with a rel=me, but it should work for auth
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GWG AustinPrior1: GO to Indieauth.com and try to log in. It should pick up Twitter even if the test doesn't.
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AustinPrior1 These link backs should work with or without indieauth authorisation?
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GWG AustinPrior1: The tester seems to not be picking things up. I'll talk to the developer.
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AustinPrior1 it did already.
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gRegor-hwc Sorry, not clear on what you're trying to do, AustinPrior1
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AustinPrior1 cool. so if it was successful on indieauth, I don't need to worry?
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GWG AustinPrior1: Exactly. I just filed a bug report on the Indiewebify.me site about the Twitter t.co urls.
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GWG AustinPrior1: So, what is next for you?
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AustinPrior1 Thanks very much. I appear to be all fixed up for rel me and the h-card
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ben_thatmust GWG, bringing more in to the fold I see
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@kevinmarks @anildash how about a New York Homebrew Website Club meetup? http://indiewebcamp.com/Homebrew_Website_Club (twitter.com/_/status/535249919582687232)
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AustinPrior1 I've just logged in to the indiewebcamp.com wiki. This feels good
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GWG KevinMarks: Thanks for trying to help me find a meetup.
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ben_thatmust AustinPrior1 add yourself to irc-people
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GWG ben_thatmust: Beat me to it there
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gRegor-hwc Yay, AustinPrior1!
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AustinPrior my next query is just in regards to file structure. Will it mater that my WordPress instance is in a subdirectory and my index is at the root?
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AustinPrior gRegor-hwc: :)
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GWG AustinPrior: Not as far as I know. But...would you rather have it as the top level?
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AustinPrior maybe. If it was, I'm wondering would there be a conflict between index.html and index.php
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GWG AustinPrior: Yes. But you can have your h-card in the WordPress installation
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AustinPrior and the rel me stuff?
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GWG Easily done.
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GWG I did.
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AustinPrior cool.
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GWG https://david.shanske.com/
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GWG There is my site and the h-card, also WordPress
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GWG Here is https://snarfed.org/ another Indieweb WordPress site
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AustinPrior cool
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AustinPrior that tool on github that you showed me at the start is prob what I need for that
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GWG AustinPrior: I wrote it on Sunday.
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AustinPrior nice one!
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GWG AustinPrior: There will be more in it later, but I'm trying to add some WordPress tools for both myself and newcomers.
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AustinPrior I'm going to go to bed now. I'm very happy with how far I've gotten tonight thanks to your help. I go to sleep one step closer to internet independence
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AustinPrior Actually, the next thing I should probably do is get myself set up for https.
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GWG AustinPrior: Try startssl. Free basic certs.
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AustinPrior great. Thanks again for all the help.
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GWG Any time.
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AustinPrior Good night GWG
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Loqi sleep tight!
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AustinPrior and good night to all the rest of you
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AustinPrior yes. and you loqi!
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Loqi who, me?
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AustinPrior !
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tantek reads logs
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GWG What do you see?
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tantek GWG, looks like you got AustinPrior setup with IndieAuth?
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tantek Was he able to login to the wiki?
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GWG tantek: Yes. And I filed an Issue about indiewebify.me not seeing a link because at some point, Twitter began to rewrite profile URLs using their shortener.
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KevinMarks__ going to try the new h-card p-category people tagging with noterlive tonight
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tantek GWG - good! I remember when IndieAuth had to fix that
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tantek next after logging into the wiki is asking someone to add themselves to /irc-people :)
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tantek so they get a link and a photo
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tantek of course it helps to set a good example there, nudge nudge GWG :)
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GWG tantek: I was typing it out when ben_thatmustbeme beat me to it. As for the profile picture...I keep meaning to do that. I just paired it with doing the icons for my site and haven't gotten to it. I'm not good at photos.
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GWG tantek: Besides, I'm still finishing up the last item on the IWC Online 2014 schedule
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tantek GWG - don't make it more work than it is - just use your existing icon that you have on your site and hotlink it
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tantek we're gathered in the SFO 153 Cappuccino room @Mozsf for Homebrew Website Club SF!
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tantek KevinMarks: want to join us? ;)
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KevinMarks__ where's that?
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npdoty <comparing phones>
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Loqi npdoty: tantek left you a message 6 days, 9 hours ago: coming to SF next week? https://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-11-19-homebrew-website-club#RSVP
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npdoty thanks, Loqi, I'm already there
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Loqi who, me?
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sparverius hi tantek's phone
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tantek_ hello from firefoxos!
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tantek http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/today?beta#bottom
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npdoty scribenick: npdoty
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chromedroid hello
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npdoty welcome to the almost exactly 1-year anniversary of the homebrew website club
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npdoty from the 7th floor, down to a small room in the corner
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npdoty broadcast mode vs. specific subjects in smaller groups
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npdoty tantek: lightspeed httpd to serve file-extension-less URLs. apache docs unfortunately poor
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: this week I got a really dumb thing working - serving a file extensionless url from a file using Apache rewrite (twitter.com/_/status/535264078386978816)
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npdoty "wait, you just gave me an app of yourself"
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: people say "you're using an iPod? how is that a phone" and I send them to my contact page to understand it (twitter.com/_/status/535264442700034049)
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npdoty tantek: download an icon to the home screen, people think they're installing "an app" of you
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: user testing shows that when you add a link to your website on their homescreen, they think they're installing an app of you (twitter.com/_/status/535264670874370048)
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npdoty ... contact website where if you're signed in, you get more contact options
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npdoty ... could even be ACL'ed
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: Ben Roberts took the contacts idea and added a login using indieauth to give more contact modes if he knows you (twitter.com/_/status/535265028296167425)
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npdoty ... sign in via IndieAuth (rel=me and OAuth through another service)
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npdoty ... can whitelist some sensitive information to just certain friends
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npdoty ... personal IRC channels with notification
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: Amy did a contact page with her own look, and also included her personal irc channell (twitter.com/_/status/535265426562117632)
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npdoty ... clone Tantek's contact page and customize it for yourself
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: handing out the prototype to non-techy people has been really useful (twitter.com/_/status/535265598528561153)
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GWG What prototype?
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: I'd like to make the contact.html idea my actual homepage (twitter.com/_/status/535265889655193600)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: trying it on android lollipop with chrome, tantek's 'add to homescreen' popup works (twitter.com/_/status/535266181914316800)
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npdoty npdoty: don't see the "add to homescreen" on Firefox
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npdoty might be a User Agent checking issue
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@latest8pc RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @t: user testing shows that when you add a link to your website on their homescreen, they think they're installin… (twitter.com/_/status/535266749357490176)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: this is simple, dumb and useful, but it impresses your friends (twitter.com/_/status/535266761764249600)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: the harder thing I got worked out was how to tag people in photos or other posts in an indieweb way (twitter.com/_/status/535266919348469760)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: if ben posts a photo of kevin on ben's site, I can post a reply that says 'in this rectangle of the image is kevinmarks' (twitter.com/_/status/535267167466692608)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: you send a webmention to the photo post to say there is a person there, and you send a webmention to the people you tag too (twitter.com/_/status/535267342025244672)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: the reply context for a person tag post on a photo is the entire photo - you should see the rect that is you (twitter.com/_/status/535267527903805441)
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npdoty webmention to the source of the posted photo, and a separate webmention to the person being tagged
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: the point is that treating a person tag as a first class post type works with all the other flows we have (twitter.com/_/status/535267776223780866)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: one process is that you can let the person who has been tagged veto the tag, or remove it (twitter.com/_/status/535267909548113920)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: one answer would be a vouch requirement that shows you have linked to each other before (twitter.com/_/status/535268084207353856)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: can I quarantine the webmention until it has been approved? (twitter.com/_/status/535268263773880320)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: a rel=status link in a webmention will make this work (twitter.com/_/status/535268341691449346)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: tagging people is one of the major sources of abuse on facebook - this lets us head that off before it happens (twitter.com/_/status/535268517541871617)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: this would not delete the tagging assertion from the source, but would prevent it propagating to the photo (twitter.com/_/status/535268693635510272)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: if ben says "where's the vouch?" I then have to show that I actually know them with a link (twitter.com/_/status/535268963736113152)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: the basic solution is that you use a p-category tag with a h-card to say it is a person - you could use a geolocation or adr (twitter.com/_/status/535269134196801538)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: you could even use a h-event to say that the photo was time bounded too (twitter.com/_/status/535269257761013760)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: you could use a like as an approval mechanism for these (twitter.com/_/status/535269456805888000)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: foursquare has the ability to check other people in - it can say 'no, yes, auto' (twitter.com/_/status/535269569787887617)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: it's an important part of foursquare to check into palces you aren't really at (twitter.com/_/status/535269805029593089)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: I was mayor of chez panisse for a while as my soul was there (twitter.com/_/status/535269884864004097)
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npdoty npdoty: I like the idea of an endorse kind of post. that tag is okay
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npdoty ... or reject
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npdoty I'm not sure how to get the "endorsement" to be easily notified to the original source of the tagged photo
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @4c4d: I change my profile every few months (twitter.com/_/status/535270686743601152)
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tantek 4c4d: mostly interested in securing all his stuff
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tantek … VPN all his stuff
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tantek … on mobile etc.
