#indiewebcamp 2015-02-19

2015-02-19 UTC
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aaronpk k. found the bug anyway
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aaronpk you should be using a client_id regardless, but it shouldn't be throwing 500 errors
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Loqi it is probable
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snarfed yup
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ben_thatmust !tell gRegor` I'm doing it from both
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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kylewm hehe, that'll make sense out of context
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snarfed aaronpk: remind me, you said you're trying to standardize all multi-valued micropub properties on array syntax?
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aaronpk yeah
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snarfed and it looks like the only ones that support multiple values right now are category and syndicate-to?
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snarfed ie micropub doesn't support e.g. multi-reply right now?
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aaronpk that sounds right
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snarfed (fine with me, just checking)
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gRegor` ben_thatmust: How are you doing it from web?
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Loqi gRegor`: ben_thatmust left you a message 25 minutes ago: I'm doing it from both
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aaronpk multi-reply is a good point
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aaronpk there aren't many of us even publishing multi-replies yet, but that seems like another good one for potential array values
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GWG snarfed: So the note..will be more careful.
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snarfed GWG: ?
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GWG snarfed: Syntax error
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snarfed aaronpk: or technically multi-like, multi-repost, etc
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snarfed since all mf2 props are multi-valued
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snarfed anyway not urgent
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snarfed GWG: ah. np! shit happens
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snarfed testing++
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Loqi testing has 4 karma
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snarfed one reason i like unit tests. should add them to the micropub plugin
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GWG snarfed: Got a good article on unit testing? I probably should learn that.
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GWG snarfed: I think I'm getting better though
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aaronpk i was getting in the habit of writing good tests. mostly just for my libraries though, not full apps.
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KevinMarks GWG: http://www.diveintopython3.net/unit-testing.html
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GWG I'm writing PHP, KevinMarks
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KevinMarks resists obvious joke
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KevinMarks this is a good article on unit testing and why you do it
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KevinMarks translating it into PHP would be a good exercise
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GWG Okay. Just checking
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snarfed GWG: i'd learn the concept first, then figure out how to do it in any specific language
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snarfed KevinMarks++
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Loqi KevinMarks has 84 karma
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KevinMarks that one by mark explains the idea of test-first development well
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GWG I'm trying to decide when I might be able to up my assessment of my programming ability from horrible to adequate.
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snarfed pro tip: don't assess your programming ability :P
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snarfed just build stuff
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aaronpk snarfed++
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Loqi snarfed has 88 karma
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GWG I am. I need to test Bridgy Publish capability in Syndication Links tonight.
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snarfed great!
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snarfed oh actually aaronpk re multi-replies, bridgy publishes them fairly often for twitter
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snarfed just fyi
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aaronpk how so?
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aaronpk oh you mean the bridgy permalinks are multi-replie?
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snarfed yeah
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aaronpk true
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snarfed well all of them i guess, since they're in-reply-to both the original and silo posts
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aaronpk hm that isn't really a multi-reply though
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snarfed eh debatable, yeah
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snarfed but for twitter also sometimes multi-tweet
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snarfed https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/217
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snarfed example in https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/217#issuecomment-49098272
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@5easypieces @SkyBrand I feel like this fear is somewhat overblown, but reinforces my sense that the #indieweb community is on the right track. #jhumda (twitter.com/_/status/568227552239722497)
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ben_thatmust gRegor` I found a chrome addon that does it for me
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ben_thatmust and i usually only run it when i'm on chrome at work, so it worked out
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@kylewm2 @anildash @t collected a lot more on a wiki, and I use it all the time http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (twitter.com/_/status/568228095699718145)
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Loqi [mention] Kyle Mahan commented '@anildash @t collected a lot more on a wiki, and I use it all the time indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth' on a post that linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (https://kylewm.com/2015/02/anildash-t-collected-a-lot-more-on-a-wiki-and-i-use)
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ben_thatmust !tell gRegor` https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/google-play-lastfm-scrobb/llpepekkleeoeiloijhcafgpjdnhhcbl?utm_source=chrome-app-launcher-info-dialog
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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kylewm.com edited /FreeMyOAuth (+146) "add Dropbox (prompted by https://twitter.com/anildash/status/568225195682631681) and update Foursquare icon" (view diff)
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@5easypieces @SkyBrand More on the #indieweb here: http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2014/04/25/indiewebcamps_create_tools_for_a_new_internet.html #jhumda #musetech (twitter.com/_/status/568230459827724288)
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Loqi [bridgy] Joe Pezzillo favorited a tweet that linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/FreeMyOAuth (https://twitter.com/kylewm2/status/568228095699718145)
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aaronpk GWG: does it sound right that the semantic-linkbacks plugin sets 4 commentmeta properties? "semantic_linkbacks_source" "semantic_linkbacks_canonical" "semantic_linkbacks_type" "semantic_linkbacks_avatar"
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GWG aaronpk: Yes.
