#indiewebcamp 2015-02-26

2015-02-26 UTC
#
Loqi acegiak@slack: nah irc/kylewm is good
#
Loqi acegiak@slack: general->specific
#
Loqi acegiak@slack: cause the next thing is then the post time on slack
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
Loqi acegiak@slack: Nope. I tap out. Slack is giving me the jibblies
#
Loqi aaronpk@slack: haha
#
tantek oh that's an interesting change - it looks odd to me though
#
Loqi kylewm@slack: acegiak: what don't you like?
#
tantek I back scan from the : and see slack: which makes it seem like slack is talking
#
aaronpk i'm open to suggestions. [slack/kylewm] seemed too noisy though
#
tantek and at the front, it starts with "Loqi:" in the IRC client
#
KevinMarks thinking about /link-preview maybe unmung could generate link preview markup from ogp etc
#
tantek so literally the most important piece, the actual author, is LOST in the middle
#
tantek middle of "Loqi: kylewm@slack:"
#
acegiak let me see how I do it for my minecraft bridge
#
aaronpk hm I can see that. it's different on my client tho
#
tantek if you don't like the brackets (don't blame you), then just drop them
#
tantek e.g. "Loqi: slack/kylewm:"
#
aaronpk with colon then?
#
Loqi pwcc@slack: Can Loqi lie about who they are positing as?
#
tantek and that way when you scan/skip past "Loqi: slack/"
#
aaronpk pwcc: of course
#
tantek then your eye sees …kylewm:
#
acegiak on my minecraft bridge I have it with <MCbridge> <username> message
#
tantek anglebrackets - how RFC822 :P ;)
#
KevinMarks could loqi post as slackqi and just put the name?
#
tantek aaronpk, the other thing about "Loqi: slack/kylewm:" is that it properly reflects that what you're seeing is from the Slack silo
#
tantek which is the root owner etc.
#
tantek and that kylewm there is scoped to Slack
#
colintedford I can see the "lost in the middle" argument, but for me reading left to right, "kylewm@slacK" is clearer.
#
acegiak slack on the right only makes sense with an @
#
tantek colintedford: except that the Loqi: is what you see first
#
colintedford My client colors Loqi's name, though, though, which helps.
#
acegiak do we have to use the whole word slack?
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: we can use anything, I just need to be able to match it on the other side
#
tantek yeah that totally looks better
#
colintedford tantek: I can see both styles in the conversation here and the @ is easier for me to read.
#
tantek "Loqi: slack/aaronpk: we can use anything"
#
Loqi slack/pwcc: I reckon having loqi lie could work - assume people aren't going to impersonate.
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: pwcc: I don't understand what you mean
#
tantek besides we're web focused, not email focused. so paths > @
#
tantek ;)
#
acegiak that looks like loqi is addressing slack/aaronpk to me
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: sLacqi
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: the only thing I don't like about this version is that yeah what acegiak said
#
acegiak lol
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: because that's IRC convention
#
Loqi slack/pwcc: sorry. Basically have loqi post in irc using the same username as in slack.
#
Loqi slack/pwcc: So Loqi impersonates me in the irc channel.
#
colintedford slack/aaronpk looks OK to me w/out the brackets.
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: oh, no I can't sign in to people's IRC nicks on freenode lol
#
tantek heh, let's just give Loqi all the keys ;)
j12t joined the channel
#
tantek and then when Loqi becomes self-aware, it will be that much easier for it to take over
#
Loqi slack/pwcc: Cool - was surprised. :simple_smile:
#
colintedford Though yeah, having Loqi up front is really the main thing that makes it weird.
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: i *could* do something like have Loqi sign in to irc as "tantek|slack" but that'd be way more complicated for me
#
tantek or you could stick with just colons
#
tantek all old school namespace like
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: slack::aaronpk
#
KevinMarks I mean create a new user "slaqi” and have that post with out a prefix
#
acegiak if loqi can use separate names just have loqi use a different name for when slack bridging
#
tantek Loqi: slack: aaronpk: oh, no I can't
#
ben_thatmustbeme or create a different bot from Loqi
#
acegiak yeah
#
tantek I like the idea of shortening/dropping slack
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: blasphemy!
#
ben_thatmustbeme Slack (though its porbably taken)
#
reidab spam the channel with many many /nick changes :P
#
tantek perhaps just a convention that this message is coming from another channel
#
tantek we already do that for tweets
#
KevinMarks so "<slaqi> kevinmarks: blah"
#
ben_thatmustbeme <Slack> aaronpk: oh, no I can't
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: the slack logo is #
#
colintedford tantek++ shorten/drop
#
Loqi tantek has 157 karma
#
tantek hold on finding example
#
tantek e.g. Loqi does this automatically when someone says a keyword in twitter
#
tantek https://twitter.com/t/status/570320538033373185
#
Loqi is done
#
@t 2 more IndieWebCamp translations started Spanish http://indiewebcamp.com/Main_Page-es Catalon http://indiewebcamp.com/Main_Page-ca Thanks @badosa! (ttk.me t4_q1) (twitter.com/_/status/570320538033373185)
#
tantek a-ha
#
aaronpk hey why didn't the ++ go to slack
#
aaronpk Loqi++
#
Loqi Loqi has 339 karma
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: Loqi++
#
tantek aaronpk, because Loqi processed the ++ here in IRC, and then stopped processing
#
KevinMarks obviously # is not ideal but maybe a sharp?
#
tantek nah
#
aaronpk tantek: good call
#
tantek I like the > prompt
lukebrooker joined the channel
#
tantek e.g. [>aaronpk] Loqi++
#
aaronpk whoa where'd > come from?
#
tantek this better? >_
#
tantek e.g. http://www.yourdailymac.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/terminal_icon.png
#
acegiak what about [s!acegiak] my message?
#
tantek ugh
#
aaronpk cryptic
#
tantek any use of letters makes it look like part of the name
#
acegiak kk
#
acegiak just spitballin
KevinMarks__ and KevinMarks joined the channel
#
aaronpk oops I broke everything
snarfed joined the channel
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: how about ♯kevinmarks
#
tantek too hashtaggy
#
KevinMarks no #is hash ♯ is sharp
#
tantek I still vote for "kevinmarks>" for anything from slack or other sources, and "@kevinmarks>" for twitter (instead of [@kevinmarks] )
#
tantek KevinMarks: still looks hashtaggy :P
#
reidab that seems like it could get a bit confusing with slack also encouraging @mentions
#
tantek too similar, cognitive dissonance and all that
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: Ok how about â™®kevinmarks
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: more natural
#
tantek now it just looks like an obscure musical reference
#
tantek is there a way to tie your domain to your slack profile?
#
tantek we could just abandon all this silo specific username crap
#
tantek and go with domain/ :P
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: I can look up your domain on /irc-people
#
tantek no matter how the identity comes in, transform it to their domain
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: slack's logo is a rotated hash
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: so ⨳kevinmarks
#
tantek KevinMarks: I'm surprised you haven't suggested #!kevinmarks :P
#
aaronpk wtf there is a rotated hash unicode?
#
KevinMarks smash product apparently
#
KevinMarks U+2A33
#
reidab #!/usr/slack/KevinMarks
#
tantek reidab++
#
Loqi reidab has 24 karma
#
aaronpk tantek: I can't do just "kevinmarks>" because I need some notation that is *only* used by the slack message
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: there's even ≋kevinmarks for activity stream sourced info :wink:
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: otherwise this happens
#
tantek this what?
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: you could use guillemots
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: oh you're not in slack anymore
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: it makes Loqi echo his line in Slack
#
snarfed tantek: aaronpk: i put my url (ie domain) in the "What I Do" profile section
#
snarfed (of slack)
#
snarfed not great but meh
#
aaronpk http://aaronparecki.com/uploads/slack-20150225-162703.png
#
tantek ok I'll switch to mobile slack
#
reidab you could probably get away with a nonprinting unicode character per service, but I think that's much more confusing than just picking a printing char to represent each service
#
aaronpk hahaha
#
Loqi hehe
#
aaronpk oops lost the icons for a minute
#
GWG rhiaro: This IRC web client, can you keep me posted?
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: eg »kevinmarks»
#
aaronpk that one looks somewhat nice
#
rhiaro GWG: they're actually building a server (like quassel) that it's really easy to build clients for (unlike quassel) and someone will build a web client to work with it
#
KevinMarks smash product is the best imo
#
rhiaro https://bitbucket.org/KitB/possel
#
GWG rhiaro: I use ZNC. Willing to switch. But I want something with a good web client.
