#acegiakkylewm: not quite. if you comment on my post and then someone else comments on your comment on your site, what I want is for you to be able to send me an update webmention and then I can show that third party comment in thread on my original post
#kylewmacegiak: oh right, I meant php-comments is similar to my mf2util library. I totally support the threaded comment thing
#kylewmgithub changed its syntax highlighting theme again
#acegiak"if you comment on my post and then someone else comments on your comment on your site, what I want is for you to be able to send me an update webmention and then I can show that third party comment in thread on my original post"
#acegiakkylewm: theoretically if I'm fetching from mf2 I should display nested reply contexts
#acegiakKevinMarks: which is why I want to just do "hey I got a new comment, here's an update webmention if you want to check it out"
#KevinMarks'cos slamon protocol decided it was goign to be not on the web, so had to have signing complexity rather than just checking the origin for a comment
#acegiakGWG: to solve this problem on wordpress we need to do a couple of steps: 1) make the mf2 parser library capable of returning data about comments on a h-entry
#GWGacegiak: It doesn't parse it? Or it needs more?
#acegiak2) make the semantic linkbacks plugin read those comment data and create/update new comments in thread for them
#kylewmacegiak: GWG: aren't you just using php-mf2? It shouldn't need any changes to read comments
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#acegiakkylewm: really? hmm. maybe I'm just not using it right then
#GWGkylewm: I don't include it in Post Kinds, but I may have to in a future version if I want to add a button to read data.
#kylewmthis will be an interesting game of telephone, parsing and re-parsing comments, sanitizing and re-sanitizing :)
#acegiakkylewm: yeah. every time GWG updates indieweb-post-kinds I have to remove the sanitization from the response-content field because it's definitely the safest thing for end users, it's stopping me reblogging youtube videos
#GWGacegiak: Is there a way we can work with that?
#acegiakGWG: I'm not allowed near anything security sensitive
#GWGacegiak: I put the Youtube video URL in and embed it separately using the oembed code.
#acegiakbut that's not the thing Im most worried about atht emoment
#GWGacegiak: The next thing on my list after the theme support thing, which is giving me trouble for some reason in testing, is rewriting the display function again. I want to try to break it into smaller pieces.
#snarfedaaronpk: yeah, home page. or silo profile for silo likes
#aaronpkokay ... i think that makes my life easier then
#kylewmsnarfed: actually I think your rationale for putting it in the context makes sense, as much or more sense than putting it in the activity. is it ok if i pull it from the context when converting to mf2?
#snarfedkylewm: maybe! the next question is consistency across the different silos. is that maybe more important than special handling for tweets as notes?
#kylewmon the other silos, inReplyTo is in the object.. but those really are comments
#KartikPrabhuaaronpk: yeah, making it work as people expect to is better. Also for likes one would expect "liked by whom" but for reposts it might be "reposted at... "
#kylewmand it looks like G+ doesn't bother with "object" at all and just puts everything in the activity
#tantekI guess not, thought I saw something in the logs about my in-reply-to markup but maybe I was missing something.
#aaronpkinteresting that twitter returns a unique URL for reposts but not for likes
#tanteknot that interesting, likely side-effect of accidental implementation design
#tanteke.g. twitter favorites were coded first, likely quickly, and sloppily / minimally
#aaronpkhm true, that seems likely given what i know about twitter implementation history
#tantekwhereas native retweets probably had A LOT more up front design work, data modeling etc. that went into them
#aaronpki guess it's interesting that it matches up with the comment earlier about possibly wanting to actually see the repost permalink but not really caring to see the like permalink
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#snarfedretweet permalinks have always seemed kind of half-assed, since they redirect to the original tweet
#snarfedi'm sure it's an intentional design choice, but still
#tanteksnarfed - I got more of the impression of "that's the best they could do" rather than "half-assed" but perhaps I'm being too charitable.
#GWGpfefferle: Either start storing my data in the mf2_ format, or just look for data in the mf2_ format and store it in my response array
#pfefferleGWG does the second option mean, that you will store the same data twice?
#GWGI'm writing a function that would return an array of the data. So, I wouldn't store it twice. I would just return it to the display functionality without worrying about where it came from.
#GWGI figured, if I do change it, adding that layer would make it easier.
#GWGAlso, there are a few other good reasons to separate it into a function
#aaronpk!tell pfefferle guten tag! what part of Germany do you live in? I'm going to be in a couple places in Germany in March and thought maybe we could host a homebrew website club!
