#indiewebcamp 2014-12-10

2014-12-10 UTC
#
tantek alright I think I have both inline and block versions of alternatives to Markdown's ugly hyperlinking and image syntax figured out
#
tantek with less noisy punctuation
tilgovi joined the channel
#
tantek wow just realizing that original markdown has no syntax for hyperlinking an image
carlo_au and joshwnj joined the channel
#
@djp1974 @stefdirusso @austinkleon's approach is good: has his own site & channels to Tumblr etc - #indieweb on horizon 4 me, but just doing is key (twitter.com/_/status/542471764467777536)
pwcc joined the channel
#
tantek rather than coding anything IG specific, I think I'll work on adding support for this: http://tantek.pbworks.com/w/page/59905776/Markdown#Hyperlinkedimages
#
tantek where the POSSE tweet copy would only see the hyperlink URL and not the image nor its alt text
#
tantek going to do a test one by hand
#
snarfed tantek: just thinking out loud…an alternative would be to attach the image to the tweet
michielbdejong joined the channel
#
tantek snarfed - I was thinking about that - however then it would be disconnected from the hyperlink
#
snarfed if you want to control when, you could attach it iff it has u-photo
#
snarfed yeah you'd want to include both
#
tantek whereas what I'm trying to do is a linked image
#
tantek the "attaching" breaks that association
#
snarfed well, it weakens it at least
#
tantek if at some point I do photo posts then yes, POSSEing those photos to Twitter makes sense
#
tantek but this is more of a hyperlinked u-featured image rather
#
snarfed understood
#
tantek besides this is good, it's pushing me to implement a much simpler and nicer looking (in plain text) alternative to markdown
#
snarfed nice!
#
snarfed (plug: bridgy publish converts u-photo to attached image for twitter. if/when you get there, feel free to use that as a polyfill until you implement twitter images yourself)
#
tantek that's a great idea - I may very well do that for POSSEing photo posts
lukebrooker, pdurbin and KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
tantek tommorris here's an example of what I'm talking about: http://tantek.com/2014/343/t1/fastest-trail-marathon-relay-time-workout (note the auto-linked link, the auto-embeded image, and the parenthetical alt-text below it)
#
tantek perfectly readable and meaningful without any confusing markdown syntax garbage
#
tantek my new code will simply hyperlink the *image* instead of displaying the link of the URL as a hyperlink, and put the alt-text inside the alt-attribute
#
tantek and either way the expected Twitter POSSE behavior is to only pass along the URL to be hyperlinked: https://twitter.com/t/status/542482373674561538
#
@t The fastest trail marathon relay team: http://instagram.com/p/wSZg-QA9XJ with them for free. #justshowup @Nov_Project_SF (ttk.me t4ZZ1) (twitter.com/_/status/542482373674561538)
#
tantek and not the image inside the hyperlink nor the alt-text, since Twitter notes are too limited to do such things
#
snarfed tantek: good run! tangent, but i did the 5k. lots of fun. https://snarfed.org/2014-12-07_11859
#
pwcc Cld I ask a n00b question about discovery re:multiple posts to a silo from a single source post?
#
snarfed pwcc: just ask :P
#
pwcc This post from brad frost could be puty into a silo as live tweeting a talk - http://bradfrost.com/blog/post/andy-clarke-at-smashing-conference/
#
snarfed pwcc: maybe multiple syndication links? http://indiewebcamp.com/rel-syndication
#
pwcc Is it possible to point multiple tweets to a single post with the .u-syndication
#
snarfed sure
simonv3 joined the channel
#
tantek snarfed - that is an awesome time!!! Great job. I'm still working towards a ~25min 5k even on flat ground. I was pretty happy with 1:17 though for a leg of the Marathon Relay. (~10k+)
#
pwcc snarfed: thanks, started writing a plugin on the weekend & wanted to make sure :)
#
snarfed pwcc: fair warning though, a
#
snarfed er, sorry
#
snarfed pwcc: fair warning though, bridgy doesn't support more than one synd link per silo per post right now
#
snarfed tantek: thanks, and congrats!