#
rhiaro Not sure how long it'll be
#
KitB It's a hobby project at the moment because I'm pissed of with quassel
#
KitB s/of/off/g
#
Loqi KitB meant to say: It's a hobby project at the moment because I'm pissed off with quassel
#
GWG rhiaro: I'm surprised no one has ever tried a web client built into ZNC.
#
KitB But a decent web client is one of the goals
#
GWG KitB: Happens
#
rhiaro I've not used znc, I believe tbrb does
#
rhiaro Who also might be involved in possel
#
KitB He's certainly in the IRC channel
#
GWG I tried Weechat and Glowing Bear
#
reidab I also use ZNC as a bouncer, but have never felt the desire for a web client
lukebrooker joined the channel
#
rhiaro Now I have a chromebook, web client has suddenly become even more noticeably missing
#
GWG rhiaro: That's one of my use cases
#
GWG reidab: One of my use cases is mobile. I don't need constant connection.
#
bear I use ZNC and when I need to have a web client I stand up qwebirc real fast
#
rhiaro Quassel android client is fine
#
GWG Then I need to have Quassel and ZNC running.
#
reidab I use a native mobile client, with ZNC set up to replay scrollback on reconnect. When I was using a chromebook a bit last year, I was using https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/circ/bebigdkelppomhhjaaianniiifjbgocn?hl=en-US
#
KevinMarks I use CIRC on chromebook
#
KevinMarks and on macos now
#
Loqi slack/tantek: So far slack iOS is better than colloquy iOS for one channel
#
bear I like the slack android client if your dealing with a single slack with a few channels
#
bear it's a nice interface and it handles mobile network disconnects nicely
#
GWG reidab: I have multiple computers connected to the same ZNC instance. MAkes that hard
#
reidab I do too, but I forget which combination of settings I found works best
#
GWG reidab: I may look into that
#
reidab I think it's "replay the scrollback buffer on connect, clear the buffer when I send a message"
#
Loqi slack/tantek: Hmm irc icons lost again?
#
KevinMarks slack android needs to let you choose which team you are sharing to after choosing slack
#
Loqi slack/tantek: Our irc logs are *much* better on mobile than Slack
#
Loqi slack/tantek: The only thing slightly nicer in slack is only one icon per person with multiple utterances.
#
Loqi slack/tantek: And by doing that they are able to make their icon display bigger
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: yes, that is a nice touch
#
Loqi slack/tantek: At the expense +1 line to put all the "info" (text name, time) on it's own line instead of inline prefixing the message
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: but they take up more vertical space
#
bear the UX they have when you load a channel that has a lot of backscroll is nice - it's one click to scroll to the top of the backscroll or one click to ignore it and stay at the most recent line
#
bear I find I do the "x stay place" more because the mobile view is my "hey, anything recent" check
#
aaronparecki.com edited /events/2015-02-25-homebrew-website-club (+79) "no pdx this week, sorry! :-(" (view diff)
#
Loqi slack/tantek: And then if the send button is enabled and you use it. All text entered disappears.
#
Loqi slack/tantek: Huh looks like disappears means lost
#
Loqi slack/tantek: Here's the text I had in the input box that got lost:
#
Loqi slack/tantek: iOS slack app limitation. When you reopen the app, it blanks the screen, erasing the previous messages and stalls with "connecting..." in the text input box. In contrast iOS Colloquy immediately shows you everything you've received previously. Thus if you have spotty network (eg MUNI under market st), iOS Slack is useless.
caseorganic joined the channel
#
Loqi slack/tantek: So Slack is quite slacky on an intermittent mobile connection.
scor joined the channel
#
bear on the android version I haven't ever lost text - and it shows the outbound message as grayed out until it knows it was received
#
Loqi slack/kylewm: Aw hwc pdx canceled?
snarfed, KartikPrabhu, KevinMarks and KevinMarks___ joined the channel
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: I do like the red line showing where you last were
#
tonious s
tantek joined the channel
#
tonious Whoops.
#
tonious goes back to lurking.
#
tantek hello from SF!
#
colintedford.com edited /User:Colintedford.com (+446) "Doing manual POSSE / backfeed @ Twitter, comment forms, bug reports." (view diff)
#
GWG Hello, SF.
caseorganic and KartikPrabhu1 joined the channel
#
snarfed colintedford, you backfeed from silos manually?
#
snarfed wow
#
snarfed that's dedication
#
colintedford Haha, yeah.
#
GWG I'm not that dedicated.
#
colintedford I don't have a lot to backfeed at the moment.
#
colintedford Definitely not planning to do it this way forever.
#
tantek.com edited /Squarespace (+222) "moved IndieAuth with rel-me how to - to historical section since it was for previous version of SquareSpace" (view diff)
#
colintedford PS. snarfed, I decided on "outbox" for my "responses" page (I'm sure you were dying to know ;)
#
kevinmarks.com edited /fragmention (+6) (view diff)
#
snarfed colintedford: nice!
#
snarfed btw, i see you're eventually moving off wordpress, but in the meantime you can get plug and play backfeed with the webmention and semantic linkbacks plugins and bridgy
#
snarfed you probably knew that
#
GWG snarfed: https://github.com/pfefferle/wordpress-semantic-linkbacks - Speaking of Semantic Linkbacks, not sure how to take this
#
snarfed GWG: how to take what?
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: <https://medium.com/@kevinmarks/4862de81b8de>
#
GWG https://github.com/pfefferle/wordpress-semantic-linkbacks/commit/ce14a0f6024ccf8083843b5f81b564d747d1a5c0#diff-04c6e90faac2675aa89e2176d2eec7d8R88
#
snarfed looks like a nice credit to me
#
GWG snarfed: I'm wondering if this means I finally got the indenting under control.
nloadholtes and tilgovi joined the channel
#
colintedford snarfed: Yup, holding off for now so i don't feel obliged to re-do those parts when I move.
#
tantek KevinMarks: that medium URL w/o JS shows attempts to access https://ssl/ and http://www/
#
colintedford But if I start getting a lot of incoming stuff before then I may fire them up anyway.
#
tantek seems like either they are being naughty, or have been compromised by someone being naughty, or have a bug where their internal dev stuff is leaking into external HTML that is being served
#
tantek hey let's see if we're live
#
GWG Live?
Kat and kylewm_ joined the channel
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: welcome to the second Homebrew Website Club of February, 4th of the year (twitter.com/_/status/570774851818037248)
#
tantek kylewm: added to my reader - live updates
#
tantek … basically copying the blog post / code that aaronpk did for live comments
#
snarfed colintedford: it's not much work and zero coding, maybe 5-10m total, so not much to redo, but up to you
#
tantek … but for entries on the reader
#
tantek … as part of that added support for getting Pubsubhubbub notifications
#
tantek … most people don't send pings for the HTML feed
#
tantek … just barnaby and me now
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kylewm2: I changed http://reader.kylewm.com to support pubsubhubbub so it updates in real time now (twitter.com/_/status/570775151706562560)
#
tantek … trying to recruit more people to do it
#
Kat what is Pubsubhubbub?
#
Loqi PubSubHubbub (PuSH) is a notification-based protocol for publishing and subscribing to feeds/streams in real time https://indiewebcamp.com/PubSubHubbub
#
tantek kylewm: And earlier this week I couldn't get Superfeedr to subscribe to his hub and got @julien51 to fix it
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kylewm2: last week I was having trouble with suprfeeder being able to subscribe but @julien51 fixed it (twitter.com/_/status/570775309638873089)
#
tantek … using kylewm.superfeedr.com
#
tantek … julien fixed it and it now works
#
tantek kylewm: my website is kylewm.com
dariusdunlap joined the channel
#
tantek dariusdunlap: have officially finished moving site to a Digital Ocean droplet
#
tantek … learned a lot in the process
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kylewm2: using http://t.co/WwBYr7nxx8 now works try it out (twitter.com/_/status/570775517189816321)
#
tantek … will be posting on his blog
#
tantek … lot of nitty gritty with setting up nginx with SSL
#
tantek … better resources, walkthrough for how to get that set up
#
tantek … a lot of stuff on my list to do
#
tantek … now that I got my sites up & running
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: I moved my hosting to a Digital Ocean droplet and I'm going to post on how to do this on https://darius.dunlaps.net (twitter.com/_/status/570775661138325504)
#
tantek … a lot of the stuff I wanted to do required e.g. getting SNI setup
#
tantek … it was fun. in an old unix guy kind of way.
#
tantek kylewm: bare droplet? or LAMP?