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tantek … all his home internet traffic
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @4c4d: I've been securing things - eg VPN my phone traffic to my home internet (twitter.com/_/status/535270770688421888)
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tantek … but also doesn't want to have to rely on Comcast too
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tantek … hosts a lot of stuff at home, SSHes in, with VPN it becomes more transparent
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tantek … have been desiloing stuff too, mostly off of Google
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @4c4d: I'm not sure I should be running my phone traffic through comcast; I've been desiloing stuff mostly off of google (twitter.com/_/status/535270944320024576)
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tantek npdoty.name or Nick IRL working on two things
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tantek … one is citations
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tantek … went to citations hackathon that PLoS had
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: I've been working on 2 things - one is citations - I went to a citations hackathon (twitter.com/_/status/535271026918424578)
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tantek … wants to put his academic writing on the web
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tantek … working on fork of citeproc.py
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: I want my academic work to be on the web wiht proper citations (twitter.com/_/status/535271118513639425)
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tantek … citeproc takes a bibtex database etc. of citations
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tantek … and when you're writing a paper, you refer to a short name
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tantek … citeproc converts to a nicely formatted citation
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tantek … there's a language for that, a citation style language
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: I forked citeproc.py which creates official citations in various formats (twitter.com/_/status/535271259962347523)
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tantek … citeproc takes that and the data and turns into HTML
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tantek … goal would be to automatically generate h-cite type things
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tantek … to be able to say "this is the author"
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: the output of the citation usually loses the semantics; I am modifying this to create h-cite markup (twitter.com/_/status/535271395526443009)
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tantek … making progress on that fork of citeproc
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tantek … the other thing
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tantek … two - is the harrassment and abuse stuff
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npdoty https://bcc.npdoty.name
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tantek … posted about it on bcc.npdoty.name
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tantek … we should be thinking proactively about how to avoid this harrassment type stuff
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tantek … some advantages on the web - based on domain names
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: harassment stuff: I posted to http://bcc.npdoty.name on how to proactively deal with harassment (twitter.com/_/status/535271676196696065)
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tantek … we need to work on /block-list
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: if someone has to buy a new domain name every time they want to harass me that's good (twitter.com/_/status/535271772703453186)
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tantek benwerd: and services that give out free subdomains (implied ;) )
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: there are also irritating free services that hand out subdomains to people (twitter.com/_/status/535271863921172481)
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tantek npdoty: if you're the kind of service that hands out identities for less than the cost of the service (e.g. free), then there has to be some way to report that kind of thing
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@ninavizz RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @npdoty: it's an important part of foursquare to check into palces you aren't really at (twitter.com/_/status/535272036248330240)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: if you're doing that you should take some responsibility for your actions (twitter.com/_/status/535272210861395968)
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tantek npdoty: in terms of code there should be a way to discover how to report abuse
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tantek … we might want some format for "this is an abusive domain"
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: using rel=me you can get more information about a subdomain and possible twitter accounts etc (twitter.com/_/status/535272430605172736)
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tantek e.g. http://microformats.org/wiki/blocklist
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npdoty https://blocktogether.org/
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tantek benwerd: dangillmor points out we don't give subdomains to people, we lend them to people
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @npdoty: the twitter thing I saw was blocktogether which collates lists of twitter accounts to block - do this for domains (twitter.com/_/status/535272953240621059)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: I have somebody pretending to be me on a facebook thread with my name and avatar (twitter.com/_/status/535273217230110721)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: I reported it to facebook and it was gone in a shot (twitter.com/_/status/535273271487631360)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: twitter does not make removing cloned profiles as easy you have to give govt id (twitter.com/_/status/535273770043576320)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: there is a question of paraody accounts -eg the new gap logo (twitter.com/_/status/535273945860427776)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: are we trying to fight parody or preserve that? (twitter.com/_/status/535274496144728064)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: ICANN has a procedure for impersonating domains in place (twitter.com/_/status/535274819848523776)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: slander and defamation have very long histories and legal defintions (twitter.com/_/status/535275101353439232)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: there are existing trust models that could be used as possibilities for vouch (twitter.com/_/status/535275272086753280)
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@DestinyLiberman RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @dariusdunlap: I reported it to facebook and it was gone in a shot (twitter.com/_/status/535275304106086400)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: what if someone uses the wrong name in a webmention (twitter.com/_/status/535275775373901824)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: there is a service called https://checkmention.appspot.com/ that sends spoofed webmentions so you cna decide how to handle them (twitter.com/_/status/535276058158063616)
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tantek shing: not much of an update - busy with different things
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tantek at shingw.com
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @shingwong: I have http://shingw.com as well as http://syncmotion.co (twitter.com/_/status/535276437625143296)
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tantek … question: been thinking about wanting to do something for presentations
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tantek …. is a presenter, would love to have one way to live-stream a presentation
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tantek … and be able to tweet out each slide
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @shingwong: how would you approach presentations - that could livestream or tweet out a slide? (twitter.com/_/status/535276557187956737)
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tantek 4c4d: reveal.js has client/server communication
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tantek … can add a widget to tweet from the slide deck
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @4c4d: reveal.js is a good way of doing presentations that lets you add css+js on top and could tweet too (twitter.com/_/status/535276821399764993)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I use reveal.js for my slides - http://slides.kevinmark.com (twitter.com/_/status/535277054397526016)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: I use shower.js pronounced as show-er (twitter.com/_/status/535277133539835905)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @shingwong: I want to share that particular slide as I speak - screengrab or URL? (twitter.com/_/status/535277440877473792)
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tantek 4c4d: see also https://www.obsproject.com/
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tantek … Open Broadcaster Software is free and open source software for video recording and live streaming.
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: http://slides.com lets you generate reveal.js files by hand (twitter.com/_/status/535278107935383553)
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tantek (various folks are playing with latest FirefoxOS on a Flame phone)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @shingwong: if I'm doing presentations it would be great to be abel to tweet out a particular slide (twitter.com/_/status/535278653182312448)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: if you have a short url for your own site for every slide you can do your own URL (twitter.com/_/status/535279004430139392)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: the problem with twitter is getting them to approve you as a card provider -you could use flickr (twitter.com/_/status/535279499878084609)
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@OhhSocialMedia RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @shingwong: if I'm doing presentations it would be great to be abel to tweet out a particular slide (twitter.com/_/status/535280132580466688)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: don't try and deal with the twitter cards markup - post an image to them. let them eat bitmaps (twitter.com/_/status/535280331331764225)
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npdoty it can be frustrating if the POSSE copies include links that don't provide anything additional
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tantek 4c4d: you can use the Twitter app too
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npdoty ... because then I click on your link in your tweet, but find out that I've already seen all of the content already
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sparverius https://twitter.com/settings/applications go ahead and review this and disable stuff
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @4c4d: I wonder how many twitter apps I have authorized. Oh wow, twitter for every platform (twitter.com/_/status/535280946812301312)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: Ben, you made http://freemydata.co/ to get your data out- could you have free your tokens too? (twitter.com/_/status/535281266971926528)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: @erinjo made http://freemydata.co with links to how to get your data out, but they're all different (twitter.com/_/status/535281478377406464)
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tantek www.google.com/accounts/IssuedAuthSubTokens
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: being able to unmung the data from http://freemydata.co into microformats would be very useful (twitter.com/_/status/535281765062311936)
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sparverius https://security.google.com/settings/security/permissions?pli=1
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: if you go to https://accounts.google.com/ServiceLogin?passive=1209600&continue=https%3A%2F%2Faccounts.google.com%2FIssuedAuthSubTokens&followup=https%3A%2F%2Faccounts.google.com%2FIssuedAuthSubTokens&passwdsession=true you can see what can see your google (twitter.com/_/status/535282293439754240)
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@latest8pc RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @t: don't try and deal with the twitter cards markup - post an image to them. let them eat bitmaps (twitter.com/_/status/535282357931360256)
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@ShirlLacsamana RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @t: don't try and deal with the twitter cards markup - post an image to them. let them eat bitmaps (twitter.com/_/status/535282359978192896)
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sparverius https://www.facebook.com/settings?tab=applications
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tantek.com created /freemydata (+70) "stub" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /freemyoauth (+146) "stub with URLs" (view diff)
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tantek KevinMarks: just implemented person-tagging in noterlive archive posts
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tantek per the <a class="p-category h-card"> pattern
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tantek KevinMarks: I don't currently send webmentions for my noterlive archive posts but I could
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I implemented the person tagging markup in the noterlive archives - They'll show up when I post these notes (twitter.com/_/status/535283643535851521)
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npdoty accepting webmentions is a little different for your homepage, maybe
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tantek benwerd: I rewrote my API code
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tantek … I also rewrote my POSSE code, but not the social media plugins
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: I rewrote my API code to use micropub, and also rewrote my POSSE code to post to multiple accounts (twitter.com/_/status/535283781595578370)
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tantek … which will let me post to multiple accounts on silos
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npdoty I'm likely not to want to display them like comments, but still might be cool to show who's talking about me, or notify me about them
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tantek … like FB pages and multiple Twitter accounts
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tantek … also wants to play with POSSE to webhooks
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tantek … so I can POSSE to Slack etc.