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aaronpk thx
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@MsBLovesART @SkyBrand I agree with @5easypieces on the sensationalism here. Migrating tech has to evolve, too. #indieweb looks promising and interesting (twitter.com/_/status/568238151233372160)
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@brinkerf RT @5easypieces: @SkyBrand I feel like this fear is somewhat overblown, but reinforces my sense that the #indieweb community is on the righ… (twitter.com/_/status/568238989880094720)
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@brinkerf RT @5easypieces: @SkyBrand More on the #indieweb here: http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2014/04/25/indiewebcamps_create_tools_for_a_new_internet.html #jhumda #musetech (twitter.com/_/status/568241863666196480)
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KartikPrabhu loqi playback?
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Loqi :)
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@kevinmarks @mkramer some indieweb tips here http://indiewebcamp.com/Jekyll (twitter.com/_/status/568305575055863808)
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pfefferle good morning
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Loqi pfefferle: GWG left you a message 11 hours, 47 minutes ago: I am done for now.
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pfefferle !tell GWG updated!
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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pfefferle snarfed are you around?
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pfefferle !tell snarfed how do you identify the user that actually posts via micropub? what do you think about replacing Micropub::authorize(); with a do_action(”žmicropub_authorize“); ?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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pfefferle !tell snarfed you/we could replace nearly all static function calls with actions or filters so they will be extendable…
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
michielbdejong, alanpearce, eschnou, hidgw, friedcell, tantek, glennjones, Pierre-O, petermolnar, LauraJ, thehighfiveghost, frzn, lukebrooker, nothingrandom, krendil, interactivist, Sebastien-L, stream7, adactio, marclaporte, scor, elima_, KartikPrabhu and pfefferle joined the channel
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Loqi [bridgy] Melody Joy Kramer favorited a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/Jekyll (https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/568305575055863808)
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@martinlindner @AKDigiGes ja, unbedingt. euro müsste sich zum os-powerhouse erklären, imho eh einzige chance: not > tugend. sucht auch mal nach #indieweb. (twitter.com/_/status/568389889873608704)
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Loqi [mention] Ben Roberts commented 'It was held because I use Webmention + Vouch. I have since added you to my whitelist so you will always get through.' on a post that linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/vouch (https://ben.thatmustbe.me/note/2015/2/19/1/)
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GWG Good morning, all.
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Loqi GWG: pfefferle left you a message 5 hours, 28 minutes ago: updated!
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david.shanske.com edited /WordPress_Plugins (+3) "/* POSSE Plugins */" (view diff)
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david.shanske.com edited /Getting_Started_on_WordPress (+51) "/* Syndicate your content to other sites */" (view diff)
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david.shanske.com edited /User:David.shanske.com (-89) (view diff)
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GWG !tell pfefferle Pushed another minor change to Indieweb
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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michielbdejong I'm getting a bit worried about the Trovebox shutdown, hopefully we can get people's data out in time https://twitter.com/jmathai/status/568317749597851648
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Loqi michielbdejong: tantek left you a message on 1/21 at 10:11am: yes it worked! I got a 202 with that same curl command and the like showed up: https://michielbdejong.com/2015/joining-the-indie-web-my-motivation-cc-by-michiel-de-jong#comments Thank you for updating the Troubleshooting!