#
tantek pwcc u-syndication is for pointing from a post *to* syndicated copies (e.g. tweets)
#
tantek it is a bit odd to point to multiple tweets if they're not all "entire" syndications
#
tantek KevinMarks does something vaguely similar with his NoterLive - may want to check that out
#
pwcc snarfed @tentek: thanks guys, still trying to figure this out. will look into NoterLive
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu tantek: bridgy publish POSSEs photos from notes btw example: https://kartikprabhu.com/notes/crispy-salmon
#
tantek KartikPrabhu: yes I know - snarfed was suggesting I do that ;)
#
tantek.com edited /Falcon (+316) "/* Working On */ autolink embed hyperlink images" (view diff)
shiflett and tilgovi joined the channel
#
PMurphs so I'm a bit out of touch, and I'm exploring other options for viable CGI languages for a project. are people still just using PHP/Perl mostly?
#
PMurphs if so that makes me kind of sad
#
colintedford What's the project?
danlyke_ and mdik_ joined the channel
#
aaronpk PMurphs: why CGI?
#
aaronpk afaik nobody uses the CGI modules for ruby or node, they run the app directly and maybe use a front-facing web server like nginx or apache to proxy to it
#
aaronpk plenty of node/ruby/python stuff going on here though
snarfed, j12t and mlncn joined the channel
#
PMurphs colintedford: need an intermediary between a mobile app and database.
#
PMurphs as well as any external services it may need to interface with
#
PMurphs most things use SOAP these days though, and p much everything can do that
simonv3 joined the channel
#
colintedford PMurphs: for your website?
#
PMurphs this is unrelated to iwc btw
#
colintedford Ah, OK. Might not be the best channel then :) but have you looked around the wiki?
#
PMurphs Not yet. setting up an indieweb thinger has been on my list of projects to do, but holy damn is that list long lmao
#
PMurphs but I'll check out the wiki, thanks man
#
colintedford Haha, they tend to get that way.
#
PMurphs yeah. #1 on priority and expense is my car :P
#
PMurphs gotta order a new rotating assembly, get that motor built, rebuild the diff, buy a new transmission, call in some favors with some welder bros and machinists to get everything reinforced and installed
#
colintedford Fun :)
#
PMurphs brotip: car dudes tend to be bad at computers, you can get some good favor exchanges going
lupinedev joined the channel
#
colintedford I lucked into a family car dude.
#
colintedford reidab: your original question you may or may not find inspiration rummaging around /projects in the wiki.
#
colintedford Oops, re: not reidab:
#
colintedford reidab: indieweb thinger are you starting from scratch or do you have a site already?
#
colintedford Agh, sorry reidab, IRC client's messing w/ me. re:^
#
PMurphs oh lmao
#
PMurphs yeah I'd be starting from scratch but I might end up using/working on ben_thatmustbeme's project, 'cause I have a decent amount of experience with opencart and his code style
#
colintedford Cool.
#
colintedford You can always put up some plain ol' HTML pages if you get achin' for a site but don't have much time.
#
colintedford & revise later
#
@bjimeneziii Talk Night: IndieWeb, Trends in PHP, OpenStack - Hack Sonoma County (Sebastopol, CA) - Meetup https://www.linkedin.com/slink?code=bKqiWSx (twitter.com/_/status/542519825696710656)
lukebrooker, j12t, snarfed, simonv3, addal, yaso, scor, gRegor`, KevinMarks, verdi_, lupinedev, Haxxa and tantek joined the channel
#
thedod Sorry about the bug, WebmentionDressing @ https://zzzen.com/420/ works again. Behold the funky timestamp you get if you webmention @ XX:20 (+-3 min) :)
lukebrooker and lupinedev joined the channel
#
@xtof_fr Pour bricolage ou projets #indieweb, joli cadeau de @dhg : #design framework pur #CSS - Skeleton 2.0 .. http://xtof.withknown.com/2014/pour-bricolage-ou-projets-indieweb-joli-cadeau-de-dhg-design (twitter.com/_/status/542575167566647298)
elima, joshwnj, simonv3, loic_m and michielbdejong joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu can urls be part of urls? use-case: given a syndication url I am trying to make my website redirect to original post. My URL is of the type: https://kartikprabhu.com/original-of/https://twitter.com/kartik_prabhu/status/539727406471589888 but it seems this is not allowed and my server get the syndication-url with only https:/ one slash. What is the right way to do this?
#
@kartik_prabhu I decided to write a short-ish rant about the science in sci-fi. more: https://kartikprabhu.com/article/science-in-science-fiction (twitter.com/_/status/539727406471589888)
#
KartikPrabhu see ^ even Loqi is confused
#
Loqi who, me?
#
KartikPrabhu yes you
wolftune joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu also better URL design suggestions are welcome
j12t and elf-pavlik joined the channel
#
finchd KartikPrabhu: is there need to incode the protocol and domain of the original? I'm pretty sure the '://' is not allowed in the rest of the URL; maybe you can get it down to: original-of/status/53#### if the domain (twitter, maybe "domain" isn't the right word for it) and user are assumed or sent/stored another way?