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tantek … and then a bunch of stuff around the reader
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: on my to do list is to try POSSE to webhooks so I can work with @slackhq (twitter.com/_/status/535283902924210176)
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tantek … also TLS
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npdoty yay TLS
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tantek … and prototyped a WordPress importer
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Loqi giggles
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: I also did a lot of work on the reader but there is nothing to show yet (twitter.com/_/status/535284075368833026)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: I also worked on a thorough Wordpress importer which we are testing (twitter.com/_/status/535284253656121344)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: we receive homepage webmentions but don't show them yet -would notify (twitter.com/_/status/535284352549412864)
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npdoty "it's like @replies, except like slightly weirder"
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@MogulAzam RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @dariusdunlap: slander and defamation have very long histories and legal defintions (twitter.com/_/status/535285120346103808)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I'm receiving webmentions at http://t.co/yHmJNg4AYA, and embedding them with the same app as other pages (twitter.com/_/status/535285159231504385)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: you could tell the distinction between being mentioned and explictly tagged in a post (twitter.com/_/status/535285341809569792)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: webmentioning your homepages woudl also work well for an invitation to an event (twitter.com/_/status/535285474529935360)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: it feels like this is getting close to the point where we can build things that normal people can use (twitter.com/_/status/535285685952184320)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: if we can use them ourselves, then implementing them in bridges to silos is also easy (twitter.com/_/status/535285871227199488)
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@MogulAzam RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @npdoty: harassment stuff: I posted to http://bcc.npdoty.name on how to proactively deal with harassment (twitter.com/_/status/535285879699693568)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: Aaron finally started POSSEing email like @npdoty does too (twitter.com/_/status/535285975065563136)
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GWG Whenever I try to extract data from a silo, I get annoyed.
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: it is easy to POSSE to email because email is so insecure you can spoof as yourself (twitter.com/_/status/535286480227536896)
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tantek Darius: has upgraded his site to A- on SSL
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tantek … recently moved to a new house
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: I have upgraded my site to A- on SSL, and I moved house (twitter.com/_/status/535286685987516416)
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tantek … can host an IndieWebCamp or Homebrew Website Club - Half Moon Bay
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tantek … has a very fast connection to the downtown network
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tantek … capable of 150Mbps+
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: I now have a very fast connection to the local ISP in my new house - now 150Mbit WiFi link (twitter.com/_/status/535286847862493184)
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tantek … directional wifi over 2-3 miles away
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tantek … capped normally 10 down and 4 up
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tantek … no reason the cap can't be removed
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tantek.com edited /Twitter (-4) "update logo" (view diff)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: If I can use my house as an event space for an indiewebcamp I could lift the ISP cap for a few days (twitter.com/_/status/535287117241671681)
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sparverius http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157475
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tantek.com edited /Facebook (+150) "logo, dfn" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /freemyoauth (+320) "add logos" (view diff)
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KartikPrabhu yo!
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GWG Hi, KartikPrabhu
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KartikPrabhu tantek_: re your earlier exploration of <area> http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-11-19#t1416441185303 I had exactly the same idea to do both people-tagging and region based marginalia on photos :P
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KartikPrabhu actually without the p-category
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@justagwailo Starred indieweb/mention-client-php on GitHub https://github.com/indieweb/mention-client-php (twitter.com/_/status/535328552120758272)
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@xtof_fr #indieweb : bricolage á suivre de @AaronGustafson pour activer les #webmentions sur @JekyllRB http:///notebook/2014/enabling-webmentions-in-jekyll/ (twitter.com/_/status/535348867647021056)
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@kevinmarks if you haven't clicked through http://freemydata.co yet, you should try it #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/535355096767266816)
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@DimitrisTzouris RT @kevinmarks: if you haven't clicked through http://freemydata.co yet, you should try it #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/535355228137476096)
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@Freerange_Inc RT @kevinmarks: if you haven't clicked through http://freemydata.co yet, you should try it #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/535355309129469952)
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@ciszek RT @kevinmarks: if you haven't clicked through http://freemydata.co yet, you should try it #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/535355317740007425)
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@deburca RT @kevinmarks: if you haven't clicked through http://freemydata.co yet, you should try it #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/535355769202683904)
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@realHermitian RT @kevinmarks: if you haven't clicked through http://freemydata.co yet, you should try it #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/535362192875720704)
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fiatjaf what about gravatar, but with domain names?
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@steveellwood RT @kevinmarks: if you haven't clicked through http://freemydata.co yet, you should try it #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/535363861088849920)
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/23-merges-and-one-db-migration-http-indiewebcamp linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-11-19/line/1416421555391 (webmention)
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nonboong__ Ouch! {'success': False, 'target': 'http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-11-19/line/1416421555391', 'explanation': 'Status code: 500, Response: {"error":"internal_server_error","error_description":"Incorrect string value: \'\\\\xF0\\\\x9F\\\\x98\\\\x8E.\\\\x0A...\' for column \'name\' at row 1"}
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nonboong__ indiewebcamp.com/irc doesn't like my "foreign" name, aaronpk :)
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@equivalentideas Tantek Çelik - The once and future IndieWeb http://www.youtube.com/ via @instapaper (twitter.com/_/status/535378762573955073)
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GWG pfefferle: The comment_class update is deployed and working on my data.
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pfefferle GWG nice!
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GWG pfefferle: I have to do some coding to take advantage of it though.
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pfefferle asdf
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pfefferle oops :)
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pfefferle GWG i am curious
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GWG pfefferle: How so?
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GWG pfefferle: I was referring to CSS
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GWG But I also want to remove some things it makes unnecessary
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GWG pfefferle: I'm not sure if you looked at the comment plugin code. I overloaded the short_ping argument to create the facepile.
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pfefferle GWG not yet, but will have a look!
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pfefferle GWG what do you think about creating some subpages to describe each plugin a bit more detailed, collect ideas and to brainstorm… like http://indiewebcamp.com/WordPress/webmention for example
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GWG pfefferle: I'm for creating pages, but there were comments about the hierarchy.
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GWG By the way, https://tiny.n9n.us/2014/10/22/726/ - Here is me testing my comment plugin against Sempress
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GWG Re the plugins...
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GWG http://indiewebcamp.com/Semantic_Linkbacks
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GWG http://indiewebcamp.com/Webmention_Plugin
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GWG We already have two top level links
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GWG For example...
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GWG What is the Webmention Plugin?
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Loqi The 'Webmention Plugin' is a WordPress plugin that adds webmentions support to WordPress http://indiewebcamp.com/Webmention_Plugin
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pfefferle GWG oh man… have to visit the wiki more often...
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pfefferle GWG the integration looks awesome!
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pfefferle GWG++
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Loqi GWG has 36 karma
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pfefferle what is Semantic Linkbacks?
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Loqi Semantic Linkbacks is a WordPress plugin that upgrades the presentation of linkback notifications (like Trackback, Pingback, or Webmention*) from the ugly default pingback presentation of "[…] random text excerpt […]" to a much more meaningful and user-friendly display as comments, reposts, likes, and favorites, detected using microformats2 markup from the source of the linkback http://indiewebcamp.com/Semantic_Linkbacks
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GWG pfefferle: The like link is going away in the next revision as the extra function added to semantic linkbacks allows me to show all the likes together.
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GWG As for the wiki, tantek was advocating top level links, as opposed to the /WordPress/___ and I figured...
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pfefferle GWG ok
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david.shanske.com created /Indieweb_Taxonomy (+713) "Created page with "''The '<dfn>[https://github.com/dshanske/indieweb-taxonomy Indieweb Taxonomy] Plugin</dfn>''' is a [[WordPress]] plugin that adds response support to WordPress. It creates a tax..."" (view diff)
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GWG What is Indieweb Taxonomy?
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Loqi The 'Indieweb Taxonomy Plugin' is a WordPress plugin that adds response support to WordPress http://indiewebcamp.com/Indieweb_Taxonomy
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GWG Figured I'd round out the set.
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GWG I will add more to all three, I suppose.
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pfefferle GWG :)
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GWG Pfefferle, what ideas do you have for the future?
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pfefferle GWG I would love to invest some time in the webactions plugin
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pfefferle and to optimize the ”žwebmention for comments“ plugin a bit
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GWG Didn't the spec change for web actions?
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GWG Regarding comments, I had a moderation idea based on something acegiak said.
