#indiewebcamp 2015-04-25

2015-04-25 UTC
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tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+15) "/* Publishing standards */ u-like-of"
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tantek
hmm - just realized I have an invalid object-type in my atom feed - /like
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tantek
and now I have no idea how to convert my "like" posts into Atom 1.0 - does that mean it is time to give up on Atom 1.0? Or should I just not put my posts there? Or should they just be notes?
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tantek
s/not put my posts/not put my like posts
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Loqi
tantek meant to say: and now I have no idea how to convert my "like" posts into Atom 1.0 - does that mean it is time to give up on Atom 1.0? Or should I just not put my like posts there? Or should they just be notes?
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tantek
kylewm: you were/are consuming my Atom feed is that right?
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kylewm
tantek: I was, am not anymore
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tantek
well I haven't gotten any bug reports so I suppose it's ok
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tantek
maybe I'll leave it in as "non-standard"
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tantek
W3C Feed Validator doesn't complain, but also doesn't support Activity Streams http://validator.w3.org/feed/check.cgi?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftantek.com%2Fupdates.atom
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kylewm
what were you using that was complaining?
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aaronpk
tantek: I would expect to see that "like" post in Atom as a regular entry
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tantek
kylewm, View Source on my Atom feed, saw that I had somehow used <object-type xmlns="http://activitystrea.ms/spec/1.0/">http://activitystrea.ms/schema/1.0/like</object-type> and then decided to check the Activity Streams 1.0 spec to see if there was a "like" object-type, noticed there was not (it's a verb in AS1)
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KevinMarks_
what deos unmung see?
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KevinMarks_
an untitled first item saying 'likes Ryan Barrett’s “Introducing Color Genomics”.'
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KevinMarks_
for feedparser that's a shrug
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kylewm
so activitystreams json it would be {"verb":"like", "object":{"url":"https://snarfed.org/2015-04-21_introducing-color-genomics"}}
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kylewm
that doesn't translate to atom xml?
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tantek
hmm - maybe I have to add another object? or verb?
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tantek
or both?
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kylewm
but if nobody consumes it, it's just an exercise in meeting the requirements of a spec?
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KevinMarks_
yay, feedparser now passes the xfn and rel tag tests again
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tantek
KevinMarks++
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Loqi
KevinMarks has 108 karma
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tantek
kylewm: I'm assuming that any currently shipping AS2 consumers also consume AS1
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tantek
because that would be logical for backward compat
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tantek
as well as not that difficult to support
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tantek
but I have no evidence
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tantek
the last time I tested AS1 consuming - it was with StatusNet
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tantek
maybe snarfed would know
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tantek
!tell snarfed do you know of any feed reader or other consuming code that consumes Activity Streams 1.0 (Atom/XML) and does something presentationally different with different object-types and verbs?
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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kylewm
this has some examples of follows and reposts http://quitter.se/api/statuses/user_timeline/115649.atom
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KevinMarks_
hm, I should put up a page that runs my version shouldn't I
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tantek
KevinMarks: did you spec your changes?
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KevinMarks_
not yet, will do that next
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tantek
it wasn't clear from the brainstorming page and the follow-up discussion what you decided to go with
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KevinMarks_
I'll go edit that now
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KevinMarks_
it was easier to code the parser than make exampels by hand
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tantek
kylewm: thanks for the example
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tantek
(from that example)
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kylewm
it's interesting how some posts have objects and some *are* the object
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kylewm
i'm not deep enough into the AS spec to understand that
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tantek
kylewm: it's because the AS spec designers fell in love with the subject-verb-object abstraction, and made everything fit that
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KevinMarks_
over to #microformats for my parsing stuff
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tantek
whereas when everything has a permalink, everything is a post, an object, and there's no need for verbs in the model
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KevinMarks_
we need to check that against the existing big activity stream users at some point
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tantek
who are they?
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tantek.com
edited /ActivityStreams (+72) "create explicit IndieWeb Examples section, and Silo Examples, note AS1.0/Atom examples"
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tantek
KevinMarks - the top level "urls" key is misleading
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tantek
oops wrong channel
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kylewm
gnu social isn't a silo is it, tantek?
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kylewm
(i.e. quitter.se)
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tantek
what is GNU Social?
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Loqi
GNU social is an free software project that "will be a decentralized social network that you can install on your own server" https://indiewebcamp.com/GNU_social
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tantek
right, GNU Social is software, quitter.se is silo that uses it (right?)