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: there's a lot of nginx config to set up so my POSSE stuff can work on the new site (twitter.com/_/status/570775782974484480)
#
tantek dariusdunlap: started bare
#
tantek … used their ubuntu 14. 4
#
tantek … going to get my notes together
#
tantek … was about about month or so of a couple of evenings a week
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: it's important to document how long this config stuff takes (twitter.com/_/status/570776113657618433)
#
colintedford snarfed: I meant the unknown amount of work on whatever I move to.
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: part of it for me was relearning the new sysadmin ways - nginx vs apache (twitter.com/_/status/570776228476653570)
#
snarfed colintedford: oh i see, so it doesn't regress. got it
#
tantek dariusdunlap: I have dunlaps.net and darius.dunlaps.net and feedthegirl.com
#
tantek … and feedthegirl.com is also feedthegirl.dunlaps.net but everything is aliased the right way
#
tantek KevinMarks: read the post about Medium ( https://medium.com/inside/blogging-on-medium-95f1546bcd7d ) and wants to instead do all that using his own site
#
tantek … can use the Medium editor to post stuff on your own site, but the process is kind of crap, editing, exporting etc.
#
tantek … of course it would work if Medium editor support micropub
#
tantek … you can write your post in Medium, keep it as draft, then use export my posts to get it out
#
tantek KevinMarks: the other news .. reporting for benwerd
#
tantek … both Blogger and Tumblr are cracking down this week on adult content
#
tantek … Blogger has said any adult content must be made private by next Monday
#
tantek … Tumblr - varying reports - nothing directly public
#
tantek … indirectly via posts saying "I have to backup my posts"
#
tantek … so benwerd is busy working on importers from both of those Known (and thus also Withknown.com)
#
tantek … the point is the that the importers are part of the open source base
#
@hybridjesus RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @dariusdunlap: I moved my hosting to a Digital Ocean droplet and I'm going to post on how to do this on https://… (twitter.com/_/status/570777594968346625)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I am trying to use @medium to pst to my site - it now involves using their export process and editing the HTML (twitter.com/_/status/570777598881603584)
#
tantek note that LiveJournal has been expiring / deleting blogs with only a 15 day notice: http://indiewebcamp.com/LiveJournal#Deletion_of_inactive_accounts
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: if @medium is serious about blogging it would be great if they supported micropub (twitter.com/_/status/570777762409132032)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: in other news, Blogger has giving bloggers with Adult content until monday to make their blogs private (twitter.com/_/status/570777904486998016)
#
tantek Kat: I have a portfolio and originally coded it myself, haven't updated in past 2-3 years
#
tantek … I wanted to update it.
#
tantek … I bought some squarespace (space)
#
tantek … playing around with it now
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kabula: I have a portfolio that I coded myself; now I am trying squarespace as hosting for my own site (twitter.com/_/status/570778079129432065)
#
tantek … easy to navigate and create, can have a blog, ecommerce site etc.
#
tantek … whereas for my old portfolio I have to start from scratch and it's a lot of work
#
colintedford Blogger--
#
Loqi Blogger has -1 karma
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kabula: the e-commerce and blog there is really easy to create. However you have to follow their grid and layout (twitter.com/_/status/570778215641452544)
#
tantek … the one thing about squarespace is that there isn't a lot of freedom
#
tantek … because you have to work within their design, their templates
#
kylewm KevinMarks: @kabula doesn't seem right
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: i've set up a couple of people on squarespace; there is a developer api (twitter.com/_/status/570778324794007555)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kabula: i do like how easy to is to blog using squarespace - it feels a bit like cheating (twitter.com/_/status/570778507191721987)
#
tantek kat: it's kind of like eating, do I want to bake my own bread, or buy bread
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kabula: do I want to bake my own bread and be really proud of it, or do I want to buy bread (twitter.com/_/status/570778592096989185)
#
tantek EJ: you can also buy a breadmachine
#
tantek kat: basically I bought a breadmachine, because I'm spending money on squarespace
j12t joined the channel
#
tantek EJ: hi I'm EJ, and met KevinMarks at the Matter thing where benwerd and erinjo presented
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: it's like having a bread machine (twitter.com/_/status/570778928660553730)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kabula: yes, as ai paid money for squarespace it is just like a bread machine (twitter.com/_/status/570779024483614721)
#
colintedford.com edited /User:Colintedford.com (+400) "/* Noise filter */ Posting replies to "outbox" instead of home." (view diff)
#
KevinMarks___ EJ is http://meta.ly and @eliservescent
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: outbox! I like it
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: I got RSVPs saying no and maybe , and remote attending - previously I only coded how to say yes to events (twitter.com/_/status/570779444127907840)
#
Kat The cobblers kids do what to him?
#
colintedford aaronpk: Thanks :D I'm pretty sure 1 or more indiewebsters use "inbox" for their mentions, which I plan to copy.
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: heh ironically I really don't like the term "inbox" for mentions
#
colintedford Interesting! Reasons, or "just" a feeling?
#
colintedford Might switch to incoming/outgoing or in/outbound, but *box won for now b/c shortest & clear enough.
#
@kevinmarks Homebrew Website Club #indieweb https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/570781283967590401/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/570781283967590401)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: a public maybe makes sense, but a public no doesn't often, but being stuck in Sydney meant I had to cancel an event (twitter.com/_/status/570781496040140800)
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: I think I don't like it because then it sounds like email, like something I have to check all the time that is a burden
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: remote attending isn't a yes/no/maybe - it is another kind of thing (twitter.com/_/status/570781840350547970)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: most event systems don't let you have multiple locations; only online events (twitter.com/_/status/570782052171321344)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: a webinar conveys a remote seminar but is rarely anything like a seminar as it isn't people interacting (twitter.com/_/status/570782257490874368)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: most webinars are a broadcast lecture or a dialog between speaker and one remote, not socratic dialogue (twitter.com/_/status/570782403280678912)
#
tantek EJ: I get frustrated about tech jargon related to "disrupting" education, especially higher education, because it's rarely anything positive
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: every time someone talks about disrupting higher education it is about having more people here a lecture (twitter.com/_/status/570782671900684289)
#
tantek EJ: it's usually about magnifying lectures, broadcasting lectures, which is perhaps the worst thing to amplify
#
tantek EJ: Khan Academy is doing some good things though.
#
colintedford aaronpk: Makes sense. I guess I'm thinking of my indieweb inbox as like email in the old days of lower volume & lower adoption, when each incoming item was like a present :)
#
tantek colintedford wow I remember those days. About 25 years ago.
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: in the humanities you do the reading at home, but the discussion is the important part (twitter.com/_/status/570782990814617600)
#
tantek tantek: so this kind of thing (waves hand around room) is a seminar
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: what we are doing here is more like a seminar (twitter.com/_/status/570783070955147264)
#
tantek EJ: yes, this (Homebrew Website Club) is a seminar
#
tantek kevinmarks: so a chatroom thing is more like a seminar
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: so the chat room is more seminar like than the lecture? (twitter.com/_/status/570783171664609280)
#
colintedford tantek: haha, yeah.
#
tantek EJ: yes, absolutely. find ways to make a chatroom not just to be a way of answering a prompt twice, but instead force learning to happen through interaction [with each other]
#
tantek kevinmarks: we have a wiki that's full of information, but it's often better if people come to the chat room and ask, and then we give them references to read
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: yes - and trying to get people to structure interaction with each other in chat rooms is hard (twitter.com/_/status/570783373108617216)
caseorganic joined the channel
#
tantek EJ: there's a crucial interaction happening there between a source of authority and a constituent. separately the wiki is a desire for a seminar-like interaction among equals.
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: I found my peer group in railsbridge, and it is the community that makes it work (twitter.com/_/status/570783918821146626)
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
@egilfujikawanes RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: every time someone talks about disrupting higher education it is about having more people here a … (twitter.com/_/status/570784033707298816)
#
@BillSeitz RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @kevinmarks: if @medium is serious about blogging it would be great if they supported micropub (twitter.com/_/status/570784258610089984)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: there is a lot of bootstrapping and self enablement her, but also a lot of opportunism here- audience seekers (twitter.com/_/status/570784422334738432)
#
colintedford Side comment re: education: Coincidentally, my high-school teachers often told distracting students they were "disrupting the class".
#
Loqi slack/kylewm: heh
#
pdurbin huh. another POSSE: http://www.redhat.com/posse/
#
colintedford pdurbin: from now on i'll imagine that owl mascot carrying my POSSE messages to the silos.