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@jmathai @michielbdejong an email should have went out. Checking on the status of that. (twitter.com/_/status/568317749597851648)
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@martinlindner @AKDigiGes gilt schon noch (= #indieweb). jedenfalls gibt es neue cottage/platform-strukturen. ob das #Uber-mäßig sein muss, glaub ich nicht (twitter.com/_/status/568408089856229376)
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notizblog.org edited /Template:pfefferle (+6) (view diff)
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snarfed pfefferle: actions and filters sound good!
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Loqi snarfed: pfefferle left you a message 8 hours, 22 minutes ago: how do you identify the user that actually posts via micropub? what do you think about replacing Micropub::authorize(); with a do_action(”žmicropub_authorize“); ?
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snarfed except maybe for authorize, since it's part of the protocol
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Loqi snarfed: pfefferle left you a message 8 hours, 18 minutes ago: you/we could replace nearly all static function calls with actions or filters so they will be extendable…
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snarfed unless you meant choosing which *wordpress* user it uses…?
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snarfed michielbdejong: sounds like a job for archive team!
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pfefferle snarfed but it would be nice if it is kind of a chain, so you might be able to implement other IndieAuth compatible services...
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Loqi pfefferle: GWG left you a message 2 hours, 31 minutes ago: Pushed another minor change to Indieweb
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snarfed pfefferle: hmm. the indieauth protocol does allow auth providers other than indieauth.com
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snarfed …but micropub requires the indieauth protocol. https://indiewebcamp.com/micropub#Authentication
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ben_thatmustbeme good morning #indiewebcamp
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pfefferle snarfed: if ”žbundled“ login doesn’t work, try … and if this does not work, try next…
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snarfed pfefferle: right, i understand the idea, it's just that micropub requires the indieauth protocol. it doesn't currently allow falling back to anything else
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pfefferle snarfed yes, but as far as I know IndieAuth is the same as RelMeAuth… and works with every rel-me+OAuth enabled service… am I wrong?
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pfefferle snarfed I thought IndieAuth.com is only one possible implementation...
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snarfed ah. i think they are all related, yes, but not exactly the same
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pfefferle it is not very indy if I can’t choose another one
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snarfed right!
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snarfed actually, maybe i misunderstand. you're talking about the micropub plugin's use of tokens.indieauth.com?
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pfefferle yes
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snarfed so you want to allow delegating to a different token provider?
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pfefferle yes
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pfefferle for example
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snarfed ok, sure. sorry, i misunderstood
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pfefferle and if it is an action or filter, it is possible to overwrite the default
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snarfed sure! sounds good. that's basically https://github.com/snarfed/wordpress-micropub/issues/5
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pfefferle yes :)
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pfefferle GWG is always faster ;)
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snarfed pfefferle: have you tried the plugin?
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pfefferle not yet… very busy at the moment… I became a father last december ;)
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snarfed congratulations!
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pfefferle thanks :)
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snarfed we have a 5 month old, i can commiserate
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pfefferle I read it at your blog :)
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pfefferle congratulations too!
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snarfed thanks!
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michielbdejong snarfed: yes, I also proposed maybe getting the Archive team involved in the Trovebox shutdown https://github.com/photo/frontend/issues/1570
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pfefferle but back to business… how do you identify the local user? or does wordpress allow posts without defining a user?
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michielbdejong for now we're trying to give people the option to move their instance to IndieHosters
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michielbdejong so far, 2 people signed up for that.
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snarfed pfefferle: it defaults to the "current" user. not sure how that's determined
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pfefferle that means you need a valid session?