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kylewm.com
edited /ActivityStreams (+86) "/* Silo Examples */ add JSON feed"
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kylewm
I don't think it has much in common with a silo, it's non-profit, federated, interoperates with other sites that publish or consume Atom
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tantek
what is a commons?
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rhiaro
Isn't GNU Social a monoculture?
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tantek.com
edited /commons (-18) "fix summary"
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tantek
let's try that again
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tantek
what is a commons?
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Loqi
A commons is a centralized web content hosting site, where users are able to freely contribute content, and easily retrieve it, typically each others' content as well https://indiewebcamp.com/commons
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tantek
sounds closer to a commons kylewm - good point
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kylewm
rhiaro: yes to monoculture
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tantek.com
edited /ActivityStreams (+69) "/* Silo Examples */ Commons examples"
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rhiaro
oh I see, multiple types
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KevinMarks_
big users of activity streams would be gnip and echo
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tantek
What is Gnip?
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tantek
What is Echo?
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rhiaro
KevinMarks_: and pumpio / mediagoblin (or did you already have this part of the conversation)?
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KevinMarks_
gnip is a social data broker, now owned by twitter see gnip.com they us Activity Streams as their internal format see http://support.gnip.com/articles/activity-streams-intro.html
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loqi.me
created /gnip (+205) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-04-24/line/1429925614884 and dfn added by KevinMarks_"
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KevinMarks_
Echo is a social data broker, see http://www.echostudio.co/
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loqi.me
created /Echo (+86) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-04-24/line/1429925617637 and dfn added by KevinMarks_"
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tantek
kevinmarks "social data broker" sounds like marketing
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tantek
brokers usually help buy / sell stuff
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tantek
I don't really see any of that here
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KevinMarks_
they buy data from twitter/fb etc and sell it to companies
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tantek
rhiaro: are GNU Social instances only interested in interoperating with other instances?
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rhiaro
tantek: I don't know for sure, that's the impression I got from "a social network you can install"
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rhiaro
(as opposed to say, "a protocol you can implement")
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rhiaro
I think some might have bridging
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tantek
rhiaro: could you document that and ( http://federation.skilledtests.com/select_your_server.html ) on http://indiewebcamp.com/GNU_social ? maybe in a Criticism / Monoculture subsection?
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rhiaro
did status.net interoperate with other systems?
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rhiaro
there's GNU FM too which "federates" with last.fm but I can't see anything about that interoperating with GNU Social, hmm
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rhiaro
right, well various different GNU Social sites seem to look different. I wonder how deep it goes.
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rhiaro
"It is possible for a GNU social user (e.g., on quitter.se) to subscribe to a feed (e.g., tantek.com) by manuallly visiting the URL" <- well that's not so bad
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tantek
wait really? does someone have that working?
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rhiaro
I just read that in iwc wiki
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rhiaro
assumed you wrote it
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tantek
I don't think so?
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tantek
because I would have provided links to support that
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rhiaro
^ behind a login
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rhiaro
also says it has microformats
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rhiaro
sounds interoppy
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rhiaro
adds to list of things to play with
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kylewm
(I wrote that bit about subcribing to tantek.com on quitter)
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kylewm
it seems to be mostly broken now though, I can still subscribe to tantek.com but cannot see any updates from him
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kylewm
and even at the time i think I had to look at the source to find that ostatussub url
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tantek
kylewm: maybe that's my fault?
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tantek
i.e. the unknown object-type
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kylewm
impossible to know
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tantek
no error message?
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kylewm
and I can't see any updates from my atom feed either
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kylewm
although it's even more likely to be broken :p
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kylewm
if someone is interested, I woudl recommend trying with a more vanilla version of GNU Social -- quitter.se is highly customized to look like twitter
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tantek
kylewm: can you document the failure at least on the page?
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tantek
either on the /AS page or on /Quitter.se - your choice
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kylewm
heading out the door, but i will document it tonight
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tantek
thanks
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@AllinNigeria
VoiceOfIndie: Arts alive in Nigeria! http://t.co/NsNBx9ByjP; RT/Support Jinlobify #RaveReviewsBookClub #IndieAuth… https://twitter.com/VoiceOfIndie/status/591797866395369472
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tantek
for now I've turned my like posts into just "notes" in my Atom AS 1.0 because I don't know of any AS 1.0 Atom consumers that do anything with a "like" that I can test :/
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tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+24) "/* Feeds */ likes are also just "notes" in the AS1 output"
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@W6AZ
Dave Winer's MyWord Editor - A community of #silo-free bloggers built around it? #indieweb http://myword.io/users/W6AZ/essays/016.html https://twitter.com/W6AZ/status/591820506220789761/photo/1
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@kevinmarks
@LynnMagic the indieweb work is mostly public by default, but there is some thought and experimentation http://indiewebcamp.com/private_posts
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@kevinmarks
@LynnMagic the vouch extension to webmention may make sense too. http://indiewebcamp.com/Vouch
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@kevinmarks
@LynnMagic selective visibility is tricky across domains but webmention should mean that if you send a hidden post the receiver won't see it
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kylewm
oh snap, a post on my website is showing up natively in quitter now
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tantek
what did you do to fix it?