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notizblog.org edited /Semantic_Linkbacks (+10) "/* Comment Type Indicator */" (view diff)
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fiatjaf.alhur.es edited /User:Fiatjaf.alhur.es (+15) "added webvatar" (view diff)
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notizblog.org edited /Semantic_Linkbacks (+80) "added WordPress directory link" (view diff)
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notizblog.org edited /Semantic_Linkbacks (-3) "fixed typo" (view diff)
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notizblog.org edited /Semantic_Linkbacks (+11) "/* See Also */" (view diff)
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pfefferle GWG yes, the spec changed and I already updated the plugin
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GWG Pfefferle, I was thinking about webmentions moderation
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ben_thatmustbeme was just reading back on the logs a little bit
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ben_thatmustbeme i don't often get time to do that any more
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pfefferle GWG moderation?
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GWG pfefferle: There is a setting in WordPress "Comment author must have a previously approved comment."
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pfefferle GWG yes there is :)
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GWG pfefferle: Was thinking of looking at it from the perspective of approving a URL, not an email as the criteria for a comment author.
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pfefferle GWG good idea
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pfefferle GWG can you file an issue for that?
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GWG pfefferle: Okay.
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pfefferle GWG thanks
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jonnybarnes does tantek have a mobile friendly contact page? I swear I've heard him talk about something like that
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /person-tag (+691) (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme johnnybarnes, yes, a number of people do
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ben_thatmustbeme mine is my uri /contact
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GWG pfefferle: Issue added
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GWG pfefferle: I have a crazy idea.
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davidized.com edited /WordPress (+133) "/* IndieAuth */ WP Link Relationships option for custom menus" (view diff)
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pfefferle GWG thanks
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /person-tag (+403) "/* Ben Roberts */ clarify my thoughts" (view diff)
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GWG pfefferle: Your wordpress-webmention-for-comments plugin, and my Semantic Comments plugin would conflict with each other
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pfefferle GWG why that?
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GWG pfefferle: Don't they both replace the comment template with a custom one?
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pfefferle GWG not in general… I replace only the template on the single view of a comment http://notizblog.org/2014/10/09/meine-linkedin-daten-gehoeren-mir/?replytocom=647397
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pfefferle but you can’t really see it, because it makes a js redirect
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pfefferle you have to disable js first
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GWG pfefferle: That explains why that link didn't work.
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GWG But what are your plans for the plugin?
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pfefferle GWG the support is really basic and I want to expand it a bit
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pfefferle GWG and make it more solid
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GWG pfefferle: Specifically, is it only to support comment threading or do you have other comment enhancements you want to do?
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pfefferle GWG you can reply to comments via WebMention and if someone replys to one of these comments, it will also send webmentions…
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/webmention.io (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/Webmention (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/comments-presentation (webmention)
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GWG pfefferle: Looking forward to that. May have some ideas at some point.
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ben_thatmustbeme !tell tantek, pretty cool idea for tagging people in photos. Just added some ideas on how to accomplish it pretty easily to /person-tag. I braindumped my thoughts before reading the full conversation from last night to see if I got to the same place.
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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pfefferle GWG this is still working in the current version!
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GWG pfefferle: I'm always thinking
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jonnybarnes I think I've got form saving working better on my micropub client
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jonnybarnes https://jonnybarnes.uk/notes/new
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jonnybarnes I've even generalised the js to work on any form on a page in which its included
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jonnybarnes even namespacing the localStorage keys so two forms can have an input with the same id and the keys wont clash
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ben_thatmustbeme oh cool
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ben_thatmustbeme I'll have to try that out later, i've been looking for some way to make offline editing on my phone sane and not keep losing where i was
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ben_thatmustbeme I think that could do a lot for me in that area
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ben_thatmustbeme gah, i just noticed a put a comment after tantek in that tell command....
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pretty blah
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Loqi pretty: ben_thatmustbeme left you a message 15 minutes ago: cool idea for tagging people in photos. Just added some ideas on how to accomplish it pretty easily to /person-tag. I braindumped my thoughts before reading the full conversation from last night to see if I got to the same place.
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ben_thatmustbeme thanks loqi
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Loqi you're welcome
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ben_thatmustbeme sarcasm loqi
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tantek.com edited /freemyoauth (+96) "more visible Twitter button, see also" (view diff)
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tantek.com moved /freemyoauth to /FreeMyOAuth "camelcase for phrase readability"
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+120) "add Instagram" (view diff)
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jonnybarnes ben_thatmustbeme: my form-save.js file has two dependencies, needed is https://github.com/nbubna/store to actually use Web Storage
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jonnybarnes then I used alertify.js to do the auto-save indicator, but you can edit that to your own needs :)
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+125) "add Flickr" (view diff)
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danlyke I use mod_negotiation to do extension-less URLs.
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danlyke Pj. waot. uesterdau
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danlyke Oh, wait, yesterday's conversation. Sorry.
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kylewm wondering if the jekyll <-> webmention.io thing is time prohibitive ... if you have 100 posts, that's 100 requests to webmention.io, seems not great
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tantek.com edited /MediaWiki:Sidebar (-1) "next IWC - will be sometime in 2015" (view diff)
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kylewm (a cool proof of concept, regardless)
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tantek.com edited /events/next-hwc (+0) "next in December" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /next-iwc (-6) "next IWC - will be sometime in 2015" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+214) "add LinkedIn" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme oh, tantek_ is in here, just his handle is hiding with us prols
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ben_thatmustbeme :P
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ben_thatmustbeme the world makes sense again
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme: no that tantek_ is leftover from a browser IRC session
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Loqi tantek: ben_thatmustbeme left you a message 56 minutes ago: cool idea for tagging people in photos. Just added some ideas on how to accomplish it pretty easily to /person-tag. I braindumped my thoughts before reading the full conversation from last night to see if I got to the same place.
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tantek meanwhile I've been adding to /FreeMyOAuth - inspired by freemydata.co
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+143) "add Foursquare" (view diff)
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tantek and Tumblr login doesn't work without JS
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+155) "add Tumblr" (view diff)
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme: the key was figuring out both tag reply posts in general (how to tag *someone else's* post), then with arbitrary objects as well as text (e.g. tagging a person/event/geolocation in someone else's post), and only then figuring out tagging a 2d point/rect on someone else's (presumably photo) post
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ben_thatmustbeme my method would cover those as well, you just use different inputs to media-queries
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tantek you mean media-fragments?
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ben_thatmustbeme s/queries/fragment
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Loqi ben_thatmustbeme meant to say: my method would cover those as well, you just use different inputs to media-fragment
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ben_thatmustbeme this would actually allow you to tag people in video too
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tantek my point is "and only then" that that's a small part of the "tagging posts" use-case
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ben_thatmustbeme well tag anything, plus it is actually what you are referencing, not the photo, but a specific part of the photo
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tantek the 2d/temporal aspects
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ben_thatmustbeme i'd agree, but i don't think any of those others really fit in the same way
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tantek problem is that there is a mismatch between mediafragments and webmention
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tantek webmention -> you link to the *post* you're replying to
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ben_thatmustbeme when you tag category, geolocation, etc, you are tagging the entire photo, not a specific part
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tantek mediafragments -> you link to the *image or other media* you're referencing
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tantek so that doesn't actually work
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tantek that = mediafragments
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tantek doesn't work with webmentions
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tantek we link to HTML permalinks
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tantek mediafragments link to PNG, JPG, OGV, MP3 etc.
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tantek hence why I constructed an actual markup example in IRC yesterday that would be workable
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tantek as part of brainstorming
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ben_thatmustbeme it would only work on "photo" type post, assuming you are only posting one photo per post, OR, you allow processing of actual photos
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tantek before writing it up on the wiki
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tantek it would not work on photo posts either
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ben_thatmustbeme why not?
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tantek because a photo post *expects* replies to link to the *post*
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tantek not the JPG
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tantek see above - webmentions link to HTML permalinks
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tantek not JPGs
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ben_thatmustbeme well, yes, you would link to the photo post
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tantek mediafragments require linking to the JPG or whatever media
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tantek that's my point - the conflict
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tantek makes mediafragments not that useful in practice
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tantek that's part of the problem
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ben_thatmustbeme you think its too much to have people process webmentions that link to actual images, not just posts?
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ben_thatmustbeme and webmention just says URL, it doesn't require a post, people webmentions homepages, which are not posts
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ben_thatmustbeme I'd agree its odd
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tantek but they're still *people's* homepages
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tantek whereas who knows where the JPG is hosted on s3 or whatever
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tantek it's both *awkward* as a publisher
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tantek to have to reply to image
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ben_thatmustbeme but it would have the added benefit of the tag sticking with the photo, you aren't tagging people in a photo in a post, you are tagging them in the actual photo
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tantek *and* more work as receiver
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tantek to have to check to see if the the "target" is on your site
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ben_thatmustbeme mmm, externally hosted images would be a problem
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tantek which, in this case, it's likely not, it's likely on a CDN or something
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tantek right, mediafragments suck for this reason
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tantek and "awkward as publisher" means harder / more fragile
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tantek what I came up with doesn't require *any* change in linking behavior
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thedod /msg NickServ identify 3ksNK2sb
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tantek thedod - you may want to change your nickserv pw
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thedod shiyat
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ben_thatmustbeme you could link to the post of the photo with those media-fragments too, its not without precedent. look at how youtube does media-frags on videos
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ben_thatmustbeme its technically the URL for the video's "post"
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tantek sure - that would be inventing something new
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tantek that's the irony, Youtube's method works in practice
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tantek and was not what got standardized
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tantek which was something no one uses
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ben_thatmustbeme i just think it makes more sense to have the media-frags in the in-reply-to url, as you are not tagging the entire photo, you are referencing one specific part of it. plus links to the page could then highlight the specific tagged person
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ben_thatmustbeme or jump to point in video
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ben_thatmustbeme but it only makes sense with media
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thedod That was stupid.