#
@kylewm2 RT @kevinmarks: Homebrew Website Club #indieweb https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/570781283967590401/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/570785546554863619)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: going to a lecture and taking a test probably teaches you less than a seminar, even if you can't measure it (twitter.com/_/status/570785700481798144)
#
pdurbin heh
#
aaronparecki.com edited /feed_file (+65) "provide citation for "legacy" feed, and add link to [[PuSH]]" (view diff)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: 'academic' can mean writing papers rather than writing things that work (twitter.com/_/status/570785900420055040)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: there is a large unfiltered mass from people who have an idea, but people who have built it say "that didn't work" (twitter.com/_/status/570786107828383744)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: if you're not willing to commit to your own website (twitter.com/_/status/570786290486149120)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: it is only $10/year to make a website but it feels like a bigger commitment (twitter.com/_/status/570786637745131521)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: how much I spend a month is nothing compared to the time I put into it (twitter.com/_/status/570786763322605568)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: is wordpress the middle ground between squarespace and self hosting? (twitter.com/_/status/570786991450648576)
#
@profbrady RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @t: 'academic' can mean writing papers rather than writing things that work (twitter.com/_/status/570787008488071168)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @dariusdunlap: wordpress was that middle ground as it made it simpler a few years ago (twitter.com/_/status/570787109117792256)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: wordpress now has got more complicated so you need to manage it too (twitter.com/_/status/570787184866951168)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: Known @withknown is the new simplification, with thinking about mobile a key part (twitter.com/_/status/570787341478043648)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: where I'm frustarted when it is too easy, but then I can't customise it - I care deeply about typography (twitter.com/_/status/570787538367066113)
#
tantek KevinMarks: this is part of my grump against Medium, with their post saying "we are a blogging site too", you can't configure anything
#
tantek KevinMarks: they are missing letting people make things look strange and weird the way people want them to
#
@benwerd @kevinmarks (And I apologize for not being there, but am working on it as we speak) @t #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/570787821960630273)
#
tantek EJ: this is where I'm interested in applications like Pocket, offline readers, and inheritors of the RSS feed, who want to take the NYT out of context for me so I can read it simply
#
tantek EJ: there's a lot of the internet I can't read because it's too upsetting, e.g. Buzzfeed
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: i'm interested in pocket and instapaper because they take the page out of it's context (twitter.com/_/status/570788267735576577)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: a big part of what made blogging matter was the chaotic possibilities that different layouts made possible (twitter.com/_/status/570788425164558336)
#
tantek EJ: I'm reading things constantly but I'm always in a battle against the open tabs.
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: there are more ways to express ourselves than the 3 or 4 templates we have from twitter and facebook (twitter.com/_/status/570788716488355840)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: I'm reading things constantly but I'm always in a battle against the open tabs. (twitter.com/_/status/570788795643252736)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: (twitter.com/_/status/570788819714347008)
#
tantek EJ: It gets delicioused when I've actually read it, but I know no one uses that socially any more. But I like that it's public. And there's a little feed built into my WordPress that shows what I've read recently.
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: I have a set of bookmarks which I will never read but ti is nice to thinkI'll search them sometimes (twitter.com/_/status/570789137755856896)
#
colintedford Tangential to "[taking sites] out of context for me so I can read it simply": I've started saving webpages of interest via Firefox, & the amount of extraneous crap on some drives me nuts.
#
tantek EJ: I've gone into IFTTT to try to get recipes to setup everything, but they don't have triggers for everything.
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: i feed things into https://delicious.com/ when I have read them, but they only show up in my blog footer (twitter.com/_/status/570789309776842753)
#
tantek EJ: Slack's real strength is integration.
#
tantek kylewm: we discovered that today, aaronpk got it connected to our IRC channel in like 20 minutes.
#
tantek KevinMarks: one of the key things Slack does is, give you a lowest common denominator of, here's a note and summary of a thing. When you send them a link, they give you a bit of it, but not the whole thing.
#
tantek … so you can get a sense of it on your phone
#
tantek … but since they've archived it
#
tantek … you can view the whole thing later.
#
tantek EJ: importantly with the integrations I will note that, one of the best things is that if I don't want to use it, I don't have to, because it's got enough integrations that I can still get messages via whatever medium I want.
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: a key thing that slack does it give a link preview for anything you post so you can grasp it, and click later (twitter.com/_/status/570789939849404416)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: the integrations are what is key to making Slack work, as you don't have to use the service they way they chose (twitter.com/_/status/570790205990539264)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: more important than integrating with other independent sites is plugging into where your friends read (twitter.com/_/status/570790589660323840)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: keep integrating with lots of other service rather than forcing people to come to your site (twitter.com/_/status/570790743708708864)
#
tantek EJ: you would really enjoy my comedy hack day project: ifthisthen.cat
#
tantek EJ: we've got "catreon"
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb @Eliservescent: my comedy hack day site was http://ifthisthen.cat/ - do read the api documention (twitter.com/_/status/570791538223157249)
#
@cheeaun RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: my comedy hack day site was http://ifthisthen.cat/ - do read the api documention (twitter.com/_/status/570792256401047552)
#
@Eliservescent RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: most webinars are a broadcast lecture or a dialog between speaker and one remote, not socratic di… (twitter.com/_/status/570793109224869890)
#
@Eliservescent RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: a webinar conveys a remote seminar but is rarely anything like a seminar as it isn't people inter… (twitter.com/_/status/570793118045503488)
#
@Eliservescent RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: every time someone talks about disrupting higher education it is about having more people here a … (twitter.com/_/status/570793139897815041)
#
@Eliservescent RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: in the humanities you do the reading at home, but the discussion is the important part (twitter.com/_/status/570793169295708161)
#
tantek we are closing up (a bit late) but done here in SF with HWC!
#
@hybridjesus RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: my comedy hack day site was http://ifthisthen.cat/ - do read the api documention (twitter.com/_/status/570793202262904832)
#
@Eliservescent RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: I found my peer group in railsbridge, and it is the community that makes it work (twitter.com/_/status/570793207195443200)
#
@Eliservescent RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: going to a lecture and taking a test probably teaches you less than a seminar, even if you can't … (twitter.com/_/status/570793464721383424)
#
@dearnetworking Search and Connect with other participants at #indieweb with @annectoapp. Networking Made Efficient. https://www.youtube.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/570793506165424128)
#
@dimatosj RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: my comedy hack day site was http://ifthisthen.cat/ - do read the api documention (twitter.com/_/status/570793873259307009)
#
@kevinmarks I'm puzzled by medium as a blogging tool http://www.kevinmarks.com/puzzledbymedium.html (also on https://medium.com/@kevinmarks/puzzled-by-medium-4862de81b8de?source=tw-d2f50a6a3291-1424923518004 ) #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/570796946253680640)
halorgium, nloadholtes and KevinMarks joined the channel
#
kylewm.com edited /PubSubHubbub (+1) "/* IndieWeb Examples */" (view diff)
wolftune, lukebrooker, caseorganic and j12t joined the channel
#
kylewm.com edited /PubSubHubbub (+1884) "/* How To */ reorganize and add some detail to the PuSH 0.4 How to" (view diff)
#
kylewm.com edited /PubSubHubbub (-292) "/* Notify Your PuSH Hub When Your Feed Updates */ this bit about subscribing to fragments should not be in the howto for publishers" (view diff)
#
kylewm.com edited /PubSubHubbub (+649) "/* Subscribe to a PuSH-enabled feed */ move fragment subscription stuff down here. add link to http://push-pub.appspot.com/" (view diff)
acegiak joined the channel
#
acegiak So I'm trying out convos
#
acegiak and you're right it could use GUI friendly things like nickserv handling
#
GWG What is convos?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "convos" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=convos&summary=prompted+by+GWG+https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Firc%2F2015-02-25%2Fline%2F1424928889661
acegiak2 and lukebrooker joined the channel
#
acegiak2 just showing blackwool the various different IRC options and chatting about their pros/cons and discussing the IRC as a gateway problem
#
Loqi slack/kylewm: Awesome, love to her assessment
#
GWG Oh
#
GWG I'm still not welcome on Slack, for some reason
#
acegiak You can't login?
#
GWG I don't seem to be getting the emails
#
Loqi slack/kylewm: Can't get the invite email
#
acegiak weird
snarfed joined the channel
#
GWG I was hoping that aaronpk could intercept
#
aaronpk GWG: you tried getting it to send you another invite?
#
GWG aaronpk: Multiple times
#
acegiak there isn't really anything in slack like public rooms is there?