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kylewm
nothing
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kylewm
i just went to look and its there suddenly
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kylewm
possibly because it was a new post since i was playing around with it
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tantek
heisenbug?
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tantek
not that it should matter, but I did "fix" my AS Atom feed to use "note" as the object type for my like posts, since it's not obvious how to minimally construct an AS Atom like (with verb)
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kylewm
next time you post an update, I'll check whether it pulls it in
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tantek
ok I'll post something
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tantek
kylewm: I posted a reply. next I'll post a like
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kylewm.com
edited /events/2015-05-06-homebrew-website-club (+168) "/* Where */ CreamerySF"
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tantek
like posted
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kylewm.com
edited /events/2015-05-06-homebrew-website-club (+63) "/* URLs */ add SF events"
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kylewm
tantek: I had accidentally unfollowed you earlier so I didn't get the first post, but the like showed up!!
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tantek
what did it show up like? (no pun intended)
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kylewm
taking screenshot
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tantek
that sounds like it showed up in near realtime then!
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tantek
note that I am sending PuSH notifications for *both* my AS Atom feed and my home page h-feed
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kylewm
it's really cool how it preserves the link
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tantek
kylewm here goes a realtime test
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kylewm
hasn't showed up in quitter yet...
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tantek
sorry haven't pushed the pub button yet
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tantek
ready?
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kylewm
ha, yes
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@t
Everyone at Homebrew Website Club SF/PDX/NYC this week was ok with @IndieWebCamp July 11-12. Mark your calendars! (ttk.me t4aq1)
(twtr.io/yinP9n01Vb)
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kylewm
haha yeah it worked!
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tantek
< 1 min?
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kylewm
oh yeah like seconds
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tantek
sweet! yay! alright, that's good enough reason to keep maintaining my AS1 Atom feed + PuSH 0.3.
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Loqi
woot
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tantek
good enough interop :)
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kylewm
yeah, i am pleasantly surprised/impressed
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tantek
that definitely deserves updated documentation
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kylewm
going to requeet you
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tantek
what is requeet?
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tantek
(saw that coming)
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kylewm
I think they thought better of calling them queets -- it says "Repeated by ... " now
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tantek
can you link to a public permalink of it?
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tantek
of this cross-site repost?
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tantek
probably a good example to capture
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tantek
hmm js required
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kylewm
that's actually the permalink of the (re)post itself
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tantek
exactly!
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kylewm
I'm not totally sure what this is
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kylewm
I guess it is equivalent to a single-post view in woodwind
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tantek.com
edited /repost (+206) "Commons Examples / quitter"
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@kevinmarks
@LynnMagic looking at quirell, it would be pretty easy to make it indieweb friendly. Mind if I try?
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fkooman
hmm quill has a http redirect URI, that is not good :(
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kylewm
tantek: sorry if this was already clear -- your note gets its own permalink page on quitter even if I don't repost it, e.g. https://quitter.se/notice/3667699
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tantek
fascinating - just because you're subscribed to me?
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kylewm
fkooman: http redirects to https, that's bad?
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fkooman
kylewm, for one, it allows for mitm :)
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fkooman
i mean, i access quill over https, then it redirects to indiecert to authenticate, but in the auth request it specifies a http://quill... redirect_uri query parameter
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fkooman
that is wrong
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fkooman
monocle work fine...
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kylewm
ohh, yes that's bad
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tantek
oh oops - sounds like an oversight
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tantek
especially since you *started* with an https access of quill
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fkooman
exactly :)
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tantek
good catch! might want to !tell aaronpk that
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tantek
kylewm: does quitter have a POSSE copy of all my posts then?
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fkooman
!tell aaronpk quill has a http URL as redirect_uri parameter to the authorization_endpoint :(
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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kylewm
I'm curious if it will have a copy of them going forward, it didn't have the old ones even though I had been subscribed to you for > a year
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tantek
I wonder if you had to have your browser open to it
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kylewm
we'll see i guess
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kylewm
heading to bed, good night all!