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ben_thatmustbeme actually, no, its the same as webmention with fragmention that was proposed, you reference the exact part of the post that you are refering to as your in-reply-to
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thedod IRC clients should say "are you sure you meant ' /' and not '/'?"
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thedod ben_thatmust, if I have img id=theimage, then the url is ...#theimage. it's in context.
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thedod imagine a page with a photo of hitler with a caption: bad guy. don't take an example.
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thedod the author doesn't want to remembered as "a source of hitler's photo". it should be in context
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ben_thatmustbeme frowns, thedod, i generally stop listening at hitler/nazi references :P
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thedod s/hitler/darth vader/
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Loqi thedod meant to say: the author doesn't want to remembered as "a source of darth vader's photo". it should be in context
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ben_thatmustbeme haha
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ben_thatmustbeme much better
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Loqi rofl
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thedod or a picture of hitler with caption: don't use this picture as a reference. it's bad taste
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ben_thatmustbeme thedod, what if the img doesn't have an ID?
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thedod we can decide that an indiewebcamp site that wants pictures (or anything) to be referenced should provide Ids to elements (even #p123 for all paragraphs. why not)
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ben_thatmustbeme plus this all seems to assume 1 photo per post, which i think is a questionable assumption. referencing the image ID would be better for that, but what if it doesn't have an ID
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tantek it's solving the common case with a simple solution
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tantek that's the typical way forward
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thedod not at all #img23 is also a valid ID. each h3 etc. at readme pages at github has an id
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tantek when you overdesign for the non-common case, then you never get any reliable adoption off the ground
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ben_thatmustbeme okay, so common case = 1 photo per post
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ben_thatmustbeme i think thats fine
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tantek and multiple photos in a post is better done as a collection of photo posts
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tantek we've already had that discussion many times
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ben_thatmustbeme okay
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ben_thatmustbeme sorry
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tantek silos like FB do it that way too
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tantek even when you think you're uploading multiple photos to a post - FB creates *separate* permalinks for each photo as a post
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ben_thatmustbeme yeah, thats what i was thinking
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tantek that anyone can comment on - just one photo of your presume "set"
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tantek in practice this is where everyone ends up
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tantek the "multiple photos in a photo post" is just not long term workable
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tantek does anyone use Evernote? can you check to see if this URL shows you a list of your authorized applications (and UI to revoke) https://www.evernote.com/AuthorizedServices.action
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ben_thatmustbeme I'm going to have to play with some options. I'll bet i could get this working pretty quickly
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ben_thatmustbeme i'm curious about what other tagging we could do besides person/geo/category
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tantek event
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tantek all of this was figured out (from a UI perspective) by Flickr years ago
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tantek anyone could tag any photo with text, geolocation, event (via upcoming id), and eventually when they added, with people tags too
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tantek just replicating that is definitely more than "good enough"
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tantek especially if we can do so in a peer to peer fashion
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ben_thatmustbeme indeed
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tantek where we can post tag replies to each others posts, and have the tags propagate via webmention
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ben_thatmustbeme so these "comments" are something of an optionally blank, so you could in theory comment at once
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ben_thatmustbeme off to lunch, be back later
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tantek.com edited /OAuth (+96) "logo" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /OAuth (+0) "higher up" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /Template:pagelogo (+75) "make this easier" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Twitter (-20) "use pagelogo template" (view diff)
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tantek anybody here know how to get the list of applications that you've approved to use with Evernote, Pinterest, App.net?
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@amandakelly4 love the POSSE concept - Publish (on your) Own Site, Syndicate Elsewhere. learn more: http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE #HarnessSocialMedia (twitter.com/_/status/535487151744774144)
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tantek.com edited /Flickr (+98) "use pagelogo template" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Foursquare (+90) "pagelogo" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Google (+82) "pagelogo" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Instagram (-7) "use pagelogo template" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /LinkedIn (+116) "pagelogo" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Tumblr (-9) "use pagelogo template" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Tumblr (+73) "use pagelogo template" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /web_hosting (+60) "/* Custom domain silos */ content hosting service" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /content_hosting (+45) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /content_hosting_service (+45) "r" (view diff)
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aaronpk oh man oauth talk? i wanna play
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aaronpk can't right now. busy at the office tho.
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tantek.com edited /Tumblr (+12) "linky linky" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Twitter (+0) "move TOC up" (view diff)
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fiatjaf.alhur.es created /webvatar (+856) "Created." (view diff)
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tantek wat
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tantek whoa that is cool!
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tantek.com edited /webvatar (+79) "dfn, see also" (view diff)
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tantek what is webvatar?
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Loqi Webvatar is a service that provides direct URLs for <img> tags when you have the domain, or website address, of the user http://indiewebcamp.com/webvatar
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aaronpk oh nice! I was hoping someone would make that!
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tantek ooh found authd apps page for Yahoo too
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aaronpk tantek: are you documenting those by chance? I would love that list
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tantek aaronpk, yes - I built a page for it *during* Homebrew Website Club last night because I said, someone should … and then I did it.
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aaronpk tantek++
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+168) "add Yahoo" (view diff)
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Loqi tantek has 124 karma
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tantek I did FB, Google, Twitter last night
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tantek and this morning I added 6 more
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tantek http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth
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aaronpk i have a fun oauth blog post coming soon :)
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tantek do you use Evernote?
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tantek and do you know the URL for App.net authorized applications?
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aaronpk I don't use evernote. app.net URL is https://account.app.net/settings/authorized-apps/
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tantek great
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tantek wow they have a boring logo
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ben_thatmustbeme webvatar, thats pretty cool
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tantek.com edited /Yahoo (+108) "page logo" (view diff)
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aaronpk webvatar++
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Loqi webvatar has 1 karma
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aaronpk it parses home page h-cards I assume?
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tantek.com edited /Yahoo (+8) "move TOC down" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme i think so, it didn't work for my page since i think i don't link it on the home page
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tantek aaronpk - presumably? it should fallback to /icon (rel=icon) support too
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aaronpk is it open source?
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tantek have to ask fiatjaf
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ben_thatmustbeme it doesn't fallback to /icon currently, thats for sure
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aaronpk fiatjaf++
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Loqi fiatjaf has 4 karma
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fiatjaf I just wrote this
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ben_thatmustbeme fiatjaf++
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Loqi fiatjaf has 5 karma
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+180) "add app.net" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /App.net (+114) "page logo" (view diff)
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aaronpk what is FreeMyOAuth?
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Loqi http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth
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fiatjaf I'll do that
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tantek ooh I found NIke+ apps too
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kylewm tantek: evernote is https://www.evernote.com/AuthorizedServices.action
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tantek kylewm: cool - I wanted to make sure someone who used Evernote verified that
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tantek rather than just trust Google
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tantek kylewm: presumably you use Evernote?
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+153) "add Nike+" (view diff)
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tantek I know snarfed uses Evernote ;)
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kylewm tantek: I do, not regularly, but I have an account and use it on occasion
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snarfed laughs
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tantek thanks for verifying the auth'd apps link kylewm
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snarfed fiatjaf++ webvatar is awesome!
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Loqi fiatjaf has 6 karma
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snarfed fiatjaf: i wonder why it doesn't work with my site though
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fiatjaf snarfed: I'm working on this.
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snarfed http://webvatar.alhur.es/snarfed.org goes to robohash :/
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snarfed fiatjaf: ok. let me know if i can help
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kylewm too
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tantek what is robohash?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "robohash" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=robohash
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kylewm but I kinda like my robohash
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snarfed maybe it doesn't support https?
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snarfed kylewm: totally. robohash is fun
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fiatjaf I'm getting a lot of robohashes here, I'm starting to hate them.
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+113) "dfn" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /Free_My_OAuth (+25) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /free_my_oauth (+25) "r" (view diff)
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aaronpk robohash?
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aaronpk oh hahaha
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+145) "add Evernote" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Evernote (+83) "pagelogo" (view diff)
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tantek anybody use Pinterest?
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tantek or maybe an even dozen is enough to post about this
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gregorlove.com created /Gravatar (+236) "stub" (view diff)
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tantek http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth
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tantek what is freemyoauth?
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Loqi Free My OAuth is a page designed to help you find who has access to various silo accounts http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth
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tantek.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+1) "reword dfn a bit" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com edited /webvatar (+15) "/* See Also */" (view diff)
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gRegor` I have Pinterest, rarely use it.
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snarfed tantek: mind if we add more freemyoauth sites? or do you want to keep it to a dozen for your post?
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tantek snarfed - go for it!