#
aaronpk slack has a public option if you pay
#
aaronpk if the organization/company pays, that is
#
GWG aaronpk: Any chance you could extract the link?
#
aaronpk my server doesn't log the actual email contents
#
acegiak I wonder if there's a way to make convos send notifications to mobile on highlight
#
GWG Oh
#
aaronpk i can send you an invite directly though
#
GWG aaronpk: Can you?
#
GWG I feel left out, somehow
#
aaronpk acegiak: yeah there are good notification options
#
acegiak ...how?
#
aaronpk check email!
#
aaronpk acegiak: in the app?
#
acegiak theres a convos app?
#
aaronpk oh, thought you meant slack
#
acegiak yeah no
#
acegiak blackwool and I were saying that the close-y pay-y ...ness of slack and irccloud are a big turnoff for us
#
aaronpk yeah I get that
#
GWG acegiak: I'm trialing irccloud for 2 months. I want to see what I like about it and hate about it
#
acegiak cool!
#
acegiak I REALLY like the avatar display/layout on slack and convos
#
acegiak so much neater
#
kylewm I think having avatars makes it way less daunting
#
GWG My problem is that when I ran an HTML based IRC client, it was blocked on various wifi networks due it not using a standard port
#
acegiak but I wish convos had a way to work out people's actual gravatars
#
kylewm like I go in #python and it is terrifying
#
acegiak rather than the hash based ones for the username strings
#
kylewm convos is using gravatar isn't it??
#
kylewm if your email is in your profile maybe
#
acegiak yeah, but how is it gonna fetch gravatars for people not connected using the same convos instance?
#
kylewm acegiak: it doesn't have a photo for me for example?
#
acegiak http://acegiak.net/files/2015/02/Screenshot-260215-162557.png
#
acegiak huh
#
acegiak oh there it is
#
acegiak cool
#
acegiak convos is displaying the picture for me which is nice
#
acegiak but It took a little while for it to work it out
#
acegiak I'm really trying hard to resist the temptation to roll my own irc client
#
kylewm.com edited /PubSubHubbub (+1) "/* = Subscribing to Fragments */ balance ='s" (view diff)
#
kylewm.com edited /PubSubHubbub (+1) "/* Advertise PuSH Hub and Topic */ fix broken </code> tag" (view diff)
#
kylewm.com edited /PubSubHubbub (+16) "/* Publish a PuSH-enabled feed */ 0.4 allows publishers to publish any resource, not consumers to subscribe to any resource" (view diff)
KevinMarks_ and KevinMarks joined the channel
#
kylewm.com edited /PubSubHubbub (+189) "/* Hubs */" (view diff)
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
snarfed GWG++ for the wordpress syndication links plugin. i added it and i'm really liking it: https://snarfed.org/
#
Loqi GWG has 82 karma
#
snarfed (icons next to the post dates)
#
acegiak man. i want to upload video to my blog
#
acegiak and i'd like to take a posse approach
#
snarfed (if they look wrong, shift-refresh)
#
snarfed acegiak: do it! you're on wp, right? media library supports video pretty well
#
acegiak but then i dont get the multiple video qualities etc of using youtube?
#
GWG snarfed: Glad you like it. I think I finally found the right level of simplicity for it
#
acegiak ill try it out with this one. we'll see how it goes
#
snarfed acegiak: wp uses <video> with a decent fallback player, i think both do adaptive streaming
#
GWG snarfed: I'll be adding hooks next.
#
acegiak lets try it out!
#
snarfed acegiak: the more pressing issue is low wp/php upload size limits. if you hit that, try scping the video file to the server directly and use https://wordpress.org/plugins/add-from-server/
j12t joined the channel
#
kylewm.com edited /PubSubHubbub (+221) "/* Discussion */ note disagreement with "polling is good enough"" (view diff)
martinBrown joined the channel
#
acegiak GWG: how do you populate the syndication links in your plugin? Is there a hook I can call?
#
GWG acegiak: Right now, it is in post meta. But I want to add a hook to add additional entries on the fly from other sources.
#
GWG That would enable extensions to the manual entering of POSSE data
#
acegiak GWG: what puts it in post meta? doing it manually?
#
acegiak kk
#
GWG acegiak: There is a post meta box, yes.
#
GWG In the post itself.
#
acegiak if you add hooks I can populate it in my quickposse plugin
#
GWG acegiak: Hooks to add extra POSSEs on the fly, or hooks to add in extra URLs to be saved?
#
@ak2webd3 RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @Eliservescent: in the humanities you do the reading at home, but the discussion is the important part (twitter.com/_/status/570833142874968064)
#
acegiak I'll have a look at the plugin and then I'll be able to answer that question better
#
GWG acegiak: I had planned on adding hooks to add dynamically. And a function to add it in that divided up some of the steps.
#
GWG It's a very simple plugin by design.
#
acegiak yeah, neat
#
GWG Suggestions appreciated.
#
GWG I also need to work on a few others things this weekend. Like the Post Kinds display functionality for the new data structure.
elima_ joined the channel
#
@Eliservescent #indieweb @kevinmarks: Learning how to use Kevin Marks' awesome live-tweeting tool. No instructions! (twitter.com/_/status/570836103265189888)
#
@Eliservescent #indieweb @kevinmarks: Optimized for quotation, but what about when I want to conversate myself? (twitter.com/_/status/570836396954550272)
#
@Eliservescent #indieweb : And if I'm not quoting? @kevinmarks' tool still has plenty of uses. (twitter.com/_/status/570836633014149120)
sanduhrs, colintedford and KevinMarks_ joined the channel
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb hi elisa (twitter.com/_/status/570840635701207040)
#
@kevinmarks #indieweb hi @eliservescent— I fixed the colon bug in http://www.noterlive.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/570841544363798528)
LauraJ joined the channel
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: medium's PESOS tool is pretty good - you can hoover in any webpage and adjust formatting
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: slurped in my blog post, needed the crossheads and blockquote reapplied: <https://medium.com/@kevinmarks/how-apple-s-ios-fragmentation-problems-distort-design-thinking-f021a2999b8a>
KartikPrabhu, Jihaisse, cweiske, LauraJ, eschnou, tantek and indie-visitor joined the channel
#
Loqi Welcome, indie-visitor! Set your nickname by typing /nick yourname
krendil, sammachin, pfefferle and alanpearce joined the channel
#
acegiak snarfed: uploaded video!
#
acegiak need to fix the styling a little
interactivist, KevinMarks_, colintedford, michielbdejong, KevinMarks and LauraJ joined the channel
#
colintedford !tell aaronpk I see twitter usernames are bolded in the logs; maybe bold the username in slack/username so it stands out better? (slack/*username*, not *slack/username*)
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
loic_m, KevinMarks, modem, friedcell, Acidnerd, wont_on, thehighfiveghost, Sebastien-L, cweiske, stream7, KevinMarks_, frzn, eschnou and upper- joined the channel
#
pfefferle good morning
KevinMarks, LauraJ, elima_, interactivist, thehighfiveghost and davidpeach joined the channel
#
davidpeach hello
pfefferle, KevinMarks and eschnou joined the channel
#
GWG Good morning.
#
GWG pfefferle: Saw the README update
#
acegiak So now I'm genuinely considering hacking on tinytinyirc
#
GWG acegiak: Just don't try talking to Andrew Dolgov
#
acegiak GWG: whysat?
#
GWG He's a jerk
#
acegiak ah ok
#
acegiak good to know
#
acegiak I'll just fork it and run then
#
GWG Just my opinion. The TT-RSS forums are full of him being...less than nice
#
cweiske it's the russians
#
cweiske we have one russian at pear who is similiarly grumpy
#
cweiske I've learned to live with it
#
pfefferle GWG yes, I hope I get the other commit done today… will change some small things
scor joined the channel
#
GWG cweiske: Just feel an open-source community shouldn't be run that way.
#
cweiske I'm with you there
#
GWG pfefferle: Thanks. As I said, my reason for asking about updating the Wordpress.org repository was the get_linkback_number function, which I was using, but is not in the stable version, only the development one.
#
ben_thatmustbeme so with all the stuff i have been seeing about pubsubhuhbub... how the hell do yoiu subscribe to feeds?