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Loqi
don't let the bed bugs bite
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fkooman
hmmm...why does ownyourgram require instagram?
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tantek
I suppose if I were using my own hub or aaronpk's hub perhaps it could tell if/when quitter retrieved the post
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tantek
fkooman: it's the whole point of ownyourgram
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fkooman
oh haha :-)
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fkooman
read now the description :o :)
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fkooman
at least the login works :-)
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tantek
night kylewm !
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@kevinmarks
@LynnMagic looking at quirell, it would be pretty easy to make it indieweb friendly. Mind if I try?
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@srbanister
Der @diplix inspiriert mich gerade mit seinem #IndieWeb - Blogpost: Dein Feedback auf meine Inhalte gehört zu mir https://www.dirkmurschall.de/blog/dein-feedback-auf-meine-inhalte-gehoert-zu-mir/
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tantek.com
edited /2015/ (+9) "main indiewebcamp date is set!"
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tantek.com
edited /2015 (+1581) "date is set, start setting up the page, move candidate dates to bottom as historical documentation"
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@Ironsoup
@t Doesn't anyone care about <TITLE>s? Too many uninformative; obfuscated. Manually editing after +bookmark'ing sucks. #indieweb
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tantek
maybe it's bookmarking that's broken :P
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tantek.com
edited /2015 (+1204) "/* IndieWebCamp 2015 */ add more sections from the 2014 home page"
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tantek.com
edited /Template:IndieWebCamp (+16) "IWC 2015 is planned, move it up to the first half"
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tantek.com
edited /Events (+3624) "add next 3 month's HWC meetups, July IndieWebCamps"
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KevinMarks_
well, <title> has been abused by SEO types
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tantek.com
created /2015/Guest_List (+5961) "copy from 2014 and update"
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tantek
and we have a 2015 Guest List setup with so far co-organizers aaronpk and mysefl
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tantek
go forth and add yourselves!
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tantek.com
edited /2015 (+19) "category 2015"
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tantek
KevinMarks - you going to be able to make it to IWC 2015 July 11-12 in Portland? https://indiewebcamp.com/2015/Guest_List#Creators
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tantek
rhiaro: https://indiewebcamp.com/2015/Edinburgh says "Once we've confirmed the dates and venue" - but you've confirmed the dates right?
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tantek
and do you have a venue confirmed too?
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KevinMarks_
I think so, yes
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KevinMarks_
that weekend is free fro me at the moment
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tantek
great! lock it down :)
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@obiwankimberly
RT @t: Everyone at Homebrew Website Club SF/PDX/NYC this week was ok with @IndieWebCamp July 11-12. Mark your calendars! (ttk.me t4aq1)
(twtr.io/yj7NegEPnC)
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KevinMarks_
I even used acegiak's pronoun markup
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ben_thatmustbeme
:/ gitlab has links to your own profile as rel=nofollow ... no "me" rel in there
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ben_thatmustbeme
KevinMarks_: have you started working on the code to quirell yet?
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ben_thatmustbeme
:( still tons of leftover dead connections in here
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ben_thatmustbeme
i had found a fix for aaronpk at one point
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ben_test2
excellent
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ben_test3
test
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ben_thatmustbeme
can't get streaming logs up and running to test on my machine
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ben_thatmustbeme
getting closer
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ben_thatmustbeme
yes, that works!
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test_ben
tests
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KevinMarks_
ben_thatmustbeme: I forked the code to get that up, yes, but I haven't used gitlab before so haven't made a pull request yet
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kylewm
hmm, so fkooman made the point yesterday that indieauthing with http://tuxed.net/ is not equivalent to indieauthing with https://tuxed.net/
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kylewm
but they are the same as far as indiewebcamp.com is concerned
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kylewm
I'm thinking of making them two totally separate accounts in woodwind
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KevinMarks_
is this what timbl was worrying about?
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@mivesto
RT @elfpavlik: "Implicit vs explicit object types" by @rhiaro http://rhiaro.co.uk/2015/04/post-and-activity-types see: [#hEntry #Activity] cc: [#IndieWeb #ActivityStrea…
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kylewm
sheesh yeah that would be nice
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@srbanister
Ich spiele in diesen Tagen mit Webmentions rum. Kann sein, dass sich mein Postingverhalten etwas ändert.
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kylewm
hmm, indieauth strips the trailing /, is that a problem?