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pfefferle snarfed I think I have to run some tests this weekend
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snarfed pfefferle: i don't think so
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snarfed (er, re "valid session")
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pfefferle snarfed does that mean that everyone is allowed to post micropubs to your site if he has a token atm?
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snarfed pfefferle: sure, that's what a token for. just like if someone has a facebook token for your account, they can post as you on fb
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snarfed see 'post_author' on http://codex.wordpress.org/Function_Reference/wp_insert_post#Parameters
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pfefferle snarfed but how can I secure my installation?
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snarfed pfefferle: sorry, i don't understand the question
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snarfed your installation of the plugin? your installation of a client?
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pfefferle if there is no combination between a token and a user, everyone that get’s a token, can post
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snarfed ahhhh sure. that's a difference between micropub and wordpress. micropub generally expects a site is single user; wordpress allows multiple
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snarfed you could set up rel=me and log into indieauth as different paths under the domain for each user
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snarfed or you could plug in a new token generator that supports wp users
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snarfed i'd happily merge a PR that added a filter to change the user!
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pfefferle snarfed what do you think about something similar to https://wordpress.org/plugins/indieauth/
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pfefferle it uses the website of the user to identify him…
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snarfed oh i see, i misunderstood your question
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snarfed it does currently check that the token's web site matches your web site: https://github.com/snarfed/wordpress-micropub/blob/master/micropub.php#L159
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snarfed er, sorry, https://github.com/snarfed/wordpress-micropub/blob/master/micropub.php#L154
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kylewm !tell emmak hey I noticed in-reply-tos in your h-feed are parsing a little strangely. you may want to use "u-in-reply-to" or "p-in-reply-to h-cite"
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell her that when I see her next
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@LukasRosenstock Interesting thoughts from @aaronpk on #quantifiedself and "the #indieweb of things": http://aaronparecki.com/articles/2013/10/11/1/the-future-of-quantified-self-devices?utm_content=buffera3861&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer (twitter.com/_/status/568466347010740224)
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aaronpk did I call it the "indieweb of things"? I didn't think so!
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kylewm you got urchin tracker'd!
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aaronpk i should make my site send an http redirect if it notices the utm params..
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Loqi yea
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kylewm !tell snarfed I'm not seeing u-in-reply-to on tweets in activitystreams-unofficial. twitter-activitystreams returns json output {..."context": { "inReplyTo": {"url":...}}}, but I *think* the micformats formatter is only looking for {"inReplyTo":{"url":..}}. is that plausible?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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snarfed kylewm: huh. maybe! let me see….
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Loqi snarfed: kylewm left you a message 5 minutes ago: I'm not seeing u-in-reply-to on tweets in activitystreams-unofficial. twitter-activitystreams returns json output {..."context": { "inReplyTo": {"url":...}}}, but I *think* the micformats formatter is only looking for {"inReplyTo":{"url":..}}. is that plausible?
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snarfed looks like context has been there since 2012.. https://github.com/snarfed/activitystreams-unofficial/commit/187f2eb64119735f3226dec09542d09fef828ecb#diff-c82be6b660f6f67a90769baabffb3553R140
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snarfed and inReplyTo parsing since jan 2014, https://github.com/snarfed/activitystreams-unofficial/commit/24c0f688697303b8da357761f298e3b7f64492df#diff-bac36628c1a6145058c4398e455cc304R80
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snarfed bridgy should be using the same code path, and it's generating u-in-reply-to, e.g. https://brid-gy.appspot.com/comment/twitter/schnarfed/567405014516105216/567405320725864448
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kylewm snarfed: that's a weird example, it's u-in-reply-to withknown.com
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snarfed true
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ben_thatmustbeme aaronpk, you did http://aaronparecki.com/articles/2013/10/11/1/the-future-of-quantified-self-devices##indie+web+of+things
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aaronpk lol thanks
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aaronpk thinking about our /irc-people page...