#
KartikPrabhu finchd: encoding the twitter URL is a possible way out, but then it isn't copy-paste friendly which is what I'd like.
#
KartikPrabhu Maybe having a query parameter auto-encodes it. will have to test it
#
KartikPrabhu finchd: also I was hoping to do a fell swoop code for twitter an G+ so a URL of the type /status/id would be very Twitter -specific
#
finchd yeah, probably go want to keep the twitter.com/ and forward, to keep it as generic as possible
friedcell, joshwnj and verdi_ joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu finchd: yes. that is a good suggestion, except I'd like a URL design that you can just copy-paste the Twitter URL into
#
finchd sure, just dropping the /https:// will be enough to make it work, and copying the tail 'twitter.com/kartikprabhu/status/###' should be enough in most browsers, right?
#
KartikPrabhu possibly yes. But then it would need more backend work on my part than just matching strings exactly :P
ben_thatmust, j12t, lukebrooker, petermolnar, joshwnj, LauraJ, Garbee and adactio joined the channel
#
bear use the ?r=http... and then escape the parts that are not valid
#
bear see the links from google search for an example
#
KartikPrabhu bear: so a query parameter does the URL encoding for you yes?
#
bear you can escape the :// and other bits to hide it
#
bear https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCAQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2F&ei=2xGIVIm2F4z_gwTjvIHQBw&usg=AFQjCNFlMeLUjfYqY_8opQ1YXQGJnqUDDQ&sig2=iRa-zdjodJo4rFa1fNQgAw&bvm=bv.81456516,d.eXY
#
KartikPrabhu i see. i'll try it out
#
bear see how google uses &url=http%3a...
stream7 joined the channel
#
bear so you would hve /original-of?url=...
#
KartikPrabhu so it seems I can use a query parameter and then URL decode it and match my strings
#
bear yes
#
bear and urllib has the decode/encode pair to do that for you safely
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
bear urllib.quote("https://foo.com")
#
KartikPrabhu yup. I know that. cool
#
bear :) k
#
KartikPrabhu bear++ neat thanks
#
Loqi bear has 49 karma
#
bear yvw
#
bear re-hibernates
#
KartikPrabhu bear your nocturnal habits are apparent :P
#
bear yea, it's been a very busy month (and it's only 10 days in)
#
bear was just helping some EU timezone devs, now to take a nap and wake up for the east coast devs
alanpearce joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu tell me about it! I have no idea where 2014-11 went
#
bear yea, I think november experienced time dilation
#
KartikPrabhu as a physicsts I might disagree. but as a human I do agree :P
#
bear :) - I was wondering if you were going to let me get away with that one ;)
#
bear o/ - laterz
#
KartikPrabhu bear: night!
joshwnj and j12t joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu adactio: in case you don't get notifications for webmentions: https://kartikprabhu.com/original-of/https://twitter.com/kartik_prabhu/status/539727406471589888 :D
#
@kartik_prabhu I decided to write a short-ish rant about the science in sci-fi. more: https://kartikprabhu.com/article/science-in-science-fiction (twitter.com/_/status/539727406471589888)
#
KartikPrabhu poo
#
KartikPrabhu adactio: https://kartikprabhu.com/notes/mustard-cutting-adactio yeah this one
Sebastien-L, KartikPrabhu, joshwnj, michielbdejong, lukebrooker, elf-pavlik_, sanduhrs, adactio_, elf-pavlik, elima, adactio, j12t, Deledrius, mlncn, simonv3, friedcell, shiflett, verdi_, danlyke_ and scor joined the channel
#
Loqi [mention] http://www.pearltrees.com/nicoxbus/html5/id2739825/item128196388 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/fragmention (pingback)
reedstrm, sanduhrs, Sebastien-L, michielbdejong, LauraJ, shiflett, fiatjaf, scor, snarfed, j12t, kerosene, alanpearce_, refnum, gRegor`, chalettu, Pea1 and verdi_ joined the channel
#
GWG Good morning, campers
j12t and tantek joined the channel
#
reedstrm Morning, GWG
#
GWG Morning reedstrm.
#
GWG Anything indienew and exciting there?
#
GWG I feel like it has been slow in here lately. Must be the season
j12t joined the channel
#
danlyke Yeah, I'm giving a talk on IndieWeb stuff to Hack Sonoma this evening, but haven't had a chance to prep as much as I'd like because: Home improvement. ugh.