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tantek
KevinMarks: it is one instance of the problems TimBL was talking about yes.
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tantek
kylewm: if the http version redirects to https - then only use the https version as the one account - in both cases
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kylewm
tantek: if I log in to indieauth with http://kylewm.com, it will return me=http://kylewm.com, even though http redirects to https
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tantek
then that's a bug in indieauth we should get fixed
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kylewm
and I think that's the right thing to do -- since someone could mitm my http:// site and redirect it somewhere bad
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tantek
no the redirect destination is what should be used as the identity, not the original
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tantek
so if they redirect it somewhere bad, that's revealed as their identity
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kylewm
ah right ok
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tantek
if someone implements level 5 https://indiewebcamp.com/https#Level_5_security then auth services should respect that.
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tantek
kylewm: re: strips the trailing /, is that a problem? - not for a domain identity
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kylewm
tantek: so would you say that http://kylewm.com is the same identity as https://kylewm.com?
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kylewm
like authing with one should give you the other?
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tantek
not in general, only in the http->https upgrade direction
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tantek
per level 5 https
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kylewm
not actually sure if that's the same issue
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tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+1351) "quote posts - including figuring out display and markup for"
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tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+239) "/* Legacy support */ recently verified consuming support for AS Atom + PuSH feature"
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@heathr
@ElisaC the web felt clearly like it was about *people*. Lots of early women inc @dooce. Early blogging (pre-blogging software) was v human
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aaronpk
good morning
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Loqi
aaronpk: fkooman left you a message 10 hours, 2 minutes ago: quill has a http URL as redirect_uri parameter to the authorization_endpoint :( http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-04-25/line/1429946764865
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aaronpk
fkooman: thanks! good catch
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ben_thatmustbeme
aaronpk, i started working on some of the issues on the webchat
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ben_thatmustbeme
i am having some trouble setting it up entirely, i got the UI up but don't have the websockets bit figured out. but I believe I found the issue with /me
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aaronpk
oh cool
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ben_thatmustbeme
i also have some code I found that should take care of the dead connections issue
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aaronpk
oh awesome, i never did figure out what was up with that
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ben_thatmustbeme
i had sent you a link to some code fix, but i never put it in github
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ben_thatmustbeme
so i'll be getting around to that bit
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ben_thatmustbeme
like i said, I have the viewer working, but I had to hardcode wss://indiewebcamp.com for where to connect the sockets to
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ben_thatmustbeme
is it a node server running the other end?
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ben_thatmustbeme
just got back from the dentist so i was rushing through some of the set up this morning
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ben_thatmustbeme
wait, no, i'd have to just leave that part, thats using loqi isn't it
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Loqi
dude
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aaronpk
oh yeah if you're not running your own node websockets server you could use the indiewebcamp one
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GWG
ben_thatmustbeme: Remember Indiewebcamp Online?
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GWG
I keep thinking of trying ab HWC online to try to build interest for more physical ones.
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aaronpk
fkooman: fixed the quill redirect uri issue! thanks
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KevinMarks
Oh, if you want to try my quirrel instance, the number of kittens is "one"
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fkooman
aaronpk, cool, thanks!
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aaronpk
tantek: kylewm: for the http://kylewm.com/ vs https://kylewm.com/ issue ( http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-04-25/line/1429979768632 ) i explicitly made it use the entered URL as the identity
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fkooman
aaronpk, i can login to quill now with indiecert :)
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aaronpk
here's a real example of why that's important: https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth.com/issues/19
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aaronpk
fkooman: awesome!
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ben_thatmustbeme
KevinMarks. that is the most random quote i've seen today (if taken out of context)
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ben_thatmustbeme
aaronpk: I may have to run my own node instance. i don't think i can really debug the other parts without that
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ben_thatmustbeme
everything in /streaming/ is the node isn't it?
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tantek
aaronpk - then do you consider http vs https as different identities?
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aaronpk
yeah, are you familar with running node stuff?