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aaronpk it's nice that it requires logging in to the wiki to add yourself, but the main issue is that it's duplicating info that should be on your home page
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aaronpk right now it's not toooo bad, name, url, photo and timezone
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ben_thatmustbeme still a bunch of tantek_'s in here
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aaronpk but if we start adding more things like preferred pronouns...
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aaronpk would sure be nice if it could pull that from your home page
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ben_thatmustbeme that would be ideal, yes
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aaronpk so I was thinking, this sounds an awful lot like what we were talking about the other day, setting up an indieweb directory
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ben_thatmustbeme well we would still need a directory of some sort
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aaronpk you could add yourself to the directory by sending a webmention
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aaronpk and if you didn't want that much info on your home page you could even send a webmention from a "bio" page
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ben_thatmustbeme aaronpk, for that matter could irc-people be built from homepages, anyone who has logged in to the wiki, pull their site and look for p-freenode-name or something
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aaronpk that's what i'm thinking, replacing the irc-people page with something that gets info from ppls' home pages
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aaronpk i'd still want it to be an explicit action to add yourself to the directory tho
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aaronpk not just automatically from anyone who logs in to the wiki, since typically logging in does not have such public effects
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KevinMarks logging into the wiki is an explicit action
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ben_thatmustbeme indeed, and if they are sharing data on their site, they have to assume that anyone can be pulling it in
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aaronpk i'd need to add a big notice on the login page that says "logging in will add yourself to the directory" or something
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bret aaronpk: that would be rad
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KevinMarks could you preview the extracted hcard on the login page?
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aaronpk ha that'd be cool
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gRegor` What about /irc-people that can't send a webmention yet?
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Loqi gRegor`: ben_thatmust left you a message on 2/18 at 5:59pm: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/google-play-lastfm-scrobb/llpepekkleeoeiloijhcafgpjdnhhcbl?utm_source=chrome-app-launcher-info-dialog
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aaronpk well it sounds like this would not do the webmention thing
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aaronpk the act of loggin in to the wiki would trigger it
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gRegor` Hm
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gRegor` Or maybe logging in + creation of User: page?
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KevinMarks hm, actually, that could be an indieauth feature - show the hCard info on the "I just parsed your page, login with what" interstitial
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ben_thatmustbeme probably want some way to explicitly trigger it still, when people update their info
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gRegor` Any indieweb examples of a reply and like in one note?
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gRegor` I'm wondering if I can just add u-like-of to the URL in the reply-context. It's nested in an h-cite, so wasn't sure if most implementations would parse it.
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gRegor` Wiki lists http://acegiak.net/2014/03/27/hexington-stand-up-comic-gifskumail-nanjiani/ as a like, reply, and repost, but I don't see the like in the mf2
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KartikPrabhu mine would parse it
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gRegor` KartikPrabhu: Have you posted any combos like that?
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KartikPrabhu no i don't publish them, but i do parse them
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KartikPrabhu of interest here: http://christianheilmann.com/2015/02/18/progressive-enhancement-is-not-about-javascript-availability/
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GWG snarfed: I'm always faster because I am single, alas.
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@kevinmarks “All by turning our assumptions into an if statement.” - @codepo8 http://christianheilmann.com/2015/02/18/progressive-enhancement-is-not-about-javascript-availability/ #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/568495964069236736)
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jgarber KartikPrabhu: Christian's post is great! I had a hand in kicking up this latest round of debate about progressive enhancement: http://sixtwothree.org/posts/designing-experience-layers (and its syndicated copy at http://viget.com/inspire/designing-experience-layers)
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KartikPrabhu jgarber: I did read your post. Adactio's links keep me pretty up-to-date on this stuff :)
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jgarber KartikPrabhu: That adactio is a helluva guy! :)
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snarfed hey micropub users, i've ported https://github.com/snarfed/ownyourresponses to micropub
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snarfed if you want to own your likes/replies/retweets automatically, via PESOS over micropub, feel free to check it out!
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