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tantek.com edited /webvatar (+0) (view diff)
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snarfed.org edited /FreeMyOAuth (+184) "add wordpress.com" (view diff)
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GWG When did webvatar happen?
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snarfed.org edited /FreeMyOAuth (+133) "add github" (view diff)
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fiatjaf.alhur.es edited /webvatar (+116) "/* Examples */" (view diff)
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aaronparecki.com edited /webvatar (-219) "remove noisy wiki markup since URLs are automatically linked" (view diff)
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snarfed.org edited /webvatar (+47) "/* Examples */ kylewm" (view diff)
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snarfed fiatjaf: thanks for the webvatar https fix!
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snarfed feature request: maybe follow redirects so https sites work even without the explicit https scheme
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snarfed (for use cases where you just have the domain, not full url)
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kylewm fiatjaf++ for webvatar!
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Loqi fiatjaf has 7 karma
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GWG fiatjaf: Is the code up on this?
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GWG This matches something KevinMarks was saying. A service that matched gravatar in functionality/api
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kylewm there's a little bit of a mismatch in that gravatar/libravatar is looking at email addresses
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GWG kylewm: Is there? Just substituting one field for another
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GWG http://en.gravatar.com/site/implement/images/
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aaronpk they're totally different, and not because one uses email IDs and the other web. gravatar actually hosts the images, so people have to have a gravatar account in order to have an icon show up.
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aaronpk webvatar doesn't require anyone to sign up, just looks at their existing website to find the icon. way better.
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GWG aaronpk: My suggestion was to just adopt their usage, not the storage
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aaronpk yes
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aaronpk webvatar++
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Loqi webvatar has 2 karma
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GWG http://en.gravatar.com/site/implement/profiles/
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aaronpk oh yeah forgot that gravatar profile pages are marked up with microformats!
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GWG Such as returning a representative h-card in json
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GWG Essentially a hosted parser
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GWG Anyone want to snap up webvatar.com?
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gRegor` tantek: I have a Pinterest account. Did you need me to look up a URL?
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snarfed gRegor`: i think he wanted to add it to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth
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gRegor` Ok
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tantek gRegor`: is there something in the Pinterest settings to check which apps you've authorized?
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tantek or "connected"?
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gRegor` looking
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gRegor` It's part of the account settings page, not its own permalink (ugh)
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gRegor` https://www.pinterest.com/settings/
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gRegor` freemyoauth is a nice looking page. Good job.
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tantek thanks!
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tantek yeah I want to use direct "obvious" links only
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tantek do you have any connected Pinterest apps yourself?
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gregorlove.com edited /Main_Page (+0) "/* Homebrew Website Club */ next" (view diff)
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tantek gRegor`: while you're there, can you move the 2014 Online IWC description to / href="http://indiewebcamp.com/IndieWebCamps" target="_blank">http://indiewebcamp.com/IndieWebCamps ?
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tantek and then we can leave the 2015 heading there below it
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tantek until we have the first 2015 IWC figured out
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gregorlove.com edited /Events (-3) "mv 11/19 to past" (view diff)
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GWG tantek: Any news on that?
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tantek what is 2015?
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Loqi http://indiewebcamp.com/2015/
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tantek GWG, there you go!
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GWG So, the answer is nothing new?
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GWG Okay
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tantek depends on what you mean by new - I suppose history of /2015/ is a good place to check depending on last time you checked it
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GWG Webvatar makes me wonder if I should put my plans to write functions to get profile pictures on hold.
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aaronparecki.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+110) "remove wiki link icon" (view diff)
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tantek GWG - it's always better to get such things yourself peer to peer than use a spof. Such proxy services are good for bootstrapping your implementation.
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tantek thus if you already have functions to get profile pictures, use them. if not, write their first version using a call to webvatar, and comment how you'd like them to work peer to peer
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GWG tantek: So far, I've been going path of least resistance, then enhancing over time
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@sonething_news A New Service Will Help You Wrest Your Online Identity From Google. http://t.co/RXzKPX0xCS. #Enterprise #IndieHosters #IndieWeb (twitter.com/_/status/535512727692001280)
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GWG But, I don't think webvatar is ready enough, so I may proceed.
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tantek GWG, sounds reasonable on both counts
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aaronparecki.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+61) "tighter spacing" (view diff)
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GWG tantek: The third scenario would be possibly contributing to webvatar to get it to that point.
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tantek nice aaronpk!
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gregorlove.com edited /IndieWebCamps (+336) "/* IndieWebCamp Cambridge 2014 */ started copy from homepage" (view diff)
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michielbdejong https://news.ycombinator.com/newest (IndieHosters)
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gregorlove.com edited /IndieWebCamps (+353) "/* IndieWebCamp Online 2014 */ copy link list from Cambridge" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com edited /Main_Page () "(-1118) /* IndieWebCamp Online 2014 */ rm 2014/Online, now archived" (view diff)
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gRegor` tantek: Done. Looks like there are Schedule and Demo pages, but they're still linked if the participants want to create those.
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gRegor` s/are/aren't/
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Loqi gRegor` meant to say: tantek: Done. Looks like there aren't Schedule and Demo pages, but they're still linked if the participants want to create those.
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@pbeaulieu timely. related to the conversation at this morning's @ibm @AGMconnect #HarnessSocialMedia event http://marketingland.com/forrester-says-marketers-wasting-resources-facebook-twitter-108376 #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/535515078385491968)
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tantek "brands should build their own communities and leverage other social sites" <- Forrester endorses POSSE
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aaronpk nice
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tantek although exception:
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tantek "REI’s Instagram photos deliver almost 3,000 times more engagement per follower than its Facebook posts."
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tantek !!!
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snarfed tantek: sounds suspicious. i wonder if that's partly because ig surfaces 100% of their posts to followers, but fb surfaces way fewer
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aaronpk why is that an exception? that sounds like leveraging!
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kylewm michielbdejong: logged into hacker news for the first time in like a year to upvote
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michielbdejong kylewm: yay, thanks!! :)
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michielbdejong it's really cool Wired wrote about us
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kylewm yeah! that's great
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Loqi Welcome, indie-visitor! Set your nickname by typing /nick yourname
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tantek what is indiehosters?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "indiehosters" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=indiehosters
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tantek what is indiehosting?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "indiehosting" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=indiehosting
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@SubhuTech A New Service Will Help You Wrest Your Online Identity From Google: Google and Facebook… http://www.wired.com/2014/11/indie-hosters/ #Enterprise #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/535519485151563777)
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tantek what is indie hosters?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "indie hosters" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=indie+hosters
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tantek Known folks are live on video: https://plus.google.com/events/cato9chtopjo3lqtr6hphcjh8j8
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tantek benwerd's mentioning tagging as we discussed last night
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Pierre-O Still need to create these pages :)
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tantek oh man I need to write this up
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aaronpk it's recoreded right? i can't watch right now but would love to
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tantek hopefully?
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gRegor` Should be, yeah
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gRegor` The dots underneath are interesting. jump around in the stream?
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gRegor` Oh, voting!
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gRegor` That's cool. The dots are viewer sentiment based on voting up or down
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tantek drafts!
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tantek what is scheduled?
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Loqi scheduling in the context of the indieweb, refers to the feature of setting a specific time for a post to be published in the future http://indiewebcamp.com/scheduled
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tantek :)
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gRegor` Are ben and erin doing these streams weekly/monthly?
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aaronpk michielbdejong: hey you made it to the front page! Just saw the article come through in the irc channel!
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aaronpk oh nice, it's by klint!
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tantek !tell benwerd,erinjo can you put the Known meetup at Mozilla Paris on the /Events page? Thanks!
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek aaronpk - yes, it's recorded and they're putting it on stream.withknown.com
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aaronpk nice
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gRegor` aaronpk: the video is recorded
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ben_thatmustbeme yep, hangouts on air, wonder if IWC Online influence that choice at all
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@IndieHosters #indieweb here we come: http://www.wired.com/2014/11/indie-hosters/ (twitter.com/_/status/535524040757501952)
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michielbdejong aaronpk: yes! we were really lucky with that.
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michielbdejong I suddenly realized yesterday that Klint had written about all my crowdfunding campaigns so far, about Unhosted on ReadWrite, and about "Terms of Service; Didn't Read" on TechCrunch.
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aaronpk nice. yeah he likes the whole anti-corporate angle.
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michielbdejong So I offered him the exclusive story, and he checked with his editor at Wired, and so we did the whole interview last night
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michielbdejong yes.