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ben_thatmustbeme
i can run them, just always started some description of how to run it
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aaronpk
tantek: indieauth.com does, but the apps like quill or teacup actually handle it inconsistently now that I look
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aaronpk
quill uses the full URL that it gets as the identity, but teacup uses just the domain part
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tantek
the wiki for example only uses the domain / path
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aaronpk
I guess we need to be more explicit about this
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ben_thatmustbeme
i use the domain
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tantek
at least document the range of behavior and what are considered better/best practices
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ben_thatmustbeme
so http and https are the same
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ben_thatmustbeme
biggest reason for that, is people who up from http to https don't look like a new person everywhere
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aaronpk
right, that's a good reason for wanting to combine the http and https identities
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tantek
yeah - there are some odd exceptions like forbes.com (try it with http vs. https)
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aaronpk
the thing i'm struggling with conceptually is that http identities can't really be treated as secure at all, so maybe apps just shouldn't allow non-https logins at all
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aaronpk
except in practice that would create a huge barrier
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tantek
that would cut off a lot of people :/
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ben_thatmustbeme
yeah, i don't think we could do that
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ben_thatmustbeme
maybe a slight nudge of "hey you really aren't secure"
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GWG
Can you require an extra step with http vs https?
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aaronpk
right, so in practice we end up with people starting off with http, then adding https and not wanting every app to consider that a new account
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fkooman
aaronpk, if you post using quill and the micropub endpoint sends a 301 with a location header, quill thinks the post was successful :)
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aaronpk
fkooman: that's correct
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aaronpk
oh wait no that should be 201
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fkooman
exactly :-)
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kylewm
yeah actually that tripped me up ^
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aaronpk
oops, it must be looking for just the location header
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fkooman
it should probably follow 3xx redirects first :-)
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aaronpk
you can't follow 3xx redirects for post
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ben_test
tests
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fkooman
can't or shouldn't? :)
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aaronpk
well browsers don't, and i believe the http spec says you shouldn't
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tantek
note that SHOULD in that context really does mean you can't unless you have some really exceptional reason
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fkooman
but I actually agree, so I'll fix that :)
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ben_test2
tests emotes with multiple words
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ben_thatmustbeme
my fix works aaronpk... send a pull request
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ben_thatmustbeme
it should be pretty easy to get notifications works too.. way toying with that this morning
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tantek
last night I setup the Guest List page for IndieWebCamp 2015 - so far it's just aaronpk and me - so go sign-up! https://indiewebcamp.com/2015/Guest_List
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GWG
aaronpk: Is there a downside to, once someone moves to https, no longer allowing http?
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GWG
tantek: Which venues are confirmed?
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aaronpk
GWG: that seems reasonable, just requires a lot more code and edge case handling
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tantek
GWG, just Portland
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kylewm
aaronpk: re: redirects, what about the situation where someone intercepts http://kylewm.com and redirects it to http://badactor.com, then they could login as kylewm.com?
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tantek
so far
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ben_thatmustbeme
wow... drugs from dentist mess with my typing apparently... just saw all the typos i made
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Loqi
[mention] yatil posted 'On May 9th, I’ll attend the IndieWebCamp Germany in Düsseldorf. It is part of the beyond tellerrand week which I will miss as I am leaving f...' linking to https://indiewebcamp.com/2015/Germany/ (https://yatil.net/attending-indiewebcamp-germany-2015/)
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@yatil
Attending IndieWebCamp Germany 2015 https://yatil.net/?p=101607
(twtr.io/yjnMFmL5u9)
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Loqi
[mention] yatil posted 'On May 9th, I’ll attend the IndieWebCamp Germany in Düsseldorf. It is part of the beyond tellerrand week which I will miss as I am leaving f...' linking to https://indiewebcamp.com/2015/Germany (https://yatil.net/attending-indiewebcamp-germany-2015/)
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tantek.com
edited /2015 (+21) "/* Candidate Cities */ move Portland to confirmed, take myself off organizing other cities"
(view diff)
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kylewm.com
edited /2015/Guest_List (+368) "/* Creators */ RSVP, yay!"
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GWG
tantek: Maybe I'll see about getting to Portland this time. I've never been.
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tantek
GWG, for other cities, see and add to https://indiewebcamp.com/2015#Candidate_Cities especially if you want to make another city happen, step up to help co-organize.
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tantek
GWG, that would be great too!
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GWG
I think in NYC right now, I'll focus on HWC.
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tantek
good call
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aaronpk
tantek: maybe we can move all the candidate date stuf to a sub-page like 2015/planning to de-clutter the main 2015 page?
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tantek
it's a mix aaronpk
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tantek
because date is set so I moved that to the bottom
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GWG
tantek: I was also pondering trying an online HWC. But afraid it might defeat the point.
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tantek
however, I left candidate cities near the top so other cities could organize
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tantek
GWG, yeah - online HWC does defeat the point a bit - we have that nearly 24x7 with just IRC :)
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GWG
tantek: My thought on it was to attract people who don't come to irc.