#
GWG I have been working on my apartment for 14 years
#
GWG Ot will be perfect some day
#
GWG Then I will have to move
#
GWG My website is the same way
mlncn-agaric joined the channel
#
tantek the escaping of URLs in a query param the way Google does it is super ugly
#
tantek also - good morning #indiewebcamp!
#
GWG Hi, Tantek
#
tantek hello GWG
#
tantek reads logs
#
tantek !tell KartikPrabhu,bear the escaping of URLs in a query param the way Google does it is super ugly
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
#
tantek anybody in touch with the person who got webmentions working with their Drupal 7 call?
Aeyoun, wolftune and verdi_ joined the channel
#
@kidehen Link: <#this>; rel="webmention" == <> <webmention> <#this> . Two notations representing the same Relation. #RDF #LinkedData #SemanticWeb (twitter.com/_/status/542740154797264896)
voxpelli joined the channel
#
tantek !tell danlyke feel free to use any of my slides CC-BY if that helps for your presentation tonight!
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
#
danlyke tantek, thanks!
#
Loqi danlyke: tantek left you a message 13 minutes ago: feel free to use any of my slides CC-BY if that helps for your presentation tonight!
shiflett, friedcell, snarfed, j12t, verdi_ and richardlitt joined the channel
#
Loqi [mention] http://tedcurran.net/2014/12/09/posse-blog-center-digital-life/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE (pingback)
#
Loqi [mention] http://tedcurran.net/2014/12/09/posse-blog-center-digital-life/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE (pingback)
KartikPrabhu and Pea1 joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu Loqi playback
#
Loqi KartikPrabhu: tantek left you a message 2 hours, 16 minutes ago: the escaping of URLs in a query param the way Google does it is super ugly
#
Loqi who, me?
#
tantek KartikPrabhu: for a positive example, see how h2vx.com does it
#
KartikPrabhu tantek: yes. so any other suggestions
#
KartikPrabhu oh hmm
#
KartikPrabhu tantek: but that only seems to do the domain name part
#
KartikPrabhu as in h2vx.com/vcf/tantek.com
#
tantek no it does a full path
#
tantek including domain name
#
tantek where did you get the impression it was domain name only?
#
KartikPrabhu well the example here: http://h2vx.com/vcf/
#
tantek yes that UI says "Web address: "
#
KartikPrabhu oh nope. yeah it does full path :)
#
KartikPrabhu so i should get rid of the https:// part and match the rest
#
tantek IMO yes. It makes the URL much more readable
#
tantek probably a good pattern to add to /URL_design if you agree
#
tantek maybe FAQ?
#
tantek How to design a URL with a URL inside?
#
aaronpk what about https vs http?
#
tantek h2vx accepts the "https://" before the domain if you want that
#
tantek otherwise it implies http:
verdi_ and snarfed joined the channel
#
@rhiaro .@benwerd is talking about @withknown at @techmeetup this evening. I didn't know Known targeted education #indieweb https://twitter.com/rhiaro/status/542771412722016257/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/542771412722016257)
#
kartikprabhu.com edited /URL_design (+446) "/* FAQ */ url-ception" (view diff)
#
tantek What is URLception?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "URLception" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=URLception
mdik, mlncn-agaric, verdi_, j12t and pauloppenheim joined the channel
#
@benwerd RT @rhiaro: .@benwerd is talking about @withknown at @techmeetup this evening. I didn't know Known targeted education #indieweb http://t.co… (twitter.com/_/status/542783417394688001)
#
@sillygwailo Known was able to receive a Webmention sent by Drupal. http://r13n.com/2014/webmention-in-drupal I needed microformats implemented on the Drupal site. (twitter.com/_/status/542784643351601152)
#
@kevinmarks RT @rhiaro: .@benwerd is talking about @withknown at @techmeetup this evening. I didn't know Known targeted education #indieweb http://t.co… (twitter.com/_/status/542784714365358080)
#
snarfed afternoon campers
#
@sillygwailo The 2.x branch of the Vinculum module https://github.com/sanduhrs/vinculum/tree/7.x-2.x does not implement receiving of Webmentions yet. (twitter.com/_/status/542784863502204928)
friedcell, Pea1 and richardlitt joined the channel
#
@drupalnation RT @sillygwailo: Known was able to receive a Webmention sent by Drupal. http://r13n.com/2014/webmention-in-drupal I needed microformats implemented on the Dru… (twitter.com/_/status/542787736219168768)
KartikPrabhu, tantek and verdi_ joined the channel
#
tantek afternoon snarfed!