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@g33konaut I believe in the IndieWeb - so I supported @indiehosters and you should, too! https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/indiehosters #indiegogo via @indiegogo (twitter.com/_/status/535524721404551168)
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michielbdejong we postponed our IndieGoGo launch from 9am EU time to 9am pacific, to give Wired the "scoop", hehe
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michielbdejong oh wow, first donation! :)
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@IndieHosters RT @g33konaut: I believe in the IndieWeb - so I supported @indiehosters and you should, too! https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/indiehosters #indiegogo via @indiego… (twitter.com/_/status/535524991522320384)
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@t What apps have #outh access to your accounts? I created this page help: http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth Inspired by ... http://tantek.com/2014/324/t1/apps-oauth-access-accounts-freemyoauth-oauth (twitter.com/_/status/535525802428080128)
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tantek oops typo
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@t What apps have #oauth access to your accounts? I created this page help http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth Inspired by ... http://tantek.com/2014/324/t1/apps-oauth-access-accounts-freemyoauth-oauth (twitter.com/_/status/535526280431960066)
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@patrick_mooney RT @t: What apps have #oauth access to your accounts? I created this page help http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth Inspired by ... http://tantek.com/2014/324/t1/apps-oauth-access-accounts-freemyoauth-oauth (twitter.com/_/status/535526510891778049)
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@kevinmarks RT @t: What apps have #oauth access to your accounts? I created this page help http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth Inspired by ... http://tantek.com/2014/324/t1/apps-oauth-access-accounts-freemyoauth-oauth (twitter.com/_/status/535527900737716225)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/repost/twitter/t/535526280431960066/535526510891778049 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/535526280431960066/2576431 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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@t “brands should build their own communities & leverage social sites” @forrester http://marketingland.com/forrester-says-marketers-wasting-resources-facebook-twitter-108376 #indieweb #POSSE (ttk.me t4ZE2) (twitter.com/_/status/535529330374619139)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/535526280431960066/153571843 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/repost/twitter/t/535526280431960066/535527900737716225 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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@tomwiththeweath RT @t: What apps have #oauth access to your accounts? I created this page help http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth Inspired by ... http://tantek.com/2014/324/t1/apps-oauth-access-accounts-freemyoauth-oauth (twitter.com/_/status/535531847296774147)
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thedod aaronpk, do webmentions at indiewebcamp wiki go thru moderation?
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aaronpk no
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thedod e.g. the 3 around http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-11-20/line/1416498039496
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aaronpk it's all automatic
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tantek aaronpk - 14 Oauth providers so far - we'll see if anyone adds any more: http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth
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aaronpk nice
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tantek I'm pretty pleased with how well it looks on mobile too
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tantek very tappable icons
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thedod so how come http://localhost:8000/#Webmention doesn't show my webmention from today?
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thedod oops
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tantek heh
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thedod I think I just answered that
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aaronpk no moderation, but it obviously doesn't report webmentions that are invalid (source doesn't link to target for example)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/repost/twitter/t/535526280431960066/535531847296774147 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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thedod aaronpk, I meant http://bl.ocks.org/thedod/raw/78b14341e39ca0d09131/23f17a64325cb314f373cf602a68ed79b1c107e4/#Webmention
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thedod looks at log
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aaronpk what am I looking at?
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thedod this shows webmention.io of /Webmention
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aaronpk ahh
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thedod http://bl.ocks.org/thedod/78b14341e39ca0d09131 also has the readme below the thing
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aaronpk this is the https/http thing again
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aaronpk webmention.io treats them as different pages
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thedod no
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thedod this one tries them both
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tantek.com edited /Nike+ (+95) "pagelogo" (view diff)
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thedod https://gist.github.com/thedod/78b14341e39ca0d09131#file-script-js-L1
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aaronpk oh hah
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tantek.com edited /Nike+ (+8) "move TOC below photo" (view diff)
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thedod this version is iframe-ready. you just change the constants at the top, and it can fit any webmention.ionized site
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thedod ah.
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thedod {'success': False, 'target': 'https://
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thedod indiewebcamp.com/Webmention', 'explanation': 'Status code: 500, Response: {"error":"internal_server_error","erro
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thedod r_description":"Incorrect string value: \'\\\\xF0\\\\x9F\\\\x98\\\\x8E.\\\\x0A...\' for column \'name\' at row 1
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thedod "}'}
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tantek.com edited /GitHub (+244) "pagelogo, expand dfn" (view diff)
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thedod it's becase of my "foreign" name :)
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aaronpk oh man. i thought i fixed that.
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aaronpk utf8 in mysql is weird
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aaronpk so it's getting to IRC but not storing in the DB
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reedstrm thedod takes the bullet for testing utf-8 compat for us all.
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tantek.com edited /WordPress (+167) "/* WordPress.com hosting service */ local logo" (view diff)
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thedod I once did a pull request "doesn't break on emoji" and people were like ZOMG, so now we're gonna have them?
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tantek slowly backs away (again), re: utf8 mysql weird DB.
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aaronpk :)
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KartikPrabhu :)
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thedod tantek, how far away is the nearest wall (or balcony) anyway?
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KartikPrabhu speaking of DBs! aaronpk how does p3k relate comments to a post in its file storage
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aaronpk KartikPrabhu: for every URL in p3k, there's a file on disk that stores its mentions. the file format is a yaml array
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KartikPrabhu gotcha! and for notes do you save both the original plain text and the auto-linked/processed content?
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aaronpk no, it's autolinked/processed each request
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KartikPrabhu cool! thanks
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aaronpk i think i store that in memcache, but not actually sure if i disabled that or not
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KartikPrabhu since I lost my local dev version sql table, I am taking this chance to move everything to file storage
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aaronpk :)
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thedod trying to mention with a "normative" name
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aaronpk "ascii" is a better description
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finchd aaronpk: https://stream.withknown.com gives me a self-signed cert for *.squirming.net not the *.withknown.com cert :(
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aaronpk oops. that's benwerd tho, not me
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gregorlove.com edited /events/2014-12-03-homebrew-website-club (+13) "/* RSVP */" (view diff)
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/webmention.io (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/Webmention (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/comments-presentation (webmention)
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gregorlove.com edited /events/2014-12-03-homebrew-website-club (+10) "/* URLs */" (view diff)
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/webmention.io (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/Webmention (webmention)
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thedod the first round failed
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/comments-presentation (webmention)
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thedod now I also changed the blog name. no more UTF8
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aaronpk it's still getting a utf8 error, trying to store the contents of the post
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thedod I see now
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thedod and the weird thing is that I think it used to work
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thedod checks
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thedod I'm not senile yet: http://bl.ocks.org/thedod/raw/78b14341e39ca0d09131/23f17a64325cb314f373cf602a68ed79b1c107e4/#2014/Online
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thedod maybe it remembers my name from then (same domain)
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thedod and it's utf-8
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thedod at the moment https://dubiousdod.org/indie/ is innocent of utf-8
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thedod both title and author are "normative"
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aaronpk it's the little 😎 after "private"
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thedod ZOMG
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aaronpk because of the implied p-name matching your whole page for some reason
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aaronpk if you set a better p-name to not include the footer of your site it'll work better
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thedod brb
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/webmention.io (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/Webmention (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/comments-presentation (webmention)
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thedod \o/
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thedod http://bl.ocks.org/thedod/raw/78b14341e39ca0d09131/23f17a64325cb314f373cf602a68ed79b1c107e4/#Webmention
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thedod I think I'll leave the site's name like this
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thedod nevertheless, aaronpk, if you ever want to test weird characters, I'm here for you
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aaronpk sweet
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thedod btw, I sometimes have Hebrew content like https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/no-1-the-but-like-i-said-is-fresh-the-rest-can-be
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thedod but I don't know anyone who both reads hebrew and accepts webmentions :)
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gRegor` Sounds like the utf8mb4 issue http://indiewebcamp.com/mysql#Full_UTF-8_Support
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aaronpk yep that's the one
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thedod ah. so that's how grownups say "doesn't break emoji"?
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gRegor` thedod: Not sure the context, but maybe?
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/535526280431960066/108312839 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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tantek <area> support is coming to mf2py! https://github.com/tommorris/mf2py/commit/a46497e52efb3903177bfad32e53361098755de6
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KartikPrabhu dope!
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KartikPrabhu bleh why can't I out a <div> in a <p>!
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KartikPrabhu s/oout/put
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Loqi [mention] https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/like-of-freemyoauth linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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rascul i've been reading /photo and i'm a little confused about where in a photo post should the <img> and the caption be
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KartikPrabhu in e-content
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rascul ok, i have them both in there now
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rascul see for an example https://rascul.io/boosie/in-bed-with-toys
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gRegor` KartikPrabhu: Cause dems the HTML rules. :)
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rascul i did recently just have issues because i was trying to put <div> in a <p> heh
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KartikPrabhu whether an element is inline or block should be CSS not HTML! this is a outrage
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gRegor` Depending what you're trying to do, put a <span> in the <p>, display: inline-block on the span
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gRegor` Haha, outrage? :)
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rascul in my case it was weird because of how it was being generated, but i just changed the generator to make it work right
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KartikPrabhu yeah I want a paragraph to contain block level math, but can't do that :(
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Loqi gives KartikPrabhu a paragraph to contain block level math
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KartikPrabhu sematically the math is in the paragraph
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tantek KartikPrabhu: yes it is strange and yes it is broken.
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gRegor` You can with a span
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tantek big problem in HTML
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tantek and we can't fix it due to content / compat
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (+1135) "/* one-off person-area-tag reply to photo */ steps." (view diff)
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KartikPrabhu judas priest! so i have to add classes to distinguish inline math and block level math... sheesh
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gRegor` Is it part of the paragraph, or is it more of a figure associated with a paragraph?