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GWG
I could always do something crazy.
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tantek
off to go for a walk, get groceries and think more about /quote posts. Wrote up my "Working On" thoughts here in case anyone wants to edit/contribute: https://indiewebcamp.com/Falcon#quote_posts
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snarfed
hey GWG have you played with the 4.2 press this at all?
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Loqi
snarfed: tantek left you a message on 4/24 at 5:51pm: do you know of any feed reader or other consuming code that consumes Activity Streams 1.0 (Atom/XML) and does something presentationally different with different object-types and verbs? http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-04-24/line/1429923075938
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ben_thatmustbeme
args: [ '*', '[object', 'HTMLInputElement]', 'Erroneous Nickname' ] well that isn't right
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ben_thatmustbeme
heh, oh yesh, thats better
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GWG
Snarfed: Yes. But I still am writing my own. It is a great improvement though, isn't it?
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ben_thatmustbeme
ohh ben_notify, are you getting notifications now?
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ben_notify
darn, guess not
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GWG
snarfed: What do you think?
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snarfed
GWG: not sure, i haven't really dug in much yet
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ben_thatmustbeme
ohh ben_notify2, are you getting notifications NOW?
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snarfed
i only use it for posting indie replies (likes etc), so i'm just annoyed i have to port…and i have a sinking feeling it doesn't support direct HTML any more…but meh
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GWG
snarfed: Want to consider signing on to my solution?
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ben_thatmustbeme
try this one most ben_notify
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ben_thatmustbeme
try this one most ben_notify
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GWG
When it is more ready?
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ben_thatmustbeme
try this one most ben_notify2
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snarfed
GWG: sure! will yours support a bookmarklet for auto-populating indie reply, like, etc markup based on the current page?
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snarfed
that's my sole use case
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ben_thatmustbeme
sorry for all the spammy guys, ben_notify2
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ben_notify2
gah
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GWG
snarfed: It already supports a bookmarklet.
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snarfed
GWG: and the rest of my q? :P
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ben_thatmustbeme
heh, a notification of the actual html... not so helpful... and probably don't want to get noficiations of my own messages
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ben_thatmustbeme
but its working otherwise
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GWG
Since I mark up on the fly and you mark up during creation, not yet. But I intend to support an unkind use case.
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snarfed
!tell tantek: re consuming AS1, obligatory answer, https://github.com/snarfed/activitystreams-unofficial does: when you use it to publish to silos, it determines the action to publish based on the verb/object type. otherwise, i don't actually follow the AS community, so i'm pretty useless. maybe try bengo?
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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GWG
I am storing the data in post meta either way.
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GWG
snarfed: You should recognize some of the code. I borrowed liberally from the micropub and webmention plugins.
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GWG
Except it uses the Wordpress auth, and if you don't send in a URL, it generates a form to fill.
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GWG
snarfed: It also has pfefferle's webactions codr, and I hope to add the work on URL handlers done at IWC UK last year.
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GWG
Hoping for a complete solution.
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ben_thatmustbeme
test message to ben_notify
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ben_notify
dang, something wrong with my regex
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ben_thatmustbeme
i will get this notifications bit working eventually
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GWG
ben_thatmustbeme: We're all rooting for you
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ben_thatmustbeme
it sends the text back already marked up, so i'll have to strip it out
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ben_thatmustbeme
i can't finish it up now anyway
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tantek
Loqi, playback
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Loqi
tantek: snarfed left you a message 32 minutes ago: re consuming AS1, obligatory answer, https://github.com/snarfed/activitystreams-unofficial does: when you use it to publish to silos, it determines the action to publish based on the verb/object type. otherwise, i don't actually follow the AS community, so i'm pretty useless. maybe try bengo? http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-04-25/line/1429987382294
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tantek
hmm - looked at that and couldn't find a way to feed it an AS1 Atom URL and get sample output (what would be published to a silo if it were doing so)
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tantek.com
edited /2015/Germany (+169) "add Indie Event URL"
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tantek
aaronpk: checking indie event post presentation, e.g. https://aaronparecki.com/events/2015/03/19/1/indiewebcamp - is the duplicate (image attending) "is attending" text (or not attending) deliberate? or is that reply text coming from Bridgy?