#
snarfed hi!
#
tantek still blown away by your level of ownyourdata - and for how long
#
snarfed tantek: aww thanks!
#
tantek way to set a high bar for the rest of us to aspire to!
#
snarfed i remember how happy (and kinda intimidated) i was when i found iwc. i'd been trying to do it myself for a while, but hadn't really thought it through, and you all had.
#
snarfed glad to be here!
#
tantek.com edited /own_your_data (+0) "/* Tantek */ .typo" (view diff)
#
tantek seriously happy you found us and stuck with us
#
snarfed warm fuzzies!!!
#
tantek not only technically, but also really appreciate how much you've helped with general community management and dynamics stuff
#
tantek I've certainly been learning :)
#
KartikPrabhu hugs all around!
#
snarfed thanks for the kind words tantek! you definitely do me too much credit in that arena, esp since the baby has meant i've been around less recently
#
snarfed regardless. hugs!!!
#
tantek is considering taking extra vacation around end of the month to implement posting reposts and likes as a replacement for his remaining Twitter "posting" usage, however infrequent.
KartikPrabhu1 joined the channel
#
snarfed cool!
#
tantek 2015-01-01 will be 5 years of owningmynotes
#
snarfed nice
#
snarfed fair warning, for me at least, owning likes and faves made me sink a *lot* of work into streamlining the UX for that, since i do them so often compared to posts/replies
#
snarfed (and it's still 3-4 clicks/taps and 10-20s, compared to one and <1s in the silos)
#
snarfed so prioritize accordingly
#
tantek interesting. well for starters my UX will consist of "copy & paste and write markup for a like/repost"
#
tantek and have the rest of Falcon handle displaying and POSSEing them correctly automatically at permalinks
#
snarfed manual until it hurts!
#
tantek my initial heavy-duty design work will go into *displaying* likes/reposts
#
tantek on my own site. and then how to best POSSE them.
#
tantek especially the challenge of how (if?) to POSSE likes/reposts of things *other* than tweets and indie posts with tweet copies.
#
KartikPrabhu i do that thusly: https://twitter.com/kartik_prabhu/status/539257925630693376
#
@kartik_prabhu likes: http://vimeo.com/108650530 more: https://kartikprabhu.com/notes/wanderers-erik-wernquist (twitter.com/_/status/539257925630693376)
#
tantek snarfed, hate to say it, but every note and blog post in these past almost 5 years has been "manually" edited/written
#
tantek KartikPrabhu: I've thought about using a different Twitter account for POSSEing such likes and reposts of non-tweets.
#
KartikPrabhu and here is the G+ version of that like: https://plus.google.com/117114060857732496623/posts/M3EF6fZcZb2
#
tantek like adactio has @adactioLinks
#
KartikPrabhu hmm yeah that could be useful, but I wouldn't want to maintain 2 twitter accounts :P
#
tantek it's not really maintainence, just setup
#
KartikPrabhu what is silo tax?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "silo tax" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=silo+tax
#
KartikPrabhu hmmm
#
KartikPrabhu reminds me, i have to write a G+ sucks rant
#
aaronpk that doesn't really require a rant imo :P
#
tantek KartikPrabhu: perhaps channel rants into dry criticisms on /Google+ ?
#
tantek then you can focus on writing positive things on your own site instead :)
#
KartikPrabhu aaronpk: ha! only a note then not article :P
#
KartikPrabhu tantek: I don't mind having negative things on my site
#
tantek speaking of dry criticisms - has anyone contacted the Webmention in Drupal guy? http://r13n.com/2014/webmention-in-drupal and does our /Drupal page need updating?
#
tantek https://twitter.com/sillygwailo/status/542784643351601152
#
@sillygwailo Known was able to receive a Webmention sent by Drupal. http://r13n.com/2014/webmention-in-drupal I needed microformats implemented on the Drupal site. (twitter.com/_/status/542784643351601152)
#
tantek aaronpk, while you're here, you should add yourself to https://indiewebcamp.com/own_your_data#IndieWeb_Examples
#
aaronpk oy. can't right now.
#
aaronpk cool new section tho
#
tantek I can stub one for you if you can answer a few simple questions
#
aaronpk just started a meeting then running off to an event. back online tomorrow
#
tantek ok fair
#
tantek have you only POSSEd to Twitter since you started posting notes to your own site? or do you sometimes Tweet directly from one of their clients?