#
cweiske "I opened a bug report and got the not so encouraging response that I should fix that myself since the author was not willing to support
#
cweiske terminally lazy people"
#
cweiske http://cweiske.de/tagebuch/tiny-tiny-rss-feed-detection.htm
#
acegiak ben_thatmustbeme: wish I knew :P
#
cweiske https://pubsubhubbub.googlecode.com/git/pubsubhubbub-core-0.4.html#anchor4
#
cweiske POST to hub url
#
ben_thatmustbeme ah ha, found some app thats support it
#
ben_thatmustbeme http://blog.superfeedr.com/state-of-pubsubhubbub
#
cweiske did someone already write a hub in php that I can self-host?
#
GWG cweiske: He didn't even suggest I implement it. He accused me of 'bitching'.
#
GWG cweiske: Ironically, someone did implement what I was suggesting as a plugin.
#
cweiske GWG, just get on with it. there's no point to be annoyed about him
#
GWG https://github.com/hrk/tt-rss-newsplus-plugin
#
GWG cweiske: I didn't have to, someone else did it for me. But still...
#
GWG I'm done thinking about that. Just didn't want acegiak to end up in the same annoyed position
#
acegiak yeah thanks for the heads up
#
acegiak basically if I can get tiny tiny irc to be as pretty as convos with some css/jquery magic I'll be happy
thehighfiveghost and GWG joined the channel
#
GWG Hmm...
eburcat, gRegor`, verdi_, bupkes, Acidnerd, frzn_, almereyda, thehighfiveghost, halorgium and pfefferl_ joined the channel
#
ben_thatmustbeme hey there
#
thawrrrr thawrrrr...dude...welcome back!
#
ben_thatmustbeme so it occurred to me, why do i bother with IRC at all
#
ben_thatmustbeme if I can log proxy through a bot, i can use my own interface and IRC / Slack literally are just plumbing
#
ben_thatmustbeme so I'm working on a nodejs bot now that will do just that
#
ben_thatmustbeme my own, web browser, whatever i want
#
ben_thatmustbeme basically i'm recreating irc-logs interface but my own
#
ben_thatmustbeme i'm working directly from my own app, so I don't care of plumbing underneath. once that is done, all that would remain is to create some indie version of a chat room and we don't need IRC
#
ben_thatmustbeme I didn't like the idea of moving into another silo when the slack stuff started, I realized thats because I can't customize IRC to hide away all that junk
#
ben_thatmustbeme so....
#
thawr sorry for all the parts/joins
#
thawr haha, it works.... aside from display
#
thawr on my end that is
#
ben_thatmustbeme test
#
thawr test
#
thawr haha, hi gRegor`
#
thawr gah, need to get my UI working over here, but the concept is good
#
ben_thatmustbeme i'm getting it down though
Loqi joined the channel
#
ben_thatmustbeme yes
#
aaronpk oh no!
#
cweiske acegiak, did you try out other web-based irc clients?
#
thawr hmm, annoying, io.emit doesn't seem to send to my client
#
aaronpk fixed logs thanks gRegor`
#
Loqi aaronpk: colintedford left you a message 6 hours, 26 minutes ago: I see twitter usernames are bolded in the logs; maybe bold the username in slack/username so it stands out better? (slack/*username*, not *slack/username*)
#
aaronpk good idea
#
thawr hmm
#
thawr yay
#
Loqi yay!
#
thawr i have text
#
thawr woah... i got 4 messages from loqi for some reason
#
Loqi woot!
thawr joined the channel
#
thawr ahh, i think that was the keeping connections open issue or something
#
ben_thatmustbeme test
#
thawr /nick ben_thatmust
#
thawr heh
#
aaronpk you can also test and spam stuff in #indiechat
#
thawr good point, since i don't have multiple rooms working yet
#
tantek.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:2015-056-hwc-sf.jpg]]""
#
tantek.com edited /events/2015-02-25-homebrew-website-club (+36) "/* Photos */ add SF photo" (view diff)
#
tantek kylewm++ for all the PubsubHubbub updates. Now to read through them :)
#
Loqi kylewm has 127 karma
#
tantek.com edited /events/2015-02-25-homebrew-website-club (+68) "/* Notes */ add KevinMarks notes" (view diff)
#
aaronpk i'm finding things are not very consistently named in the PuSH spec
#
cweiske it's 0.4. you can suggest improvements :)
#
aaronpk I am doing so
#
aaronpk new wiki page coming shortly
#
aaronpk actually i'm not suggesting any changes to PuSH 0.4 right now, just trying to clear things up
#
kylewm it looks like my subscriber is not compatible with wordpress's push hub, pushpress yet :(
#
cweiske.de edited /webhook (+172) "/* IndieWeb Examples */" (view diff)
#
aaronpk huh why not?
loic_m joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /events/2015-02-25-homebrew-website-club (+57) "/* Photos */ POSSE copy on IG" (view diff)
#
kylewm not sure yet, I just went through and subscribed to everyone in /PuSH#IndieWeb_Examples
#
aaronpk oh wow
#
kylewm and apparently I've never gotten an update ping from barnabywalters
wolftune joined the channel
#
kylewm ah crap, that's what i was afraid of, pushpress appears to be PuSH 0.3
#
aaronpk 0.3 is only XML right?
#
kylewm right
#
ben_thatmustbeme probably on topic,s o moving this over here
#
ben_thatmustbeme since I had a fairly easy time getting my own nodejs -> IRC client working
#
ben_thatmustbeme I'm going to try to do the same with multiple chat rooms, multiple servers, and even joining both the slack and IRC versions of the room (via either slack/IRC or slack/XMPP)
#
ben_thatmustbeme maybe even roll in AIM
#
ben_thatmustbeme if only hangouts still supported XMPP
#
ben_thatmustbeme i know they are dropping it
eburcat joined the channel
#
kylewm oh phew, looks like I just needed to add hub.verify=async to the subscription request to get compatibility with pushpress...
pfefferle joined the channel
#
kylewm ben_thatmustbeme: I don't understand what you're dong :)
#
aaronpk kylewm: are you receiving "fat pings" from any subscriptions right now?
#
kylewm aaronpk: nope I ignore the content of pings right now
#
ben_thatmustbeme kylewm, hopefully i will have a nice version out there in a month or so
#
ben_thatmustbeme would be cool to be able to show off at IWC Cambridge
#
kylewm and to be clear, I've only gotten pings from me and anildash so far :) hopefully that will change now that i'm subbed to some xml feeds
#
aaronpk what are your thoughts on fat pings in general?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "your thoughts on fat pings in general" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=your+thoughts+on+fat+pings+in+general&summary=prompted+by+aaronpk+https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Firc%2F2015-02-26%2Fline%2F1424968661792
#
kylewm the great thing about tantek's atom feed is it specifies a timezone,unlike his h-feed :p
#
aaronpk hahaha
#
ben_thatmustbeme your thoughts on fat pings in general are quite interesting to me
#
loqi.me created /your_thoughts_on_fat_pings_in_general (+92) "prompted by aaronpk https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-02-26/line/1424968661792 and dfn added by ben_thatmustbeme" (view diff)
#
Loqi ok
#
aaronpk ben_thatmustbeme: lol
#
ben_thatmustbeme sorry
#
ben_thatmustbeme still arguing for a prefix to address loqi when you want him to edit
#
Loqi dude
#
aaronpk so far the only "accidents" have been intentional :P
#
ben_thatmustbeme it will happen
#
aaronpk i can wait
#
kylewm fat pings seem pretty critical if youre a really high subscriber feed
#
kylewm so you don't have 15,000 readers all fetching your site at once after they receive the ping from the hub
#
aaronpk yeah
#
kylewm but that's a problem because you as a publisher don't have any control over whether your subscribers are doing that :p
#
aaronpk and it seems that there's no trust issue with fat pings from a hub like there is for webmentions
#
aaronpk because the hub is trusted by the publisher, so subscribers should trust the hub as much as they trust the publisher
#
kylewm i haven't read about them, is there some verification method that proves it is indeed a message from the hub?
#
aaronpk if you provide a secret during subscription yes
#
aaronpk i'll make a note of that in this writeup but for the first pass I don't want to involve the secret
#
kylewm are fat pings part of the PuSH spec or are they something superfeedr provides?
#
kylewm sigh, i really need to get an ssl certificate for reader.kylewm.com :(
#
aaronpk the PuSH spec doesn't actually what goes into the notification, so you can get fat pings or not
#
aaronpk it's funny cause the more I read the PuSH spec the more I realize how thin it actually is
#
aaronpk I am almost done with this... brb
#
kylewm Royal Payne Diaz
#
ben_thatmustbeme hmm, aaronpk, can i not delete page on the wiki
#
aaronpk i think deletes are restricted for some reason
#
ben.thatmustbe.me edited /your_thoughts_on_fat_pings_in_general (-23) (view diff)
#
ben_thatmustbeme what are your thoughts on fat pings in general?