#aaronpkthe more I start pulling in external content (like reply contexts, reposts, likes, and mentions) the more I think my site might be better off rendering my own posts from the same data format, h-entry
#@tLife is short. Appreciate it. Smile. Be kind. Breathe. Be impatient. Actions over talk. Be patient with the kind ones. (ttk.me t4_X1) (twitter.com/_/status/563433773480415232)
#hmansHow do we deal with someone migrating their site from http to https -- wouldn't that break existing u-uids? (Or do they just remain at http://, and nobody cares?)
#hmansRight... and the UID remains at its original value. Only way this works, I guess
#hmans(I'm looking at using u-uid for deduplication when fetching remote documents after receiving a webmention)
#tantekat some point in the future I expect a revision of the "http:" spec to switch to "try accessing the resource over https *first*, and then fallback to http"
#aaronpkfor deduplication I'd just ignore the scheme when comparing
#hmansI guess it's not a big problem as long as the uid is considered primarily an identifier and not an actual location (even though it will be just that in most situations.)
#aaronpki can't remember the citation, but somewhere it's written that if your site responds to both http and https the contents of the URLs should be the same
#hmansYeah, I would expect most if not all people who serve both :80 and :443 to 301 from one to the other.
#gRegor`Alternately, why not store the JSON and not worry about breaking out individual parameters?
#GWGstore a post's top-level microformats2 string properties in post metadata with the property names as the keys, prefixed by mf2_.
#hmanstantek, I'm noticing that your u-uid URLs are relative -- is it assumed that consumers should build a fully qualified URI when encountering a relative u-uid?
#GWGgRegor`: The proposal states storing using mf2_toplevelproperty. The citation is not top level.
#tantekhmans - per microformats2 parsing spec, parsers MUST build a fully qualified URL when encountering u-* properties.
#hmansAs a h-entry consumer interested in using UID for deduplication (and I may be on the wrong path?), I would expect the UID to remain the same during the lifetime of a post, even if content or URL change.
#tantekto answer first question, don't know, haven't had to yet (since I started blogging 2002-08-08)
#tantek(thus postponing bothering to think about / solve hypotheticals)
#aaronpkI am going to have to make this decision very soon
#aaronpksince I am going to change my URLs to drop the post type from them
#aaronpkbecause I often create posts out of sequence such as when I'm importing car2go history or last.fm scrobbles
#tantekhmans - it's not reasonable to place any burden on publishers like "UID to remain the same during the lifetime of a post, even if content or URL change" therefore you must not assume that
#tanteku-uid is more like the canonical URL for a post, which *can* change over time
#tantekthough I could see posts keeping all past variants as "u-url" property values somewhere, and only the current canonical one as u-uid
#tantekaaronpk, "often create posts out of sequence" is *exactly* why I type-segment the numerical index portion of the URL
#hmansThat doesn't sound like I should be using u-uid for deduplication.
#tantekit also permits me to change URL policies once a year should I choose to
#hmanstantek, the scenario I'm trying to solve is this: I receive a webmention with source=http://bob/foo. Later, Bob changes the URL of the post to http://bob/bar and sends another webmention. I want to find out if /bar is the same document as /foo.
#hmansWhat I'm building on the receiving end (Pants) is the following: if I get a new webmention from bob.com, and the target document already has existing incoming links from other documents at bob.com, I will iterate through them, HEAD them, and check for a redirect. If one or more gets redirected tp new URLs, I will combine and consolidate accordingly. (As a fallback if u-uid don't match.)
#aaronpkI just realized I'm also struggling with the concept of post types
#aaronpkI currently have a lot of things as "metrics"
#tantekaaronpk in the short URL form, I preferred the type first because I thought it looked nicer, and since it was going to redirect to the year-first permalink anyway I thought it was fine
#tantekaaronpk, I did spend a lot of time in 2009 stressing over the segmentation / design of a taxonomy of post types
#aaronpkmy car2go, biking and running posts all have something in common, which is the fact they are all routes
#aaronpkbut biking and running are also exercise, along with pushups
#tantekmostly at least to capture my immediate needs, near term needs, what I had published at all, then likely future additions
#tantekah - I've actually captured my use of text notes for replies and RSVPs on my post type taxonomy design page: tantek.com/w/Whistle#design - just after the list of letters
#tantekfor those that don't know the name, he was heavily involved in the DiSo effort that predated IndieWeb(Camp) and had many similar principles/values/goals