#
tantek aaronpk - oops I think I found a URL bug on your site - your oldest note permalink redirects to a 1970-01-01 calendar! http://aaronparecki.com/2012/232/note/1
#
tantek should redirect apparently to http://aaronparecki.com/notes/2012/08/19/1/indieweb
#
tantek oh boy - something really broken with your permashortlink redirect too! check out the TwitterCard/box preview on the tweet POSSE copy: https://twitter.com/aaronpk/status/237344101928951808
#
@aaronpk Alright, if all goes well, this message will be posted to my site and syndicated to Twitter... #indieweb http://aaronparecki.com/notes/2012/08/20/1/ (twitter.com/_/status/237344101928951808)
#
tantek.com edited /own_your_data (+411) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ start Aaron Parecki section based on his first note which was POSSE'd, therefore possible (likely?) start of ownyournotes instead of twitter" (view diff)
#
danlyke Anyone else syncing with Facebook? I saw some rumblings that they were disabling stand-alone apps, and now FBCMD is giving me errors and behaving weirdly. I'm getting along by slaving Facebook to Twitter and just pushing everything to Twitter, but it'd be nice to have the rest of their API...
richardlitt joined the channel
#
tantek danlyke I suggest using Bridgy Publish to FB.
#
tantek works great and the maintainer is a real nice guy. :)
#
@hellekin @dosch the #fediverse's working decentralized social Web-based systems: @GNUsocial, #Friendica, #RED, #Pump, @MediaGoblin, D*, @indiewebcamp (twitter.com/_/status/542804839269687298)
#
tantek nearly none of which talk to each other
#
tantek I think GNUsocial<->Friendica, and Pump<->MediaGoblin but that's it.
#
KartikPrabhu but it is the fediverse!
#
tantek more like the fedipelago
#
tantek bunch of (mostly) disconnected islands
#
KartikPrabhu haha
#
danlyke tantek, I like what I've heard about Brid.gy, but I'm way more interested in services I'm running on my own hardware, for all of the silo arguments...
#
tantek danlyke I believe you can deploy Bridgy Publish on your own hardware as well
#
tantek and I understand the *bottleneck* (SPOF) arguments. Bridgy itself is not a silo.
shiflett joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu yeah bridgy is completely open source and so your should be able to run your own instance
#
snarfed yup. danlyke: go for it! e.g. on http://www.appscale.com/ . feel free to ping me with any q's
#
danlyke Oh, cool! Okay, I'll put that on my list.
#
snarfed another option might be ifttt, i bet lots of new people here could use it to POSSE to a number of silos without any code
#
danlyke And, yeah: If I have active copies of it, I have trouble distinguishing "silo" from "single point of failure". I have cron jobs grabbing and archiving my Twitter feed every hour or so, but ...
#
snarfed e.g. trigger on RSS/atom
lukebrooker joined the channel
#
tantek danlyke - right, *external* SPOF in particular
#
gregorlove.com edited /own_your_data (+110) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ adding myself" (view diff)
#
danlyke Exactly. In the current application, aside from a little bit of selectivity (which of the external sites I publish to), using Brid.gy as a hosted service is essentially the same as using Twitter.
#
tantek gRegor`: is http://gregorlove.com/2002/01/1/ really an article? looks more like a /note to me
#
snarfed danlyke: if you just mean POSSE-as-a-service, then yes
#
snarfed but just in that sense
#
gRegor` I'd argue yes. I had no concept of notes at that time. I was blogging earlier, but those earlier posts are likely lost in some static HTML files somewhere.
#
tantek danlyke - quite different - especially in terms of commercial vs. not, nasty TOS vs. not, history of mistreating developers vs. not etc.
#
KartikPrabhu and whether it has your content or not too :P
#
tantek wow this is a fascinating /archives display that I have never seen before http://gregorlove.com/archives/
#
snarfed btw, confirmed, ifttt looks like a fast, easy way to get started automatically POSSEing. e.g. https://ifttt.com/recipes/search?q=feed+facebook
#
snarfed what is ifttt
#
Loqi IFTTT is an abbreviation for IF This Then That, and is a spof for performing (semi?)-automated actions using feeds https://indiewebcamp.com/IFTTT
#
snarfed good
#
gRegor` Thanks, tantek. it's inspired by tumblr's archives.