#
Loqi fat pings? https://indiewebcamp.com/your_thoughts_on_fat_pings_in_general
#
kylewm just redirect to /Fatberg
#
aaronpk you can force a summary by adding <div class="p-summary"> btw
#
aaronpk otherwise it just tries to find the first sentence
#
ben_thatmustbeme eh, i would delete it, figured i'd have some fun with it before then
#
kylewm there was a good email somewhere complainiing about 0.4's underspecification
#
aaronpk i'm fixing that
#
kylewm it's interesting that being underspecified seems to make it more likely for only one or two implementations to exist
#
aaronpk I wonder if OAuth 2.0 had been written originally as the way it ended up, if that would also be true for OAuth
#
aaronpk it used to be better specified, and for a whole summer it didn't change, which is when most of the APIs got built
#
aaronpk so a bunch of them essentially implemented draft 10, and now we're past draft 23 and there's not a lot left in it
#
kylewm iyi https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/pubsubhubbub/7RPlYMds4RI
#
kylewm actually here is the first round where Jay R actually gives constructive comments https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/pubsubhubbub/sW6nVt_a7VQ
#
kylewm i guess the publisher and hub could really be the same application, and then there is no need for a ping between them
#
aaronpk that is kind of the same thing I have with https://tokens.indieauth.com
#
aaronpk your token endpoint and authorization endpoint *could* be the same server, but if they're not, then I described how they communicate
#
kylewm ha, great point
#
aaronparecki.com created /How_to_publish_and_consume_PubSubHubbub (+7892) "attempt a simple description of PuSH 0.4 as it would be used in the indieweb context" (view diff)
#
aaronpk kylewm: would you care to review this? https://indiewebcamp.com/How_to_publish_and_consume_PubSubHubbub
#
aaronpk this is my attempt at hard-coding more of the PuSH 0.4 spec
#
kylewm wow! nice work, yes i will review in a bit. headed out the door atm
#
aaronpk sweet
KevinMarks, jacus and arlen joined the channel
#
aaronpk oops i broke twitter https://www.flickr.com/photos/10970592@N04/16468843549/
snarfed joined the channel
#
ben_thatmustbeme i had google telling me how long it would take to get home wrong... "NULL to Home"
#
ben_thatmustbeme I don't know how long NULL is exactly
#
sparverius ben_thatmustbeme: well the distance home in that case would not be a number soooo
#
sparverius have you watched the film gravity? i think you're trapped in that.
#
sparverius I've asked this before, I think, but would anyone have some suggestions for colo/dedi/vps hosting? I looked on the wiki briefly
#
aaronpk I'm still a fan of Linode
#
sparverius the urgency moved up
#
sparverius hmm... yeah, ive heard a lot of nice things about them. i think i'll just go with it
#
aaronpk (referral link: http://aaron.pk/linode )
#
sparverius sure, why not
#
aaronpk :) thanks!
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
@benwerd Without #netneutrality, you could have been penalized for running your own website instead of using a big player. Big win for the #indieweb. (twitter.com/_/status/571012107111510016)
tilgovi, j12t, benwerd and KevinMarks joined the channel
#
kylewm sparverius: last time i looked, DigitalOcean was half the price if you can live with half the RAM
scor joined the channel
#
bear DigitalOcean, Vultr, Linode -- all depends on which combination of extras you need
#
aaronpk anyone have any experience flattening a wordpress site into static HTML?
#
bear yep - many many rounds of xml export -> python cleanup scripts to get the words and images into a file structure
#
aaronpk eesh
#
aaronpk i'm trying this one right now https://wordpress.org/plugins/static-html-output-plugin/
#
bear I use pelican-import
#
bear http://docs.getpelican.com/en/3.2/importer.html
#
aaronpk oh yeah I guess I could do it that way
#
aaronpk tho I'd probably go the route of middleman or something since I'm more on the ruby side
#
aaronpk I was hoping I could just export the actual HTML wordpress is generating and avoid reformatting and rebuilding everything
benwerd joined the channel
#
bear I use pelican-import to generate all of the files in a clean manner - didn't end up using it at the end
#
bear that sounds like you want to spider your own site and then extract the body content with images references
#
aaronpk pretty much
#
aaronpk i basically want to do what archive.org is doing
#
aaronpk but i can't find any good information on *how* to do that
#
sparverius so, i'm looking to slap about 100GB of files somewhere, and occasionally unzip large chunks of data once or twice a day for backups
#
sparverius any suggestions for providers that wont get pissed?
#
aaronpk amazon
#
bear amazon
#
sparverius damn
#
tonious aaronpk: Try wget --mirror?
#
sparverius okay
#
aaronpk tonious: everyone keeps saying that but then i usually end up hitting weird edge cases with it
#
bear I use scrapy for my web crawling and archivning needs
#
tonious Fair enough.
#
aaronpk scrapy looks promising
#
bear scrapy is nice because you define the allowed domains so it will avoid also archiving anything you link to
#
aaronpk i'm gonna give that a shot
#
bear http://doc.scrapy.org/en/0.16/
Jeena and wolftune joined the channel
#
aaronpk hm scrapy seems to be more about selecting specific bits of a page
#
aaronpk can't find examples of using it to make a complete archive
#
bear I wonder if I mixed up my memory - let me go look at the code I last used for an archive...
#
bear so, the code I used was some old crufty python code and feeling bad for giving you some old info I went and found out what Internet Archive uses
#
bear https://github.com/internetarchive/heritrix3
#
aaronpk i think i'm gonna write one in node really quick... we'll see how this goes
verdi__ joined the channel
#
bear in "theory" it's a queue of urls to process
#
bear but the good ones also dig into CSS and extract that data
benwerd, VeryLittleGravit, eschnou, KevinMarks, raretrack, KartikPrabhu, modem and zero-gravitas joined the channel
#
GWG kylewm: Saw your statement on PushPress. Look at the last changelog for it.
#
kylewm GWG: not seeing anything interesting on https://wordpress.org/plugins/pushpress/changelog/
#
aaronpk whee almost got it
#
GWG The first entry
#
kylewm Make sure to only output the hub information in feeds?
#
GWG It doesn't consider h-feed as a feed.
#
kylewm oh yeah i know
#
kylewm i'm subscribing to your xml feed
#
GWG Wondering if it is worth exploring.
#
GWG If it becomes more popular..
michielbdejong joined the channel
#
kylewm GWG: if the pushpress hub is 0.3, which i suspect it is, that might be more work than you want to bargain for
#
kylewm 0.3 is Atom/Rss only
#
KartikPrabhu kylewm: nice woodwind logo
#
GWG There isn't a php hub I could install?
#
Loqi [mention] http://dougmckown.com/2014/why-im-quitting-facebook/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths (webmention)
#
Loqi [mention] http://dougmckown.com/2014/why-im-quitting-facebook/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com (webmention)
#
Loqi [mention] http://dougmckown.com/2014/why-im-quitting-facebook/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/why (webmention)
#
kylewm KartikPrabhu: thanks! :)
zero-gravitas, tantek, krendil, benwerd, vanderwal and wolftune joined the channel
#
@Inkwater_Masha Proper book layout—use it or look like an amateur. http://writerlycommunity.azurewebsites.net/interior-book-design-10-top-rules-to-help-you-achieve-a-book-that-no-one-can-put-down/ #indieauth #selfpub (twitter.com/_/status/571050880218341376)
#
@TheWritingGeek Proper book layout—use it or look like an amateur. http://writerlycommunity.azurewebsites.net/interior-book-design-10-top-rules-to-help-you-achieve-a-book-that-no-one-can-put-down/ #indieauth #selfpub (twitter.com/_/status/571050880285450242)
gavinc joined the channel
#
distresssignal.org created /User:Distresssignal.org (+8) "Created page with "**Heya**"" (view diff)
#
distresssignal.org edited /User:Distresssignal.org (+2) (view diff)
#
kylewm GWG: honestly I don't know if there are any (other) php implementations. Google's reference implementation is appengine/python and seems v. outdated
#
kylewm but you can just delegate to a third party hub, like the one at appspot or superfeedr
#
distresssignal.org edited /User:Distresssignal.org (+25) (view diff)
#
distresssignal.org edited /User:Distresssignal.org (+14) (view diff)
#
aaronpk i'll probably make a hub at some point, but for now, happy to use someone else's
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
ben_thatmustbeme did we just get botted in #indiechat?
wont_on joined the channel
#
kylewm what does that mean?