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KartikPrabhu it is part of the paragraph if you look at it from a reading POV
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gRegor` Hm
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gRegor` All you need is one class, actually, since inline is implicit
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KartikPrabhu gRegor`: good point
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KartikPrabhu ok I'll do that
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KevinMarks_ re pinterest, the link is https://www.pinterest.com/settings/#apps
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tantek gRegor`: could you verify that link ^^^ takes you directly to your list of authorized apps for Pinterest?
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kevinmarks.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+120) "add pinterest" (view diff)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/535526280431960066/139199211 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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@kevinmarks RT @IndieHosters: #indieweb here we come: http://www.wired.com/2014/11/indie-hosters/ (twitter.com/_/status/535551612509769728)
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tantek What is IndieHosters?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "IndieHosters" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=IndieHosters
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@kevinmarks RT @t: “brands should build their own communities & leverage social sites” @forrester http://marketingland.com/forrester-says-marketers-wasting-resources-facebook-twitter-108376 #indieweb #POSSE (ttk.me t4ZE2) (twitter.com/_/status/535551815182721024)
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gRegor` tantek: It tries to take me to that anchor in the page, yes. It's still the whole settings page.
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tantek but does it at least scroll to the list of apps?
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gRegor` I have zero apps authorized and it's bottom of the page, so the anchor doesn't show *just* apps
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tantek but if you make the window small?
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gRegor` tries again
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@ayirpelle RT @t: “brands should build their own communities & leverage social sites” @forrester http://marketingland.com/forrester-says-marketers-wasting-resources-facebook-twitter-108376 #indieweb #POSSE (ttk.me t4ZE2) (twitter.com/_/status/535552961531764738)
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KevinMarks_ I have an app authed (Home by Facebook) and it works
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gRegor` Yeah, it scrolls.
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tantek great! thanks gRegor` and KevinMarks
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tantek always nice when the block of icons lines up again, even mod 3 number
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gRegor` At least on the first load. Something AJAXy makes it not work if I try to refresh
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/535526280431960066/758056 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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@garyturner RT @t: “brands should build their own communities & leverage social sites” @forrester http://marketingland.com/forrester-says-marketers-wasting-resources-facebook-twitter-108376 #indieweb #POSSE (ttk.me t4ZE2) (twitter.com/_/status/535553904780787712)
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gRegor` Odd. Scrolls to the anchor, then removes #apps from the address bar. No redirect that I can tell from the inspector
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gRegor` Manually addeing #apps a second time does nothing.
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thedod aaronpk, why do I get 404 on https://webmention.io/api/mentions?jsonp=jQuery1110022154156504612021_1416521616423&target=https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Fevents%2F2014-12-03-homebrew-website-club&_=1416521616424
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thedod used to work
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fiatjaf.alhur.es edited /webvatar (+509) (view diff)
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Loqi [mention] https://kylewm.com/2014/09/greasemonkey-script-to-replace-indie-actions-with-links-to-my-site linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/webactions (webmention)
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snarfed webvatar.com!
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snarfed fiatjaf++ i love how small and contained the source is
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Loqi fiatjaf has 8 karma
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snarfed https://github.com/fiatjaf/webvatar/blob/master/main.py
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/rsvp/facebook/27301982/952591281437660/506306793 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-12-03-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/rsvp/facebook/27301982/952591281437660/27301982 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-12-03-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
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@TheRealDod Showing off the newest https://dubiousdod.org/indie/2014/11/announcing-webmentiondressing-https-gist-github-com theme for #IndieWebCamp webmentions https://twitter.com/TheRealDod/status/535561760129187841/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/535561760129187841)
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@kevinmarks @lunalindsey I like @benwrd's idea of the #indieweb of things - webpages for your gadgets (twitter.com/_/status/535561888789045248)
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kylewm.com edited /Template:kylewm (-14) "experiment with using webvatar" (view diff)
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bear wow - webvatar is a great idea - nicely done fiatjaf !
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bear fiatjaf++
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Loqi fiatjaf has 9 karma
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rascul yeah webvatar is nifty
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rascul fiatjaf++
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Loqi fiatjaf has 10 karma
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/535526280431960066/18299065 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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bear a great example of why I don't like twitter cards - I use ghostery to block all ad tracking items and that combined with firefox blocking mixed content items means that the twitter posts referenced in the story do not show up at all -- https://secure.marketwatch.com/story/ashton-kutcher-is-kinda-ok-with-uber-digging-dirt-on-journalists-2014-11-19#
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fiatjaf snarfed: I hope it is not too much bugged
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snarfed fiatjaf: you did the right thing! do the smallest amount of work that gets *something* working, then iterate
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bear @ftrain has a great article about the web, html5 and the history of both - http://www.newyorker.com/tech/elements/group-rules-web
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rascul i feel like i should add checkins next to my site
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rascul leaflet looks interesting for showing map of where i checkin at
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fiatjaf rascul: are people using geojson for this kind of task?
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aaronpk leaflet is good if you want a zoomable map
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rascul fiatjaf i have no clue
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aaronpk if you just want to show a single point on an image, you can use this https://github.com/aaronpk/Static-Maps-API-PHP
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aaronpk http://static-maps.pdx.esri.com/img.php?marker[]=lat:45.5165;lng:-122.6764;icon:small-blue-cutout&basemap=gray&width=400&height=240&zoom=14
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aaronpk my site uses that API and downloads a copy that is stored on disk, so it's always served from a static image that lives on my server
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rascul aaronpk interesting, i may end up using that
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bret fiatjaf++
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Loqi fiatjaf has 11 karma
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bret great idea on webvitar
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aaronpk for example the image here https://aaronparecki.com/metrics/2014/11/20/091942/ is actually on my server
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bret webvatar*
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rascul i'm not really sure if i want to use a static map image or a zoomable map like from leaflet so i'm looking at different options
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bret embed a static map and enhance it with a leaflet in JS
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kylewm aaronpk: I might like to switch to that from Leaflet, are there any particular restrictions on usage?
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kylewm oh wait I get it. I could self-host the script and it just uses public tilesets. that's awesome, nice work aaronpk!
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gregorlove.com created /webvitar (+22) "r" (view diff)
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aaronpk yep. the restrictions will depend on the tileset that you use
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tantek what is webvitar?
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Loqi Webvatar is a service that provides direct URLs for <img> tags when you have the domain, or website address, of the user http://indiewebcamp.com/webvitar
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tantek what is webitar?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "webitar" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=webitar
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tantek what is webatar?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "webatar" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=webatar
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gRegor` Maaaan
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tantek what is wavatar?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "wavatar" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=wavatar
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aaronpk wavatar is a great name
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gRegor` Don't try to out-tantek a tanteker
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gRegor` :)
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tantek is done.
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gRegor` What is whatitar
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "whatitar" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=whatitar
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gregorlove.com created /webitar (+22) "r" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com created /webatar (+22) "r" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com created /wavatar (+22) "r" (view diff)
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bret crap wrong twice: webvatar *
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gRegor` web-sitar
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gregorlove.com created /gravatar (+22) "Redirected page to [[Gravatar]]" (view diff)
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gRegor` Fixed my (third party, rather old) anti-spam plugin yesterday and so far today, 200 spam comments blocked, 0 getting through.
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tantek what kind of plugin for what kind of CMS?
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gregorlove.com created /Akismet (+241) "stub" (view diff)
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gRegor` ^ on Nucleus CMS
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tantek Nucleus runs Akismet?
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tantek I thought that was wordpress only
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gRegor` Akismet is available for all sorts of CMS. Drupla, Joomla, etc.
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gRegor` It's a REST API. It does require a wordpress.com API key, but they're free.
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gRegor` *free for non-commercial sites
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gRegor` Drupla, heh
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gRegor` Just wanted to rhyme. Yeah, that's it.
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gRegor` The code was basically their example here: https://akismet.com/development/api/#comment-check
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gRegor` I think fsockopen was failing on my shared host for some reason. In my logs I had a lot of blank responses. I just updated it to use cURL instead
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/t/535526280431960066/15435193 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (webmention)
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gRegor` And a sanity double-check, in case a blank response is ever received, consider it spam. The old code didn't do that part.
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gRegor` I'd much rather let cURL build my HTTP headers, thanks. haha
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@dj_hematite "One person starting IndieWeb today equals one person leaving Facebook or Twitter tomorrow" (!!!) https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/indiehosters @IndieHosters (twitter.com/_/status/535579849772265472)
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@BillSeitz RT @t: “brands should build their own communities & leverage social sites” @forrester http://marketingland.com/forrester-says-marketers-wasting-resources-facebook-twitter-108376 #indieweb #POSSE (ttk.me t4ZE2) (twitter.com/_/status/535581117148307456)
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gregorlove.com edited /Akismet (+370) "Supported Platforms + API" (view diff)
mko joined the channel
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gregorlove.com edited /Akismet (+20) "Automattic reference" (view diff)