#
tantek Tumblr's archives have lots of different presentations
#
tantek I've not seen one like the simple but elegant design you've made
#
snarfed.org edited /IFTTT (+88) "recipes link" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /own_your_data (+0) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ sort gRegor to top by date of first ownyourdata" (view diff)
#
gRegor` The tumblr /archive URL is what I'm referring to. I haven't dived into tumblr in a while, but it looks like it's largely stayed the same. http://npr.tumblr.com/archive/
#
gRegor` But yeah, I went for a cleaner, calendar-style layout
#
tantek.com edited /archive (+27) "/* gRegor Morrill */ note the beautiful design" (view diff)
colintedford joined the channel
#
tantek I'm a fan of interesting / novel visualizations / presentations of sparse time blocks - and yours is definitely a nice approach
#
gRegor` Thanks
#
danlyke tantek, snarfed: yeah, I know y'all, and know you've got hearts in the right place, but I was also on a first name basis with ev back in the day, and know folks on the Twitter API team... If I'm not directly paying for the service, I put no particular faith in it.
#
gRegor` Shucks. :)
#
KartikPrabhu to be fair/negative gRegor`s archives could use some responsive-ness
#
gRegor` My entire site could.
#
snarfed danlyke: understood!
#
tantek what is free?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "free" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=free
#
gRegor` KartikPrabhu: It should also be cached. :)
#
KartikPrabhu oh you generate the whole archive each time?
#
gRegor` Responsive has been in the back of my mind; didn't even know what it was at the time I launched this design. :)
#
gregorlove.com edited /User:Gregorlove.com (+39) "/* Interests */ responsive" (view diff)
#
gRegor` And now it's officially on the list
#
tantek.com created /free (+339) "stub with dfn, criticism" (view diff)
#
gRegor` KartikPrabhu: Yeah, it's a db query.
#
KartikPrabhu gRegor`: most of your site design looks responsive ready, might have to jangle the archives a bit though
#
tantek.com edited /free (+22) "see also business models" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /free (-3) "Unreliable" (view diff)
#
gregorlove.com edited /User:Gregorlove.com (+51) "/* Interests */ caching" (view diff)
#
tantek danlyke: reasonable criticism. added: https://indiewebcamp.com/free#Unreliable
#
tantek danlyke, is "unreliable" a reasonble dry rewording of "no particular faith in it" ?
#
tantek.com edited /business-models (+27) "see also free" (view diff)
#
gRegor` Yeah, I will probably make the archives a collapsible <ul> for mobile
#
KartikPrabhu or just stack the boxes
#
GWG Did someone say POSSE as a service?
#
KartikPrabhu but that will make for a long list
#
tantek the boxes naturally stack after a certain number
#
snarfed GWG: yup
#
tantek what is POSSE as a service?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "POSSE as a service" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=POSSE+as+a+service
#
gRegor` A long list isn't a problem
#
KartikPrabhu what is PAAS?
#
Loqi PAAS (Platform As A Service) is a hosting environment typically for a web applications written in scripting languages (python, ruby, node) and usually offers simplified setup and maintenance tools compared to a VPS https://indiewebcamp.com/PAAS
#
KartikPrabhu hmm
#
tantek.com moved /PAAS to /PaaS "canonical caps"
#
tantek.com edited /PaaS (+6) "fix lowercaps and examples wikilinks" (view diff)
#
GWG Snarfed, I keep saying I will let Bridgy take over my POSSE
#
tantek.com created /Google_App_Engine (+24) "r" (view diff)
#
snarfed GWG: i keep saying i'll let you! :P
#
GWG Snarfed, I keep procrastinating.
#
snarfed so current examples of posse as a service include…ifttt, bridgy publish, and ironically FB and twitter
#
danlyke tantek hmmm... I'm looking for a word a little bit more towards "Mutable" from "Unreliable". Unpredictable?
#
snarfed and many others
#
tantek danlyke - feel free to edit - did my best to quickly capture
#
danlyke tantek, will ponder it.
#
snarfed danlyke: even paying for something doesn't really guarantee you qualitatively more than something free
#
tantek feel free to change it immediately if you have a medium pref for using something other than "Unreliable"
#
snarfed i'm guessing you mean you only trust (long term) services you personally operate?
#
GWG When Google Reader shut down, I found myself looking for a replacement.
#
tantek Google Reader was free
#
tantek what is free?
#
GWG With a third party service, you always risk it shutting down
#
Loqi free could refer to no charge, or freedom, as in the freedom to fork an open source project, and ship it yourself https://indiewebcamp.com/free
#
danlyke snarfed: yeah. I mean really it's "trust with what?", as I don't really put a whole lot of value in the stuff that gets pushed to Twitter or Facebook, but if I'm going to have to write code to implement and debug it, I want to do that once.