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aaronpk
That text is coming from Bridgy
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aaronpk
The same way text from an indie site would come through
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tantek
I thought we figured this out a few weeks ago
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aaronpk
I don't remember that conversation
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tantek
it was primarily with kylewm IIRC
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aaronpk
I may have been traveling too
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tantek.com
edited /event (+222) "/* Kyle Mahan */ note newer example with de-dupped display of RSVP status for Bridgy responses"
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tantek
hmm - looks like kylewm has made it work recently https://kylewm.com/2015/04/homebrew-website-club-1 - though older events still have the duplicate, e.g. https://kylewm.com/2014/12/homebrew-website-club-17-december-2014
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tantek
aaronpk: since an RSVP is also a reply, the receiving site needs to know how to distinguish between default reply text and actual reply content. I think we settled on p-summary as the place for fallback information for replies in general
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tantek
i.e. if the receiving site does not understand the "special" reply (e.g. RSVP), it will do the right thing by using the p-summary
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tantek
whereas for *special* replies (e.g. RSVP), the receiver should use the RSVP information, and then only add reply commentary if there is some in the content
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tantek
kylewm - do you recall when we had this conversation? because clearly you fixed/changed something in your Indie Event RSVP receiving/display code.
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tantek.com
edited /Main_Page (+555) "/* IndieWebCamp */ note more 2015 IndieWebCamps coming up!"
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Loqi
slack/snarfed: tantek: re a-u, you're right, it doesn't have a built in publish preview UI. it's primarily a library. bridgy publish/preview uses it directly though, so you can look at that
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tantek
but bridgy publish only consumes permalinks to posts right? not feed file URLs?
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Loqi
slack/snarfed: bridgy, yes. a-u also consumes AS JSON/XML
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Loqi
slack/snarfed: (and outputs atom but doesn't consume it)
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tantek
interesing, then I'm confused about what Bridgy Publish actually *publishes* because I thought it only published a single post (by design)
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tantek
what does feeding it a feed do?
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tantek
use the most recent entry in the feed?
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Loqi
slack/snarfed: sorry, I'm being unclear. you're right about bridgy. I'm talking about the a-u library
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tantek
one of the challenges I have found with AS1/Atom (and frankly JSON) is that there are insufficient *simple* / minimal publishing examples
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tantek
makes me realize all our "How to markup" sections should start with the simplest possible markup, with maybe a few variants, and only incrementally show how to do more complex things
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tantek
like there is no simple/minimal AS1/Atom (or JSON) "like" post example anywhere AFAIK
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snarfed
examples weren't the primary use case for these, but you might be interested: https://github.com/snarfed/activitystreams-unofficial/tree/master/testdata
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tantek.com
edited /IndieWebCamps (+1706) "copy IndieWebCamp Cambridge 2015 from home page to here"
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tantek.com
edited /Main_Page (+27) "/* IndieWebCamp */ ID"
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tantek.com
edited /Main_Page (-66) "/* IndieWebCamp */ -ID already had one, dedup "next" & h-event container, move p-name summary markup to after heading"
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tantek
aaronpk - I've taken care of copying the home page next IWC section to the /IndieWebCamps archive - go ahead and update it for /2015/Germany : https://indiewebcamp.com/#next
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tantek.com
edited /2015 (+205) "add Indie Event placeholder, Lanyrd"
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tantek
really pleased with how well lanyrd works without JS
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tantek
Lanyrd++
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Loqi
Lanyrd has 1 karma
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tantek
speaking of - Lanyrd URL for IWC 2015 is up: http://lanyrd.com/2015/indiewebcamp/
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tantek
what is Lanyrd?
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werd.io
edited /2015/Guest_List (+344) "/* Creators */"
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tantek.com
created /Lanyrd (+137) "stub with dfn, URL, see also"
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tantek.com
edited /Lanyrd (+183) "POSSE to, link to Bridgy feature request"
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tantek.com
edited /Lanyrd (+220) "Backfeed from - no one so far, note Bridgy backfeed feature request"
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tantek.com
edited /event (+274) "/* POSSE */ Lanyrd"
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tantek
kylewm: could you post an indie event for https://indiewebcamp.com/2015 and FB POSSE copy? If Redwind allows for it, note also the Lanyrd copy: http://lanyrd.com/2015/indiewebcamp/
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fkooman
aaronpk, can you clean the micropub location cache of quill? i moved the endpoint and now the old one is still used :(
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fkooman
aaronpk, oops, my bad :)
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tantek
that adamrcoom link is js;dr. also tried it with JS on, and got this error:
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tantek
"Failed to load resource: https://.… jquery … An SSL error has occurred and a secure connection to the server cannot be made."
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tantek
js required = your content is fragile and can fail to show for many reasons, not just because the user has JS off
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