#
gRegor` Excluding your nodebod? ;)
#
ben_thatmustbeme haha
#
gRegor` *nodebot
#
ben_thatmustbeme yes, tfontaine just reads like spam bot
#
gRegor` awkward
#
gRegor` Nope, that's my friend Tyler
#
ben_thatmustbeme ahh
#
gRegor` He made a bot to ping his internet connection, because they're crap
#
gRegor` (the ISP)
#
ben_thatmustbeme so I have been trying to figure out a way to get my nickserv password to store on my site
#
kylewm oh funny, i didn't read that as spammy at all
#
ben_thatmustbeme i'm thinking of doing it as a config endpoint, and then it just has to request a token with scope=configs or something
#
ben_thatmustbeme but i HAVE to store passwords in the clear when doing it this way... which i don't really like the precendent of without a clear listing of what passwords it will be getting access to
benwerd and tfontaine joined the channel
#
ben_thatmustbeme but do i do scope=freenode_password,aim_password
#
ben_thatmustbeme looks messy
#
kylewm why would you want that?
#
aaronpk oh nice
#
aaronpk that is exactly what scope is for :)
#
ben_thatmustbeme the idea being to log in to a site (like the irc-logs for example) with indieauth and have it be able to make all the connections I need
#
ben_thatmustbeme thats going to be a lot of scopes though
#
ben_thatmustbeme or would it be better to store scope as <myapp>_configs
#
ben_thatmustbeme and then it has its own private space to store configs
#
ben_thatmustbeme thus only enter my PWs once on the service, but know that it isn't going to access i didn't input in that app
#
ben_thatmustbeme kylewm, my hope is to create a single place that I host, that i can do all my messaging and chatting from
#
ben_thatmustbeme and log on my own terms, display on my own terms
#
ben_thatmustbeme no more AIM, and IRC clients
#
kylewm #OwnYourBitlbee
#
aaronpk waits for ben_thatmustbeme to try to find an iMessage client library
#
ben_thatmustbeme that would be lovely
#
ben_thatmustbeme i'm not there yet
#
ben_thatmustbeme i really wish it did google voice too
#
ben_thatmustbeme send and receive texts and such
#
ben_thatmustbeme but i don't think they have an API anymore
#
ben_thatmustbeme i'll have to look in to that
#
aaronpk they never had an API
#
ben_thatmustbeme only for mobile integration
#
aaronpk I reverse engineered it at one point and made a php library
#
ben_thatmustbeme :(
#
kylewm Pidgin has a Skype integration that actually requires skype to be running
#
aaronpk it's still my most popular github repo :(
#
kylewm it's awful
#
ben_thatmustbeme one option is go the pushbullet route and need an app on your phone to do it all through
#
ben_thatmustbeme what is pushbullet
#
Loqi Pushbullet is a free service that sends rich notifications to your Android or iOS device, as well as various web browsers https://indiewebcamp.com/Pushbullet
#
aaronpk you could script imessage with applescript
#
ben_thatmustbeme oh nice
#
aaronpk leave an old mac running at home and write an API on top of it
#
aaronpk i've been tempted to do that for a while. in the mean time I have a script running that downloads my imessage history and converts to static html files
#
ben_thatmustbeme there are some imessage node plugins
#
ben_thatmustbeme s/plugins/libraries
#
Loqi ben_thatmustbeme meant to say: there are some imessage node libraries
#
gRegor` Ugh. Forget it all. I'm going back to telegrams. Stop.
#
gRegor` Small but maybe good improvements re: Twitter abuse. http://www.theverge.com/2015/2/26/8116645/twitter-improves-abuse-reporting-tools-phone-numbers
#
gRegor` "With today's update, Twitter is bringing the same tools to reporting impersonation, self-harm, and the inappropriate posting of personal information. Now third-party accounts can report those violations of Twitter's terms of service using the same simplified workflow."
#
gRegor` That sounds particularly good. Last time I tried to report on behalf of someone else, it basically halted me once I indicated the report wasn't about me.
LauraJ, scor, lukebrooker, eburcat_, atomicules and friedcell joined the channel
#
atomicules Hello all. I have been slowly working through my blog archives adding microformats. I have a question around the use of h-cite for nested quotations.
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: Coming back to the channel after a bit of time, our Web archive is better than the slack view on mobile (android) by a long way.
#
gRegor` Hi atomicules! Shoot.
#
atomicules I have some posts I imported from Tumblr to Jekyll where I reblogged people. Does this kind of markup make sense: https://gist.github.com/atomicules/32f17cf337b3da0f2661
#
atomicules I've had to add divs so I can get the root class h-cite correct. At least I *think* it's what I need to do.
#
gRegor` It seems to parse correctly: http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fapp.simplenote.com%2Fpublish%2FMSD9YN
#
gregorlove.com created /cite (+22) "r" (view diff)
almereyda joined the channel
#
atomicules Ok. Great. Thanks. Anything else you'd recommend I add in mark-up wise or shall I go ahead with that idea?
#
gRegor` I *think* the h-cite could just be on the blockquotes, if the top-most u-repost-of link was moved within the blockquote. Then the extra divs wouldn't be necessary. But that could be tricky to automate
#
atomicules Ok, I will have a look at that. Automation isn't a worry at the moment. I'm manually fixing awkward imported posts like these.
#
gRegor` It would also require the top-most item is wrapped in a blockquote. Shouldn't affect the parser, though, just less HTML.
#
gRegor` <blockquote class="h-cite"> person 2 said . . . <blockquote class="h-cite"> . . . </blockquote> </blockquote>
#
atomicules I have updated my Jekyll includes and templates to add in microformats for any posts I'd created natively under Jekyll.
#
atomicules Thanks gRegor. I shall have a look at that option this weekend.
#
gRegor` You're welcome!
#
gRegor` Have you logged in to the wiki already? You can add yourself to http://indiewebcamp.com/IRC_People
snarfed joined the channel
#
aaronpk my website archiver crawler thing is working :)
#
aaronpk I had to force it to run synchronously because when it was making a bunch of parallel requests it would crash the server that wordpress was on within a few seconds
#
kylewm way to go nodejs
#
aaronpk kinda scary that i could probably take down a bunch of websites with this script
tilgovi joined the channel
#
atomicules gRegor': I'll see about adding myself.
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: Reminds me of when Aaron Swartz took down Technorati by fetching links to all of Congress in parallel
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: I would suggest serving wp statically, but that's what you're trying to do I presume. What do the crashes look like? MySQL getting blocked?
#
aaronpk KevinMarks_: yeah I'm trying to archive a site which is a combination of wordpress and a ruby app
#
aaronpk once I turn it into a pile of html i can host it anywhere
#
aaronpk the server just runs out of ram and then crashes
#
Loqi slack/pwcc: aaronpk: Are you accross Loqi's confusion with /nick instrucitosn in slack? <https://indiewebcamp.slack.com/archives/indiewebcamp/p1424939860000967>
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: haha
#
Loqi slack/aaronpk: oops!
#
Loqi slack/pwcc: She's still learning.
zero-gravitas joined the channel
#
Loqi slack/pwcc: or he? Do amphomorphic bots have a pronoun?
modem joined the channel
#
aaronpk Loqi: a/s/l
#
Loqi 204441464/bot/internet
#
Loqi slack/pwcc: Loqi++ ★, +1 etc
#
Loqi slack/kevinmarks: Trickster gods get to choose
#
vanderwal.net edited /IRC_People (+56) "/* Nicknames */" (view diff)
#
tantek oh hey welcome vanderwal!
#
vanderwal tantek hello
scor joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /WordPress (+437) "/* Criticism */ Complexity (per last night's tweet), rename Jetpack to JetPack Requires Login" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /events/2015-02-25-homebrew-website-club (+127) "/* Photos */ add KevinMarks photo" (view diff)
#
kylewm kind of a cool looking tool for building Wordpress sites https://roots.io/
#
kylewm the first guy on the about page is Ben Word, and I kind of feel like we have to get him to join #indiewebcamp
#
Loqi slack/pwcc: Lowercase p dangit for Jetpack. Going in now.
#
peterwilson.cc edited /WordPress (+0) "Outside of quotes, ensure case correct for both Jetpack (sentence case) and WordPress (camel case)" (view diff)
#
Loqi slack/pwcc: kylewm: looks nice.
#
acegiak oh hey look, I DO have the lamp stack installed on my desktop!
#
acegiak kylewm: then we would have benwerd, benward, benword and ben_thatmustbeme :S