#
GWG Tantek, but mu hosting provider could go out of business.
#
tantek.com edited /free (+101) "consequence: site-death sooner" (view diff)
#
danlyke I have code that hasn't been touched in a decade and a half, and I like code like that.
#
tantek GWG - at least your hosting provider has *some* business
#
GWG Just being paid doesn't mean it will be there forever
#
tantek such absolute comparison arguments are of little utility
#
snarfed absolutism—
#
snarfed shadesofgray++
#
Loqi shadesofgray has 1 karma
#
snarfed aww
#
tantek wonders where defaulting to dichotomy framed based reasoning is taught / learned.
#
KartikPrabhu everywhere
#
snarfed (human nature)
#
gregorlove.com edited /Template:twitter-link (-4) "update twitter image URL" (view diff)
#
www.flutterby.net user:danlyke edited /free (+109) "/* Unreliable */" (view diff)
#
tantek snarfed - I'd lean more towards nurture than nature on that one.
#
GWG Isn't the important part data Portability so if a service dies I can roll with it?
#
danlyke GWG hosting providers are commodities. If a hosting provider gives me a machine/vm, or will let me run Perl CGIs and a few cron jobs, I can migrate to it.
#
gRegor` hm
#
GWG That is how I treat Bridgy
#
GWG If snarfed shut it down, I could download the code and replace it.
#
danlyke Yeah, so I may as well download it and run it locally now...
#
GWG Snarfed, please don't make me do that though.
friedcell joined the channel
#
snarfed not today at least
#
GWG snarfed, you would give notice.
#
snarfed :P yes
#
GWG You seem that sort of person
#
GWG On just have so much I want to do. Bridgy allows me to focus on other things
#
gRegor` "Bridgy is going away tomorrow!" ;)
#
snarfed GWG: yay, that was the hope
#
snarfed gRegor`: sadly possible. the main threat is that silo(s) could shut it off
#
snarfed e.g. https://snarfed.org/2013-07-09_twitter-atom-is-back
#
snarfed i don't expect that anytime soon though
#
colintedford \
#
gRegor` Oh, I just meant it jokingly, that you got tired of us/it. :)
#
snarfed hah
#
GWG snarfed, notice all the plugins I built start by assuming manual data entry
#
GWG I am writing to cover the possible demise of anything
#
GWG Automatic is always phase 2
j12t joined the channel
#
GWG snarfed, if I could ever return the favor of Bridgy, I would.
#
tantek GWG, consider that you're "paying it forward" as a friendly and helpful member of the WordPress Outreach Club :)
#
snarfed GWG: tantek: oh man, hell yes
#
tantek and since that comment about absolute comparison struck a nerve :) https://twitter.com/t/status/542814233919234049
#
@t Absolute comparison arguments are of little utility. E.g. * two sides to … * either … or * fair & balanced #spectrums (ttk.me t4Z_1) (twitter.com/_/status/542814233919234049)
#
GWG Tantek, I was going to offer to buy him a beverage.
#
gregorlove.com edited /own_your_data (+17) "/* gRegor Morrill */ /me has" (view diff)
#
GWG And my commitment to the Wordpress Outreach Club is unwavering
#
tantek GWG++
#
Loqi GWG has 39 karma
#
tantek did we ever get Dan Gillmor fixed up?
#
GWG I remember someone tweeted him to offer help
#
snarfed GWG: oh i remembered how people should pay me back for bridgy! file bugs, bump bugs you've filed that i haven't gotten to, and ideally even tackle one yourself :P
#
@schnarfed @t hear hear! (…i also love the irony of advocating nuance and shades of gray on twitter. the medium is the message; #indieweb FTW!) (twitter.com/_/status/542816603558006784)
#
tantek adding to FAQ
#
tantek what is Bridgy?
#
Loqi Bridgy is an open source project and proxy that implements backfeed as a service https://indiewebcamp.com/bridgy
#
snarfed tantek: thanks! e.g. https://www.brid.gy/about#cost
#
tantek.com edited /Bridgy (+408) "/* FAQ */ How can I pay for Bridgy" (view diff)
#
tantek snarfed, for your review: https://indiewebcamp.com/Bridgy#How_can_I_pay_for_Bridgy
#
snarfed tantek: lgtm, thanks!
amblin, richardlitt, mlncn-agaric, pwcc and simonv3 joined the channel